Author Topic: What book(s) are you reading?  (Read 844788 times)

0 Members and 6 Guests are viewing this topic.

desert punk

  • ENDUT! HOCH HECH!
  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2760 on: November 22, 2017, 03:16:28 PM »
(History of Rome by Theodor Mommsen)
one of the founding classics of modern historiography; how are you liking it?

It’s really great. I didn’t expect it to be that readable, but Mommsen’s prose is really really good (at least in the German original that I’m reading). He shows so much passion and intensity, particularly when describing important events and battles. But even when he gets into the minutiae of the constitution, religious customs or whatever, it never gets boring. I also like his wit, as subtle and dry as it may be.

It may be outdated in parts, but since my knowledge of Ancient Rome is rather shaky the more I move away from the Late Republic and Early Principate era, it’s not as noticeable for me, except maybe the early chapters describing the ethnogenesis of the Italic people. I’m cross-checking a lot anyway and it’s worth reading just for the prose alone.

While Mommsen is never really quite impartial, I did notice a tendency during the Hannibalian war chapters to paint the senate as the voice of reason while heaping the blame for the defeats at Cannae and earlier battles onto the general citizenry and decrying them (quite harshly) for voting fools into the consulship. Not squarely of course, he also blames a general mistrust between senate and people and the dual military leadership of the consuls for the failing war. Still, I wonder how he’s going to reconcile the admiration for the senate he’s showing here with his excessive partisanship for Caesar later on.

« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 03:30:01 PM by desert punk »

jakefromstatefarm

  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2761 on: November 22, 2017, 04:02:11 PM »
I haven’t read it outside a single passage that’s cited offhand in one of Will Durant’s essays (which is killing me because I can’t remember/find it), so I’m afraid I don’t have anything intelligent to add. I will say though that if you’re interested in what a more recent macropolitical survey would look like, Syme’s Roman Revolution and Gruen’s Last Generation of the Roman Republic are worth looking into. Though both are obviously limited to the 1st centuries bc/ad.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2762 on: November 22, 2017, 09:35:49 PM »
It may be outdated in parts, but since my knowledge of Ancient Rome is rather shaky the more I move away from the Late Republic and Early Principate era,
Isn't everybody's?

spoiler (click to show/hide)
For you non-history dorks/elite degree holders (loser dorks), IIRC that's one of the two periods when there's the big gap missing in ancient historian's accounts. And by gap, I mean that we never found their works about those periods to republish. Even during the Empire, some later historians just sorta fake their way through the periods like writing a capstone paper off the equivalent of 300 AD's Wikipedia "History of Rome" page.
[close]

Olivia Wilde Homo

  • Proud Kinkshamer
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2763 on: November 22, 2017, 10:51:29 PM »
There's one period of time (5th and 6th century Britain) where the only real source is a guy who sounds like he's "Get off my lawn" personified: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gildas

Of course, the fact that there's only one (suspect) source is probably proof that Britain was in bad shape at this time but this ties into my overall theory that Britain has always been shit and will always be shit.
🍆🍆

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2764 on: November 22, 2017, 11:44:22 PM »
I always thought more historiography courses should start off by explaining the situation with Ancient Greek history which is incredibly well preserved considering the time tables involved. But the general opinion for laymen is that it's vaguely accurate because it can be confirmed elsewhere like through Persian history, etc. but any details are basically later Greek politics. Like if Sean Hannity wrote a history book, he'd probably put Vietnam and stuff in it in a way that's in line with lots of other histories, but all sorts of other stuff would be him fitting stuff into his world view and maybe even making shit up like how the anti-war movement lost it. And you want to approach history with the knowledge that just because Sean Hannity's book is the only one you can find 3000 or even 30 years later...

The five historiography courses I worked on, the one I took, and a few others I've been familiar with, do explore this idea but always seem to use like George Bancroft or Henry Adams (probably because they've received so much attention from historians) even though nobody really knows who they are or what they did let alone anything about antebellum histories, especially not undergrads.

Though the main takeaway I got is that nobody in history departments wants to teach historiography. Our department provided some "incentives" once after the professor of it bolted to South Carolina or something in what felt like the middle of the night (he seriously emptied out his office over the weekend lol) and somebody finally volunteered. Rather than just use the old syllabus and tweak it they wrote their own, I was "on" the "committee" to review them, which was usually a rubber stamp, officially as administration (budget/legal, they aren't scheduling field trips constantly, etc.) but they allowed me to make academic criticisms since I had a masters and all, so I sent a mass e-mail like five minutes after we got it because he started the course with the founding of the American Historical Association and spent half the semester on famous 20th century "historians" before getting to the main part of "how to read newspapers from the library, look up historical documents, etc." for the second half, and I was like "assuming an American focus, this at least needs to start with colonial historiography right?" I don't think they did a historiography course that year. That whole episode explained a lot about that department really in retrospect. Or myself. Like how much of a garbage fun ruiner I am with my stupid faux-intellectualism.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 11:49:12 PM by benjipwns »

desert punk

  • ENDUT! HOCH HECH!
  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2765 on: November 23, 2017, 02:35:43 AM »
Even during the Empire, some later historians just sorta fake their way through the periods like writing a capstone paper off the equivalent of 300 AD's Wikipedia "History of Rome" page.

:lol

Olivia Wilde Homo

  • Proud Kinkshamer
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2766 on: November 23, 2017, 08:23:42 AM »
The biases of historical records should be taken into account.  For example, in the year 5000, after a couple of nuclear winters, people find that the only source that exists about 2017 is RejectEra posts.  Based on that "history", they'd think that Gamergate was some massive watershed moment for humanity.  Also Naughty Dog games were considered the pinnacle of high culture.

Maybe one day we can find a copy of Lives of Famous Whores somewhere.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 08:28:58 AM by Olivia Wilde Homo »
🍆🍆

HardcoreRetro

  • Punk Mushi no Onna
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2767 on: December 28, 2017, 01:50:42 PM »
Reading some dutch History of America book.

I like the first few chapters. "The spanish were terrible, but don't worry, the mayans and incas were pieces of shit as well."

The book also said that Columbus brought syfilis back with him to Europe. (I put it in google and found some 2011 study saying they just found that. How the hell does this 1965 dutch history book on the Americas have the same information?)

Tasty

  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2768 on: December 28, 2017, 02:01:58 PM »
The book also said that Columbus brought syfilis back with him to Europe. (I put it in google and found some 2011 study saying they just found that. How the hell does this 1965 dutch history book on the Americas have the same information?)

Rumors that later ended up being confirmed by science? Or a lucky guess?

eleuin

  • perennial loser
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2769 on: December 28, 2017, 02:36:18 PM »

Syph

  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2770 on: December 28, 2017, 02:59:54 PM »
Also Naughty Dog games were considered the pinnacle of high culture.
not entirely untrue
XO

HardcoreRetro

  • Punk Mushi no Onna
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2771 on: December 28, 2017, 03:42:14 PM »
The book also said that Columbus brought syfilis back with him to Europe. (I put it in google and found some 2011 study saying they just found that. How the hell does this 1965 dutch history book on the Americas have the same information?)

Rumors that later ended up being confirmed by science? Or a lucky guess?

Going by wikipedia, we still don't know for sure.



I like this treatment for a nose defect by syphilis on the page though.

I'm a Puppy!

  • Knows the muffin man.
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2772 on: January 24, 2018, 11:46:16 AM »
gardens of the moon.  You can read the first 5 books in the series before the reading order gets complicated (and even then its not complicated like a lot of people try to make it seem)

Note that GotM was written a decade before the rest of the books and so its writing style is not nearly as good as the rest of the series.  Also its ok that its confusing.  Just roll with it - its part of the experience.
OK, we need to talk about this Arvie.

I got the book started to read it. It got stolen when I was about 80 pages in. I went and read a bunch of history books and finally got around to re-ordering it. I'm about halfway and well.....I don't know what to make of it.

I mean the first hundred or so pages are rather well written. Very tight and moves well. You understand who the characters are, and what is happening, to an extent. After that though, it sorta falls off a cliff. The author does some stuff that just irks me. First off he throws a bunch of characters and places and things at you and doesn't explain who they are, why they're important, what they want, etc. It started to grate on me and I actually wrote some stuff down. For example: Dude starts a chapter by giving you 4 new names of things in the first sentence of the chapter. I wrote these words down. 125 pages later, none of those words were important or came up again. I'm not saying everything needs to be Chekov's gun but man, don't overwhelm me with terminology and stuff I don't have to remember.

Also, a lot of the interactions are not really believable. That's fine, usually, fantasy writers are 10x better at making a world that works than characters that work, it's par for course. Annoying, but I'm not going to fault him too much there. There's a lot of threads out there and floating around. I feel like the author let the world get away from him and everything feels like a jumbled mess right now. It really worked well in the first hundred pages with fewer characters and all that. Now it feels like we're following everyone, everywhere and people keep popping up....sorta.

I don't know what to make of it honestly. I'm still reading it to see if it all gets back in line, like it was in the beginning, and I'm going on the recommendation. If Arvie said it's not bad, I'll give it a full opportunity. I guess we'll see.
que

Joe Molotov

  • I'm much more humble than you would understand.
  • Administrator
©@©™

HardcoreRetro

  • Punk Mushi no Onna
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2774 on: January 27, 2018, 01:04:38 PM »
Still going through that history of America.

Apparently Benjamin Franklin's grandmother was a white slave from England. Seems his grandfather bought her from the slave owner and married her.

History is great.

VomKriege

  • Do the moron
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2775 on: January 27, 2018, 01:20:29 PM »
I've started reading a bit again and I'm patiently crawling through Anna Karenina. I regret not having been more astute because that book is a joy. I'm currently at the part where Levine brother died and Anna tries to see his son in Petersburg as Alexis is trying to rebuild his home on God and countess Ivanovna. Every page or so will have a tactful, just description of feelings I can relate to. Hopefully the ridiculously character heavy plot makes it easier to hop in and out, the beauty lies in their study and not so much on story beats.

I have still a good 1/3 to go through but I really look forward to finish it and attack a new novel. I keep buying books despite and I want to reduce that backlog (Dr.Zhivago recently).
ὕβρις

HardcoreRetro

  • Punk Mushi no Onna
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2776 on: January 27, 2018, 01:46:59 PM »
I have still a good 1/3 to go through but I really look forward to finish it and attack a new novel. I keep buying books despite and I want to reduce that backlog (Dr.Zhivago recently).

Own over 500 books, have actually only read like 250 of them...

chronovore

  • relapsed dev
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2777 on: January 27, 2018, 08:11:53 PM »
 I’m still working my way through the Expanse series, and audio book form, and finished the fourth one. I have not been impressed at all with the third one, so I was very excited how well paced and coherent the last when I read was. I’m happy to have a good series I can stick with. I may end up reading listening to all of them.

 In contrast, I am reading Chuck Wendig’s AFTERMATH, the new Star Wars canon novel of what happened after Return of the Jedi. I didn’t sample it before purchasing it, or I might not have. It is a dramatic reading with sound effects and music. I don’t need any of that stuff, and it encourages scenery chewing reading rather than storytelling. Not feeling it.

VomKriege

  • Do the moron
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2778 on: February 01, 2018, 06:46:38 PM »
Anna leaves me cold and Vronski comes through as a but of an asshole, both being pretty self centered. The narrator hides nothing of their flaws but there's a bit of a Laura Palmer syndrom going on with the unabashed praise from every character which elicit suspicion from me. I'm at the part where she meets Levin and I can't really believe he would just be instantly gushing given how restrained of a man he is.

I've read that part months ago but that wedding proposal with chalk had me emotional.
ὕβρις

Madrun Badrun

  • twin-anused mascot
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2779 on: February 01, 2018, 07:40:12 PM »
gardens of the moon.  You can read the first 5 books in the series before the reading order gets complicated (and even then its not complicated like a lot of people try to make it seem)

Note that GotM was written a decade before the rest of the books and so its writing style is not nearly as good as the rest of the series.  Also its ok that its confusing.  Just roll with it - its part of the experience.
OK, we need to talk about this Arvie.

I got the book started to read it. It got stolen when I was about 80 pages in. I went and read a bunch of history books and finally got around to re-ordering it. I'm about halfway and well.....I don't know what to make of it.

I mean the first hundred or so pages are rather well written. Very tight and moves well. You understand who the characters are, and what is happening, to an extent. After that though, it sorta falls off a cliff. The author does some stuff that just irks me. First off he throws a bunch of characters and places and things at you and doesn't explain who they are, why they're important, what they want, etc. It started to grate on me and I actually wrote some stuff down. For example: Dude starts a chapter by giving you 4 new names of things in the first sentence of the chapter. I wrote these words down. 125 pages later, none of those words were important or came up again. I'm not saying everything needs to be Chekov's gun but man, don't overwhelm me with terminology and stuff I don't have to remember.

Also, a lot of the interactions are not really believable. That's fine, usually, fantasy writers are 10x better at making a world that works than characters that work, it's par for course. Annoying, but I'm not going to fault him too much there. There's a lot of threads out there and floating around. I feel like the author let the world get away from him and everything feels like a jumbled mess right now. It really worked well in the first hundred pages with fewer characters and all that. Now it feels like we're following everyone, everywhere and people keep popping up....sorta.

I don't know what to make of it honestly. I'm still reading it to see if it all gets back in line, like it was in the beginning, and I'm going on the recommendation. If Arvie said it's not bad, I'll give it a full opportunity. I guess we'll see.

Just seeing this now.  Bascially this is how everyone feels reading the book.  Don't worry.   Now some people hate it and stop the series, others continue.  It gets better, and his writing improves a hell of a lot by book 2 which makes a lot of the issues - like character interactions - better.  There are also a lot of characters and all of them are important.  Again Gardens is particularly bad in regards to this but this is pretty much all the books.  The cool thing is that minor characters all have a story and some of their stories are damn good.  There is a character that only gets a few paragraphs in books 4 and 6 then about 60 pages in book 7 and in those 60 pages becomes one of the most loved characters in the series. 

The main issue is there is no Harry Potter or Bilbo to discover the world with the reader.  You are thrown into it - and into the middle of a war to boot - with  all characters having some understanding of the world.  And it gets worse in that there is no Dumboldor or Gandolf that knows what's what in the world to eventually explain it to you.  In fact, knowledge is power in Malazan and the people that know some things will not share it very often and may actually lie to the reader on a rare occasion.  No one in the world of Malazan has a complete picture of things and that makes it really hard for a reader.  Also, the world of Malazan is very dynamic so the way things were does not necessarily mean they stay that way.  So feeling the like the world building got away with the author is a very natural feeling.  You won't start getting a non-hazy vision of the world until book 3.  When it starts to click it will be an awesome feeling and well worth the initial confusion. 

Its worth pointing out that SE wrote the books with the intention of trying to not fall for standard fantasy tropes like the Farm Boy trope with Harry or Bilbo.  This is particularly apparent with Gardens when the writing is clunky and doesn't always work.  Its also worth pointing that Gardens is really just a fraction of Malazan and my feelings about it are very coloured by what comes next.  It is a much better book after having read books 2-4. 

new siege of Pale image https://i.redd.it/ohpqbo8bymd01.jpg
« Last Edit: February 01, 2018, 07:55:13 PM by TheInfelicitousDandy »

I'm a Puppy!

  • Knows the muffin man.
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2780 on: February 01, 2018, 08:05:14 PM »
Thanks for the reply. I was starting to think "man, I must be dense" and while that's true, it's good to know that it didn't have much to do with my general feeling of being perplexed
que

Madrun Badrun

  • twin-anused mascot
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2781 on: February 01, 2018, 08:16:24 PM »
Also if you keep reading.  Stay away from google and the malazan wiki.  Go to r/malazan if you have questions.  They answer everything in non-spoiler ways.

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2782 on: February 01, 2018, 10:33:01 PM »
I’m still working my way through the Expanse series, and audio book form, and finished the fourth one. I have not been impressed at all with the third one, so I was very excited how well paced and coherent the last when I read was. I’m happy to have a good series I can stick with. I may end up reading listening to all of them.

 In contrast, I am reading Chuck Wendig’s AFTERMATH, the new Star Wars canon novel of what happened after Return of the Jedi. I didn’t sample it before purchasing it, or I might not have. It is a dramatic reading with sound effects and music. I don’t need any of that stuff, and it encourages scenery chewing reading rather than storytelling. Not feeling it.

I had kind of heard the same about aftermath and thus haven't read it. The new trilogy desperately needs something to explain the events after rotj.

By the way, I recently read the Southern Reach series because I was at the library and the cover looked cool. I'd pretty much recommend it. It's a pretty fascinating mystery, but it is not resolved very cleanly.

The movie Annihilation looks like its barely freaking based on it though, despite being an interpretation.

chronovore

  • relapsed dev
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2783 on: February 01, 2018, 11:51:55 PM »
https://twitter.com/scottlynch78/status/959277334447755264

I thing I did not know about Scott Lynch! I want to go back to this series.


I’m still working my way through the Expanse series, and audio book form, and finished the fourth one. I have not been impressed at all with the third one, so I was very excited how well paced and coherent the last when I read was. I’m happy to have a good series I can stick with. I may end up reading listening to all of them.

 In contrast, I am reading Chuck Wendig’s AFTERMATH, the new Star Wars canon novel of what happened after Return of the Jedi. I didn’t sample it before purchasing it, or I might not have. It is a dramatic reading with sound effects and music. I don’t need any of that stuff, and it encourages scenery chewing reading rather than storytelling. Not feeling it.

I had kind of heard the same about aftermath and thus haven't read it. The new trilogy desperately needs something to explain the events after rotj.

By the way, I recently read the Southern Reach series because I was at the library and the cover looked cool. I'd pretty much recommend it. It's a pretty fascinating mystery, but it is not resolved very cleanly.

The movie Annihilation looks like its barely freaking based on it though, despite being an interpretation.

I've picked up Annihilation and plan to read it at some point. The movie looks good, but I try and keep movie adaptations separate in my head.


Thanks for the reply. I was starting to think "man, I must be dense" and while that's true, it's good to know that it didn't have much to do with my general feeling of being perplexed
I was just as baffled with some of it going on. One thing I recall is that there are apparently two characters that are actually just ONE character, but no-one knows it — especially not the reader. So… yeah, GOOD ONE, Erikson! You got us!  :-\

Madrun Badrun

  • twin-anused mascot
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2784 on: February 02, 2018, 12:11:34 AM »
Who?

Cerveza mas fina

  • I don't care for Islam tbqh
  • filler
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2785 on: February 02, 2018, 12:54:23 AM »
Finished listening to the Antidote which is about how people embrace hardships instead of denying them, kind of an anti self-help book.

It was pretty interesting for someone like me who is not big on only "positive thinking" for positive thinking sake.



https://www.theguardian.com/books/2012/jun/22/the-antidote-oliver-burkeman-review

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2786 on: February 02, 2018, 01:03:53 AM »
Oh, I forgot to post here, I read House of Leaves last month for a book club. Pretty much every review on Goodreads is like 5 star or 1 star.

Didn't love it, didn't hate it, had some interesting ideas, sections, layers, was enjoyable about as often as it was skimmable, worked as a satire of high-literary analysis, but also was a lot of waste of time (20 page chapter on how echoes work; don't even get me started on some of the footnotes). Took me a bit to get the book, and when I did and learned to parse what's worth reading and what's worth skimming was pretty entertaining. End was a bit weak.

Big ass book, but worth a read. Can't get passionate about it either way. 3 stars  :idont


chronovore

  • relapsed dev
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2787 on: February 02, 2018, 08:22:24 AM »
Oh, I forgot to post here, I read House of Leaves last month for a book club. Pretty much every review on Goodreads is like 5 star or 1 star.

Didn't love it, didn't hate it, had some interesting ideas, sections, layers, was enjoyable about as often as it was skimmable, worked as a satire of high-literary analysis, but also was a lot of waste of time (20 page chapter on how echoes work; don't even get me started on some of the footnotes). Took me a bit to get the book, and when I did and learned to parse what's worth reading and what's worth skimming was pretty entertaining. End was a bit weak.

Big ass book, but worth a read. Can't get passionate about it either way. 3 stars  :idont
Best way to enjoy house of leaves is through the author's sister's album, which is sublime.

Who?
Scott Lynch, author of the Gentlemen Bastard series. The Lies of Locke Lamorra is one of the best fantasy books I've ever read.

Madrun Badrun

  • twin-anused mascot
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2788 on: February 02, 2018, 08:51:56 AM »
No the two characters that are actually just one character?

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2789 on: February 02, 2018, 12:14:00 PM »
Oh, I forgot to post here, I read House of Leaves last month for a book club. Pretty much every review on Goodreads is like 5 star or 1 star.

Didn't love it, didn't hate it, had some interesting ideas, sections, layers, was enjoyable about as often as it was skimmable, worked as a satire of high-literary analysis, but also was a lot of waste of time (20 page chapter on how echoes work; don't even get me started on some of the footnotes). Took me a bit to get the book, and when I did and learned to parse what's worth reading and what's worth skimming was pretty entertaining. End was a bit weak.

Big ass book, but worth a read. Can't get passionate about it either way. 3 stars  :idont
Best way to enjoy house of leaves is through the author's sister's album, which is sublime.

Music album?

chronovore

  • relapsed dev
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2790 on: February 04, 2018, 08:24:01 PM »
(…)
Best way to enjoy house of leaves is through the author's sister's album, which is sublime.

Music album?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haunted_(Poe_album)

jakefromstatefarm

  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2791 on: February 08, 2018, 04:05:13 PM »
The Order of Things, by Foucault.
ayy. Lemme know how it goes. Whether you like it, or your humanity gets effaced like ocean waves wiping away marks in sand on the beach.
Quote
Is this what people in college are reading nowadays?
about ~40 years ago, sure. Nowadays people crack into foucault with discipline and punish primarily, maybe history of sexuality or his lectures at Berkeley (which are fairly accessible). Order of things and archaeology are hugely important to his methodology but they mark they end of his early period, so they don’t deal directly with the sociological/anthropological themes like power/sex of his later stuff (they do inform that later stuff though). Also importantly, they give the best sense of the philosophy of science tradition he’s growing out of; it’s important to remember he’s as much an inheritor of canguilhem and batailles as Levi-Strauss.

TVC15

  • Laugh when you can, it’s cheap medicine -LB
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2792 on: February 10, 2018, 06:10:32 PM »
I read House of Leaves like 20 years ago when it came out. It’s fun. It’s a weird situation of the book relying on a cheap gimmick while simultaneously being pretty far up its own ass. I had just discovered Jorge Luis Borges 2 or so years before reading it, so I enjoyed the many references to him and his work. I tried to reread it at some point and, well, it ended up being a one time ride for me. Just read Borges instead. At least his stuff is like all under 10 pages.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2018, 07:07:22 PM by TVC 15 »
serge

TVC15

  • Laugh when you can, it’s cheap medicine -LB
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2793 on: February 10, 2018, 07:06:53 PM »
TVC, the current year is 2018. Are you ok?

Oh, fuck, that was in reference to House of Leaves. I forgot to quote the post, lol.

serge

TVC15

  • Laugh when you can, it’s cheap medicine -LB
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2794 on: February 10, 2018, 07:09:22 PM »
Also, Order of Things is one of my least favorite of the big Foucault books. Discipline and Punish along with Madness and Civilization are my faves.

I figured I should add a comment relevant to your post :p
serge

TVC15

  • Laugh when you can, it’s cheap medicine -LB
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2795 on: February 10, 2018, 07:19:48 PM »
I don’t know how to begin answering that. I like transgressive stuff and wish the world was more interesting than it is.
serge

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2796 on: February 13, 2018, 04:18:31 PM »


Interesting semi-insider account of part of the Libor scandal, namely the only person to receive a jail sentence for it. Although it plays up a bit too much how the one character is an autistic savant, and some others had no formal education and came up the hard way and blah blah blah. It's obvious just from the material included in the first half which is supposed to portray the success before the storm that they knew, but they didn't care. Even the guy the blurb and book cover portray as a semi-victim is very clear in the recorded messages/e-mails/etc. from the time that he knew what he was doing and he was manipulating the brokers and his own bank as much if not more than they were supposedly manipulating him into this cabal.

The book also hits on but scurries away from the WHY aspect of how the "scam" worked, no one had a prior interest in it because it was effectively working as intended just not how they claimed it was intended, and this was because most people didn't care as long as it "worked" from their point of view.

The money was being made on the fringes of deals, like the Office Space scam, and would have continued to operate arguably just fine. Except you know, the banks collapsed, which exposed the fraud and more importantly removed the countepressures within the system. It notes a few times that Hayes couldn't get Libor moved in the direction he wanted because others banks were moving it against him, and later he even pisses off the employee in his own bank so that guy moves it against him, and it goes even further to note that the favors he was calling in, especially with brokers, were often ignored and they didn't actually know who to call or how to pressure Libor in a direction and more importantly they knew that Hayes wouldn't know this. (This is actually how the brokers avoided jail, by arguing that they didn't actually do anything but lie to their clients, which is a key part of their job.)

So again the problem was when the banks collapsed, Libor was exposed, especially because many of the banks who would have been countermanipulating it ceased to exist or at minimum stopped lending to other banks. So the difference between many variables went from explainable as noise to evidence of deliberate manipulation attempts. Which people knew was happening for years, and was complained about for as long.

This is probably an odd complaint from me of all people, but the book seems especially hard on the regulatory bodies and governmental oversight bodies. Even as the book explains how Libor existed and how it was never tied to any of those, where even the banks themselves didn't know or care how it operated. Amusingly, it seems the only significant country with a regulatory arm that could have legitimately claimed oversight was the United States, but that our banks assumed it was being regulated elsewhere. When the UK regulators actually ran interference against both the US government and US banks from trying to get involved or investigate or prosecute, and the entire system placed significant pressures on the branches US banks were operating in London to not tell the motherland banks anything. (Even though they in many cases arguably couldn't.)

One of the ball rolling moments was when a lowly official at a US branch of a smaller German bank contacted the Fed of New York about how this was being manipulated by non-US banks to the detriment of all kinds of people, and the Fed just forwarded it on to another agency and eventually it wound up at the CFTC who had to fuck everything up by starting an investigation after later reading about a WSJ story and tying it to this report they had sitting around. And when the private industry ran UK BBA (which owned Libor) got requests from the CFTC for basic information on how it works they forwarded it on to British regulators (who were headed by a man who had all his e-mails printed out for him into 2010, the real crime of this story) the UK regulators told the BBA to shut the fuck up about this and organized with all the banks to basically tell the CFTC to stick to the colonies, thanks.

Favourite paragraph maybe:
Quote
"If Goldmans can get it wrong, maybe there's a complete lack of public understanding?" Fisher wrote to Ewan. "If so, I would start by putting the official definition on the BBA website. And then get someone's son or daughter to edit Wikipedia [which had the wrong definition Goldmans used in their internal report]." A week later, someone corrected Wikipedia's definition. It was perhaps the only time that the BBA actually addressed a grievance about Libor.

Also nearly everyone involved apparently has "ruddy" cheeks. Unless they're a fee-male, then they all have high cheekbones and/or are pale. Someone should investigate the strange coincidence of that.

desert punk

  • ENDUT! HOCH HECH!
  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2797 on: February 14, 2018, 05:16:35 AM »
Finished Vineland from Thomas Pynchon earlier this month. Wasn’t my first Pynchon, I’ve already read The Crying of Lot 49 and Inherent Vice over the course of the last 2 years or so.

Was apprehensive when I contemplated reading him back then because he’s known for being obscure and difficult to read. But I didn’t really expect him to be this funny when I finally started with The Crying of Lot 49. I really dig his zany style, the weird characters he populates his equally crazy world with and that general feeling of confusion he creates with his opaque but clever prose. Pynchon is still a lot of fun, even if you have no clue what’s going on at times.

I liked Vineland a lot, though I can’t say if it’s better than the other books I’ve read. I did use a reading guide I found online this time, so I got a better handle on the myriad of references Pynchon makes than before. But like I said, for me it ain’t really that important if I miss some of the allusions and points he’s trying to make. His prose alone can sustain me just fine.
 
That said, I generally like the broad points he makes in regards to the downfall of hippie culture (caused as much by Nixon’s War on Drugs as by their own ignorance and weakness), and the complacency and media and television addiction of the Reagan Era. Though the most fun I had was during the middle of the novel, when he's riffing on William Gibson and cyberpunk, Godzilla and other fun shit :hyper

desert punk

  • ENDUT! HOCH HECH!
  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2798 on: February 14, 2018, 05:41:34 AM »
You've gotta read Gravity's Rainbow!

Yeah, it's gonna be the next Pynchon on my list, though I think I'm gonna do a re-read of Inherent Vice before that.

Corporal

  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2799 on: February 19, 2018, 09:36:06 AM »
Darn you all for reading all these fancy stuffs. Where's my fast food reading?

Time for webnovels. And I'm not talking about the 1000+ chapter monstrosities that some authors vomit at their readers. I'm more for the bite-sized variety. Short stories are OK too.

Examples:

Mulberry song. A shortish story dealing with loss and mourning. A man gains the throne but loses the love of his life in the process. She can't simply leave him alone and watches over him as a ghost. So we watch him grow old ....that's pretty much it. Kind of a sobstory, but has a nice ending. Fulfilling, in a way. I want me some of that bitter sweet reality-transcending love.
Four chapters.
https://www.novelupdates.com/series/mulberry-song/


My Hero. On friendship, and small acts of kindness that unknowingly have a big effect. A guy gets roped into babysitting his friend, the hero, who often wanders off and has his head in the clouds. They go and beat the baddy... And then the story is retold from another perspective.
Short story.
https://www.novelupdates.com/series/my-hero/


Our second Master. Its got a cripple in it! Written from the perspective of a lowly and of course not beautiful maid. She gets beaten and abused by the second master, a peerless beauty and major playboy. Then a catastrophe happens, and the severely wounded in body and spirit second master finds himself left with no options and no future, but with only that one pesky servant still at his side. Yeah, you know where this is going, but the titular second master has a major redemption arc that is pretty damn satisfying to read. No surprises, but feel good stuff with just the right amount of sugar and spice for a short snack.
Seven chapters.
https://www.novelupdates.com/series/our-second-master/


So yeah. Git 2 muh levl nubs. Let's roll around in the gutter for a while.
!list

TVC15

  • Laugh when you can, it’s cheap medicine -LB
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2800 on: February 19, 2018, 11:04:05 AM »
my copy o this came in

serge

desert punk

  • ENDUT! HOCH HECH!
  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2801 on: February 19, 2018, 12:39:41 PM »
Finished the Foundation-Trilogy by Isaac Asimov yesterday evening. I actually only read the last book, The Second Foundation, while I listened to a radio adaption of the first two books by the BBC. The radio play was okay but ancient. The sound effects sounded like they stole them straight from Star Trek: TOS. Weird beeps and whistles that hurt my ears after a while. That and the fact that they glossed over a lot of details convinced me to try out the last book at least.

Anyway, the trilogy was okay. As a history buff I appreciate how Asimov adapts the period of transformation of the Roman Empire and Europe from Antiquity to the Dark Ages into a space opera setting. But the basic premise of the novels, that SCIENCETM will prevent or at least shorten the descent of a Galactic Empire into barbarism for thousands of years with the help of some clever mathematics and the machinations of a bunch of stalwart scientists, is kinda naive and starry-eyed. Though context is key I suppose, and Asimov did write these books in the 40s and 50s where people still believed that scientific progress will lead them to salvation and utopia (despite ample evidence proving otherwise).

Other things to criticize are his dry prose and paper-thin characters, though you could argue that the fact that all the books are basically a collection of self-contained novellas, are counterproductive in creating deep characterizations. There are also almost no woman characters of note in the trilogy, except a precocious teenage girl in the last book, who was fun to read but rather inconsequential in the long run regarding the actual plot. The books in general are also a bit boring at times, especially in the first book, which is fragmented in five or six novellas. He gets more interesting in the following two books which consist of two novellas each.

TL;DR: Decent read that has some interesting concepts, but also suffers from boring parts, dry prose and shallow characterizations. Frank Herbert's Dune is the better old school space opera alternative. It deals with similar topics, but with better prose, characters and without the naive glorification of science and progress.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2802 on: February 28, 2018, 09:48:09 AM »
since i did the CIA one, i figured i might as well


benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2803 on: March 03, 2018, 10:55:53 AM »
keeping with a theme i suppose



about the break-in by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens%27_Commission_to_Investigate_the_FBI

HardcoreRetro

  • Punk Mushi no Onna
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2804 on: March 04, 2018, 04:40:04 AM »
G.A. Bredero's Spaanschen Brabander.

A dutch play from the 1600s.

Clockwork5

  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2805 on: March 06, 2018, 01:45:25 PM »
Just started reading Welcome to the Monkey House. It is a collection of short stories and ramblings by Kurt Vonnegut. One story,"Harrison Bergeron," was particularly fascinating. It is a look at forced equality in the future and was insightful, silly and hilarious in a cunning way. The other stories have been great as well. I'm looking forward to making my way through this collection.

Crash Dummy

  • teleiophile
  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2806 on: March 06, 2018, 05:29:13 PM »
i've gone from reading books kara would approve of to business books

chronovore

  • relapsed dev
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2807 on: March 06, 2018, 06:37:46 PM »
i've gone from reading books kara would approve of to business books
(Image removed from quote.)

Cool, just like the Baby-Boomers did!

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2808 on: March 07, 2018, 06:20:27 AM »
why doesn't it say "as recommended by etoliate, discussion driver of thebore.com" on the cover?

Crash Dummy

  • teleiophile
  • Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2809 on: March 07, 2018, 04:59:36 PM »
i've gone from reading books kara would approve of to business books
[img]https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51BT8oqQenL._SX324_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg[img]

Cool, just like the Baby-Boomers did!
what's almost as annoying is that the author gave a 90minute talk that's up on youtube that summarises and covers the book =/

VomKriege

  • Do the moron
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2810 on: March 10, 2018, 03:14:41 AM »
I jumped on to War & Peace and it is a joy (I mean really... It's the Young & the Restless but with scope, richness and subtlety) but I wanted to comment on the end of Anna Karenina which can be jarring or hilarious, depending on your disposition. Tolstoi is famous for never having been to reconcile in his writing his thoughts as an artist and his opinions as a moralist. Tension in artistic creation is often a good thing and most of the book lies in balance. Sometimes it does not.

Basically the book ends not with the titular character (which killed herself a few months ago at that point) but with Levin, the obvious self insert for Tolstoi, finally rounding the square and getting his late Christian epiphany. Which in itself doesn't bother me. The problem is that prior to that, Levin/Tolstoi savages the arrogance of intellectuals who believe they can tap into the will of the masses on the basis of biased anecdotes (specifically in the story with regards to Slavophiles and their belief that the Russian intervention in the Serbian-Turkish war is a spontaneous, unanimous, demand from the "people"), much to my enjoyment... Then turns around and use exactly the same faulty line of reasoning to justify Christianity  :lol

It's not a detriment to the book but still.
ὕβρις

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2811 on: March 10, 2018, 10:12:06 AM »
I like Tolstoy as a writer as there is something fascinating about his approach, but as an anarcho-pacifist I've never really "got him" for all that other stuff he wrote after his existential crisis like a lot of people do. The Kingdom of God Is Within You is regularly listed as anarchist canon but it was just a mess to me from what I recall.

But that may be because I've just always been irreligious, not a convert atheist or otherwise traditional American with enough Christian roots to be able to have a frame of reference with his specific beefs and their importance to his worldview. I often have that problem with dense Christianity.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2812 on: March 10, 2018, 10:14:14 AM »
Also, I think he went a bit overboard with the whole becoming a peasant hermit in the woods approach to nonviolence. But that's nobility that drops out of college and has to join the army to pay off gambling debts for you I guess.

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2813 on: March 10, 2018, 02:11:46 PM »
Finished Brandon Sanderson's The Hero of Ages capping out the Mistborn trilogy. Took me like 4-5 years to get through the 3 books, mostly because while I liked each one I never loved any of them so I'd read other stuff for a year or two before getting back to the next book in the series. This is my first Cosmere universe/Sanderson book series and I liked it, but yeah didn't love it. Felt like a JJ Abrams book series. B+ pure entertainment throughout, but no characters too complex or fancy prose. I liked the characters and the most interesting part was the world building of how this fantasy world came to be and its creatures and how all the magic system of metals pushing/pulling worked.

The ending was like very jrpg, felt a bit rushed. Idk, like I said B+ popcorn read. Good enough to get me interested in checking out more of the connected Sanderson universe, so I picked up the transition book for the sequel Mistborn series Alloy of Law as well as Sanderson's first book in Cosmere, Elantris. Will read them sometime. Need to get back to Stephen King's The Dark Tower now and read 5-7. After that maybe will read Elantris.

I'm kinda interested in reading his Stormlight Archives series, but going from Mistborn trilogy 1 I feel like it'll be JJ Abrams version of GRRM's Song of Ice & Fire and I dunno if that'll do it for me. Then again Mistborn was early in Sanderson's writing, so maybe his prose and character morality has improved. But then Stormlight is only 3 books in out of planned 10 and yeah dunno if I want to jump into something that's not going to finish for 20-30 years.


Oh, I forgot to post here, I read House of Leaves last month for a book club. Pretty much every review on Goodreads is like 5 star or 1 star.

Didn't love it, didn't hate it, had some interesting ideas, sections, layers, was enjoyable about as often as it was skimmable, worked as a satire of high-literary analysis, but also was a lot of waste of time (20 page chapter on how echoes work; don't even get me started on some of the footnotes). Took me a bit to get the book, and when I did and learned to parse what's worth reading and what's worth skimming was pretty entertaining. End was a bit weak.

Big ass book, but worth a read. Can't get passionate about it either way. 3 stars  :idont
Best way to enjoy house of leaves is through the author's sister's album, which is sublime.

Yo, Chrono! Did my book club on House of Leaves this week and we all listened to POE's haunted for a the week before to prep and discuss its relation in our discussion Qs. Yeah, good album! Reminds me of NIN x Silent Hill songs. Book club went well, was a lot of "what the fuck does this mean? Idk, IDK, idk..."

chronovore

  • relapsed dev
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2814 on: March 11, 2018, 06:16:44 AM »
I really love that album.

HardcoreRetro

  • Punk Mushi no Onna
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2815 on: March 13, 2018, 04:53:16 AM »
Het woud der verwachting by Hella Haasse (English title: In a Dark Wood Wandering.)

It's a historical novel about Charles of Orleans and basically traces his entire life. Not sure how to feel about it since it's more interesting as an historical account of his life than as a story.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2816 on: March 16, 2018, 02:36:35 AM »


A tale that chronicles the long forgotten times (1946-1968) when the government (almost entirely in the office of the Presidency, who were held by men of principled vision and detailed demands for pants) acted solely to achieve The Good (in the Aristotelian sense) and the people followed its mandates knowing they were for The Good. Unlike recent years where the government is so weak, crippled and paralyzed by fear of the people that it does literally nothing and basically no longer exists. A shameful sorry state of an anarchist hellscape ruled by selfish barons who refuse to walk away on the roads that government gifted prior generations.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2817 on: March 16, 2018, 02:41:27 AM »
it's kinda a book version of this Hillary (rip in peace) argument:

VomKriege

  • Do the moron
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2818 on: March 17, 2018, 06:45:17 AM »
War and Peace is so  :aah
ὕβρις

HardcoreRetro

  • Punk Mushi no Onna
  • Senior Member
Re: What book(s) are you reading?
« Reply #2819 on: March 17, 2018, 07:08:22 AM »
Read The Chrysalids by John Wyndham.

It's about conservative bible thumpers hating mutated humans in the post apocalypse.