Die Hard 4 is OKAY, but fun and not really a Die Hard film

[The Fake Shemp]

So I broke down and saw the film.

It's a solid, fun action film that in this era of computer generated hijinks delivers some much needed down and dirty fare.  I won't really bother with the plot, as it has to do with hackers that are trying to dabble in virtual terrorism in order to get revenge or prove a point or something.  John McClane, who apparently just came out of a Vic Mackey look-a-like contest, is told to escort that kid from the Mac commercials to D.C. after the film establishes that McClane stalks his daughter at 3 AM when she is on dates (so they could shoehorn a personal element into the film).

The dynamic duo begin a collision course with the bad guys, led by Timothy Olyphant, whose surrounding cast of Maggie Q, some dude who apparently thought this was Spider-Man 3 and Euro white trash mercenaries, are much more menacing than his bottom-of-the-barrel Die Hard villain performance.

This leads from action set piece to action set piece, each more spectacular and crazy than the one before until it hits a climax - John McClane fights a jet.  It would be no less absurd if he just jumped out of a moving vehicle and roundhouse kicked the jet, Chuck Norris-style, into atoms.  That's how over-the-top the sequence is.

But it's all a lot of fun and the film never really drags.  Still, this does not at any one point feel like a Die Hard film and that's the problem - it's a fun action flick that they've forced John McClane (and his daughter) into.  The film feels more like the lost script to 24: The Motion Picture than the fourth installment of everyone's favorite everyman hero.

Which brings me to the other point - John McClane isn't very "everyman" anymore.  He's practically invincible and never really in jeopardy, even when they introduce his daughter as a bargaining chip.  At no point in time does he feel like an everyman; he actually feels more like Superman in this than in any Die Hard flick to date.  Sure, he gets banged up, but there's no sense of urgency or dread or anything really.  Not to mention that someone has apparently got him to quit drinking, smoking and cursing.

Also worth noting is the cinematography, which feels very cold in comparison to the John McTiernan helmed entries, sets it apart in tone from its predecessors.  After a nice theatrical viewing, this almost feels like a spinoff or something.  This just isn't Die Hard.

Still, you could do a lot worse with your money.  And it is fun.  But it's no Die Hard.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

I wish I was like you
easily amused
what else could you be
all apologies

[The Fake Shemp]

I don't think you can honestly watch this film and not be entertained at some level, even primordial if need be.  That said, if you're worried that you need to sell your Die Hard trilogy DVD sets to make way for this installment, you can sleep tight.

[Human Snorenado]

I can't trust you, brah.

SPIDER HYPHEN MAN.

[The Fake Shemp]

Hey, if you can't dig on the first two, then you're dead inside.  Spider-Man 3 was pretty mediocre, though.

[Human Snorenado]

RAIMI BLINDERS

[Vizzys]

THE SUIT, THE POWER, IT FEELS GOOD

[TVC15]

So is it better or worse than Fantastic Four 2?

[The Fake Shemp]

Y'know, he never actually says that in the movie, Viz!

Die Hard 4 was probably on par with the Fantastic Four sequel.

[Solo]

Still, this does not at any one point feel like a Die Hard film and that's the problem - it's a fun action flick that they've forced John McClane (and his daughter) into. 

They did this for Die Hard With A Vengeance, too. It was originally called "Simon Sez", and featured some generic main character. Then some suit thought it would make a good DH movie, so they shoehorned John McClane in there as the protaganist, as well as the Hans Gruber connection.

[Candyflip]

Still, this does not at any one point feel like a Die Hard film and that's the problem - it's a fun action flick that they've forced John McClane (and his daughter) into. 

They did this for Die Hard With A Vengeance, too. It was originally called "Simon Sez", and featured some generic main character. Then some suit thought it would make a good DH movie, so they shoehorned John McClane in there as the protaganist, as well as the Hans Gruber connection.

Except that worked.

I haven't seen DH 4, but that's the general vibe I got from the trailers. A generic action flick. I'll probably wait for DVD.

[Cyanista]

Willco is right on this one.  It's a great theater experience because omg crashes and explodeys and sassy quips (which hold up all right despite the lack of cursing), but it didn't feel exactly like home.

No matter what he says in the movie (yes, they wrote this into actual dialogue in the movie to try and convince the viewer it was happening), this was not a case of John McClane being in the wrong place at the wrong time, NOR was it a case of John McClane being the only guy for the job.  The FBI guy actually got there in plenty of time to have stopped the bad guy even if McClane, Daughter, and Mac guy all bit it.

No, he actually like put on his superhero face and started fighting vehicles as if he could not die.  Still, it was a fun movie.  I have hope for the director's cut.  Maybe if they give McClane his balls back the movie will benefit.

[$till LegendaryU2K]

 Die hard movie, PG-13?

Sounds a dream come true. Btw, die hard 3 is still the best and always will be. And the reason why it dont feel like a die hard movie, well because the storyline is kinda stupid and john hair is gone, not to mention his sidekick is lame and how long did it take for another new die hard movie to come out?

See, many many problems, which makes this new die hard flick a 3/5.

[The Fake Shemp]

Still, this does not at any one point feel like a Die Hard film and that's the problem - it's a fun action flick that they've forced John McClane (and his daughter) into. 

They did this for Die Hard With A Vengeance, too. It was originally called "Simon Sez", and featured some generic main character. Then some suit thought it would make a good DH movie, so they shoehorned John McClane in there as the protaganist, as well as the Hans Gruber connection.

As Candyflip said - that worked.  Even the original Die Hard wasn't written as a Die Hard movie.  It's fine to take another script and rework it, but they really didn't here.

[$till LegendaryU2K]

 Die hard 2 was the lamest. It didnt look like a die hard movie, and even tho the action was pretty good, it just didnt feel like die hard 1 or die hard 3.

[rodi]

Holy crap, the first Die Hard was the only one worth watching.

[MyNameIsMethodis]

What was the one with the guns, and the explosion, and the airplane, and the terrorist, and the yippie ki yay?+

[MrAngryFace]

I wont watch it because ive never liked the Die Hard movies, but in 4's defense this screen looks cool:

[The Fake Shemp]

I think you might like it, dude.

[MrAngryFace]

I dont want to see it, so I probably won't ever like it.

[The Fake Shemp]

I dont want to see it, so I probably won't ever like it.

 

Fair enough.  It's not really "like" the other Die Hard films.  I think you'd like some of the more practical stunt work and action - it'll appeal to you on that level.

[Ichirou]

I saw this movie yesterday.  I thought it was terrible, and not just because it didn't feel like a Die Hard movie (it was originally just another action movie script until it was adapted to shoehorn in the John McClane character so it could become Die Hard 4 - but hey, they did that to Die Hard With A Vengeance, and it turned out really well, so that's not an excuse).  The movie has an awful fucking script which shows no understanding of the McClane character or the reason why the Die Hard movies were successful in the first place.  McClane was always supposed to be a very human hero, far removed from the testosterone-fueled adventures of Schwarzenegger and Stallone.  The "hacker" stuff is cliched and oooold, the villains are awful (especially Olyphant - wtf, dude, I thought you could act after Deadwood, but I guess clenched jaw intensity is all you can do), and McClane has no personal investment in the action until about 3/4 of the way through the film ('cuz they shoehorn in his daughter...they should've just used his wife like they did in the first two, at least that way there would have been a returning cast member other than Willis).

I've decided to give up on rating stuff, but this was putrid.  This along with Pirates of the Caribbean III (which I also saw yesterday) have made me  at the movies.

EDIT: And also, the first two movies had Carl Winslow as the sidekick (and he was pretty fucking awesome, IMO), and the third one upgraded to Samuel L. Jackson, and then for the fourth one we get JUSTIN FUCKING LONG.  THE MAC GUY.  THE FRICKIN' MAC GUY.

THIS MOVIE SUCKS ASS, DO NOT LISTEN TO WILLCO, DO NOT GO SEE IT IN THEATERS.  JOHN MCCLANE DESERVED BETTER THAN THIS.

[CajoleJuice]

I wont watch it because ive never liked the Die Hard movies, but in 4's defense this screen looks cool:

WHAT THE FUCK

[Van Cruncheon]

eh, i was never big on the die hard movies, myself. die hard was dumb fun largely because of alan rickman; the rest were forgettable crap in the vein of speed.

[Ecrofirt]

Jesus fucking christ, this movie sucked balls. Goddamnit.

The only fucking redeeming part was Tuvoc.

[CajoleJuice]

eh, i was never big on the die hard movies, myself. die hard was dumb fun largely because of alan rickman; the rest were forgettable crap in the vein of speed.

Well, at least you admit the first is good. 

[Van Cruncheon]

it's entertaining; it's not really good.

come, let's not squabble. sit on my lap and we shall speak of vic mackey and other matters, my pet.

[TVC15]

I like how Vic Mackey and friends treat black people in a way FoC could jerk it to.

[Van Cruncheon]

if shane was flabby and impotent, he could be a police version of foc.

[CajoleJuice]

Shane is so racist lolz

[The Fake Shemp]

If you get hung up on the fact that this is not a Die Hard film, I could see someone hating or tearing the film down.  But just as Terminator 3 was a solid action flick, albeit nowhere near as good as its predecessor, people will not look past that and instead focus on how it strip mines the license for buckets of Jewish shekels.

[Ichirou]

If you get hung up on the fact that this is not a Die Hard film, I could see someone hating or tearing the film down.  But just as Terminator 3 was a solid action flick, albeit nowhere near as good as its predecessor, people will not look past that and instead focus on how it strip mines the license for buckets of Jewish shekels.

Die Hard 4.0 is not a solid action flick.  It is a silvery turd.  There is absolutely nothing good about this movie - Bruce Willis doesn't even look like he's really trying, he looks positively dour.  And he's saddled with a supremely shitty supporting cast - the only one worth a damn is Maggie Q and all she's given to do is look pretty, do a few high kicks ('cuz all asian people know kung fu don'tcha know) and show off her boobles.

And Kevin Smith as "Warlock"...the fat nerd living in his mom's basement...Jesus Christ, the bottom of the barrel of cliches.

And Mr. Olyphant, WHO HACKED INTO NORAD USING A LAPTOP OMGZZZZZ...the bad guy from Hackers made a better villain.

[The Fake Shemp]

Again, you're shooting it down based on characters and comparing it to its predecessors.  What about the action?  It's pretty damn good - that's what!

[Ichirou]

The only halfway decent action sequence in the movie is McClane vs. za chopper.  Everything else is either totally mediocre or ridiculously unbelievable (McClane vs. jet).  I must've checked my watch six times during the movie hoping it was going to be over, and soon.

A good action movie can't rely solely on technically impressive (but utterly soulless) action set pieces.  There's gotta be something else to keep the viewer's interest, and in this respect the latest Die Hard totally FAILS.

[The Fake Shemp]

Meh, I thought it was a fun ride and all the folks involved, save for Olyphant, were fun to watch.  I really dug Willis, but I wish he wasn't playing McClane or the film was not titled Die Hard.

[Ichirou]

To be honest, I would think it sucks even if it weren't a Die Hard film, I'm honestly not being blinded by franchise love.  Though the fact that it has to live up to the previous DH films just makes 4.0's failures all the more obvious.

[The Fake Shemp]

You might tell me that's true, but your posts say otherwise.  I'm not saying you're some crazed fanboy.  It's not a Die Hard film - I think I said that in the first post.  McClane is a completely different character in this and he's been forced (in addition to his daughter) into a script that feels like 24: The Motion Picture.  If I was going to compare it to the other Die Hard installments, I could sit and tear it apart all day.  Really, I could. 

But - hey! - the action beats were all there, there's lots of cool, practical stuntwork and Willis still has great screen presence.  It's worth the price of admission alone to watch him slug it out with Maggie Q.

[Ichirou]

How do my posts say otherwise?  Yeah, I'm using the other Die Hard films as a point of comparison 'cuz, y'know, this is Die Hard 4.0.  But even if this were "Generic Bruce Willis Actioner", I would still loathe it, I just wouldn't have paid good money to see it in a theater.

Also, the Maggie Q scene was useless and lasts, what, all of five minutes?  lol, the super-hot asian hacker chick turns out to be a KUNG-FU EXPERT.  That was just way too  for me.

[The Fake Shemp]

She wasn't much of a kung fu expert, dude.  There was nothing there she couldn't learn in a self defense class or military training (there was no insane choreography).  She kicked and grabbed a few times and McClane knocked her the FUCK OUT.

She was obviously military to some degree, as she was knowledgeable on computer infrastructure, firearms and hand-to-hand combat.  I don't think it's THAT preposterous considering that Gabriel worked the government and that was her boy toy.

What was over-the-top was the jet scene.

[Ichirou]

She wasn't much of a kung fu expert, dude.  There was nothing there she couldn't learn in a self defense class or military training (there was no insane choreography).  She kicked and grabbed a few times and McClane knocked her the FUCK OUT.

Okay, I'll give you that point (though the fact that an asian chick starts pulling out kung-fu moves still seems horribly cliched to me), but the fact remains that she was a complete cipher, as were all of the other bad guys, which was probably the movie's biggest flaw.  If there had been some kind of amusing interaction between Willis and the bad guys, something to make it feel like some sort of tangible victory had been achieved whenever he took one out...but, nothing.  DH4.0 just feels...empty.

[The Fake Shemp]

It definitely feels disjointed from the other films, and I'd place it firmly in the The Last Boyscout tier of action films that Bruce Willis has done from over the years, but I guess that's what really matters - did you like The Last Boyscout as an action film?  If not, I can probably understand why you didn't like this.

I think the worst part about this sequel is that even a carbon copy of a Die Hard sequel still features cooler stuntwork and more practical effects than most modern Hollywood action films.

[Ichirou]

The Last Boy Scout at least has amusing interactions between Willis and Wayans...compare that to Willis and the kid from the Mac ads trading quips and it's no contest.  And did you gag slightly when Justin Long started on his "NEWS IS CONTROLLED BY THE GOVERNMENT" paranoid technogeek conspiracy rant when McClane turned on the radio at the start?  Because that part was where I started to realize that this movie would hold no surprises for me. :/

[Ecrofirt]

What was over-the-top was the jet scene.

And the car-kills-helicopter scene
And the SUV in an elevator scene
And the pressing-delete-blows-you-up scene (What fucking hacker wouldn't notice that someone added a BOMB to the innards of his or her computer? And who presses the fucking DELETE key to close a window or whatever?)
And the hackers take down the entire national infrastructure plot
And the fucking ridiculous Kevin Smith basement scene

Well, they weren't all over the top, but they were all fucking shit.

The only time I really enjoyed the movie at all was when that Tuvoc motherfucker came on. He was in like 2 scenes, and I thought I was gonig to get kicked out of the theater when he came on the second time because I couldn't stop laughing.

[Ichirou]

What was over-the-top was the jet scene.

And the car-kills-helicopter scene
And the SUV in an elevator scene
And the pressing-delete-blows-you-up scene (What fucking hacker wouldn't notice that someone added a BOMB to the innards of his or her computer? And who presses the fucking DELETE key to close a window or whatever?)
And the hackers take down the entire national infrastructure plot
And the fucking ridiculous Kevin Smith basement scene

Well, they weren't all over the top, but they were all fucking shit.

The only time I really enjoyed the movie at all was when that Tuvoc motherfucker came on. He was in like 2 scenes, and I thought I was gonig to get kicked out of the theater when he came on the second time because I couldn't stop laughing.

LOL AT PRESSING DELETE BLOWING YOU UP!!!  Yes, that was fucking RIDICULOUS.  The movie just showed a lack of knowledge about technology in general.  Kevin Smith as WARLOCK.  HOLY SHIT.  Talk about vomit-inducing.  I hated every second of the movie that guy was in, and NOT because it's Kevin Smith but because it's such a stereotypical representation of a computer hacker ("LOL GUYZ I GOT THIS IDEA - WHY DOESN'T MACCLANE GO SEE A HACKER - BUT THE TWIST IS...THE HACKER IS THIS FAT DUDE LIVING IN HIS MOM'S BASEMENT!" Also, what was the big deal with Warlock's house being "the only one with electricity"? Do they honestly expect us to think WARLOCK hacked the power company (lol) into sending him electricity?  Or that he has multiple electric generators in his home (note that the guy had like six or seven TVs and monitors turned on, plus ALL THE LIGHTS IN THE HOUSE).

SUCH A FUCKING distinguished mentally-challenged MOVIE.

[The Fake Shemp]

The Last Boy Scout at least has amusing interactions between Willis and Wayans...compare that to Willis and the kid from the Mac ads trading quips and it's no contest.  And did you gag slightly when Justin Long started on his "NEWS IS CONTROLLED BY THE GOVERNMENT" paranoid technogeek conspiracy rant when McClane turned on the radio at the start?  Because that part was where I started to realize that this movie would hold no surprises for me. :/

That really wasn't that bad.  Long carried himself well, but if you're going to point out bad dialogue - it should be the "bad timing awards" bit or something.  I don't understand why you'd be bothered by the fact that a socially awkward, anti-establishment hacker had a paranoid technogeek conspiracy rant.  It kind of just goes with the territory.

[Ichirou]

I just think that a guy who's being hunted down probably wouldn't be antagonizing the dude who had just saved his ass.

"LOL you like Creedence Clearwater Revival"

"LOL you listen to radio news"

"LOL HAY GUYS CAN I STOP AND GET A BURGER?  I AM STARRRVING (or some ketchup packets)"

[The Fake Shemp]

I don't think it was that antagonistic, dude.  You're reading a bit much in that.  Obnoxious?  Yes.  Antagonistic?  Not really.

The Kevin Smith part didn't bother me because he lived in mom's basement (guess what, a lot of nerds do - who cares), but because it was Kevin Smith.  That was just lame.

[Ichirou]

I guess we have a difference of opinion, dude - you think that just looked at as an action film and not part of the DH franchise, it's an okay, fun movie.  I just think it sucks all across the board, and never the twain shall meet. 

[The Fake Shemp]

I think we can both agree that the Kevin Smith part was lame.

[Ichirou]

Totally.

[Tauntaun]

I love CCR! 

I FEEL A BAD MOON A RISING!

[futami]

there's no blood in this film.

the deaths, while plentiful, are always cut in a way so as to not show much of anything besides the quick dispatchment of enemies.

the villian, unconvincing in his menace, seemed like a straight ripoff of bogosian's mastermind in under siege 2.

it's certainly not as bad as i thought it'd be, but it didn't feel at all like the 4th installment in the same series that gave us die hard 1.

[Tauntaun]

there's no blood in this film.

the deaths, while plentiful, are always cut in a way so as to not show much of anything besides the quick dispatchment of enemies.

the villian, unconvincing in his menace, seemed like a straight ripoff of bogosian's mastermind in under siege 2.

it's certainly not as bad as i thought it'd be, but it didn't feel at all like the 4th installment in the same series that gave us die hard 1.

Oh right right, like the mac guy should get movie blood all over his pair of $5,000 jeans, COME ON!