apparently n'gai croal hates gaming

[Jansen]

http://www.slate.com/id/2206243/entry/2206594/

I think it's time for publishers to throw it a much bigger bone by leading development on Wii, then up-porting the games to the more powerful systems, which should result in a larger addressable audience.

DONOTWANT.jpg

[bork]

Who cares?

[dammitmattt]

This will just result in more 3rd party games that I ignore.  Make your Wii shit on the Wii and make your HD shit on the HD consoles.  Very few games translate well across all three.

[Purple Filth]

HD gaming needs to get off its ass.

MS need to push more and that goes for to you too SONY  

[Jansen]

Who cares?

who cares what you think others don't care about?!

[Mr. Gundam]

HD gaming needs to get off its ass.

MS need to push more and that goes for to you too SONY 

Push HARDER!!!!

[hyp]

n'gai is just asshurt that sony's doing so bad.

[Bocsius]

I used to agree with N'Gai. Now, I think the markets are too dissimilar. Publishers need to think about Wii for sure, peel away resources from PS3/360 once they've figured out how to complement Nintendo's own software, and start making some real money. I just don't think the ideas they come up with will translate all that well to the traditional consoles. I think Guitar Hero / Rock Band are the only multiplatform games doing well on Wii, and their success makes sense given the Wii's audience. Other games? Not so much.

[The Innocent X]

Best thing would be to recognise wii as something other than a games console and stop pretending to release "games" for it. Save those for games consoles.

[dammitmattt]

I used to agree with N'Gai. Now, I think the markets are too dissimilar. Publishers need to think about Wii for sure, peel away resources from PS3/360 once they've figured out how to complement Nintendo's own software, and start making some real money. I just don't think the ideas they come up with will translate all that well to the traditional consoles. I think Guitar Hero / Rock Band are the only multiplatform games doing well on Wii, and their success makes sense given the Wii's audience. Other games? Not so much.

Licensed kiddy movie games and the Lego games are also doing well on the Wii.  But those are typically no more "next-gen" than Gun was on the 360.

nobody is quite sure what works for wii yet.  if i had told you that Carnival Games was going to be a blockbuster success before it came out would you believe me?

I think you answered your own question.  Shit like Carnival Games works.

[bork]

Who cares?

who cares what you think others don't care about?!

 

[Himu]

lmao

[Olivia Wilde Homo]

Who gives a fuck about what this pseudointellectual thinks about anything?

[drew]

ok this does it

enough with the gaffy threads here

im sick of it

[dammitmattt]

It doesn't though.  there is a string of similiar games that are utter failures.  Carnival Games worked for some reason, but noone knows why exactly.

How do you know that?  There are also plenty of them that are successful.  Game Party is another one that comes to the top of my head.

Remember, these games are so shitty and so cheap to make that they might turn a profit selling 10 copies at a swap meet.

[Jansen]

okay how bout this. instead of discussing what n'gai has posted lets talk about soma bringer.

i just started playing it and it's awesome. shame that nintendo passed on localizing it.

[cool breeze]

this is yet another 'game journalist' who fears that they will become even more irrelevant so they turn to their only other option -- tossing Nintendo's salad.  Garnett Lee and Jeremy Parish both did this as well.

[Draft]

Is he wrong?

Nintendo is officially butt fucking Microsoft and Sony. Hardcore, east coast prison style.

Why does anyone bother making HD games? So they can sink $25 million dollars into a project and then $100 into a Wal-Mart shotgun when their project results in a game that moves 300k copies and disappears?

It's madness.

[cool breeze]

I'd like to think that some developers care about making quality games

oh, and also good games on the Wii don't sell. 

[WrikaWrek]

I just hope that when every publisher decides to ditch "experience/cinematic/HD/Hardcore" whatever gaming, that they do it really quick.

Like, BAM, now they are making party games and games that i don't want and shit. Then i can just leave this shitty hobby in an instant.


See, how can games ever be art, if devs are forced to make games they don't want to do, on platforms they don't want to do? So, the faster it happens, the better, because it will once and for eternity condemn games to the toy category, that Nintendo is so set on doing.

[Bocsius]

I'd like to think that some developers care about making quality games

Yeah, get over that idea. If I were a developer, I'd care about making a game that paid the bills first and foremost. Does it work? Will it sell? Ship it.

[Draft]

I also hope that publishers dump the whole "experience/cinematic" gaming thing as quickly as possible. Because it's stupid. And often embarrassing. And doesn't really result in better games.

I don't own a Wii. I have basically zero interest in owning a Wii.

But I do own a PC, and an Xbox, and a PS3. And the games I've played and enjoyed on those systems, aside from being in a higher resolution and having fancy textures and some motion blur, they all could basically be PS2 games.

I mean, maybe I'm wrong? Maybe there's a lot going on under the hood in Dead Space that's not immediately apparent to a layman like myself. But aside from being graphically amazing, it sure plays a whole lot like RE4.

Seems to me the only genuine gameplay advancement that the "HD" generation gifted upon us was coop.

[y2kev]

I wouldn't make an HD game.

[Bildi]

This will just result in more 3rd party games that I ignore.  Make your Wii shit on the Wii and make your HD shit on the HD consoles.  Very few games translate well across all three.

Yeah.  If a game is on the Wii and 360, there's no way I'll buy the Wii version.  They need to concentrate on making things like Zack & Wiki and Umbrella Chronicles.

[WrikaWrek]

If you take away the "experience/cinematic" gaming, you end up with either, party games, arcade games, or games better fit for persistent online gaming.

So, yeah, if you are into one of those, sure, ditch the "experience/cinematic" gaming. Personally, i don't give a fuck about those games, like didly fuck.

Yes it's cool to play buzz, and singstar when there's 10 people in the room, looking for entertainment, but what else? If i want to "socialize", well, i'm in social communication studies, i got plenty of socialization in college, i got EB, i got MSN, i got football, i got cellphone, shit i spend most of my time socializing with people. I barely watch T.V.

So whenever i want something that can be appreciated, more on an individual basis, i look to movies and "cinematic" games. That allow me to like bring those manchild, imagined adventures that brake the "monotonous"(it's not) real world life.

I want to be a hero, i want to be a detective, i wanna fight super villains, i wanna catch bad dudes, etc (*cue pussycat dolls*)

But whatever, end that part of gaming, i'll look elsewhere, no prob. I guess that's why some people when they start getting jobs, having bills to pay, another one to share his day to day life with, sorta stop playing games, because they are that sort of dudes, but i guess they stop "dreaming", and as a consequence, these games stop being something worth wasting money on.

[brawndolicious]

This would only increase the number of badly-ported waggle games on the other consoles, with really bad graphics.

[Phoenix Dark]

nobody is quite sure what works for wii yet.  if i had told you that Carnival Games was going to be a blockbuster success before it came out would you believe me?

I think you answered your own question.  Shit like Carnival Games works.

It doesn't though.  there is a string of similiar games that are utter failures.  Carnival Games worked for some reason, but noone knows why exactly.

Was it the marketing? There's lots of shovelware on the Wii aimed at families and thus it's hard for games to separate themselves from the pack. I'd imagine developers that manage to catch the eye of the desired demographics get more success. Which means less game previews/ads on G4 or IGN, and more ads during Ellen or in Oprah's magazine

[Eel O'Brian]

nobody is quite sure what works for wii yet.  if i had told you that Carnival Games was going to be a blockbuster success before it came out would you believe me?

I think you answered your own question.  Shit like Carnival Games works.

It doesn't though.  there is a string of similiar games that are utter failures.  Carnival Games worked for some reason, but noone knows why exactly.

i have the answer to this one, i believe

lots of more mature people own the wii, people my age and a bit older

when i was a kid, town fairs and carnivals were a big event every year (not so much nowadays), and it was a ritual to gather up a bunch of friends and spend an entire saturday night riding the rides and trying to win some worthless crap playing the "games"

so i think nostalgia and familiarity with the setting and minigames in carnival games had a lot to do with its success

i wonder if the mini-golf game sold as well (whereas carnival games is just mediocre, carnival games mini-golf is just flat-out terrible)

[Eel O'Brian]

btw, CoD WaW isn't bad at all on the wii

lots of options to micromanage the controls, and the online multiplayer is surprisingly smooth and fun

it's almost just like the other console versions with the ranking and perks - it's only deathmatch and team deathmatch modes, but the other modes probably wouldn't have made a whole lot of sense considering there's no way to communicate

the graphics...well, they did the best with what they had to work with

that's the way to do a port-down, though

[dammitmattt]

I also hope that publishers dump the whole "experience/cinematic" gaming thing as quickly as possible. Because it's stupid. And often embarrassing. And doesn't really result in better games.

I don't own a Wii. I have basically zero interest in owning a Wii.

But I do own a PC, and an Xbox, and a PS3. And the games I've played and enjoyed on those systems, aside from being in a higher resolution and having fancy textures and some motion blur, they all could basically be PS2 games.

I mean, maybe I'm wrong? Maybe there's a lot going on under the hood in Dead Space that's not immediately apparent to a layman like myself. But aside from being graphically amazing, it sure plays a whole lot like RE4.

Seems to me the only genuine gameplay advancement that the "HD" generation gifted upon us was coop.

The combination of clarity and scale.  Last gen, you had to pick one or the other.  Now you can have both.  That and having a persistent online persona across all games for the 360.  Those are the two biggest advancements of the HD generation.

[Draft]

If you take away the "experience/cinematic" gaming, you end up with either, party games, arcade games, or games better fit for persistent online gaming.

So, yeah, if you are into one of those, sure, ditch the "experience/cinematic" gaming. Personally, i don't give a fuck about those games, like didly fuck.

Basically, I'm like this: Dead Space is my GOTY 2008.

Strip away all the story stuff from Dead Space. The cut scenes, the voice over, all that crap.

Dump me into the same game, only with a splash screen at the front that reads, "You are Isaac Clarke, Space Welder. On a routine Space Welding mission gone awry, you've been stranded on the USG Ishimura, once the crown jewel of Space Welding, now a lifeless hulk full of crazy zombie aliens. Armed with nothing but your Space Welding tools, you must escape this nightmare made flesh. Good luck..."

It's still my GOTY. Easily.

I'm not against games creating mood and atmosphere with their visual and audio design. I'm actually all for it. But I do have huge contempt for every developer who thinks they're a movie director or Brian K. Vaughn. So drop that shit, and get back to the basics.

[WrikaWrek]

Oh, ok Draft.

Dead Space is a very "experience/cinematic" game to me. Non playable cut scenes isn't what makes those games, those games.

Imo taking that away from Dead Space would be horrible, like horrible. I mean what else do you have left? A shooting gallery.

[AdmiralViscen]

If you take away the "experience/cinematic" gaming, you end up with either, party games, arcade games, or games better fit for persistent online gaming.

So, yeah, if you are into one of those, sure, ditch the "experience/cinematic" gaming. Personally, i don't give a fuck about those games, like didly fuck.

Basically, I'm like this: Dead Space is my GOTY 2008.

Strip away all the story stuff from Dead Space. The cut scenes, the voice over, all that crap.

Dump me into the same game, only with a splash screen at the front that reads, "You are Isaac Clarke, Space Welder. On a routine Space Welding mission gone awry, you've been stranded on the USG Ishimura, once the crown jewel of Space Welding, now a lifeless hulk full of crazy zombie aliens. Armed with nothing but your Space Welding tools, you must escape this nightmare made flesh. Good luck..."

It's still my GOTY. Easily.

I'm not against games creating mood and atmosphere with their visual and audio design. I'm actually all for it. But I do have huge contempt for every developer who thinks they're a movie director or Brian K. Vaughn. So drop that shit, and get back to the basics.

Nailed it

[WrikaWrek]

Nailed it

Really?

I don't understand the appeal of bare bones "killing simulators".

[dammitmattt]

Nailed it

kbear???

[y2kev]

Nailed it

kbear???

that is the best nailed it that has ever been nailed, it is a revolutionary nailed it

[Draft]

Christ, stripping out the cinematic stuff from Dead Space and reducing it to it's "basics" would have resulted in a two hour game.  For a short game it is already overlong by like 4 hours.

Man, what a sweet two hours.

[AdmiralViscen]

Wrik, I like gameplay. I barely pay attention to game stories at all. They're all C-grade movie scripts anyway so why not cut costs their first.

I haven't played Dead Space but his post would apply to just about any non-RPG I've played.

Nailed it

kbear???

that is the best nailed it that has ever been nailed, it is a revolutionary nailed it

me

[cool breeze]

I liked Dead Space the way it was, I'd like it the same if it was the way Draft said it.  Makes no difference to me.

I do think that the game would have been scary if it was how he described it though.  The fact that people were telling me that I should be scared made me not.

[littlemathletics]

I'm not against games creating mood and atmosphere with their visual and audio design. I'm actually all for it. But I do have huge contempt for every developer who thinks they're a movie director or Brian K. Vaughn. So drop that shit, and get back to the basics.

This pretty much hits the nail on the head in regards to why GTA IV blew goats.

[fistfulofmetal]

I don't think game developers should just stop trying to make good well written stories in games just because they might not be as good as they hoped.
I'd rather them at least try and get better at it than it go away completely.

[WrikaWrek]

I liked Dead Space the way it was, I'd like it the same if it was the way Draft said it.  Makes no difference to me.

I do think that the game would have been scary if it was how he described it though.  The fact that people were telling me that I should be scared made me not.

So, take away context, characters, motif etc.

Really, what the hell is the point? It becomes a tech demo. In Dead Space's case at least.

[Draft]

I liked Dead Space the way it was, I'd like it the same if it was the way Draft said it.  Makes no difference to me.

I do think that the game would have been scary if it was how he described it though.  The fact that people were telling me that I should be scared made me not.

So, take away context, characters, motif etc.

Really, what the hell is the point? It becomes a tech demo. In Dead Space's case at least.

The point is to play a game.

Remember when games were just games? Like, when you fired up Contra III: The Alien Wars, you got about 45 seconds of exposition, and then the rest of the "story", defending the city, chasing the alien mother ship, bringing that bitch down, getting dropped off in Red Falcon's jungle base, it all happened while you were playing, and was related quickly and quietly.

That's the way to do it, man.

[AdmiralViscen]

I don't think game developers should just stop trying to make good well written stories in games just because they might not be as good as they hoped.
I'd rather them at least try and get better at it than it go away completely.

$$$$$$

[Eel O'Brian]

i can't believe no one's given me shit over buying cod for wii

[cool breeze]

I liked Dead Space the way it was, I'd like it the same if it was the way Draft said it.  Makes no difference to me.

I do think that the game would have been scary if it was how he described it though.  The fact that people were telling me that I should be scared made me not.

So, take away context, characters, motif etc.

Really, what the hell is the point? It becomes a tech demo. In Dead Space's case at least.

I liked that stuff.  I actually said that in my post.  I'm just saying that it would be scarier without that stuff, you know, that whole 'fear the unknown' thing.

[y2kev]

why is anyone making hd games

[dammitmattt]

why is anyone making hd games

Ask Infinity Ward, Treyarch, Epic, Bethesda, Valve, and Bungie.  Some of them actually sell.

i can't believe no one's given me shit over buying cod for wii

I assume that you reviewed it and got paid to play it.  I'm shocked that someone would actively choose to purchase that version.

Does that work?

[y2kev]

They could sell better on wii and be cheaper to make

like bungie has any choice

edit: bungie, treyarch, and infinity ward don't make hd games anyway

[EmCeeGrammar]

I cant disagree with him.
All new ips should be tested on low risk hardware. If it succeeds there you can move on to including other consoles.  The point is to see if the appeal exists in the first place. Even a POS like No More Heroes ended up selling 300k worldwide, no doubt they made good returns on that.  Now lets hope the sequel will be good.

[EmCeeGrammar]

They could sell better on wii and be cheaper to make

like bungie has any choice

edit: bungie, treyarch, and infinity ward don't make hd games anyway

Well CoD 3 and WaW are both on Wii and didnt outsell their 360 counterparts.

[y2kev]

They could sell better on wii and be cheaper to make

like bungie has any choice

edit: bungie, treyarch, and infinity ward don't make hd games anyway

Well CoD 3 and WaW are both on Wii and didnt outsell their 360 counterparts.

For 10 billion reasons. The Wii version is gimped, and the install base is already on the HD consoles. I don't understand why you'd buy the Wii version unless you don't have a 360, eel o'brian obviously excluded.

Do I think Wii games would sell as well as HD games if they got the same kind of attention and promotion? We're going to see VERY shortly. If the Conduit and Madworld bomb, I think it's going to be over for the foreseeable future for Wii (DQX nonwithstanding but really nobody cares).

[ananus]

this is the time of the year when there are the most games to play and eb is talking about sales numbers

[Eel O'Brian]

I assume that you reviewed it and got paid to play it.  I'm shocked that someone would actively choose to purchase that version.

Does that work?

no, i bought it, albeit not with Realbux™

got it used, burned off some gamestop credit and a jar full of loose change i'd cashed in at the coinstar machine

like i said, it's surprisingly fun online, i would have bought it new had it been $29.99 (in my opinion no wii games should be priced more than that)

[EmCeeGrammar]

Street fighter 4 numbers vs T vs C numbers in japan will be very telling.
When does Sf4 release again?

[dammitmattt]

I assume that you reviewed it and got paid to play it.  I'm shocked that someone would actively choose to purchase that version.

Does that work?

no, i bought it, albeit not with Realbux™

got it used, burned off some gamestop credit and a jar full of loose change i'd cashed in at the coinstar machine

like i said, it's surprisingly fun online, i would have bought it new had it been $29.99 (in my opinion no wii games should be priced more than that)

Except Mario Galaxy and Zelda.  Those are really the only two that I felt I got my $50 out of, and even then Zelda is iffy.  $30 would've been perfect for Mario Kart, Boom Blox, etc.

Street fighter 4 numbers vs T vs C numbers in japan will be very telling.
When does Sf4 release again?

Why is it telling?  Japan doesn't play real games anymore.

[y2kev]

No they won't. SF is a bigger brand than MvC ever was in Japan, and this is without Marvel involved.

You want a test? Have an equal quality version on all three platforms (except graphics) and see which sells more.

[Eel O'Brian]

if the wii version of madden had been priced at $30 or $40, do you think sales would have been much better, and would they have compensated for the lowered retail price?

[y2kev]

I really think EA's going about marketing their games all wrong on Wii. The whole All-Play stuff is confusing and contradictory-- they insist that they aren't dumbing down the game but that they've added stuff to the formula (and subtracted other stuff) so that anyone could play it. But I contend that if this were the case, those changes would be applied to EVERY version of Madden. EA still has these advertising deals with Sony and MS, so you never see the Wii version on TV. And then there's the box art and crap.

Personally I would like the Wii to go away. It does not deliver on any promise it ever made (the graphics of most games are sub-GC, the interface hasn't been used in fun and innovative ways for the majority of games, the online is absolutely unusable, the virtual console is a depressing piece of crap 95% of the time, WiiWare is an abortion) and it's had two really horrible years now, 1 or 2 games a year nonwithstanding. It's absolutely been worse than the GameCube.

But it deserves better games than what it has been getting. And publishers will have to wake up to this sooner or later.

[Eel O'Brian]

the online is fine to me, i've never been disconnected once, and never noticed any lag in mario kart even playing people from across the world

unless you mean hardly anyone bothers to include online play in their games