Who the hell says 2001 has no story?

[Himu]

I'm at intermission now.

Who ever says this movie has no story has problems. wtf. ADD has ruined people.

[CajoleJuice]

I thought you just watched this yesterday like the rest of us.

[Himu]

I had to do stuff. I watched an hour and had to do some errands.I dvr'd it.

[Phoenix Dark]

what the FUCK did I just watch?

You saw a bunch of monkeys doing nothing then some shit in space capped off with a laser light show at the end.

Time wasted: aprox 2 1/2 hours

what the FUCK did I just watch?

You saw a bunch of monkeys doing nothing then some shit in space capped off with a laser light show at the end.

Time wasted: aprox 2 1/2 hours

what the FUCK did I just watch?

You saw a bunch of monkeys doing nothing then some shit in space capped off with a laser light show at the end.

Time wasted: aprox 2 1/2 hours

what the FUCK did I just watch?

You saw a bunch of monkeys doing nothing then some shit in space capped off with a laser light show at the end.

Time wasted: aprox 2 1/2 hours

what the FUCK did I just watch?

You saw a bunch of monkeys doing nothing then some shit in space capped off with a laser light show at the end.

Time wasted: aprox 2 1/2 hours

[FlameOfCallandor]

I said it has no story. It doesnt.

[Himu]

You people really need to stick to by the numbers movies and movies that require no thought.

[Phoenix Dark]

You people really need to stick to by the numbers movies and movies that require no thought.

Jesus, shut the fuck up Garret. Did you wake up thinking you're Willco or something? Look in the mirror: you aren't Jewish, you don't have a big dick, and you don't have an asian gf.

Now fix me my fries

[FlameOfCallandor]

You people really need to stick to by the numbers movies and movies that require no thought.

 

[Himu]

Jesus, shut the fuck up Garret. Did you wake up thinking you're Willco or something?

No, but I do love analyzing plots in any art form.

[FlameOfCallandor]

Jesus, shut the fuck up Garret. Did you wake up thinking you're Willco or something?

No, but I do love analyzing plots in any art form.

Please analyze this plot for. I'm having trouble with it.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]

[Phoenix Dark]

Jesus, shut the fuck up Garret. Did you wake up thinking you're Willco or something?

No, but I do love analyzing plots in any art form.

What's there to analyize? Evidence of alien life is supposedly found buried on the moon. Some scientists visit the area. All of a sudden a loud noise starts, and then you never see them again in the movie. Nothing is explained, at all.

18 months pass by. Another team of scientists is on their way to Jupiter for some reason. They have a HAL computer onboard, which never makes mistakes. But when it does it tries to kill the crew.

?

[Himu]

Theme, PD. 2001's plot is not grounded in traditional movie story telling, but in the themes that are brought up.

[Phoenix Dark]

And that's supposed to impress me? It made no sense.

[Himu]

It makes no sense because you didn't attempt to make sense of it, or you're too stupid to make sense of it in the first place.

[Phoenix Dark]

What did the ending mean? Why did the movie completely cut out the first doctor after he found the monolith?

[Robo]

There's a lot to think about considering it's purposefully vague.  If you didn't walking away from that film with some questions, I wouldn't believe you even saw it.  You can read Clarke's book if you really need to know the details, but it isn't necessary.  The ride is what's important.

Oh yeah, Solo posted this in another thread that must have gone unread, so I'm gonna post it again:

Well, the whole film is about evolution, as the three acts are broken up as such (and the black monoliths symbolize each evolutionary leap). The monkeys learn to use/make tools, which was the first evolutionary jump. The next jump is man in space. Then when HAL goes crazy, and Dave is forced to shut him down and make it to Jupiter on his own, the final evolutionary leap is made. Dave arrives in the chamber, and begins aging rapidly, and the final monolith appears when he is on his deathbed. The final evolutionary step is Dave (aka man) being reborn as the Starchild, a higher form of intelligence and being, and being sent back to earth.

[VALIS]

Two of my favorite outlines on my favorite movie of all time. The first one offers specific interpretations of each event while the second one offers several. It's absolutely astounding how much depth there is in this movie. Everything is symbolic and carries a larger, more obscure meaning, from the way they eat their food to the way they lifelessly converse to the screwdriver used to dismantle HAL.

1. The theme of 2001 is man's evolution, from ape through Earthman to astral being.

2. In the beginning, the ape has what it takes to make the first evolutionary leap. Presented with the monolith, his curiosity and courage overcome his fear. These innate characteristics -- and not some buzz from the big block -- lead to the ape's subsequent invention, the tool.

3. A million years later, the first tool has become a spaceship and Earthman is soaring at the peak of his evolution. He's so civilized -- when Floyd meets the Russians in the bar, it's: "Dr. Floyd, won't you join us for a drink?" (cf. that with ape hospitality round the last watering--hole we saw).

4. But, immediately, we sense something is wrong. Earthman is just not suited to space. He eats junk. Every step is an effort. Even taking a crap requires advanced technology. What's more, man has become a bore. His emotions are flat. He communicates in banalities. He has lost his sense of curiosity -- meeting the monolith for the second time, he touches it with a cold, scientific, gloved hand, then poses for a tourist snap.

5. The Jupiter mission. What a sad sight, these Earthmen. Bored, boring, all intellect and no feeling. The ones in hibernation testify to man's utter incompatibility with space exploration -- he has to be virtually dead just to get around. Seems like he just doesn't have what it takes to last out here in space.

6. But maybe HAL does. HAL is a tool, no more and no less than that bone wielded by the ape. But he's so smart he beats man at his own game ("I'm sorry, Frank, but I think you missed it....").

7. HAL -- but not the crew! -- knows that Earthman is heading for an appointment with destiny, with higher powers. "But hey," thinks HAL, "who's to say I'M not the Chosen One? I'm a lot smarter than these jerks. And I'm made for space. I don't need to hibernate, I don't need oxygen or phoney cheese sandwiches. Hey, I'm practically immortal..." The ultimate tool, HAL, doesn't need the apes anymore. He's decided to end an association that has lasted a thousand millennia.

8. HAL plots and schemes. And Earthman finally twigs: "I've got a bad feeling..." says Bowman's buddy Poole in the pod, making the film's first reference to feelings. Facing the ultimate, mortal conflict -- although only dimly aware of what's coming -- Earthman regains that old ape intuition.

9. HAL almost succeeds, but Bowman (get it? -- man is culturally so far behind his own evolution he's stuck with a name from the 12th century) outsmarts the machine with his ingenuity, imagination and courage. And he kills HAL using the simplest of all tools, the screwdriver. That's what tools are for, HAL!

10. Man makes his appointment.

11. The room in the 4th dimension is a 'colour negative'.

12. At his last supper, Earthman tips over his glass. The glass breaks -- but the wine is still there. Hey...container/content, body/spirit... Ah!

13. Earthman is dying. Enter the monolith. Have you got it yet, Earthman? As an ape, you touched me with a child's fear and courage. On the moon, you touched me with your cold logic. And now?

14. With his rasping, dying breath, Earthman reaches out to the monolith, at last, with deep understanding and wisdom. The body -- container of his spirit for a million years, but like fish out of water in space -- is cast aside forever. He's ready for the next evolutionary leap -- and the Starchild is born. (Ba--baa--baaa--baaaa baabaaaa!...bombombombombom...)

Afterthoughts/re--elaborations/repetitions:

In space, man finds himself at an evolutionary dead--end, so unadapted to the new environment that he is forced to delegate practically all human functions -- from toilet--work to command decisions -- to his tools/machines. At that point, it is simply "natural selection" for the machine to replace its creator.

That is the crux of 2001: man on Earth used tools -- extensions of his body -- to progress. In space, the tools become so "vital" that they take on a life of their own, detach themselves (remember the floating pen?) and ultimately decide to do away with him.

When HAL threatens to destroy him, Bowman draws on man's innate qualities (his spirit) to outsmart and finally destroy the machine (the screwdriver used to lobotomize HAL represents man's reappropriation of domain over his tools).

At the same time, in destroying HAL, Bowman draws the curtain on Homo Utensilis ("lays down the bone", as Geoffrey Alexander puts it) -- he's seen that evolutionary route leads to disaster. And if the tool/machine has exhausted its evolutionary thrust, so, by extension (or intention), has the human body. At that point, all that is left to evolve is the wine in the broken glass, i.e. the spirit in the old man's broken, dying body.

Note also that while the ape and Homo Utensilis actually had to touch the monolith to get results, dying man only has to lift a finger -- it's his intention that counts this time, not what he does with his body.

I. The monolith - source of infinite knowledge and intelligence

   A. Perfection represented in its shape; its color -- black --
      could symbolize:

      1. Evil and death, which result from man's misuse of knowledge;

      2. The incomprehensible -- man, with his limited senses, cannot
         comprehend the absence (perfect black) of color or light.

   B. Its first appearance.

      1. Movie implies that life has reached the stage when it is
         ready for inspiration, a divine gift, perhaps. [It is interesting
         that the apes are expectant, waiting for something.]

      2. Maybe apes become men when this inspiration is given.
         [Question: Is man really a separate entity, with something (soul?) 
         that no other form of life possesses, or is the difference merely in
         quantity (rather than quality) of intelligence? Is the evolution
         gradual and continuous or in defined levels? Does the difference in
         quantity become in fact this difference in quality?]

      3. Inspiration is given: 
   
         a. When men (apes) need it; or,     
         b. When they seek it; or,     
         c. At the whim of the force giving the gift; or,     
         d. In various combinations of these three.

      4. The purpose of the gift may be to allow man to create
         life- sustaining forces. [In this "cycle," he creates only death;
         interesting -- death from death (bones).]

      5. Its disappearance (after weapon is made) -- Reasons:

         a. It is taken away in punishment for misuse of knowledge; or,
         b. It is no longer sought -- apes (men) consider themselves masters
            now and try to continue on their own energies after the initial
            impulse. Maybe the monolith is always present, but is invisible to
            those who don't wish to see it or to whom it does not wish to be
            visible; or,
         c. It is taken away by the force that gave it, to prevent mortal
            understanding of everything.

   C. Its second appearance (on Moon).

      1. Reasons for appearance:

         a. Man is subconsciously seeking it again; or,
         b. It is needed to remind him of his insignificance; or,
         c. It is given as a new opportunity to create a meaningful
            existence for humanity.

      2. Men on Moon touch monolith in the same way that the apes did --
         this indicates no basic change in man's nature. Then, after
         touching it, they have the audacity to try to take photo --
         still conceited, still lacking in understanding of the gift.

      3. From Moon, there is a strong magnetic field directed toward Jupiter
         (this is where man will go next). This indicates that man will still
         fail and will need monolith again when he reaches the next stage of
         exploration. Monolith is always beyond human scope -- man is still
         reaching at death.

      4. It is ironic that men on Moon believe that the monolith was made
         by a more advanced civilization. This to them is the ultimate --
         they can't comprehend that anything could be above the mortal level.

   D. The monolith and infinity.

      1. After HAL is made, man shows that once again he has refused,
         through ignorance and conceit, to take advantage of the chance
         to obtain superhuman intelligence. Maybe the system is slowing
         down and it is impossible for man to progress any further on
         his own energies.

      2. Now he is given another chance -- the monolith shows him infinity,
         perfect knowledge, and the beginning of the universe, but he can't
         comprehend it. Reasons for his being shown all this:
         
         a. It may be truly another chance for man; or,
         b. It may already be determined that he must die
            [maybe all people are shown perfect knowledge at death]; or,
         c. Maybe perfect knowledge (represented by monolith) is always
            present, but our understanding of it will always be imperfect.

II.  HAL

     A. He is evil, but only because he reflects human nature.

     B. His uneasiness about the mission implies that even the highest
        development of human intelligence is imperfect in ability to
        understand.

     C. Man, trying to progress independently of divine aid, attempts, either
        consciously or unconsciously, to create life, in the form of HAL. This
        is not allowed. Man is reaching, or is being forced to reach, a limit
        in his ability to progress further.

     D. Reasons for HAL's failure:

        1. Eternal human error once again in evidence; or,
        2. This may be a divine punishment; or,
        3. God will not allow man to become subordinate to his own
          foolish creations.

     E. The fact that man can overcome HAL's evil is optimistic; however,
        to do this he must destroy HAL, who is nearly a living being --
        again, the theme of death, futility.
        [This and triviality are shown in HAL's "song."]

III. The room (at end) death.

     A. It is elegant, maybe to show man's cultural achievements,
        but it is sterile and silent -- nothing has meaning without
        the spirit of the monolith. This is man's universe, that with
        which he is supposedly familiar, but even this is hostile to him.

     B. Room could represent:

        1. All that man can comprehend (finite) of infinity. Even
           in this limited scope, he is confused; or,
        2. Man's cultural history, as men remember their past before
           they die; or,
        3. The trivia for which he relinquished the monolith (then at death
           he realizes his need for it); or,
        4. A reminder of man's failure to draw on past -- it could contain
           more wisdom than the present. [Monkeys responded to the monolith
           better than modern man -- race is slowly degenerating.]

     C. In this room, man must die, because:

        1. He has reached his limit; or,
        2. He has failed too much; or,
        3. He has been shown infinity.

     D. Question: Is his death (following degeneration) inevitable after being
        shown all knowledge, or is this experience still another chance to
        improve? Then, when man returns to trivia, perhaps this is the
        breaking point, the end of his opportunities.

     E. Maybe he knows what is happening to him but is powerless to change it.
        The changes in the man may be a vision shown to him as punishment, or
        they may merely represent the various stages in the life of one man or 
        of all men.

IV.  The themes

     A. Animalism and human failure

     1. Throughout picture, there is constant eating, made to appear 
        revolting; also, exercising, wrestling.
     2. At end, goblet is broken. This may imply that man's failures will
        continue forever.
     3. Animal nature and conceit remain the same throughout. Will there never
        be any true progress? The monolith is always shown with sunrise and
        crescent. When first seen, this is a sign of hope, of a beginning; but
        the sun is never any higher except when man is shown infinity. This
        last fact may symbolize hope that, despite all his past failures, man
        will ultimately rise above animalism; or it may merely represent the
        perfect knowledge he cannot comprehend.
     4. There is a delicate balance between the animal and divine nature in
        man. We will never be permitted to go beyond a certain point (as
        individuals and as a race).

     B. Futility

        1. It is shown:

           a. In the rescue and subsequent release of Frank (after the
              struggle to catch him);
           b. In the meaningless talk -- "People talking without speaking."

        2. Is all that we do in vain? Each person certainly dies without
           attaining all understanding. Will our race (history) also terminate
           and begin again, continually, with no progress ever made?

     C. Whether the movie is terribly pessimistic or optimistic depends on the
        answer to the question, "Does the man at the end represent just our
        'cycle' or all 'cycles' for eternity?"

        1. Pessimistic: Man may never become more "divine" -- all chances for
           rebirth may be merely a mockery. Irony -- no matter how much man
           ruins his life, chances for improvement are always given. Since he
           will probably continue ruining his life for eternity, this may be
           the cruel tantalizing by some capricious god.

        2. Optimistic: The preceding is impossible to believe if one assumes
           that there is some life-giving, life-sustaining force in the
           universe that is the source of absolute good. With this belief,
           one can hope that someday man will be able to use the divine
           inspiration offered him to propagate life-sustaining forces.
           Probably he will never be able to understand more, but he will use
           his understanding better. The sunrise, fetus, etc., seem to
           indicate this hope. Also, it seems that, despite human stupidity,
           new opportunities to become sublime are always given. Someday,
           perhaps, man will learn that he cannot truly "live" unless he
           accepts the gift, in the form of the monolith, that demands human
           subjugation to a divine force. Then he will not be required to
           create, and to experience, only death.

[bagofeyes]

It has the greatest story of all time

[The Miles Trahan Burger Experiment]

It has the greatest story of all time

Pretty much.

[Solo]

Thanks so much to robo for quoting me  I took the time to write that up in the other thread, which promptly died after my post. Thanks for bringing it back.