Wada "We have to reconstruct all our brands again"

[magus]

“We have to reconstruct all our brands again, and make them into something perfect. I regret the fact that we let them all get so sloppy.”

CHRONO TRIGGER GRITTY REBOOT INCOMING
I CAN FEEL IT IN MY SKIN

[pilonv1]

So what does this mean for those who defended their sloppy games?

[Diunx]

So what does this mean for those who defended their sloppy games?

It means they should get some dignity and stop defending games just because of their name.

[Great Rumbler]

The only thing that can redeem Square-Enix's paltry RPG record of late is Deus Ex 3 and Dungeon Siege 3.

[Mr. Gundam]

I want a fucking turn-based JRPG, but clearly that's asking too much.

[pilonv1]

The only thing that can redeem Square-Enix's paltry RPG record of late is Deus Ex 3 and Dungeon Siege 3.

Also



 

[Diunx]

I want a fucking turn-based JRPG, but clearly that's asking too much.

Isn't ff13 turn based? I want more games like the amazing ff12.

[Bebpo]

Fact: 8 out of 10 SE released games this gen are AAA.  That's a better output % than almost every company in the industry besides Blizzard/Rockstar.

People only think otherwise because all they see are the big FF games and ignore 90% of SE's output this gen (hint: it's on handhelds and western PC games).


Yes, FFXIV sucks and FFXIII was kind of bad.  But Last Remnant, Just Cause 2, Lara Croft and the Guardian of Light, Kingdom Hearts BBS, The World Ends With You, Tactics Ogre PSP, etc...etc... are all fantastic games.  Some people even like that DQIX thing.  I wish more Japanese publishers would be as consistently good as Square Enix.  Though I'll admit if you're a PS3 only user you're kind of getting the short end of the stick.

[The Sceneman]

FFXIII is turn based, leper Mr. Gundam

If Square Enix shits in your mouth you have to love it and keep suckin that SE dick

[Great Rumbler]

S-E's problem was spending millions and millions of dollars, basically hinging the success of the company, on two games: Final Fantasy XIII and Final Fantasy XIV.

[Smooth Groove]

I don't think JRPGS have gotten worse.  They've just hardly evolved at all and gamers are finally starting to realize that much of JRPG game design is dated and really not that fun to play.  It took awhile because up to last gen, gamers were still blinded by the visual glitz of JRPGS.  But now, even in that area, JRPGS are lacking.  FF13 is the only JRPG this gen that has graphics that stand out and even then it doesn't look that impressive. 

[Mr. Gundam]

FFXIII is turn based, leper Mr. Gundam

If Square Enix shits in your mouth you have to love it and keep suckin that SE dick

It is, I just want more.

[magus]

I don't think JRPGS have gotten worse.  They've just hardly evolved at all and gamers are finally starting to realize that much of JRPG game design is dated and really not that fun to play.  It took awhile because up to last gen, gamers were still blinded by the visual glitz of JRPGS.  But now, even in that area, JRPGS are lacking.  FF13 is the only JRPG this gen that has graphics that stand out and even then it doesn't look that impressive. 

oh pu-leaze,i can't stand people that says "RPG HAVEN'T EVOLVED AT ALL!" that would be like me coming out and saying that fps are horrible because they all come with cover mechanic and wolverine like regeneration

personaly i just think people like to demonize japanese game... i mean you pick dragon quest "IT'S THE SAME STUFF EVERYTIME" then that same guys goes and buys madden 2011 or the last call of duty

[Smooth Groove]

It's still the same rock-paper-scissors shit that we were playing on NES.   

[magus]

tell me the truth
you are that guy?

[cool breeze]

Obsidian did talk about wanting to work in a Chrono Trigger game

[magus]

[demi]

I want a fucking turn-based JRPG, but clearly that's asking too much.

Plenty on 360... guess you just picked the wrong console I suppose.

[naff]

personaly i just think people like to demonize japanese game... i mean you pick dragon quest "IT'S THE SAME STUFF EVERYTIME" then that same guys goes and buys madden 2011 or the last call of duty

I think people hate on CoD and Madden for being dull and repetitive just as much as JRPGs Magus. I guess Western mainstream hates on JRPGs more, but tbh I understand why the average westerner hates on weaboo games. They're pretty embarrassing and hard to stomach a lot of the time.

[The Sceneman]

I want a fucking turn-based JRPG, but clearly that's asking too much.

Plenty on 360... guess you just picked the wrong console I suppose.

Blue Dragon
Last Remnant
Lost Odyssey

any others I'm missing?

[chronovore]

I want a fucking turn-based JRPG, but clearly that's asking too much.

Plenty on 360... guess you just picked the wrong console I suppose.

Blue Dragon
Last Remnant
Lost Odyssey

any others I'm missing?

MeestarGundam is on PSThree, so he's unable to access the cool-guy games, like you.

[Smooth Groove]

personaly i just think people like to demonize japanese game... i mean you pick dragon quest "IT'S THE SAME STUFF EVERYTIME" then that same guys goes and buys madden 2011 or the last call of duty

I think people hate on CoD and Madden for being dull and repetitive just as much as JRPGs Magus. I guess Western mainstream hates on JRPGs more, but tbh I understand why the average westerner hates on weaboo games. They're pretty embarrassing and hard to stomach a lot of the time.

I'm OK with the subject matters in most JRPGS.  Like most anime, they're dumb but entertaining.  It's just the brain-dead combat and grinding that bore me.  I hate spending 5 hrs to level up a character only to find that character is completely useless against a certain enemy because of the rock paper scissors mechanics. 

Magus is an idiot weeaboo, btw.  Even if Halo had Doom-like graphics, any decent gamer would recognize that it plays completely different from Doom. 

[Positive Touch]

I think people hate on CoD and Madden for being dull and repetitive just as much as JRPGs Magus. I guess Western mainstream hates on JRPGs more, but tbh I understand why the average westerner hates on weaboo games. They're pretty embarrassing and hard to stomach a lot of the time.

nailed it

most rpgs still have anime asthetics which are fucking kryptonite to all but the most unrepentant basement-dwellers.  the rest of the world has moved on and jrpg companies have yet to catch up, which is why all you see anymore are low-budget games on handhelds.  sqeenix games this gen may have been great (haven't played any except the awful ff13), but they're almost all still animu thats targeted at children or tweens.  

also ffs the final fantasy milking has gotten beyond sad.  when you're barely even releasing games in the series anymore (and the ones that you do put out are BAD), please do not try to keep the franchise alive with asstasstic spinoffs and ports.

[Positive Touch]

also it's not that all jrpgs play the same, it's that the basic mechanics are not considered fun by most people anymore.  evolve or die plz

[demi]

I want a fucking turn-based JRPG, but clearly that's asking too much.

Plenty on 360... guess you just picked the wrong console I suppose.

Blue Dragon
Last Remnant
Lost Odyssey

any others I'm missing?

Nope, looks like plenty to me.

[Smooth Groove]

In terms of story, what irks me most about anime/JRPGS is their total lack of self-awareness.  It's unbelievable how condescending they can get with their shitty exploration of existential themes or why we need to protect the environment.  What makes it 10X worse is when their fanboys and fangirls are wowed by the "intellectualism" of those POS and try to enforce their shitty tastes on everyone else.  

[Stoney Mason]

Certain things are niche and certain things are mainstream and that's going to become even more distinct as you cross cultures. Gamers need to get over it, if some game or genre they like isn't popular where they are. Because whining about it ain't going to change jack. Just be happy you get the games you do get for that genre and support them and if enough people do then you will get more of that.

But whinging about why something you like isn't more popular is the first sign that you are becoming an annoying person. There is a reason why some things are very popular and some things aren't. Sometimes its taste, culture, quality, appeal, etc. 

[Mr. Gundam]

I want a fucking turn-based JRPG, but clearly that's asking too much.

Plenty on 360... guess you just picked the wrong console I suppose.

Pretty much. Oh well. 

But wait! I have those Idea Factory/NSIA turn-based JRPG... oooh... yeah... 

[Bebpo]

Resonance of Fate is sort of turn-based.

Most turn-based rpgs are on handhelds this gen, though I think in general turn-based is going out of style in Japan and that's why you're getting more arpg or hybrids like Yakuza and Peace Walker.



And the "jrpgs haven't evolved" line of thought is lolz.  Jrpgs have probably advanced as much since Dragon Quest/FF1 as FPS have since Doom.

[Diunx]

I have been playing Tales of the Abbyss for two weeks and only are like 15 hours in, I used to been able to finish rpgs in a week or two a couple of years ago but I have really gotten bored off them lately.

[Himu]

Jrpg is the most varied genre. That's my say on that.

In regards to Wada's comment, it's both good and bad. Good because it means they recognize they've thrown the FF name in the toilet and that they need to fix it. Bad because they could "fix" the problems of recent FF development by farming out to c-list western devs.

Also I once again called it. FF, irrelevance, etc.

[Himu]

Also turn based games are dead on consoles.

[Mr. Gundam]

I've got a DS Lite, but I hate playing games on it. Stupid JRPG developers.

Speaking of the 360 games, the PS3 version of The Last Remnant is STILL on the Famitsu most wanted list. It's currently #18 in the top 30. It's never left the list.

[Himu]

I agree. I'd like to play more command based RPGs on console but beggars can't be choosers so I just go where the games go.

[Cormacaroni]

I've got a DS Lite, but I hate playing games on it. Stupid JRPG developers.

Speaking of the 360 games, the PS3 version of The Last Remnant is STILL on the Famitsu most wanted list. It's currently #18 in the top 30. It's never left the list.

Is GT5 still on there?

[pilonv1]

I want a fucking turn-based JRPG, but clearly that's asking too much.

Plenty on 360... guess you just picked the wrong console I suppose.

Blue Dragon
Last Remnant
Lost Odyssey

any others I'm missing?

Nope, looks like plenty to me.

Operation Darkness

[maxy]

Good,stop with annoying loli characters,embarrassing cutscenes and then West might give you a chance.
jrpg fans

Last Remnant

[Positive Touch]

on the nintendo ds

[maxy]

I have a feeling that jrpgs will move to 3DS,fine by me
FF15 on 3DS,nice

[magus]

Good,stop with annoying loli characters,embarrassing cutscenes and then West might give you a chance.
jrpg fans

Last Remnant

nope
the west will never give you a chance

N
E
V
E
R

don't believe me? look at monster hunter,that's as close as possible to western taste as it could come,did it bomb into irrelevance? why! yes it did

so please don't make your game more western like,if anything try to scale your project down,it work for atlus so.....

most rpgs still have anime asthetics which are fucking kryptonite to all but the most unrepentant basement-dwellers.

and i have an hard time stomaching the gritty alien-like aesthethic that they have to give to every fucking shooter (a virus that's starting to infect japanese company too,just look at vanquish or that sega game with that name so generic i don't even remember it) but i don't go around telling people who still buy into that,that they are idiot westernaboo

[iconoclast]

westaboos

[Corporal]

Sorry magus, but while the gameplay mechanics of MH are indeed very western-y the actual gameplay itself is a grindy mess void of any story buried underneath an unusual control scheme and horrible GUI, hobbled by ancient design paradigms.

This is like PSO when the west is used to WOW.


That said, MH is awesome (and Tri was on the right track IMHO). Played quite a bit on it on PSP and Wii. However, if you think the game in its current condition has even the faintest of shots at appealing to more than a bunch of zany basement dwellers that play unhealthy amounts of videogames... yeah. Not seeing it. This is a niche game. It's a textbook example of a niche game.

[maxy]

This gen

Japan-handheld dominated,big consoles are secondary
West-big consoles dominate,handhelds are secondary

Don't see that changing anytime soon(if ever).

[tiesto]

SMH at JRPG not evolving line... Valkyria Chronicles and Resonance of Fate are both extremely innovative, not to mention some of what's on handhelds - The World Ends With You and Half Minute Hero to name 2. But if all you play is the FF series you might not know any better.

And SMH at every game from Japan having an 'animu' storyline. Am I allowed to complain that every western game tries its damndest to be a wannabe hollywood movie? Most games have crappy storylines whether eastern or western. Some people prefer animu, others prefer Saving Private Ryan and LOTR wannabes, who cares?

[magus]

oooohhh
tiesto wins the thread,even tough i wouldn't throw the word "innovative" so easily around

[maxy]

Am I allowed to complain that every western game tries its damndest to be a wannabe hollywood movie?

Yes you are.But you have to ask yourself why are western games doing that.

[magus]

because they are western game?

i don't know guys... it makes sense to me that western takes inspiration from west entertainement while east takes inspiration from east entertainement......

[maxy]

Because audience wants that and more importantly they are willing to pay for it.

[magus]

going by that logic konami might as well make a walking simulator using the wii balance boa.....

[youtube=560,345][/youtube]

oh right! that logic is the thing i hate the most about gaming

[tiesto]

Because audience wants that and more importantly they are willing to pay for it.

So fine, every company should just make the exact same COD clone or waggle minigame compilation because that's 95% of what sells this day and age... instead of taking risks, and being interesting and innovative?

[Sho Nuff]

Because audience wants that and more importantly they are willing to pay for it.

So fine, every company should just make the exact same COD clone or waggle minigame compilation because that's 95% of what sells this day and age... instead of taking risks, and being interesting and innovative?

At this point, pretty much (if you like money)

[tiesto]

Because audience wants that and more importantly they are willing to pay for it.

So fine, every company should just make the exact same COD clone or waggle minigame compilation because that's 95% of what sells this day and age... instead of taking risks, and being interesting and innovative?

At this point, pretty much (if you like money)

That's so fucking depressing, though

[maxy]

Because audience wants that and more importantly they are willing to pay for it.

So fine, every company should just make the exact same COD clone or waggle minigame compilation because that's 95% of what sells this day and age... instead of taking risks, and being interesting and innovative?

Risks don't pay bills,besides it was always like that,market demand is everything.You will still occasionally see people trying to do something else to separate themselves from the rest.

Long time ago John Carmack said something like this(he was criticized about Rage,don't remember about what exactly)
"Why don't you invest 20 million dollars of your money into some project then?"
He said it with a 

[demi]

Yes because it's much better in Japan

[magus]

you know i always tought "man wouldn't it be cool if another gaming crash happened? maybe we could return to ye olde snes times where it seemed people didn't give a fuck about target audience and the like...."

[tiesto]

Yes because it's much better in Japan

It's not much better, but at least what sells in Japan is more in line with my taste. (Except Monhan and the waggle shit) So it's depressing no matter what

[Sho Nuff]

Yes because it's much better in Japan

The difference is, Japanese developers get paid the same amount whether or not their game sells or bombs

Poor cavia 

[The Sceneman]

you know i always tought "man wouldn't it be cool if another gaming crash happened? maybe we could return to ye olde snes times where it seemed people didn't give a fuck about target audience and the like...."

Only thing I can see happening is niche genres becoming even more under-represented and 4 Call of Duty games per year, Black Ops has done disgustingly well, blockbuster mainstream gaming aint going away soon

[Stoney Mason]

you know i always tought "man wouldn't it be cool if another gaming crash happened? maybe we could return to ye olde snes times where it seemed people didn't give a fuck about target audience and the like...."

You're getting older. Life ain't gonna cater your specific tastes for all your life. Might as well get use to it. It's going to apply to every other area for the rest of your life as well.

[Himu]

SMH at JRPG not evolving line... Valkyria Chronicles and Resonance of Fate are both extremely innovative, not to mention some of what's on handhelds - The World Ends With You and Half Minute Hero to name 2. But if all you play is the FF series you might not know any better.

And SMH at every game from Japan having an 'animu' storyline. Am I allowed to complain that every western game tries its damndest to be a wannabe hollywood movie? Most games have crappy storylines whether eastern or western. Some people prefer animu, others prefer Saving Private Ryan and LOTR wannabes, who cares?

Nailed it. Even FF13 is risky and different even if it's not good. Meanwhile people put stock in "innovative" moral choices. If I'm looking for a game I go with jrpgs, if I want something more different with RPGs I go with a wrpg. Thankfully there are games like Fallout 3. Like both genres, can't stand misinformation from either camp and it's usually from people who haven't played a jrpg or wrpg in years, and if they do they play one game and judge the whole genre. No, jrpgs do not strive to emulate film or bring players totears: that is saved for games like FF and even FF changes game to game. FF10 had a story focus, X-2 didn't, 12 didn't, 13 did. Just like how Diablo clones are totally different from Bethesda games with a different focus.