The Legend Of Zelda Skyward Sword thread of cumbersome control 7.5 7.5 7.5 7.5

[EmCeeGrammar]

Zelda (especially 3d zelda) has been on a kinda decline in Japan.  I remember TP not selling too well for a launch title.  If NSMB and DKCR are any indication, I think a New Legend of Zelda could work wonders for the franchise.  2d is always more approachable for mass audiences. 

[Van Cruncheon]

shoulda packaged and sold it as a mini-game collection -- which is what it wants to be, anyhow

no wonder the zeldaspergs special fellow about it; they luv themselves some simple, discrete, fixed domain problems with conveniently structured, self-contained solutions and FUCK any real holistic decision-making or branching choices!

[TakingBackSunday]

but you love TP, which you just described perfectly   

if y'all want open domains with open solutions and open branches...play the very much open skyrim?

[cool breeze]

you can say "I will!" or "I promise" at one point.

those are real branching choices.  suck it, bioware.

[recursivelyenumerable]

When I make a game I will start it with a tutorial that explains the concept of Euclidean 3D space from first principles, based on Hilbert's axioms (e.g. it will need to explain the concept of 'betweenness' and how 'if a point B is between points A and C, B is also between C and A'). It'll be a 3D game, but I want to make sure it's not inaccessible to entities who happen to come from some radically non-Euclidean / non-spatial universe and aren't familiar with those concepts.

[magus]

[Bebpo]

Knock it down to 65 and we have a winner.

[cool breeze]

Sword controls were nearly perfect for me, at least slashing.  There were problems with stabbing (even pulled off correctly had a weird delay), but that's it. 

The problems with other motion controls were losing calibration/drift and how they were designed.  The bomb controls technically worked fine, it's just that the motions to do it were awkward and dumb if you were sitting down.

[Bebpo]

So I did Silent Realm Trial #3 and like with #1 I got 14/15 and then died on the last one and had to do it all again    Died because I couldn't hit one of the sliding down side ones   Next time I just made sure I got those ones first!  The silent realms are really easy on the 2nd try when you know where everything is, but Nintendo shouldn't have made you start from scratch just for getting hit once.  Dumb design.  Also, how do I get a bigger wallet?  I keep maxing out my 1200 rupee wallet and I need 1600 to buy the dumb heart 1/4th piece at the shop.

I just found out you could sleep and there's a night cycle in the game haha

[magus]

give more gratitude crystal to the vampire or buy an extra wallet from beedle (the extra wallet cost 100 rupee and let you hold 300 extra rupee's,you can buy up to 3)

[tiesto]

Just beat dungeon 6, really nice design in there... so far my favorites are 3, 4, and 6. Am I correct in assuming I'm near the end? I still have a buncha sidequests I want to do, so I don't know if I will finish it this weekend... probably next weekend.

[magus]

was the last boss you fought

spoiler (click to show/hide)

girahim again?

[close]

if so before the end of the game there is

spoiler (click to show/hide)

- return to skyloft
- return to the song island
- fight a pretty cool boss
- return to the forest
- fight the imprisoned a third time
- finish an underwater fetch quest,yes i said underwater fetch quest for part 1 of the song
- return to the volcano
- finish a stealth section for part 2 of the song
- return to the desert
- find a new path leading to part 3 of the song
- but wait! before you can get part 3 of the song,return to forest zone again,then return to the desert zone
- after getting all 3 parts,return to skyloft
- do the last one of those stupid trials
- finish dungeon 6.5
- lot of cutscene happens
- final boss

[close]

[tiesto]

That sounds pretty shitty  Zelda fetchquests... how long does all that take? Can I get through it in a weekend afternoon?

[magus]

mmm yeah i guess you could,they don't really take that long,not more than it took to clear the original zone anyway

[Bebpo]

give more gratitude crystal to the vampire or buy an extra wallet from beedle (the extra wallet cost 100 rupee and let you hold 300 extra rupee's,you can buy up to 3)

I bought all 3 wallets from Beedle, that's how my max is 1200.

There's a vampire in this game?

There are crystals??

[demi]

GUESS FI DIDNT BOTHER TO TELL YOU THAT

[cool breeze]

yeah, it's initiated by a sidequest at skyloft

spoiler (click to show/hide)

a little girl goes missing and people say its a monster.  you hear a guy at the pumpkin bar knows more, you fly there, he tells you to do something at the grave yard.  you do it, a secret passage opens, you go under skyloft and a friendly vampire is there with the girl.  he asks you to get gratitude crystals to turn him human.  I think about 10 are hidden around skyloft and other areas of the sky (2 at the pumpkin bar, one at beedle's place) and they only appear at night.  The rest are received through sidequests, 5 gratitude crystals per quest.

[close]

[Bebpo]

Yeah, I didn't do that.  They were like "MY GIRL IS MISSING!!!" and I was like "is this required to progress in the plot?  No, well then screw your missing kid fetch quest.  She's going to stay lost!"

When a game has pacing like SS and is long like SS, I avoid any and all optional parts and just try to speed run the main game.

[demi]

He calls it pacing

[EmCeeGrammar]

This game is weird in how it sends you off in one direction while in the middle of something else.

Some notes:
Tadtones was kinda fun once you capitalise on the controls and know how to collect groups with the spin.  Really liked this section Super Chill.

Forsaken Fortress (STEALTH) 2.0 was enjoyable but felt underdeveloped in the end.  Needed more intricate patrol routes and whatnot.

4th Silent Realm was nerve rackingly good.  I was tailed by so many sentries while they dingalinglingaling.  I think I had 10 guardians surrounding me on one of my attempts.

Returned to an old dungeon due to some dowsing misdirection.  Apparently you can refight minibosses for rare crafting materials.

On the last dungeon and the gimmick is pretty cool, although its manipulated by a SLIDE TILE PUZZLE blargh.

[tiesto]

I'm on the last dungeon too, kept on getting my ass kicked by that dungeon's miniboss... the last few parts of the game are like some of the worst cases of filler I've ever seen in a game... was really enjoying the game up til this part too. Hopefully I'll be able to beat the dungeon's miniboss soon and can get to the part where I go finish collecting heart containers, hunt goddess cubes, doing sidequests, etc. I think I got a good chunk of the sidequests done already.

[Bebpo]

I'm still just after the 5th dungeon.  At the new volcano area with my earrings.  I've kind of stopped wanting to play this so I've been avoiding it and playing other games.  I like it when I play it, but the game is too long and pacing too slow.  I just want to finish it at this point so I can play other games with my time.

Zelda should not be a 30 hour game.

[demi]

It's fine as a 30 hour game. It's just full of BULLSHIT and not GAME

and TEXT BUBBLES

[Barry Egan]

people have been comparing majoras mask with this title, and I was wondering if anyone might be able to point out the comparable elements (besides the obvious core mechanics)...?  I presumed when people said this that they were referring to an emphasis on sidequests and overworld.  Sky Village is static.  There are sidequests but there is no real emphasis or intrigue carrying them.  The narrative does not seem to have anything analogous to Majoras darker shades either.

In conclusion that comparison is kind of nuts. 

I do agree with Bebpo that this game should be a lot shorter.  The last 3 dungeons were GREAT and I wish Nintendo would have just let me play them.

[Trent Dole]

It's fine as a 30 hour game. It's just full of BULLSHIT and not GAME

and TEXT BUBBLES

Made the mistake of telling the first Goron I met that I was interested in hearing him tell of Skyloft mythos or something. Five minutes later I could start actually playing again.

[Bebpo]

It's like Majora's Mask because it's not a typical Link vs Ganon get the tri-force game and the dungeons are good and there's a lot of repetition. 

Or something like that.  I dunno, I don't think it's like any Zelda except the awful no budget DS games except way better.


Just got to dungeon #6.  BZZT I AM STUPID ROBOT CREATING FILLER FOR YOU TO MAKE YOU RUN ALL THE WAY UP THE MOUNTAIN AGAIN.  How more blatant can they get?  Ugh, at least the pre-dungeon stuff to dungeon #6 was short, even if it was all filler.


My problem with the Zelda franchise in general, since at least the two DS games and this, is that they feel like WORK and not fun gaming.  It's the reason why I don't really want to play the game but when I force myself to sit down and play it I enjoy it.  It's a good game but everytime someone says "HEY DO YOU WANT TO DO A FOR ME?" I always shudder because whatever they want me to do is going to be a pain in the ass, sometimes frustrating, and almost always waste of time.  Compare that to say a game like Saints Row where when someone wants you to do something you're excited because it means a fun mission to do.  I swear Zelda has become a franchise for masochists.  It's made to make the player WORK and suffer to enjoy the satisfaction of Japanese corporation employment.


Will do dungeon #6 tomorrow.  Then at least it'll just be ONE LAST FILLER BUILDUP to dungeon #7 and then 1 night on dungeon #7 and I can call it done.

[magus]

I'm on the last dungeon too, kept on getting my ass kicked by that dungeon's miniboss... the last few parts of the game are like some of the worst cases of filler I've ever seen in a game... was really enjoying the game up til this part too. Hopefully I'll be able to beat the dungeon's miniboss soon and can get to the part where I go finish collecting heart containers, hunt goddess cubes, doing sidequests, etc. I think I got a good chunk of the sidequests done already.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

you mean the pirate captain repeat? he's really easy if you block and then attack instead of actively attacking him

[close]

Just got to dungeon #6.  BZZT I AM STUPID ROBOT CREATING FILLER FOR YOU TO MAKE YOU RUN ALL THE WAY UP THE MOUNTAIN AGAIN.  How more blatant can they get?  Ugh, at least the pre-dungeon stuff to dungeon #6 was short, even if it was all filler.

[SantaC]

man this game is shit on a stick. Zelda has never been farther down the drain. Nintendo is killing their own franchises.

[demi]

at least try to troll.

[Bebpo]

man this game is shit on a stick. Zelda has never been farther down the drain. Nintendo is killing their own franchises.

The DS games.

...which were also by this guy!


It's sad because the GB/GBA games were really good!  It's like once Zelda hit the Wii/DS it just dove headfirst downhill.  Maybe that's when the big N decided Zelda was not a big enough seller to warrant a budget anymore.

[Bebpo]

Dude, the re-use of areas over and over and over again is entirely budget related.  You don't think they would have preferred to have a new location pre-dungeon #6 like they had pre-dungeon 1-5?  They just didn't have the money/manpower to create the assets.

Same reason why the game has only 6-7 dungeons and Skyloft is this big empty area.  Creating locations takes money/time, and apparently with what they were given these were the only locations they could make and so they had to re-use a ton to create a full-size game out of it.

[Bebpo]

PS.  Nintendo's extreme conservatism when it comes to low-balling budgets on their franchises is going to bite them so hard in the ass when Wii U hits and suddenly they need to make every texture and environment detailed in 720p visuals.  I have a feeling we are going to see a trainwreck on the likes of Sony Japan w/PS3.

[Bebpo]

btw, if it seems like I angrily bring this up in every Nintendo thread it's because I actually really like Nintendo's franchises and I think they have quite a few extremely talented game designers and great development teams.  So it's extremely depressing seeing each game get screwed over time and time again because Nintendo refuses to spend money to make games because all they care about is $$$ and profitability.  It's frustrating and I'd like to see the return of great Nintendo titles but I don't see it happening until they start giving teams the money they need to make great games

[Bebpo]

It's a design choice in the way of Publisher's design to not give them money to make more areas.  I'm sure the director and team would rather have had non-stop unique areas one after another from start  to credits if they had the manpower and time.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

serious question: I skipped Twilight Princess when it came out. if I am hankering for ZELDER should I play it or Skyward (in 2013 on my PC)

[Bebpo]

TP

[Bebpo]

Twilight Princess has more dungeons and they are about even in quality with Skyward Dungeons (some are better in TP, some are better in SS).  TP has some boring riding around the overworld and sidequests, SS has a lot of padding.  TP has a way better story and more interesting art direction.  TP has far better controls.  SS has nicer graphics and probably better music.

[Sho Nuff]

How can you play SS on your PC with the actual motion plus?

[Bebpo]

There are ways apparently.  A lot of pirates people on gaf were playing it on emu in the dolphin thread.

[naff]

Sync your wiimote and motion plus with bluetooth. You can do it through Dolphin and I'm pretty sure if you have motionplus connected it just works. You can also use a pair of candles instead of an IR bar

[cool breeze]

man this game is shit on a stick. Zelda has never been farther down the drain. Nintendo is killing their own franchises.

The DS games.

...which were also by this guy!

No, Skyward Sword is the Minish Cap guy.

[cool breeze]

I just think Nintendo has seen the money in appealing to the lowest form of intelligence (wait, second lowest if we count nintendo fans).  Zelda SS is an awesome game with a lot (a looooooot) of bad decisions that drag it down.  And it's not like "we fucked up" mistakes, but really deliberate and polished mistakes.  Like the train in Spirit Tracks is a fucking awful decision dragging down legitimately great dungeons; but that train has side quests, bunny collecting, upgrades, and a bunch of shit to reinforce how shit that shit is.

And somethings in Skyward Sword are completely baffling.  Reintroducing items, ayaname rei, tadtones, text speed, stamina, etc.  I can't believe more that one person touched the game and wasn't like "are...are you joking?"   

But maybe people are genuinely dumb, or it was just nintendo fans who forgot how to play video games, because  I saw posts on gaf about (And this is a spoiler for the final boss, so  )

spoiler (click to show/hide)

when fighting him they didn't realize you could hold up your sword and summon lightning yourself.  The game had a cutscene where you see the boss raise his semi-identical sword into the air, the same motion as your skyward strike, and charge it with lightning, as it looks with your skyward strike.  Even if it isn't immediately obvious, which it is, are people so weened on linearity that they could even attempt to raise their sword without Fi telling them?
 

[close]

Basic baby gaming language.  They'd fukin pass out trying to learn the wall jump in Super Metroid.  And it's the worst in SS when there is a clever puzzle or dungeon, or the bonus "hard" level in Mario games, and wish they'd just make more games.  Nintendo clearly has some talented people making its games, but their talent is kinda wasted.

[Van Cruncheon]

man, i love being right on skyward sword. you should really listen to me (and demi) more often.

[demi]

i didnt know you could use the lightning either. i watched a video of a person doing that and the fight was a complete joke, even moreso than it already was.

[Bebpo]

man this game is shit on a stick. Zelda has never been farther down the drain. Nintendo is killing their own franchises.

The DS games.

...which were also by this guy!

No, Skyward Sword is the Minish Cap guy.

I thought Minish Cap was by Capcom?

[SantaC]

It is still better than every single JRPG made this generation though.

xenoblade shits on SS in all aspects. It's not even close.

[magus]

But maybe people are genuinely dumb, or it was just nintendo fans who forgot how to play video games, because  I saw posts on gaf about (And this is a spoiler for the final boss, so  )

spoiler (click to show/hide)

when fighting him they didn't realize you could hold up your sword and summon lightning yourself.  The game had a cutscene where you see the boss raise his semi-identical sword into the air, the same motion as your skyward strike, and charge it with lightning, as it looks with your skyward strike.  Even if it isn't immediately obvious, which it is, are people so weened on linearity that they could even attempt to raise their sword without Fi telling them?
 

[close]

i didn't realize that either but that's because you can punch the final boss just as well without never doing that

[Damian79]

It seems that i am just uncoordinated.  My brother plays this game flawlessly.  So i just watch him play it.

[Barry Egan]

soooo I just entered the "search for the triforce" part of the game where

spoiler (click to show/hide)

they scatter all the items you've already accumulated for a stealth section

[close]

annnnnddd fuck it!  don't want to play anymore.  I haven't heard anything that great about the final dungeon so I'll just assume I've already played the best the game has to offer.  What a shame this title couldn't meet it's ambition.

[Bebpo]

I thought I was done with the stealth going into dungeon 6.



That sounds awful.  To think I haven't even started on the tri-force hunt filler section of the game.  ugh.

[magus]

eh it's not that bad bebpo,if you get caught you get sent back like just before the point where the guard walks up and after you retrieve your slingshot,you can just shoot the guard and walk past them

the trials are worse,especialy the last one

[Bebpo]

Why is there another TRIAL

3 trials, 3 dungeons -> NOW YOU CAN OPEN THE GATE.  Why are there more trials??

[magus]

Why is there another TRIAL

3 trials, 3 dungeons -> NOW YOU CAN OPEN THE GATE.  Why are there more trials??

you must suffer for not trusting me and demi when we said the game had a lot of filler

[Oblivion]

I suppose it goes without saying, but NEVER help out a parent who's recently homeless by offering to have them stay with you.

So I get SS a day or two after it comes out, and was planning on playing it throughout Thanksgiving break. Unfortunately, one problem is that we only have one T.V. and it's in the living room where my mom sleeps. I want to take the T.V. into my room at least until I'm done beating the game, but mom whines that she would get bored staring at the wall. So I say fine, I'll play in the living room, but the only thing I ask is that she not speak to me while I'm playing. She doesn't say anything but makes it completely obvious that she's not gonna do that.

Anyway, she goes to sleep, and I start SS and am enjoying myself for the most part. Some time after the first dungeon, I get surprised when all of a sudden, I hear "How are you enjoying your little girl game, SON?"

She was lambasting me for like half an hour, and I just couldn't play the goddamn game any more. Now, I have to wait until I either get a new T.V., or find a proper (read: cheap) old folks home.

Goddamn it all.

[The Sceneman]

I suppose it goes without saying, but NEVER help out a parent who's recently homeless by offering to have them stay with you. So I get SS a day or two after it comes out, and was planning on playing it throughout Thanksgiving break. Unfortunately, one problem is that we only have one T.V. and it's in the living room where my mom sleeps. I want to take the T.V. into my room at least until I'm done beating the game, but mom whines that she would get bored staring at the wall. So I say fine, I'll play in the living room, but the only thing I ask is that she not speak to me while I'm playing. She doesn't say anything but makes it completely obvious that she's not gonna do that.

Anyway, she goes to sleep, and I start SS and am enjoying myself for the most part. Some time after the first dungeon, I get surprised when all of a sudden, I hear "How are you enjoying your little girl game, SON?"

She was lambasting me for like half an hour, and I just couldn't play the goddamn game any more. Now, I have to wait until I either get a new T.V., or find a proper (read: cheap) old folks home.

Goddamn it all.

this doesn't help the Nintard stereotype at all...

[Damian79]

WTF you shoudl have told her that if she is bored she should be in the kitchen making you a sandwich or gtfo out the house, it is your house after all?  Seriously what is wrong with you, grow a pair.

[naff]

I suppose it goes without saying, but NEVER help out a parent who's recently homeless by offering to have them stay with you.

your mum giving you shit about playing vidja is no reason to leave her homeless! SMH

[Damian79]

your mum giving you shit about playing vidja is no reason to leave her homeless! SMH

But demanding to have his only tv is.  I am surprised they arent watching gay porn togehter.  SMH.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

Moms are tough! (on their Nintard children)

[demi]

owned... lmao