Anime-Booru Desu~ |OT|

[Great Rumbler]

Original dub

[Himu]

nope nope

[Vizzys]

whats it feel like to be so wrong

[Himu]

pioneer dub all the day homos

[Great Rumbler]

It's sad, really. Himu's been on fire in this thread, then he stumbles at the final stretch. So sad.

[Vizzys]

johnny yong bosch

[Himu]

I'm sorry, okay? You just can't top Johnny Yong Bosch for cheese factor. Sure, Kaneda is Leonardo in the 80's dub, beyond that?

[Vizzys]

 
to be fair to akira, i'm a bit harder on it because i feel it is the direct grandpappy of all of the problems anime had (pre-the recent moe problem, which is not akira's fault and might be even worse than what akira did).  because of akira, anime producers realized it was okay if your story didn't make any fucking sense at all as long as the animation was nice and you made it sufficiently weird that people could philosophize about it.  i blame it for the ghost in the shell movie, which has almost EXACTLY the same problems and strengths, and evangelion, which was extremely influential and extremely idiotic, among a litany of other shitty anime that at least nobody cares about.

[Great Rumbler]

to be fair to akira, i'm a bit harder on it because i feel it is the direct grandpappy of all of the problems anime had (pre-the recent moe problem, which is not akira's fault and might be even worse than what akira did).  because of akira, anime producers realized it was okay if your story didn't make any fucking sense at all as long as the animation was nice and you made it sufficiently weird that people could philosophize about it.  i blame it for the ghost in the shell movie, which has almost EXACTLY the same problems and strengths, and evangelion, which was extremely influential and extremely idiotic, among a litany of other shitty anime that at least nobody cares about.

Ghost in the Shell was a really weird movies that didn't make any sense? Err...what?

[Himu]

himuchan, when i first watched this, there *were* no expectations.  this movie wasn't always the great legendary unicorn of anime.  once upon a time, it was just a new movie.  i watched it because "hey this guy on the cover looks kinda cool, let's watch this". 

to be fair to akira, i'm a bit harder on it because i feel it is the direct grandpappy of all of the problems anime had (pre-the recent moe problem, which is not akira's fault and might be even worse than what akira did).  because of akira, anime producers realized it was okay if your story didn't make any fucking sense at all as long as the animation was nice and you made it sufficiently weird that people could philosophize about it.  i blame it for the ghost in the shell movie, which has almost EXACTLY the same problems and strengths, and evangelion, which was extremely influential and extremely idiotic, among a litany of other shitty anime that at least nobody cares about.

if you can get into it, so be it.  the animation is great and the first half of the movie kicks ass.  the art style is wonderful.  but don't sit there laughing at the goofy shit hollywood is doing to the story with their adaptation, cuz akira never had a story leg to stand on to begin with.

how does not akira not make sense, though? I mean, it make a heck of a lot more sense than Eva. Ghost in the Shell makes tons of sense. It's just BORING.

[Himu]

For the record, I know what Oscar's talking about here. I just don't think Akira is one of them. I'd say what he's talking about is more attributed to Eva more than Akira. Akira is the result of a manga still being made during its development. Evangelion is the product of a dude who was going to kill himself so he sets off to make the most nihilistic, putrid mecha anime ever which goes on to completely change anime. Akira didn't change anime. Evangeion, however, did.

 
to be fair to akira, i'm a bit harder on it because i feel it is the direct grandpappy of all of the problems anime had (pre-the recent moe problem, which is not akira's fault and might be even worse than what akira did).  because of akira, anime producers realized it was okay if your story didn't make any fucking sense at all as long as the animation was nice and you made it sufficiently weird that people could philosophize about it.  i blame it for the ghost in the shell movie, which has almost EXACTLY the same problems and strengths, and evangelion, which was extremely influential and extremely idiotic, among a litany of other shitty anime that at least nobody cares about.

(Image removed from quote.)

evangelion is self absorbed pap. haven't seen the movies, but I kinda don't want anything to do with Eva ever again.

[Eric P]

Akira didn't change anime

Jane, you ignorant slut.

[Himu]

How did it change anime then? Before Akira, anime received most of its revenue from films and toys. The same thing continued after Akira. Evangelion popularized the television format, which created a televised anime boom after it started getting popular and being heralded as the greatest anime tv series of all time. That's without bringing up the pseudo intellectualism Eva brought to the table that became so prominent after its release.

Did Akira help create more mature works of films being created? No, it did not. Golgo 13 is probably far more, if not equally bloody than Akira ever will be and just as controversial in regards to sex. The Professional predates Akira by five years. Even Grave of the Fireflies was released before Akira. How did Akira change anime? It didn't.

Did Akira help create a wave of more cyber punk anime? Sure. But how is that directly attributed to Akira when cyber punk was big during that period to begin with?

Akira is a highly influential anime. However, it didn't change the industry -- literally -- on its head like Evangelion.

Akira probably changed anime for overseas masses by exposing them to anime, but it didn't really change anime. Akira's influence is mostly seen through how it influenced manga, particularly the art, and that's mostly because of this:





Not this:

[bork]

Evangelion 

[Eric P]

How did it change anime then? Before Akira, anime received most of its revenue from films and toys. The same thing continued after Akira. Evangelion popularized the television format, which created a televised anime boom after it started getting popular and being heralded as the greatest anime tv series of all time. That's without bringing up the pseudo intellectualism Eva brought to the table that became so prominent after its release.

Did Akira help create more mature works of films being created? No, it did not. Golgo 13 is probably far more, if not equally bloody than Akira ever will be and just as controversial in regards to sex. The Professional predates Akira by five years. Even Grave of the Fireflies was released before Akira. How did Akira change anime? It didn't.

Did Akira help create a wave of more cyber punk anime? Sure. But how is that directly attributed to Akira when cyber punk was big during that period to begin with?

Akira is a highly influential anime. However, it didn't change the industry -- literally -- on its head like Evangelion.

Akira probably changed anime for overseas masses by exposing them to anime, but it didn't really change anime. Akira's influence is mostly seen through how it influenced manga, particularly the art, and that's mostly because of this:

ok, framed like that you're correct.

[Himu]

If you really think that the other two big 90's "Japanimation" titles,Ghost in the Shell (film) and Ninja Scroll, couldn't have come into being without Akira (film), I don't know know what to tell you, especially when the director Ghost in the Shell did Angel's Egg, a film steeped with Biblical symbolism (which predates Akira's film btw ) and later, Patlabor (pre-Akira film ). Ghost in the Shell was just business for Mamoru Oshii. Yoshiaki Kawajiri, the director of Ninja Scroll, did Neo-Tokyo (sound familiar? another pre-Akira film anime ) and especially Wicked City (another pre-Akira film ).

Akira didn't change shit. It's just an anime movie with tremendous backing and funding because the manga was so fucking amazing they wanted everyone to bust a nut while watching it.

[Eric P]

uh ok

It didn't change anime as an institution, i'll agree, but Akira is absolutely an important anime film if for nothing else than it really helped open the door for modern Anime fandom in America.  Also, Akira was probably the most technically proficient anime film at that time (my recollection is somewhat hazy. It was certainly the most impressive anime film I had seen up to that point).  You may not consider it a Citizen Kane but you can't dismiss it as Transformers 2.

[cool breeze]

I believe Golgo 13 was the most technically proficient

[Himu]

My overall point is that I think many westerners link Akira to doing many things Akira didn't even innovate or bring to the table, such as the subject matter or the utterly maddening violence that occurs throughout the film. This is understandable, because at a time, Akira was one of the few anime films in circulation in the west, and it was a big hit with the fanbase.

I also think that westerners give too much credit to anime, and little to manga. Akira was originally a manga. Most of its influence is seen through that medium as well. Most anime is based off of manga. Most of the manga authors and artists I follow thank Akira as a main source of inspiration; not the anime film, but the manga.   Akira's film was definitely influential, but I think many western fans overestimate that influence.

So when you're lumping it with stuff like Ghost in the Shell, and saying that Ghost in the Shell was influenced by Akira, I find that entirely false. Because it wasn't. It was its own thing, in a sea of shit doing their own thing.

[bork]

How did it change anime then? Before Akira, anime received most of its revenue from films and toys. The same thing continued after Akira. Evangelion popularized the television format, which created a televised anime boom after it started getting popular and being heralded as the greatest anime tv series of all time.

WHAT

You think a Evangelion, from what...1996, was what popularized the format?  Stuff like Sailor Moon and Dragonball Z did all that first.  Come on dude...merchandise out the ass and Sailor Moon was so popular that images of the characters could be found inside Tokyo Tower.

Akira is absolutely an important anime film if for nothing else than it really helped open the door for modern Anime fandom in America.

Absolutely, but even then it was still "before its time" when the film came out in the States in '89-'90.  Ghost In The Shell in 1995 is what really attracted attention.

[Himu]

I'll agree that the film's ending isn't as cohesive or satisfying as the manga's. I'll even concede that many characters don't get developed as much as I'd like to. But I think what's there is still pretty fucking awesome, even if it's Akira: Sparknotes Edition.

[Himu]

How did it change anime then? Before Akira, anime received most of its revenue from films and toys. The same thing continued after Akira. Evangelion popularized the television format, which created a televised anime boom after it started getting popular and being heralded as the greatest anime tv series of all time.

WHAT

You think a Evangelion, from what...1996, was what popularized the format?  Stuff like Sailor Moon and Dragonball Z did all that first.  Come on dude...merchandise out the ass and Sailor Moon was so popular that images of the characters could be found inside Tokyo Tower.

Not disputing that. I'm mostly talking about more "serious" anime tv shows. You know what I'm talking about. I think it's debatable Cowboy Bebop would not exist without Evangelion. Evangelion helped create a specific audience, and I'm trying to think of any anime tv show, besides Gundam, that penetrated this audience with television series' before Evangelion's time.

[bork]

How did it change anime then? Before Akira, anime received most of its revenue from films and toys. The same thing continued after Akira. Evangelion popularized the television format, which created a televised anime boom after it started getting popular and being heralded as the greatest anime tv series of all time.

WHAT

You think a Evangelion, from what...1996, was what popularized the format?  Stuff like Sailor Moon and Dragonball Z did all that first.  Come on dude...merchandise out the ass and Sailor Moon was so popular that images of the characters could be found inside Tokyo Tower.

Not disputing that. I'm mostly talking about more "serious" anime tv shows. You know what I'm talking about. I think it's debatable Cowboy Bebop would not exist without Evangelion. Evangelion helped create a specific audience, and I'm trying to think of any anime tv show, besides Gundam, that penetrated this audience with television series' before Evangelion's time.

Gundam and Macross certainly come to mind first.  But our scope is really limited since for most of us anime starts in the late 80s and early 90s.

You also talk about merchandising.  Eva has nothing on the more-popular kids' series out there in that regard.

[Himu]

True enough.

It seems to me, before Evangelion, stuff with the content that's in that show were mostly left to film and ova's. This is why, for a long period of time, film and ova's were the subset of anime that had the more risque', more adult content. If you wanted to watch an anime about the philosophical shit, you'd stick to a film. But after Evangelion, whew boy. That stuff permeated anime tv like flies against Jinfash's unclean bidet infused asshole.

[Mr. Gundam]

How did it change anime then? Before Akira, anime received most of its revenue from films and toys. The same thing continued after Akira. Evangelion popularized the television format, which created a televised anime boom after it started getting popular and being heralded as the greatest anime tv series of all time.

WHAT

You think a Evangelion, from what...1996, was what popularized the format?  Stuff like Sailor Moon and Dragonball Z did all that first.  Come on dude...merchandise out the ass and Sailor Moon was so popular that images of the characters could be found inside Tokyo Tower.

Not disputing that. I'm mostly talking about more "serious" anime tv shows. You know what I'm talking about. I think it's debatable Cowboy Bebop would not exist without Evangelion. Evangelion helped create a specific audience, and I'm trying to think of any anime tv show, besides Gundam, that penetrated this audience with television series' before Evangelion's time.

Touch (consistently got a 30% share of all viewers during it's 101 episode run), Macross, Ranma 1/2, Aim for the Ace!, Space Battleship Yamato... I can do this all day.

[Himu]

How did it change anime then? Before Akira, anime received most of its revenue from films and toys. The same thing continued after Akira. Evangelion popularized the television format, which created a televised anime boom after it started getting popular and being heralded as the greatest anime tv series of all time.

WHAT

You think a Evangelion, from what...1996, was what popularized the format?  Stuff like Sailor Moon and Dragonball Z did all that first.  Come on dude...merchandise out the ass and Sailor Moon was so popular that images of the characters could be found inside Tokyo Tower.

Not disputing that. I'm mostly talking about more "serious" anime tv shows. You know what I'm talking about. I think it's debatable Cowboy Bebop would not exist without Evangelion. Evangelion helped create a specific audience, and I'm trying to think of any anime tv show, besides Gundam, that penetrated this audience with television series' before Evangelion's time.

Macross, Ranma 1/2, Maison Ikkou, Urusei Yatsura, Space Battleship Yamato... I can do this all day.

Macross and Yamato being exceptions, I don't think those others really fit the bill, there's even stuff like LoGH and Captain Harlock. I'm not saying anime like that didn't exist before Eva. But Eva certainly helped create a boom for the format.

[Mr. Gundam]

SPACE RUNAWAY IDEON.

Seriously, Anno has even admitted that he ripped it off to make Evangelion.

Yes, Evanglion spawned countless "machoor" ripoffs, and as much as I like it, it wasn't really a unique snowflake.

[Himu]

I didn't say Eva was a unique snowflake. I'm talking about impact.

[Mr. Gundam]

Gainax was also incredibly willing to whore Evangelion out as much as possible.

[Himu]

Haha, no joke.

[Mr. Gundam]

Evangelion also aired at what was probably an inappropriate time originally, causing some controversy and resulting in many people watching who wouldn't typically give anime the time of day.

[ZephyrFate]

Akira, the film has been considered a landmark for Japanese animation and filmmaking in general. I don't know why you're arguing this, Himu. Ghost in the Shell would be the other film that achieved this, but several years later, effectively popularizing cyberpunk in both animation and film.

[Mr. Gundam]

The first GitS film is interesting, in that it didn't do a whole lot in Japan, but really caught on everywhere else.

[Himu]

Akira, the film has been considered a landmark for Japanese animation and filmmaking in general. I don't know why you're arguing this, Himu.

I didn't say it wasn't. I worship Akira. It is probably in top 5 favorite animated films.

[cool breeze]

Anecdotally, I find that the Akira film and the Evangelion series are kind of given that "Important" stamp and are often hyped up to the point of setting unrealistic expectations for new viewers.


I temper my praise nowadays, and for some folks I just recommend the manga / the Rebuild films, respectively.

I don't remember when Evangelion came out, but when I was getting into anime in the last 90s, my nerdier friends never recommended it.  I watched it later on and ended up liking it quite a bit.  I'm being hypocritical here because of what I said earlier, but I can appreciate Evangelion's dedication to being up its own ass.

Other than Ghibli films, Akira, and GitS, it was stuff like Jin-Roh, Vampire Hunter D, and Ninja Scrolls.

I think Ninja Scrolls was when I stopped listening to their recommendations.

[Himu]

The first GitS film is interesting, in that it didn't do a whole lot in Japan, but really caught on everywhere else.

Ghost in the Shell was marketed on the strength of Akira.  If you don't have Akira you don't have a lot of money pouring into Anime during the 90s, you don't get the big budget series aimed at selling in America (Cowboy Bebop for instance).

This is a fair point, and exactly why Akira is influential. But when I say Akira changed anime, I'm talking about how anime is made. Akira is culturally relevant, but I don't think I can say with a straight face that Akira really changed anime. Not in the way Oscar said it did.

[Himu]

Anecdotally, I find that the Akira film and the Evangelion series are kind of given that "Important" stamp and are often hyped up to the point of setting unrealistic expectations for new viewers.


I temper my praise nowadays, and for some folks I just recommend the manga / the Rebuild films, respectively.

I'm one of those people burned by Eva for these exact reasons. I wasn't burned by Akira.

[Bebpo]

SPACE RUNAWAY IDEON.

Seriously, Anno has even admitted that he ripped it off to make Evangelion.

Yes, Evanglion spawned countless "machoor" ripoffs, and as much as I like it, it wasn't really a unique snowflake.

I'm like 60-70% through IDEON's story in SRWA3 and I still don't see any connection between IDEON and Eva.  Maybe Anno ripped the ending of Eva from the ending of Ideon, but otherwise they don't seem very similar in the shows themselves.

[Mr. Gundam]

End of Evangelion has scenes literally lifted from Be Invoke, the IDEON finale film.

[Great Rumbler]

Speaking of Yoshiaki Kawajiri, he directed this over a year before Akira:



by the way.

And, like Himu said, Mamoru Oshii was no stranger to deliberately-paced, high-minded scifi. And Ghost in the Shell was more a product of Blade Runner's influence and the cyperpunk novels of the 80's. Shirow might have been influenced by the Akira manga though, it came out about year before GitS started.

[Himu]

Speaking of Yoshiaki Kawajiri, he directed this over a year before Akira:



by the way.

And, like Himu said, Mamoru Oshii was no stranger to deliberately-paced, high-minded scifi. And Ghost in the Shell was more a product of Blade Runner's influence and the cyperpunk novels of the 80's. Shirow might have been influenced by the Akira manga though, it came out about year before GitS started.

Just like I said, mayne. And yea, Wicked City owns.

[Himu]

More 80's anime films:









80's anime.

Akira is really just a product of 80's anime being fucking AWESOME but with a huge budget.

[Great Rumbler]

[Himu]

MACROSS: DO YOU REMEMBER LOVE?

80's is my favorite decade for anime films. 

[TEEEPO]

The first GitS film is interesting, in that it didn't do a whole lot in Japan, but really caught on everywhere else.

Ghost in the Shell was marketed on the strength of Akira.  If you don't have Akira you don't have a lot of money pouring into Anime during the 90s, you don't get the big budget series aimed at selling in America (Cowboy Bebop for instance).

This is a fair point, and exactly why Akira is influential. But when I say Akira changed anime, I'm talking about how anime is made. Akira is culturally relevant, but I don't think I can say with a straight face that Akira really changed anime. Not in the way Oscar said it did.

the success of akira changed anime the same way the success of western games has changed the landscape of the videogame industry in japan, e.g. square enix and capcom. it didn't necessarily change the industry as a whole in japan in terms of what producers and studios were puting out, but having just the few number of eyes in the states gazing over towards the direction of japan for something that was so scarce and highly demanded did eventually shift the entire industry.

[TEEEPO]

80s anime thread worships never get old

[TEEEPO]

remember when this was the extent of fan service you'd get in an anime series? hell the only other 'fan service' found in the original macross was the closeup of minmei's ass in the first episode, though that did serve an actual purpose in terms of setting up the characters.

[Mr. Gundam]

Votoms had tits. A lot, actually.

[chronovore]

In VOTOMS, I am always drooling over the mecha to notice anything else, like characters, story, or tits.

[Mr. Gundam]

In VOTOMS, I am always drooling over the mecha to notice anything else, like characters, story, or tits.

Glad someone else here appreciates something about Votoms. I thought I was the only one.

[Great Rumbler]

Fanservice in TV anime didn't really start getting bad until the late 90's, when the harem genre really started picking up steam. But even that's tame compared to where TV anime has gone in the past few years. Most of the series that peddle that sort of thing are terrible to begin with, so it's easy to avoid them, but it's depressing to see how that's basically become the industry's biggest source of money [outside of shounen series and K-On].

[cool breeze]

I think there's a difference between nudity and fan service.  Fan service is more like having a scene dedicated to showing panties, or it's just unnecessary.  and then there are moeblob characters.

[Great Rumbler]

I think it's gotten to the point where shows are now ABOUT fanservice.

[Himu]

Fanservice in TV anime didn't really start getting bad until the late 90's, when the harem genre really started picking up steam. But even that's tame compared to where TV anime has gone in the past few years. Most of the series that peddle that sort of thing are terrible to begin with, so it's easy to avoid them, but it's depressing to see how that's basically become the industry's biggest source of money [outside of shounen series and K-On].

Well, anime back in the 80's and 90's wasn't just for anime fans. You can look at the vids in this thread, on this very page and see that. Today's anime is aimed specifically at a subset of anime fans, a very tiny minority.

[Momo]

OMG I read the words "Space Battleship Yamato" and did a Kodai shuffle here, I love that you guys can reference anime of that nature <3

[TEEEPO]

speak of the devil.

[Himu]

OMG I read the words "Space Battleship Yamato" and did a Kodai shuffle here, I love that you guys can reference anime of that nature <3

Uh lol

most of us are lapsed anime fans with a heavy leaning towards space opera and sci-fi, so of course.

[Great Rumbler]

I'm not really a lapsed anime fan, but I've at least got the good sense to know that it's gone downhill since the 90's closed.

[Mr. Gundam]

Yeah, we long for the days of awesome 80s/90s anime and a time when everyone loved mecha, not moe moe panty animu.

[Robo]

Downhill?  Pish posh.  This is brand new and it sounds amazing.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many%C5%AB_Hiken-ch%C5%8D

Plot

In a reign ruled by the Tokugawa shogunate, breasts mean everything. If you have breasts, you are guaranteed wealth and popularity. If you lack them, you are rarely considered "human". Members of the ruling Manyu Clan help raise the future big breasts. Written on a secret scroll possessed by the clan, there is said to be various techniques on how to grow big and beautiful breasts. Chifusa is to be successor of the clan. However, she takes the secret scroll and runs away with it, hoping to fight against the cruel world that the Manyu Clan has created...