Author Topic: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops  (Read 3207 times)

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MrAngryFace

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Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« on: August 25, 2006, 11:45:16 AM »
I've discovered during my daily commute that when I drive say five miles over posted speed limit, I either hit yellows early enough to slow down safely, or late enough to pass through without accelerating.

However on mornings I am feeling sluggish behind the wheel, and drive posted speed limit, I am often having to break hard to avoid running a red with one of those POINT OF NO RETURN YELLOWS that cops WILL pull you over for if you dont time it right.

So its clear the best course is to always drive five miles per hour over, which just happens to be the margin of error on radar guns. If anything driving speed limit introduces more situations where I can be rear-ended or rear end the person in front of me.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2006, 11:47:00 AM by MrAngryFace »
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G The Resurrected

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2006, 11:49:13 AM »
i drive 5-10 mph faster than posted most of the time. I usually hit yellows as well strangely enough. But i get through them easily. I hate the cops in this town they are after anyone's ass. Right in front of the park they just line up 5 or 6 motorcycle cops and go after people left and right. At least i know where the fuck they hide so i go around them.

MrAngryFace

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2006, 11:54:30 AM »
Well 5 is as fast as you can go safely unless youre travelling in a pack.
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G The Resurrected

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2006, 12:02:01 PM »
Yes i know this my three tickets back when i had a different car have taught me that.

Loki

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2006, 12:32:25 PM »
, I am often having to break hard to avoid running a red with one of those POINT OF NO RETURN YELLOWS that cops WILL pull you over for if you dont time it right.

Speaking of "point of no return" yellows, I'm not sure how it is in your neck of the woods, but here in NYC they've got a nice little racket going on:

Generally, the best way to tell when the light is going to turn yellow is to look at the crosswalk signal for the cross-traffic.  It used to be that it would blink "Don't Walk" 8-10 times, then display a solid "Don't Walk" for a good second and a half to two seconds, and then the light would turn yellow.  The duration of the yellow light was generally 2 seconds.  So all in all, you had 3-4 seconds from when the solid "Don't Walk" appeared until the light turned red.

In the last several years, they have either made the solid "Don't Walk" exactly coincide with the appearance of the yellow light (giving you only the 2 seconds of yellow to react before the light turned red), or -- and this is far more devious -- they don't have a flashing "Don't Walk" at all, it's simply a solid "Don't Walk" the entire time (so you can't gauge when the light will turn yellow and you're uncertain during the 100-foot runup to the light).  They've also shortened the duration of the yellow light at many intersections.  Oh yeah, here's the best part of this scam:  they have red light cameras at many of the locations that they have this solid "Don't Walk" system in place, so you'll be ticketed if you run the red by even a fraction of a second.  It's basically a red light trap; no one can tell me that this was not done intentionally, because all the "Don't Walk" signs in Brooklyn were originally on the 3-4 second delay system, and then several years ago about 80% of them changed for no apparent reason.


I've read studies which demonstrated that the best way to prevent people from running reds is to increase the duration of the yellow light.  Instead, they've effectively shortened it.  Go figure.  They've also put 4-way stops or streetlights on nearly every corner (literally a 60-80% increase from when I was an early teen), which just makes traffic grind to a halt, since the lights along, say, a residential avenue are never timed correctly.  They try to act like they're putting the lights up at "dangerous intersections," but that's BS, because at most of the intersections on my avenue there hasn't been an accident in over 15 years.  Honestly, on my avenue there's a stretch of literally 14 blocks where every corner has a light -- and this is a two-way, single-lane, residential avenue where the blocks are literally only 100 feet long.  They've also massively increased the "double-red" times (i.e., the amount of time between one light turning red and the oncoming traffic light turning green), though at least that I can see a reason for in many cases because people like to "anticipate" and jump the light.  Still, we're talking a double-red of 6+ seconds many times.  Just ridiculous all around.  Don't even get me started on driving in NY -- they treat us like sheep, releasing us from one pen (light) and stopping us at the next pen 50 feet down the road.  Heaven forfend we should be able to actually get anywhere in one of the fastest-paced cities on the planet.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2006, 12:36:57 PM by Loki »

Error Macro

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2006, 12:51:45 PM »
I usually drive around five miles per hour below the speed limit, and I hardly ever hit those pesky yellows.  I give myself plenty of time to stop.  I also leave plenty of space between the cars in front of me.  I like about a car length in stopped traffic.  Can't stand those assholes that pull up behind me at a red light with about half a foot between their front bumper and my rear.  Maybe I drive like a grandpa, but whatever.
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MrAngryFace

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2006, 12:54:09 PM »
Haha, your research into this topic is impeccable, loki.

Honestly as it is, most states aren't doing so well financially. Some, like Washington do great because of the amount of whatever industry they specialize in. States like Arizona, however, thrive on income by means of which you just described above.

The quote is very much alive, despite what any cop will tell you.

Error: well I hadnt considered that, but I think forcing people to pass me creates as many possibilities for accidents. I hope you at least stay in the far right 'slow' lane  :-\
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CajoleJuice

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2006, 12:56:08 PM »
Loki, you should be like on Jeopardy or something.






...if it had questions that you had to answer with essays.

 :meeble
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Loki

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2006, 12:58:46 PM »
Loki, you should be like on Jeopardy or something.






...if it had questions that you had to answer with essays.

 :meeble

 :-[

"What is existentialism?"

"yadda yadda x 1000" ;)

Error Macro

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2006, 01:04:21 PM »
Error: well I hadnt considered that, but I think forcing people to pass me creates as many possibilities for accidents. I hope you at least stay in the far right 'slow' lane  :-\

Oh yeah, I hate when people rush up behind me and ride my ass, then get all huffy and pass me, so I stick to the right lane.  But then people like to do that to me when I'm in the right lane too, lol.  I suppose I might drive faster, but like 99% of my driving is comprised of being on the defense against these craaaazy people on the roads.  Southern California is seriously messed up when it comes to driving.  Well, it's messed up on just about everything really, but driving especially.
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CajoleJuice

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #10 on: August 25, 2006, 01:05:37 PM »
I drive 10-15 mph over the speed limit, but so does everyone else on Long Island.  :-[
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MrAngryFace

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2006, 01:11:11 PM »
If people ride your ass in the right lane they've got problems. Left lane is for the fast. Right Lane is for people who want to drive speed limit or under and large trucks.
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Loki

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2006, 01:26:10 PM »
If people ride your ass in the right lane they've got problems. Left lane is for the fast. Right Lane is for people who want to drive speed limit or under and large trucks.

...or pansies like Error Macro. ;) :P

MrAngryFace

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #13 on: August 25, 2006, 01:28:17 PM »
LOLLLLLLzzzzzzz
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Error Macro

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2006, 01:42:22 PM »
haha

I should get one of these stickers and put it on the trunk lid or something



lol
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MrAngryFace

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2006, 01:46:52 PM »
hahah
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Loki

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2006, 01:57:36 PM »
I'm a careful driver (then again, doesn't everyone think they are  :P), but I cannot stand it when people are driving slowly for no apparent reason or for a stupid reason (of course, I'm the sole arbiter of "stupid" in these scenarios ;)).  I used to work at a restaurant located in a commercial area, and there were times where I'd be behind a woman driver (this particular offense was always committed by women) and they would be driving at around 5 mph while window-shopping from their cars, holding up the traffic behind them.  When I see them point at a storefront and start conversing, that's when I usually lay on the horn.

Other times, people will be driving  10+ mph below the speed limit on a quiet residential avenue for no discernible reason, and, if they fail to heed my initial honks, that's when I'll just drive right around them, crossing over the yellow line to do so if necessary (obviously being wary of oncoming traffic).  Beat it, gramps! ;)  I mean, I'm totally patient if I can see why someone is driving slowly (e.g., double-parked cars, people crossing, a light up ahead that will be red by the time they get there etc.), but if they're just pansies like our friend Error Macro here?  I'm gonna lap you.  :D


These people think that just because they don't have to be anywhere, nobody else does either.  And I say: balls to that. :D


(note: I'm speaking only of those driving 10+ mph below the speed limit, not those doing the speed limit or even slightly lower; we're talking extreme cases here)

Howard Alan Treesong

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2006, 02:35:14 PM »
My personal pet peeve is when I'm doing 80 on the highway in the next-to-leftmost lane, and I STILL get people riding my ass like I'm some kind of slowbie grandpa.

I'm going 15 over! WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT?!
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Loki

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2006, 02:41:44 PM »
My personal pet peeve is when I'm doing 80 on the highway in the next-to-leftmost lane, and I STILL get people riding my ass like I'm some kind of slowbie grandpa.

I'm going 15 over! WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT?!

Yeah, as aggressive as my above post makes me sound, I'm not really a fast driver on the highway.  I generally try to stay with the flow of traffic, and usually won't go faster than 80 even if all the other cars around me are (and believe it or not, there are places in upstate NY, NJ, and Pennsylvania where you have 18-wheelers doing 85-90 mph :lol).  Hell, a female friend of mine drives much faster than I do -- I feared for my life on a recent road trip with her.  Maybe she has more testosterone than me?  SEEMS SO.  :-[ :'( ;)


Another pet peeve is how ridiculously low the speed limits are in NYC.  You have major thoroughfares (3+ lanes on each side) where the limit will be 40 mph; on the Belt Parkway, a major thruway here in Brooklyn/Queens, the limit is 50.  Give me a friggin' break.  The speed limit on 3+ lane highways should be 60-65 mph imo.  I don't agree with people who call for limits of 75-80 mph, however.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2006, 02:43:46 PM by Loki »

Solo

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2006, 02:53:59 PM »
Nothing wrong with what you're doing MAF. First off, most cops give you about a 10mph over/under anyways. Second of all, in my traffic engineering (civil engineering student) course I took last year, I found out that they design a road/highway for a certain safe speed, then reduce that by 10mph for the posted speed. So, in effect, your 10mph or so "speeding" is actually you traversing the roadway at the speed intended.

They really need to finally bite the bullet and go with the 85th percentile theory of design. That is to say that they need to measure the average speed of the 85th percentile, and post the speed limit as that. Studies have shown this to be a better method, and despite what you may think, studies have also shown that this does NOT promote further speeding on top of this.

Also MAF, your speed has no bearing on hitting or missing reds. Thats all tied up in the phase lengths for each movement and lane of traffic. Major street's lights are often designed in a "progression", however, so that a driver who gets a green while doing the speed limit can sail through many sets of lights without stopping.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2006, 02:56:42 PM by Solo »

MrAngryFace

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2006, 03:27:55 PM »
solo: but more often than not I hit reds, while your explanation makes sense it doesnt remove the suspicions I have that the traffic light people are out to claim my immortal soul.
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Solo

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #21 on: August 25, 2006, 03:31:49 PM »
Thats probably the case.

However, is it possible that the street you use is a minor one, intersecting with major ones? If so, your traffic movement will get like 30 seconds of green time compared to say 90 for the major street. Add in amber and all-red phases, and you basically get a green light like 20% of the time.

MrAngryFace

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #22 on: August 25, 2006, 03:33:24 PM »
Nah its actually a highway. Its this awful road in WA called 'Bothell/Everett Hwy'. I drive it twice a day, I want it to die. Plus they're building apartments all along it so soon its gonna be accident central with people crossing traffic and trying to turn off the road without slowing down so the idiots behind dont rear end them.
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Solo

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Re: Driving Speed Limit = Sudden Stops
« Reply #23 on: August 25, 2006, 03:41:24 PM »
The problem with highways is that they're designed to meet Average Daily Traffic, not peak hour traffic. So while there may be 1000 cars out there at dinner time, but only 500 at most times, then it will be designed to accomodate 500 vehicles. So what you get is like a Level Of Service A (as good as it gets) say overnight, a LOS C (average) most other times, then during peak hours, like a LOS E or F, aka gridlock (when the road can no longer maintain its capacity, and "fails"). It all comes down to a matter of economics here. Its just not economically feasible to design for peak hour volumes, unfortunately.