Author Topic: Looks like it's Biden  (Read 7452 times)

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Mandark

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Looks like it's Biden
« on: August 23, 2008, 02:15:19 AM »
Not official yet and I might be wading into "Dewey Defeats Truman" territory here.

Not too thrilled personally.  Biden seems to be solidly in the middle of the Democratic Party and has done some good on things like college tuition and violence against women. But he was a sponsor of and driving force behind the godawful bankruptcy bill a couple years ago.

In any case he's not as energized by domestic stuff as he is by foreign policy.  He tends to be pretty accurate and insightful when he summarizes a geopolitical brouhaha (unlike Lieberman et al who are describing fictional worlds) but he always seems to follow it up with a solution that overestimates America's ability to shape events outside of its borders.

Like with the current Bush admin the Secretary of State, Secretary of Defense, and National Security Advisor will all have to compete with the Office of the Vice President for influence.  Biden doesn't strike me as a guy who would be content with attending state funerals and waiting for Obama's death or the odd tiebreaking vote in the Senate.

On the other hand, I award him a billion points for this:

[youtube=425,350]mPOAKXBi9Pw[/youtube]

MrAngryFace

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2008, 02:19:54 AM »
Not sure how I feel bout this yet. I dont know much bout Biden.
o_0

Crushed

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2008, 02:27:16 AM »
Quote
"There has been no harsher critic of Barack Obama's lack of experience than Joe Biden," McCain campaign spokesman Ben Porritt said in a written statement.

"Biden has denounced Barack Obama's poor foreign policy judgment and has strongly argued in his own words what Americans are quickly realizing -- that Barack Obama is not ready to be president."

So the McCain campaign admits that Obama can win over even the harshest of critics.
wtc

Mandark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2008, 02:37:32 AM »
I don't think that's true, though.

I was following the whole thing pretty closely and I don't remember Biden sticking it to Obama.  I'm sure he must have tweaked him at some point but if a legendary quote machine like Biden was strongly opposed to Obama we would have seen at least a couple overblown news cycles about it.

Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2008, 02:53:33 AM »
the only thing i know about biden is he's white, he's a male, and he called Obama a distinguished black fellow.  no, not that other word.
Crm

Grecco

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2008, 03:27:16 AM »
An old guy whose been in Washingon mehtastic pick

BlueTsunami

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2008, 04:07:33 AM »
Seemed like the safe choice. I can dig it.
:9

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2008, 08:21:32 AM »
I don't think that's true, though.

I was following the whole thing pretty closely and I don't remember Biden sticking it to Obama.  I'm sure he must have tweaked him at some point but if a legendary quote machine like Biden was strongly opposed to Obama we would have seen at least a couple overblown news cycles about it.

[youtube=425,350]LSMS85bo4WM[/youtube]


It would be easy for Biden to wiggle out of that. "I didn't think he was ready at the time, but as I watched him campaign with such wit and grace blah blah blah"
010

Eric P

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2008, 08:33:03 AM »
well the VP debates will be interesting at least.
spoiler (click to show/hide)
fffffffffffffFFFFFFFFFFFFfffffffffffffffffffffffuck
[close]
Tonya

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2008, 08:36:47 AM »
sucks, but it's not like i would have liked his other choices much better
pcp

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2008, 08:39:50 AM »
He was the best choice on the short list imo, by a long shot. But no matter what he did Obama was in for criticism: he needed a specific type of VP, and not many people fit the "foreign policy attack dog who also represents/was born in important state" mold. Seemed like Biden, Nunn, or Clark to me.

But Mandark makes good points. He'll probably be giving Susan Rice and the rest of Obama's fp team a good workout every day
010

GilloD

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2008, 08:46:43 AM »
I'm telling you, it's a Laurel and Hardy thing.
wha

GilloD

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2008, 08:52:32 AM »
wha

GilloD

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2008, 08:56:27 AM »
So, anyway. I think aside from all Biden's credentials, more than anything he's the "funny" one to Barack's "serious" one. He'll say something goofy- Blacks are dumb- that taps into a truth no one wants to speak. Barack will apologize and say, "What he means is that urban communities are under funded!". That way they get the "working-man,GWB, plain English" thing done and they get the progressive, ELITE thing done and everyone feels like they won.
wha

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2008, 09:01:06 AM »
The good cop/bad cop routine  :o

I wonder when the Obama camp will send Biden to Pennsylvania to campaign his ass off; can't wait to see how that state's numbers change. I doubt Obama will get a huge poll bump nationally but Penn. should be interesting
010

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2008, 11:38:32 AM »
i bet he was BIDEN his time for this nom!

...


...

you don't know how long i was waiting to say that

you have no idea

GIRL LET ME TOUCH U
duc

GilloD

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #16 on: August 23, 2008, 12:06:12 PM »
i bet he was BIDEN his time for this nom!

...


...

you don't know how long i was waiting to say that

you have no idea

GIRL LET ME TOUCH U

Looks like Obama kept poor Evan at BAYH.
wha

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #17 on: August 23, 2008, 12:08:02 PM »
:o


:lol
duc

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #18 on: August 23, 2008, 01:51:54 PM »
Bad pick, further chipping away at the reason everyday people are excited about Obama: a fresh face, nice guy, not a firebrand, who was right about the war.  I see the entire purpose of manipulating media hype over the pick--but putting the announcement so close to the convention--as an attempt to stop the possible hemorrhaging caused by this choice, which I guess is a strong tactical maneuver but also underscores how ridiculous it is.  I do however like the fact that this is another data point in my, "Obama is W'08" argument, but it's a Pyrrhic victory at best; you go with the candidate / President you have, not the etc etc you etc.

This 08 election is turning out weird--people are definitely charged up, but they're charged up about an enormously boring race that has been more about the utter unseriousness of the media, coupled by an endless cascade of gaffes and fumbles by everyone running.  The reality is completely overshadowed by the noise.


/disappointed
***

Eric P

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #19 on: August 23, 2008, 02:22:40 PM »
should've gone with rev wright
Tonya

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #20 on: August 23, 2008, 02:39:04 PM »
Always go with your heart
***

bachikarn

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #21 on: August 23, 2008, 02:54:26 PM »
Obama / Biden...

Osama Bin Laden...

COME ON!

jiji

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #22 on: August 23, 2008, 03:21:48 PM »
OSAMA BEEN HIDIN'

 :o :o  :american
OTL

siamesedreamer

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #23 on: August 23, 2008, 03:26:49 PM »
Biden's a fucking badass. I've always liked him. Had he been the DEM nominee I probably would have voted for him.

Just don't get the pick since Biden represents just about everything Obama has been running against this entire campaign.

Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #24 on: August 23, 2008, 04:41:24 PM »
how dunno how to feel

i both support and disapprove of this pick
Crm

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #25 on: August 23, 2008, 05:10:11 PM »
Yeah looking at the booger on my finger I can't help but feel the same way.
***

Olivia Wilde Homo

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #26 on: August 23, 2008, 05:41:29 PM »
I still thought he would make a better Secretary of State than a Vice President.

I can see why he would pick him since he has foreign policy experience.  At the same time, the fact that he is something of a loose cannon and a machine politician is going to make it easier for McCain and Co. to attack the Obama/Biden ticket. 
🍆🍆

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #27 on: August 23, 2008, 05:56:05 PM »
I think the last thing you want as Secretary of State is a "loose cannon" though
***

Mandark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #28 on: August 23, 2008, 06:31:29 PM »
I rolled my eyes a bit when David Brooks talked up Biden as a working class Democrat, but apparently he's one of the poorest Senators and maybe the poorest.  Makes some sense because he's been in the Senate forever and you usually can't get a lot of outside income while sitting in Congress.  Byrd's down there too.

Be nice to see a little more of the class warfare they've started with the McCain-house thing.

siamesedreamer

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #29 on: August 23, 2008, 06:44:09 PM »
Biden's a fucking badass. I've always liked him. Had he been the DEM nominee I probably would have voted for him.

Just don't get the pick since Biden represents just about everything Obama has been running against this entire campaign.

Best of both worlds?

Nah...Biden won't do anything to stop Obama from nuking the economy.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #30 on: August 23, 2008, 07:07:03 PM »
Bad pick, further chipping away at the reason everyday people are excited about Obama: a fresh face, nice guy, not a firebrand, who was right about the war.  I see the entire purpose of manipulating media hype over the pick--but putting the announcement so close to the convention--as an attempt to stop the possible hemorrhaging caused by this choice, which I guess is a strong tactical maneuver but also underscores how ridiculous it is.  I do however like the fact that this is another data point in my, "Obama is W'08" argument, but it's a Pyrrhic victory at best; you go with the candidate / President you have, not the etc etc you etc.

This 08 election is turning out weird--people are definitely charged up, but they're charged up about an enormously boring race that has been more about the utter unseriousness of the media, coupled by an endless cascade of gaffes and fumbles by everyone running.  The reality is completely overshadowed by the noise.


/disappointed

Picking a "fresh", inexperienced face would backfire more than picking a Washington "insider" - who actually isn't an insider. If he picked say Kaine people would complain about the youth and experience of the ticket. I would much rather have the media - because honestly they're the only people who'll complain about this - complaining about him picking an experienced, "old Washington insider" than have voters becoming even more worried about Obama's lack of experience

Biden is popular with the voters who will decide the election. He's going to secure Penn. and be very popular in Ohio and Michigan. There wasn't a better choice available. Obama said it best: he's spend decades bringing change to Washington, but Washington hasn't changed him.
010

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #31 on: August 23, 2008, 07:22:02 PM »
Should I reply to your post here or on GAF? ;P
***

TVC15

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #32 on: August 23, 2008, 07:38:26 PM »
Bad pick, further chipping away at the reason everyday people are excited about Obama: a fresh face, nice guy, not a firebrand, who was right about the war.  I see the entire purpose of manipulating media hype over the pick--but putting the announcement so close to the convention--as an attempt to stop the possible hemorrhaging caused by this choice, which I guess is a strong tactical maneuver but also underscores how ridiculous it is.  I do however like the fact that this is another data point in my, "Obama is W'08" argument, but it's a Pyrrhic victory at best; you go with the candidate / President you have, not the etc etc you etc.

This 08 election is turning out weird--people are definitely charged up, but they're charged up about an enormously boring race that has been more about the utter unseriousness of the media, coupled by an endless cascade of gaffes and fumbles by everyone running.  The reality is completely overshadowed by the noise.


/disappointed

Picking a "fresh", inexperienced face would backfire more than picking a Washington "insider" - who actually isn't an insider. If he picked say Kaine people would complain about the youth and experience of the ticket. I would much rather have the media - because honestly they're the only people who'll complain about this - complaining about him picking an experienced, "old Washington insider" than have voters becoming even more worried about Obama's lack of experience

Biden is popular with the voters who will decide the election. He's going to secure Penn. and be very popular in Ohio and Michigan. There wasn't a better choice available. Obama said it best: he's spend decades bringing change to Washington, but Washington hasn't changed him.

I agree with PD.  Biden was a "diplomatic" pick.  While he's not some ur-liberal that will bring hope and change, he'll get more people to consider the Obama campaign.
serge

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #33 on: August 23, 2008, 07:52:14 PM »
I think that unlike Cheney:Bush, Biden does not add gravitas to the Obama Presidency.  Quite the opposite actually.  Biden's a hothead who loves to hear himself talk.  Cheney has said maybe three words in the last two years and one of them was a growl.  And then you get all the negatives of having a very strong, very opinionated VP to deal with--Obama's "Team of Rivals" fantasy that threatens to end up being a Clintonian circular firing squad.

Youth tickets do work.  Future of the party / future of America tickets do work (especially when they're pretty).  This isn't 04; with such an enormous positive public reaction in 08 to the idea of getting new blood, it's baffling why you'd want to preemptively hit the self-destruct button on it just because your enemy's only plus is his longevity.
***

AdmiralViscen

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #34 on: August 23, 2008, 07:56:36 PM »
So who do you think he should have picked?

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #35 on: August 23, 2008, 08:02:24 PM »
I thought he was going to go with Bayh, and I thought that would be a good choice.  Ultimately though I would have been more ok with anyone who could reasonably be considered someone Obama thought shared his direction for the future of the party / America.
***

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2008, 08:32:57 PM »
Youth tickets don't work when the vast majority of voters don't even think you're qualified to be president. Come on. Clinton was an established governor with executive experience. Same with Bush. Their VP choices were direct opposites though: Clinton doubled down on his positives (fresh face), Bush chose an established consigliere. Obama doesn't have executive experience and most voters aren't impressed with the experience he does have. I hate bringing race into this but I would argue that Obama has more ground to cover because he constantly has to prove himself to certain voters, who don't give him the benefit of the doubt they might give to someone else; that doesn't make them racist, they're just less trusting of this dude ("well I kinda like him, but what do we really know about him?").

Kaine has been governor for less than a term and hasn't done anything spectacular. Sebelius is a no name governor from a pure red state; she has an anti-gun history, she has tried to raise taxes on many occasions, and she has no foreign policy experience. Bayh was a very successful governor of a red state, he cut taxes...but he also co-chaired a committee for the liberation of Iraq with John McCain; Biden was initially wrong about Iraq but Bayh went overboard.

As Mandark said, Biden hasn't shown much interest in domestic policy - an area where most voters favor Obama. He shores up Obama's weakness on Iraq, he appeals to regular white working class voters, he's a brilliant debater, etc.

You're right: if Obama becomes president I'm sure Biden will have many passionate debates with Susan Ride and the rest of the fp team. But at the end of the day Obama will be making the decisions. Biden is going to offer wise advice. If anything he'll overshadow the Sec of State (Richardson seems like a timid guy who'd constantly be pushed to the side by Biden, for instance)
010

Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #37 on: August 23, 2008, 08:48:41 PM »
PD you should become an EB exclusive.  Why do you bother with the GAF obama-circle jerk anayways
Crm

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #38 on: August 23, 2008, 08:50:24 PM »
If youth tickets don't work, then why is Obama the presumptive nominee?  They do work.  This is a perfect year for it to work.  Biden is a bad choice when it comes to message, and a bad choice when it comes to filling the office itself.  He's a fair choice to win the VP candidates' debate though.  Bravo.  As useless as the VP really is, at the very least try and use it to incubate / elevate your choice to lead the party when you're out of office; not someone whose positive soundbytes are going to be equally matched by the negative ones, and who might see his office as the Real Presidency he was never close to getting.



And if recent history has shown anything, it's the amazing benefit of having your Secretary of State overwhelmed by a VP with his own agenda.
***

Amir0x

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #39 on: August 23, 2008, 10:05:52 PM »
Not many posts in here to judge by comparison, but PoliGAF was pretty infuriating today and this seems better tonight.  Nice to see SOME decent back and forth over here.  Too bad not many people are participating in this one.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #40 on: August 23, 2008, 10:10:35 PM »
Er, primary elections work differently than general elections. There are no caucuses to spam now, and decent youth turnouts no longer result in state blowouts at this stage. I'm not belittling Obama's primary successes, but we must realize this is a new game.



With respect to succession: if Obama serves 8 years Biden will be what, 73 years old? Who knows whether he'd run for president at that age, and if not guess what - Obama's got shit ton of buddies in the wing to take the job. All those candidates too inexperienced this year would be front runners to extend the Democratic Dominance. Warner? Kaine? Sebelius (lol Hillary)?  Bayh? Now that's a primary I can't wait to witness
010

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #41 on: August 23, 2008, 11:13:44 PM »
I don't think it's a compelling counter-argument to simply suggest, "it doesn't have to be that way."  I also question the relevance of your poll, when in fact it's Obama who will be running for President, and Obama who will be CIC.  I know the argument is that people are dumb, but the assumption that Biden will control foreign policy has its disadvantages, disadvantages that aren't represented in that poll (plus I don't believe I've been arguing it will cost him the election--just that it's a crappy pick on message, and a crappy pick for the office).  We can see how much that differential shifts when next week's polls come out however.

If "too inexperienced" is a disqualifier for the office of VP, how is it not an argument against an "inexperienced" President?  If your VP has a chance of running when your term is up, then choose someone who you feel represents the future of the party.  If he doesn't, then make sure he knows he isn't President.  If anything (well, "if anything" it should go to the runner-up, but that was nixed) the roles should be reversed, especially in the case where you have a relatively fresh political hand at the reigns: you want a strong President with a promising and independent VP with an eye on holding the Office in eight years; if you want active dissent, it's going to happen in your cabinet anyway.  Again, the last thing you want is a domineering VP who thinks he's President.  Honestly, this observation has gone from "lol he's like the Dem's Bush" to, "OMG they actually fucking WANT a Democrat version of W's Presidency!" It's kinda spooky.
***

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #42 on: August 23, 2008, 11:21:39 PM »
what sayeth you, Mandark?
010

AdmiralViscen

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #43 on: August 23, 2008, 11:23:00 PM »
Not many posts in here to judge by comparison, but PoliGAF was pretty infuriating today and this seems better tonight.  Nice to see SOME decent back and forth over here.  Too bad not many people are participating in this one.

Thanks for the insight

Fresh Prince

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #44 on: August 23, 2008, 11:26:30 PM »
Quite the opposite actually.  Biden's a hothead who loves to hear himself talk. 
Same as McCain but it hasn't hurt his chances. I want McCAin to chose Bobby Jindal just because he's a crazy converted Catholic.
888

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #45 on: August 23, 2008, 11:27:28 PM »
Thanks for the insight.
***

Fresh Prince

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #46 on: August 23, 2008, 11:31:40 PM »
You still sore over Obama-is-the-antichrist thread?

Thanks for the insight.
888

demi

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #47 on: August 23, 2008, 11:33:33 PM »
David Spade is so snippy
fat

APF

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #48 on: August 23, 2008, 11:47:25 PM »
You still sore over Obama-is-the-antichrist thread?

Thanks for the insight.

And you are...?
***

Mandark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #49 on: August 23, 2008, 11:48:01 PM »
what sayeth you, Mandark?

I'm still basking in the afterglow of avoiding Evan Bayh.  Woulda been hard talking myself into that pick.

Fresh Prince

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #50 on: August 23, 2008, 11:51:05 PM »
888

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #51 on: August 24, 2008, 12:08:33 AM »
what sayeth you, Mandark?

I'm still basking in the afterglow of avoiding Evan Bayh.  Woulda been hard talking myself into that pick.

I liked him until I found out about the Liberation of Iraq co-chair thingie, plus this

Quote
Yet on a chaotic election night in Indianapolis, when Clinton’s staff was panicking about the excruciatingly slow count of votes in Obama-friendly Lake County, Bayh seemed powerless to scare up inside information.

To the amazement of several Clinton insiders, he sat in a holding room, hunched over a laptop, hitting the “refresh” button over and over on a newspaper website’s interactive vote tracker in a state he was supposed to dominate.

“He’s a great guy, but he couldn’t even get the scoop on the results in his own state,” said a Clinton supporter who witnessed the scene. “He was just waiting around like everybody else. It seemed like he didn’t really have the juice we thought.”
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12629.html
 :-\
010

Mandark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #52 on: August 24, 2008, 12:20:01 AM »
I liked him until I found out about the Liberation of Iraq co-chair thingie, plus this

He's definitely a hawk.  Not just that he's more comfortable with the use of force than I am but that he actively pushes the Democratic party in that direction.

He voted in favor of the Kyl-Lieberman amendment, wants to boot Russia out of the G-8, thinks it's a shame that Iraq has soured America on fighting wars (specifically one in Iran), and the opening salvo of his campaign was a foreign policy speech largely seen as targeting Hillary Clinton from the right.

Plus there's that whole DLC chairmanship thing.  That starts him off with a big deficit in my accounts.

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #53 on: August 24, 2008, 12:32:40 AM »
The Kyl-Lieberman amendment yay/nay list kinda gives you an idea of who did and didn't learn their lesson from the Iraq resolution.
010

Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #54 on: August 24, 2008, 12:35:16 AM »
Your insight is thanked
Crm

siamesedreamer

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #55 on: August 24, 2008, 01:50:03 AM »
Watching Biden today you get a sense of why he was picked. He's going to be a great attack dog for Obama. But, at the same time, I think they run the risk where he could end up being so good at it that he completely overshadows the main dude who in effect looks like a complete pussy.

He already made one pretty huge gaffe that was overlooked, but the McCain people caught it. He said, "She [his wife] also has a doctorate degree which is a problem." Why the fuck would he said that? You know its going to be twisted just like the "100 years in Iraq" and "$5 million is rich".

Then there's foot in mouth moments like this:

[youtube=425,350]E9aIb-IplqY&eurl[/youtube]

I imagine we'll be seeing that quite a bit in the future...


treythemovie

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #56 on: August 24, 2008, 05:28:56 AM »
what sayeth you, Mandark?

I'm still basking in the afterglow of avoiding Evan Bayh.  Woulda been hard talking myself into that pick.

I was actually getting a little worried when it became clear that Obama was trying to decide between Bayh and Biden. Thankfully the media responded with love of Biden while Obama's base cried out "Anyone but Bayh!"

tiesto

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #57 on: August 24, 2008, 10:52:45 AM »
I'm not a fan. Biden is the one responsible for the creation of the Drug Tsar, and he was one of the main supporters of the R.A.V.E. act. His positions on drug policy have set the country back decades.

:piss The RAVE act :piss2
^_^

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #58 on: August 24, 2008, 11:35:08 AM »
Watching Biden today you get a sense of why he was picked. He's going to be a great attack dog for Obama. But, at the same time, I think they run the risk where he could end up being so good at it that he completely overshadows the main dude who in effect looks like a complete pussy.

Biden will throw the punches Obama can't connect - or can't even throw. I almost jumped out the car when he said "these times require more than a good soldier, they require a wise leader." It's essentially what Clark was saying, but without the chance of being misinterpreted/twisted/etc

Article on the VP process. Interesting points: Kerry advised Obama to really take his time and find a compatible partner ; Richardson was greatly considered; Biden's working class roots (past and present) were as important as his fp experience

And this is funny:
Quote
Mr. Biden, meanwhile, was viewed as undercutting himself with his own behavior as reporters staked out his Delaware residence. When Mr. Biden returned home in his white pickup truck from a garbage dump and made an off-color joke to camera crews last week, an e-mail message circulated among Mr. Bayh’s closest associates that read, “Keep talking Joe, please keep talking.”

He did not.
lol
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/24/us/politics/24deconstruct.html?_r=1&hp=&adxnnl=1&oref=slogin&adxnnlx=1219590305-SeaB+FtJ9yAFlo7ws03eEQ
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TakingBackSunday

  • Banana Grabber
  • Senior Member
Re: Looks like it's Biden
« Reply #59 on: August 24, 2008, 02:31:03 PM »
That video is awesome  :lol
püp