Author Topic: Cultural Appropriation Megathread  (Read 1232 times)

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Kurt Russell

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Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« on: July 23, 2021, 05:02:27 AM »
 :drudge :drudge

 :drudge :drudge

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Can anyone explain to me the basic concepts behind cultural appropriation? From what I can see, this has been happening since the days of the Roman Empire and is essentially the aim of a "multi-cultural society". So, I'm genuinely interested to know:

  • Why is this bad?
  • Is there such a thing as "good cultural appropriation"?
  • Is it possible to borrow from other cultures without falling into the cultural appropriation trap?
  • How would one seek permission to borrow from another culture?
« Last Edit: July 23, 2021, 05:07:04 AM by Kurt Russell »
woke

Potato

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2021, 05:27:35 AM »
Cultural exploitation is bad.

Cultural appropriation is just like you said...incorporating the cultures of new migrant communities into the mainstream.
Spud

Pissy F Benny

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2021, 06:41:36 AM »
I'm pretty sure the vast majority of people who complain about it online don't really know what it means :trumps
(ice)

MMaRsu

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2021, 06:49:22 AM »
Cultural exploitation is bad.

Cultural appropriation is just like you said...incorporating the cultures of new migrant communities into the mainstream.

Yeah..so whats bad about it?
What

Uncle

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2021, 07:40:57 AM »
Yeah..so whats bad about it?

this is the meandering path society has taken on the subject:


woman mockingly says "ohhh me chinee, ching chong wing wong" -> yo that shit ain't cool, that's racist to make fun of their language






man goes to a party with face paint and native american headdress -> dude don't make fun of cultural groups you're not part of, you're not glorifying you're stereotyping




girl tries to respectfully explore japanese ceremonial culture -> get the fuck out of here, you don't understand the deep significance of what you're doing "for fun"




today: anyone not of a given race/culture who does or says anything perceived to be from within that culture is now unambiguously in the wrong and stealing from that culture, devoid of context or intent


https://www.polygon.com/2020/11/30/21734131/animal-crossing-space-buns-puffs-black-hairstyles-nintendo-switch



https://twitter.com/MahouEcho/status/1330329300868993024

https://twitter.com/lilbittysherb/status/1330238407537266695
Uncle

Nintex

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2021, 10:27:21 AM »
You steal something from a specific group, like the gay anthem for your campaign :trumps

Or final fantasy from Sony
🤴

team filler

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2021, 12:15:13 PM »
let me genocide and enslave you, then wear your skin as a suit. pass it on to my kids and grandkids, they won't even know how terrifying they look. most people won't realize why it's wrong anymore after a time, even those enslaved and nearly wiped out. it was easier to dehumanize you because of the difference in your skin, now they wear it around to celebrate themselves and question why you feel uneasy about it. remember the boarding schools for native children? how they worked to wipe away all that they are, now it's all worn for costume by the descendants of those who brought on the apocalypse. I can see why some would have a problem with it.


it's like racial slurs, mostly a problem because of the current power structure and what lead up to it.
*****

GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2021, 01:12:37 PM »
it's like racial slurs, mostly a problem because of the current power structure and what lead up to it.

slurs only ever come from a place of ridicule, enjoying an element of another culture - even on the most superficial 'hey, this is pretty cool' level - comes from respect.

team filler

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2021, 02:16:21 PM »
why should one who has been skinned alive be concerned with whether the person wearing their skin as a suit is doing so from a place of ridicule or a place of respect?
*****

GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #9 on: July 24, 2021, 09:33:29 AM »
why should one who has been skinned alive be concerned with whether the person wearing their skin as a suit is doing so from a place of ridicule or a place of respect?

They don't, but innumerable cultures have been lost to time. Thats just how history works. When two different cultures meet, the results are always going to be synthesis, assimilation or extinction for one.

We could ask the Mithraists if it worked out better for them to make their culture secret and gatekept only to members of their order. I mean, theoretically we could. None of them fucking exist and nobody knows what the fuck they were about other than a couple of bits of art because they kept their culture a closely guarded secret and it no longer exists.

Lonewulfeus

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #10 on: July 24, 2021, 11:30:19 AM »
why should one who has been skinned alive be concerned with whether the person wearing their skin as a suit is doing so from a place of ridicule or a place of respect?

They don't, but innumerable cultures have been lost to time. Thats just how history works. When two different cultures meet, the results are always going to be synthesis, assimilation or extinction for one.

We could ask the Mithraists if it worked out better for them to make their culture secret and gatekept only to members of their order. I mean, theoretically we could. None of them fucking exist and nobody knows what the fuck they were about other than a couple of bits of art because they kept their culture a closely guarded secret and it no longer exists.

What else is there to know?  Mithras was born from rock and liked to kill bulls. :bolo

Uncle

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #11 on: July 24, 2021, 02:13:50 PM »
 :bow :bow2

 :heartbeat :drool :drool :heartbeat
Uncle

team filler

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #12 on: July 24, 2021, 06:26:39 PM »
why should one who has been skinned alive be concerned with whether the person wearing their skin as a suit is doing so from a place of ridicule or a place of respect?

They don't, but innumerable cultures have been lost to time. Thats just how history works. When two different cultures meet, the results are always going to be synthesis, assimilation or extinction for one.

We could ask the Mithraists if it worked out better for them to make their culture secret and gatekept only to members of their order. I mean, theoretically we could. None of them fucking exist and nobody knows what the fuck they were about other than a couple of bits of art because they kept their culture a closely guarded secret and it no longer exists.
indigenous tribes do invite outsiders in to festivals and events to share their culture. doesn't grant everyone immunity from scrutiny while they parade around in sacred garb they may only see as costume, or recreational.

whitey doesn't like it when things they hold sacred are used in a way they find disrespectful. like flag burning. "Do you know how many men and women have died for those colors" or something to that effect. and how many were massacred for the right to just be and continue on living here in their own land? wearing their traditional and sacred garments? if native peoples take issue with outsiders doing anything, I am willing to hear them out before anyone else. especially those being dismissive because they feel they can get away with it.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2021, 06:33:24 PM by team filler »
*****

SmokyDave

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2021, 04:29:39 AM »
There are definitely issues that need to be scrutinised (black hairstyles becoming 'acceptable' on white heads), but there are also many issues that aren't really issues outside of twitter. Generally, it's pretty easy to ignore this stuff.

why should one who has been skinned alive be concerned with whether the person wearing their skin as a suit is doing so from a place of ridicule or a place of respect?
We don't really find out what the person skinned alive thinks. We find out that some people that have never been skinned alive want to make a noise and choose to co-opt a grievance from the descendants of the man skinned alive.

That's why it rings hollow to me. Most of these stories end with the flayed man being ignored as he sits there saying 'I'm actually not bothered about this'.

GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2021, 07:25:12 AM »
indigenous tribes do invite outsiders in to festivals and events to share their culture. doesn't grant everyone immunity from scrutiny while they parade around in sacred garb they may only see as costume, or recreational.

whitey doesn't like it when things they hold sacred are used in a way they find disrespectful. like flag burning. "Do you know how many men and women have died for those colors" or something to that effect. and how many were massacred for the right to just be and continue on living here in their own land? wearing their traditional and sacred garments? if native peoples take issue with outsiders doing anything, I am willing to hear them out before anyone else. especially those being dismissive because they feel they can get away with it.

I'm not sure what kind of sitcomesque scenario you're envisaging where setting fire to a cultural artifact (or smashing it, or otherwise destroying it) is accidentally mistaken by the person doing it as anything other than an attempt at cultural erasure or defacement, but you're right that most cultures will happily invite outsiders in to partake and share of that culture, because its part of who they are and its a way keeping those traditions alive.

People who inherently believe that 'outsiders' are inherently 'disrespecting' a culture by partaking of it in an act of appreciation are the same people who think its outrageous that blacks are allowed on 'their' golf course, or jews are allowed in 'their' country club, or gays are allowed in 'their' military, or whites are allowed to make 'their' cuisines.
The 'disrespect' comes from their own bigotry - that outsiders are worth less in their eyes, and it 'devalues' their culture to see it shared outside 'the tribe'.

Those people can fuck right off, tbh.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2021, 07:30:37 PM »

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Mr Gilhaney

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Re: Cultural Appropriation Megathread
« Reply #16 on: July 28, 2021, 11:51:10 AM »
Is this cultural appropriation if I'm not American?