Author Topic: STAR CITIZEN: JEU PRÉFÉRÉ DE VOMKRIEGE  (Read 306982 times)

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benjipwns

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #600 on: July 20, 2016, 12:37:44 AM »
I guess CIG now owns the bank.

Kara

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #601 on: July 20, 2016, 03:17:36 AM »
A company I work with grosses ~50 million dollars every year and every year they sweat bullets about their line of credit for less than 5 million dollars being renewed.

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #602 on: July 20, 2016, 05:09:33 AM »
A company I work with grosses ~50 million dollars every year and every year they sweat bullets about their line of credit for less than 5 million dollars being renewed.

Yeah that's what I would expect. It often seems to be glanced over that while the funding raised is impressive, it was achieved through a non stop 4 years of aggressively pushing preorders and overpriced virtual goods. They may have stable revenue but their only chance at a major payout now would be a moderately successful release of an actual product.

EDIT - More from the guy who claim to have come connections to the dev scene in Manchester : Work on cutscenes and mocap performance is being prioritised heavily over any gameplay features. One dev commented on it as "icing before the cake".

EDIT :



 :heh
Even just speaking of wages (I'm not certain of how it works in the UK and US but in France you'd also have to pay fees for using image/likeness/publicity rights within agreeed upon mediums and territories), that's incredibly optimistic.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2016, 12:21:15 PM by VomKriege »
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CatsCatsCats

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #603 on: July 20, 2016, 02:50:35 PM »
I would love to know what kind of insurance policy there is on this project

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #604 on: July 20, 2016, 07:28:22 PM »
More reddit goodness.

Quote
What happened to vaulting and sliding?
The first we heard about it was in January (...) Then again in February

Quote
we've got things like vaulting over obstacles and stuff and that isn't going to be in 2.2 but it'll be in 2.3 for instance... ultimately it'll have the equivalent of being able to do parkour with sliding and ledge grabbing and all the rest of the stuff.

And then it got dropped from 2.3, didn't appear in 2.4, and now we've got a feature list for 2.5 where it is once again absent. Where did it go?

Quote
Quote
if CIG is going to hype up a feature for several months, they really need to stop going completely silent on it afterward.... there are dozens of features they have done this with. It really undermines their credibility.

Dude, they're just trying to do their jobs and their best. They have a million things to worry about, and the more they worry about this type of thing, rather than simply making their game, the longer it will take.

Quote
I think it's important to note that with the level of realism they're going for, sliding us fairly ineffective, it's a great way to get into cover a moment ahead of the gunfire headed your way, but if you tried to baseball slide around a corner you'll likely find that with their aim system you'd be hitting nothing, as this isn't COD. Also, since realism is a point, realistically you'd tear your suit eventually and the deathlock would get you. Just sayin. I am looking forward to vaulting and their version of a cover system.

Quote
What happened? Game development happened.

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/4tqka4/what_happened_to_vaulting_and_sliding/

---

Quote
"Yeah, good job we don't have a publisher", I say as I vibrate through the floor of my Mustang, "Who knows how much content we'd be missing and bugs we'd be dealing with", I say as it explodes, flinging me through the void around one of the three space stations in the only system.

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/4tnjo1/about_this_whole_delay_thing/d5jb4iz

:dead
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Yulwei

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #605 on: July 20, 2016, 07:49:39 PM »
That delicious downplaying of features they were promised and which they paid money for :rejoice

Kara

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #606 on: July 20, 2016, 11:40:09 PM »
A company I work with grosses ~50 million dollars every year and every year they sweat bullets about their line of credit for less than 5 million dollars being renewed.

Yeah that's what I would expect. It often seems to be glanced over that while the funding raised is impressive, it was achieved through a non stop 4 years of aggressively pushing preorders and overpriced virtual goods. They may have stable revenue but their only chance at a major payout now would be a moderately successful release of an actual product.

Basically, gross revenue is only a factor in credit worthiness. In my personal example, the concern exists in a low profitability industry, so not only is that comparatively small credit extremely important in day to day operation, but it represents an amount comparable to their annual net income.

I know that people (often blinded by the hope that things that otherwise wouldn't have been made will be made) call crowd funding "patronage" (or something equivalent) but really they're customer deposits, which are an accounting liability for the recipient of the funding until product is delivered.

Given that I can't imagine a banker going, "You've promised 120 million dollars of product and have no other revenue until delivery? Let me lend you an additional 250 million, sirs and madames." (Unless they're a Citizen themselves, of course.)

Great Rumbler

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #607 on: July 21, 2016, 12:05:47 AM »
Lots of Citizens seem to be under the impression that CIG has access to vast amounts of resources both presently and in the future, so there's no concern about them running out of money since then can simply tap into these reserves by selling more copies of the game/getting massive bank loans/receiving expensive third-party services essentially for free. There's a rude awakening in store for the lot of them.
dog

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #608 on: July 21, 2016, 01:09:03 AM »
I think a lot of you need to read the following:
This isn't a typical game that gets pumped out of a major studio every year with sequel after sequel that just builds on top of an original idea that could never be achieved because the suits wanted money now now now. You know, those games where they release DLC or the next one in the series that really just adds features that should/could have been in the original game.
I know, it sucks. I have terrible patience myself, but I take long breaks and just pop into PU here and there to keep up on what's going on. I've already made my investment, so I'm just along for the ride now.


No.. Anything but the suits!!! 
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Joe Molotov

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #609 on: July 21, 2016, 11:23:50 AM »
Man, I hate the suits. Always releasing DLC because they want money now now now.

*buys several $1000 DLC spaceships*
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #610 on: July 21, 2016, 03:19:10 PM »
http://www.pcinvasion.com/star-citizen-squadron-42-reality-tv-show

A Squadron 42 casting session will be featured on a real tv show  :heh
« Last Edit: July 21, 2016, 03:24:01 PM by VomKriege »
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Trent Dole

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #611 on: July 21, 2016, 03:39:54 PM »
So is this the most feature creep-y dev story ever or is there something worse out there?
Hi

Great Rumbler

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #612 on: July 21, 2016, 04:14:22 PM »
So is this the most feature creep-y dev story ever or is there something worse out there?

Duke Nukem Forever, maybe?
dog

nudemacusers

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #613 on: July 21, 2016, 08:19:40 PM »
http://www.pcinvasion.com/star-citizen-squadron-42-reality-tv-show

A Squadron 42 casting session will be featured on a real tv show  :heh
well at least something from this game will release  :aah
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benjipwns

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #614 on: July 22, 2016, 12:16:19 AM »
The Duke we got kinda was what I imagine what the game would have been had it come out earlier. (Much like Prey sorta. Its hook was always the portals, they just stopped developing it for five years or whatever.) That was development/engine/personnel hell like Daikatana. (The entire Daikatana programming team quit mid development!) IIRC, they were still trying to do DNF with 1990s era sized teams well into the mid-2000s.

This has that on top of the constant feature creep/over-promising plus large wastes of money (like Ion Storm) and Derek Smart. Also the whole Cult forming around it.

Half-Life 3/2: Episode Three probably is like this to some extent.

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #615 on: July 22, 2016, 02:41:07 AM »
More Derek Smart fuckery :

https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/756235468660936704

https://twitter.com/dsmart/status/756238528976154626

Quote
Star Citizen fans. Read this news bite. And standby for more during gamescom. (...) Can you picture this guy [Borean note : Actor who's been a mainstay in British soap Coronation Street] on the bridge of an Idris?

 :ohyou

SA speculating that he is brought in to stand for Gary Oldman which was rumoured (without any solid source to my knowledge) of being done with the project. Theorically with "performance capture" you could digitally graft Oldman's face on any set of data captured with any no name actor, maybe that's that ? It's not too far out to think Oldman would be too expensive or busy to be brought back for reshoots. Guess we'll see if there's truth to any of that...

If that actor involvement is true and he is being featured at Gamescom, that's a hell of a cliff in star power. :lol
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Joe Molotov

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #616 on: July 22, 2016, 02:36:11 PM »
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #617 on: July 22, 2016, 06:49:53 PM »
Speaking of Squadron 42, here's an oldie but goodie part of CitizenCon 2015 :

https://youtu.be/IehITxsK4Fs?t=1h37m

Roberts literally dropping on stage his monstruous script with an awkward aide standing behind him.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2016, 06:53:56 PM by VomKriege »
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #618 on: July 22, 2016, 09:04:38 PM »
https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/4u41i9/reverse_the_verse_episode_104_inn_summary/

Imperial News Network, the biggest fan site for Star Citizen, get called out by Community Manager discolando for plainly making stuff up in their summaries of the videos.

Quote
Actually, that's not what I said at all.

"Procedural generation footage will most likely come at Gamescom during the course of the event. They still aren't doing a big fancy presentation, but will reveal things over the course of the Gamescom event."

Absolutely none of that was said. Those are assumptions being made on the part of those making the summaries.

"AtV is not the good time to show that. There might be a cool event in Germany coming up in a month that would be the perfect time to show procedural gen off."

Close. I never said Germany.

Misunderstandings come when people read summaries instead of watching the shows, and the summaries are incorrect and possess statements that were never made.

Fan expectations getting out of hand even for hype artists like CIG...
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wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #619 on: July 23, 2016, 03:46:49 PM »
https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/4u41i9/reverse_the_verse_episode_104_inn_summary/

Imperial News Network, the biggest fan site for Star Citizen, get called out by Community Manager discolando for plainly making stuff up in their summaries of the videos.

Fan expectations getting out of hand even for hype artists like CIG...

Well, turns out this month's PC Games feature just so happens to cover the procedural planet stuff ahead of Gamescom.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2016, 03:52:55 PM by wsippel »

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #620 on: July 23, 2016, 07:50:03 PM »
https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/4u41i9/reverse_the_verse_episode_104_inn_summary/

Imperial News Network, the biggest fan site for Star Citizen, get called out by Community Manager discolando for plainly making stuff up in their summaries of the videos.

Fan expectations getting out of hand even for hype artists like CIG...

Well, turns out this month's PC Games feature just so happens to cover the procedural planet stuff ahead of Gamescom.

That's the big feature in the german mag right ? It has a few new images and it reiterates some stuff about what is supposed to be coming for 2.6 / 2.7 . It also put to print that indeed they want to really have "Star Marine" (as a module or better FPS mechanics) in 2.6 .

Content summary in spoiler tags :

spoiler (click to show/hide)
[close]

You're in the project, wsippel, right ? Are you worried or confident ? What are you most reasonable and optimistic assessment of the games (SC and SQ42 part 1) being completed or going gold judging by whatever we have at our disposal now ? For all the sarcasm and bias I harbor with the project, I'm still curious to hear your opinion on this.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2016, 08:12:53 PM by VomKriege »
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wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #621 on: July 24, 2016, 10:13:16 AM »

You're in the project, wsippel, right ? Are you worried or confident ? What are you most reasonable and optimistic assessment of the games (SC and SQ42 part 1) being completed or going gold judging by whatever we have at our disposal now ? For all the sarcasm and bias I harbor with the project, I'm still curious to hear your opinion on this.

Yeah, I spent roughly €100 on the game. While I absolutely expect further delays, I'm still cautiously optimistic. I think one of the main causes for the backlash is that CIG appears to be very open, which leads people to believe that what's in the PTU is all there is. That is almost certainly not the case. They're evidently working on tons of things we haven't seen yet, and things only people who closely follow the project have seen teasers or leaks of. Also, when people talk about feature creep, they often forget that a lot of the planned features aren't supposed to be ready for 1.0. It's an MMO after all, it won't "launch" with 100 solar systems, tons of professions, all of the ships, alien races, pets and god knows what else they've been talking about. Even procedural planets and orbital mechanics weren't initially supposed to be 1.0 features. Plus, I expect several of the promised feature to never make it, not necessarily because they're too ambitious, but simply because quite a few don't sound like they'd work from a gameplay perspective.

Now it seems CIG might even be going for a rolling release, which is fine by me. I have to say though, 2.7 is a bit of a litmus test. If they truly have a complete star system with 40 landing zones, three inhabited planets with cities, several uninhabited procedurally generated planets you can land on, dynamic missions and all that other jazz out by the end of the year, that would certainly help their credibility. What Tony Zurovec, SC's director, said last week also sounded reasonable: They'll roll out several major essential features sooner than initially planned, but start on a smaller, more manageable scale. Like, they'll start with handheld mining and salvage equipment which is much easier to implement than dedicated ships, simply because they need commodities in the game and they need to give people something to do.

That was about SC, of course. SQ42 is a smaller, much more focussed project, the kind of project Chris and Erin have been doing many times in the past (Erin's always been the guy who made sure Chris eventually shipped something, but he didn't work on Freelancer, which might explain some of the issues that game had). I'm certain it won't make 2016, but I'm pretty confident that it'll come out some time next year.

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #622 on: July 24, 2016, 10:45:39 AM »
Thanks. My opinion is obviously less than favourable but I would agree that major tangible progress by year's end (along the lines you mention) would certainly help in dispelling the impression that CIG will fail to deliver something down the line. By year's end we'll also see if the funding drive is really slowing down. I'd wager it would actually be a good thing for CIG to be subjected to a real material deadline for delivery.
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #623 on: July 24, 2016, 06:22:19 PM »
A quote from C.Roberts in that german feature, translated by someone on the Frontier forums :

"If you know you want to build a castle, you can design and build it from the ground up. But if you are building a house, then later discover that you can change it into a castle, you run the risk of having to redo a lot of work. Both methods work in the end. We have decided on the second choice, and yes, that does mean that we'll have to deal with delays and setbacks. However, I think that in the end, it will result in a better experience for Star Citizen players."

Make of that what you will. Myself, I question that you ought to build a castle if you can, but heh...
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naff

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #624 on: July 24, 2016, 06:47:11 PM »
Doubt this "Castles" Serfs will continue to labor for much longer in return for nothing.... Then again maybe i underestimate these nerdlingers
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recursivelyenumerable

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #625 on: July 24, 2016, 07:53:52 PM »
The correct answer is to finish the fucking house first, and only then move on to start work on the castle. Oh well ... :doge
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Joe Molotov

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #626 on: July 24, 2016, 08:05:28 PM »
Then they tore down the castle to make the spaceships.
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wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #627 on: July 24, 2016, 11:57:46 PM »
I honestly don't get why so many people who didn't back the project are so quick to complain. The changes in scope and the delays don't really affect them, and most backers, myself included, don't seem to mind delays if it benefits overally product. It's just as nonsensical as complaining about the prices for the ships. Nobody has to buy them. Sure, CIG relies on the sales, and quite a few people are evidently happy to throw money their way, but it should be easy to ignore for anybody else. If you were interested and somewhat confident, you could have pre-ordered the whole thing for less than $50, for both Star Citizen and Squadron 42. That's what the vast majority of backers did. If you're interested but not as confident, you can just wait until the damn games actually come out.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2016, 12:03:29 AM by wsippel »

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #628 on: July 25, 2016, 02:16:43 AM »
Well, it's an entertaining trainwreck, for one. I'll happily concede if I was wrong to be a fuckwit and the game turns out fine and hell, who knows, could maybe become a client myself (in theory).

I can't really side with you about the ship prices, because well, several thousands people do buy them, I personnaly don't think anyone should be invested in that much within the frame of something like crowdfunding*. Now you could say to each his own and people are free to do just that and after all, I won't harass anyone personnaly to not do it; yet from our perspective, CIG is exploiting dishonest** and predatory practices. The cardinal sin, in my view, is them running an always-open unlimited fund drive, which is highly unorthodox with current crowdfunding practices (for a reason) and IMHO, cannot be conductive with sensible production management especially on such a wildly ambitious project.

I understand your frustation, you think the game is being unfairly grilled on the basis of misinformation or bias : I mean, I'm having the same feeling in reverse. But a lot of the responsibility for that is with CIG : they're the ones who decided on this economic model and they're the ones that decided to vastly change the scope of their project, adding several years in development time in the process.
:yeshrug

* I've used crowdfunding myself, on much smaller amounts. I would have been uncomfortable if someone besides myself would have had dropped a couple of grands, though.

** Whatever your opinion of Derek Smart may be, it is a fact that CIG/RSI just revised twice in a year the terms of their own accountability. That may not be a proof that something sinister is going on, but that's poor form and not exactly something that inspire confidence.



 :ryker
« Last Edit: July 25, 2016, 03:00:42 AM by VomKriege »
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wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #629 on: July 25, 2016, 09:53:42 AM »
SC is an MMO. They'll always need more money to keep the servers up and running, fix bugs and add content. As far as I know, all crowd funded MMOs do the same thing. Here are a few examples:

https://www.crowfall.com/
http://www.gloriavictisgame.com/
https://www.shroudoftheavatar.com/

As you can see, the games all reached their initial funding goals, they are all still in development, and they still sell crap for hundreds or thousands of dollars. Comes with the territory, really. MMOs have no finished release state after all.

CatsCatsCats

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #630 on: July 25, 2016, 07:26:00 PM »
Oh this is much more entertaining now that we have someone to argue the pro side

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #631 on: July 25, 2016, 08:41:18 PM »
Par for the MMO course ? Maybe so. I wouldn't find that economic model anymore palatable : I can of course accept that they may have running costs but nothing stopped them to switching at any point to a more traditional revenue model based on selling the single player game, for instance, or selling preorders...

...well, they're already selling preorders, really. Except they won't call it that but insist on using the crowdfunding lexicon which conveniently comes with less legal strings, as evidenced by the fact they now pretend that they will not abide to a comprehensive refund policy unless the game has ceased development. Mostly a fancy way of saying "never", as the game(s) not being delivered somewhat "complete" at all would mean RSI/CIG has gone under, more or less.

It's possible to go over budget despite the best intentions. Surely, however, overrun should be marginal. CIG having received almost twice their own highest projection of 65m (and six time over the originally pitched 20m) should largely be in the clear to cover it already. Yet they're still chasing funds retentlessly instead of settling into full development mode. I don't think anyone would be worried if RSI/CGI was laying low at this point and "only" providing regular updates showing steady progress on the core content they promised back then.  Do they need the money ? Has the scope of the game continued to increase still ? Both of those assumptions, to me, are worrisome and contrary to what I'd expect from solid project management.
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wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #632 on: July 25, 2016, 11:46:05 PM »
Nobody can verify obviously, but CIG stated a while ago that they don't actually need any more money at this point, and that all the money they got in recent months would be set aside for post-release stuff. Yet people constantly bug them to do new concept sales (which is true as far as I can tell), and would you honestly expect them to leave money on the table? Why should they? To appease Derek Smart and folks who only seek drama and don't actually care about their games to begin with? And lets be honest, if they stopped taking money tomorrow, those exact same people would use that as ammunition - spining it as damage control or something.

bluemax

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #633 on: July 26, 2016, 03:51:31 AM »
I think part of it is that most of us were initially interested in the project when it wasn't an MMO and now that it has spiraled into some uncompletable behemoth we are just along to watch for the inevitable downfall. Lots of other studios do dumb shit along the same lines, but few do it with the level of scope, money and public access as Star Citizen has.

I legit believed in this project once. Enough to interview for a job with them. Now I go to the monthly industry drinking events and see all the people whose nametags used to say Cloud Imperium and now list a different company.
NO

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #634 on: July 26, 2016, 08:48:33 PM »
Nobody can verify obviously, but CIG stated a while ago that they don't actually need any more money at this point, and that all the money they got in recent months would be set aside for post-release stuff. Yet people constantly bug them to do new concept sales (which is true as far as I can tell), and would you honestly expect them to leave money on the table? Why should they? To appease Derek Smart and folks who only seek drama and don't actually care about their games to begin with? And lets be honest, if they stopped taking money tomorrow, those exact same people would use that as ammunition - spining it as damage control or something.

I actually don't think anyone would be worried if they stopped the pledge drive, provided they continue communications and show faster progress. In truth, the jeering about the project wouldn't be half as strident if they weren't two years behind schedule, were farther along, not denying or allowing refund at their own discretion, etc... Now I know that delay is accroding to some (and maybe you) perfectly understandable given the increase in scope but I think the point of view of some backers seeking refunds is not unreasonable, either. RSI/CIG did fumble, and not only once, on their schedule.

I'm also not convinced by framing the question as "leaving money on the table". That partly is not money that may be left, but revenue cashed in advance. To be clear, I don't argue that RSI/CIG should have shut in all income streams, just that they should have at the very least aknowledged that they are no longer "crowdfunding" but are just selling preorders, with all the obligations entailed. And for my personal preference, dialed down the sale of concept ships at ludicrous prices. Beyond the moral discomfort, while it is of course expected that a company will seek out revenue and profit, it's not always the best course of action to pocket anything ASAP especially if that may result in the future in potential trouble (maybe legal). Since I'm not Derek Smart, I cannot predict with certainty that it will happen, though.

Speaking of Mister Smart, his latest grandiose claim :
Quote
We're getting word that CIG-UK have hired a firm to root out leakers via social media. More as this develops.

As usual with the flamboyant internet warlord, take it with a two ton pinch of salt...

Whatever the outcome, I do hope the post mortems will live up to it.
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #635 on: July 30, 2016, 01:48:40 AM »
Cliff notes of the latest CIG broadcast :

Quote
Chris is back from London after finishing up some pickup performance capture shoots for Squadron 42 and some Persistent Universe captures as well. The current Squadron 42 script is at 1,255 pages.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/259596-The-Star-Citizen-Thread-v5?p=4291135&viewfull=1#post4291135

Just how many times can he be come back from shooting in London ?
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wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #636 on: July 30, 2016, 02:55:42 PM »
Cliff notes of the latest CIG broadcast :

Quote
Chris is back from London after finishing up some pickup performance capture shoots for Squadron 42 and some Persistent Universe captures as well. The current Squadron 42 script is at 1,255 pages.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/259596-The-Star-Citizen-Thread-v5?p=4291135&viewfull=1#post4291135

Just how many times can he be come back from shooting in London ?

The main session was about a year ago, now they shot some additional footage. So unless I missed something... twice?

He often comes back from the UK, which shouldn't be all that surprising considering that's where the main development team and most of the SQ42 cinematics team are.

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #637 on: July 30, 2016, 06:16:19 PM »
He was already engaged in "reshoots" a month ago (Mark Hamill tweet + why Roberts was unavailable for a video with... Sean Tracy, I believe ?). There was also talks of additional "smoother" mocap sessions in London being integrated back in the beginning of June. Sounds either like along string or several days peppered through the agenda, on top of a rather generous principal photography.
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wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #638 on: July 30, 2016, 08:35:47 PM »
He was already engaged in "reshoots" a month ago (Mark Hamill tweet + why Roberts was unavailable for a video with... Sean Tracy, I believe ?). There was also talks of additional "smoother" mocap sessions in London being integrated back in the beginning of June. Sounds either like along string or several days peppered through the agenda, on top of a rather generous principal photography.

Each session took two to three months, with some breaks. That might seem like a lot, but apparently, it's really not: http://www.gamestm.co.uk/features/the-evolution-of-motion-capture/

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #639 on: July 30, 2016, 09:19:40 PM »
He was already engaged in "reshoots" a month ago (Mark Hamill tweet + why Roberts was unavailable for a video with... Sean Tracy, I believe ?). There was also talks of additional "smoother" mocap sessions in London being integrated back in the beginning of June. Sounds either like along string or several days peppered through the agenda, on top of a rather generous principal photography.

Each session took two to three months, with some breaks. That might seem like a lot, but apparently, it's really not: http://www.gamestm.co.uk/features/the-evolution-of-motion-capture/

I don't see any indication of the length of mocap shooting for games, would you have some examples or did I miss something ? The comparison is not 1:1, but 60 days of performance capture for a feature film would absolutely be a very generous amount (Tintin is reported to be 32 days, Polar Express 38) and film is likely to be by far the medium where you're allowing the slowest advancement by day. Obviously, I understand the amount of raw material needed is not the same, but my point is that those things are pretty expensive (esp. at the Imaginarium...) and the cost will add up fast. To my knowledge it's not rare for games to do the body mocap with stand ins (MGSV, apparently) and / or to use much simpler studios as to keep costs down.
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wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #640 on: July 31, 2016, 07:50:35 AM »
Yeah, I could only find data for motion pictures as well, but as you wrote, while their standards are higher, they need a lot less material. I think it's also worth noting that CIG didn't just shoot SQ42 cutscenes at the Imaginarium. They also did a lot of mocap for Star Citizen, and captured general gameplay and idle animations at the Imaginarium. Those were directed by Steve Bender and performed by mocap actors, not by anybody famous. I assume they book the studio for longer continuous periods, as that is probably cheaper, then use downtime or remaining days for "second unit" sessions.

VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #641 on: August 01, 2016, 06:49:37 PM »
I would imagine, still I feel I read quite a few times of people "back from London". Their own mocap equipment is in the States, right ? Honestly, besides the speculation on this, I cannot shake the feeling it's all a bit... superfluous. I know, Wing Commander and FMV, but such an extravagant cast is something you only find on CoD or maybe GTA, and were never the core reason of their success. Really hard for me to find such use of backer's money reasonable.
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #642 on: August 03, 2016, 06:10:44 PM »
Well Derek Smart ruined the joke and just made it creepy for everyone.

:larry
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bluemax

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #643 on: August 04, 2016, 12:18:18 AM »
Quote
Derek Smart ‏@dsmart  Aug 2
for those miffed about Sandi appearing in a soft-core tickle video on pornhub, u may as well stay off the Internet tomorrow. Fair warning

Derek Smart ‏@dsmart  Aug 2
And you should probably read up on "18 U.S. Code § 2257" of the US legal code by tomorrow, and what that means for adult performances

Derek Smart ‏@dsmart  3h3 hours ago
It's her. And the tickle stuff is tame in comparison to what I have now received. Blog going live once I get legal (and moral) clearance

Derek Smart ‏@dsmart  3h3 hours ago
It's her. And the tickle stuff is tame in comparison to what I have now received. Blog going live once I get legal (and moral) clearance

Derek Smart ‏@dsmart  3h3 hours ago
I remember back when I wrote a blog outing them for nepotism. Everyone said I was wrong. Until they were forced to come clean.

 :doge

So if I understand this correctly the head of HR for the UK portion of RSI got discovered by the cofounder of RSI because he has a tickling fetish.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2016, 12:24:01 AM by bluemax »
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Great Rumbler

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #644 on: August 04, 2016, 12:44:22 AM »
She's also Chris Robert's wife.
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #645 on: August 04, 2016, 02:38:37 AM »
Nah she's the head of marketing for all branches.
Mocking Chris Roberts and his wife was within limits, including say her comedy chops or the awkward way they interacted during the first few years of development (which some interpreted as a way to conceal their marriage). Same with digging up some atrocious quotes from the past website of Community Manager's Ben Lesnick, though I never really cared for it myself and thought the jokes about his obesity on SomethingAwful already became way too frequent and mean... However it really just sound like some sordid blackmail at this point. Someone went out of his way to find those -not too surprising in this day and age, but still- and Smart is making the decision to signal boost something that doesn't seem to be relevant at all with regards to how the Star Citizen project is run. Unless it exposes something with legal ramifications, I can't really think of this as anything but crass.

Meanwhile, subscribers get :



Apparently no other perks than the privilege of being able to buy the ship (which went up for 170$ last time).
« Last Edit: August 04, 2016, 03:00:41 AM by VomKriege »
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Joe Molotov

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #646 on: August 04, 2016, 10:34:00 AM »
kink shaming  :wag
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Great Rumbler

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #647 on: August 04, 2016, 10:41:10 AM »
Derek Smart is really going hard on this line of attack, and he's trying to straddle this weird line between "Oh ho! Look at what Chris Roberts' wife was up to when she was younger!" and "But I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, I'm just providing the information." And I really don't understand how this is meant to help his crusade against RSI.
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demi

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #648 on: August 04, 2016, 10:41:20 AM »
Yo what the fuck? Link to this tickle vid? I'd love to jerk off to Chris Roberts' wife.
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #649 on: August 04, 2016, 12:04:13 PM »
Who are the SC superbackers ?

Quote
The first thing I bought was the Rear Admiral package. I remember, because it was like $250, I was like, ‘that’s insane! That’s an insane amount of money for a game! Hell no!’. I don’t know why I caved. It looked cool. So I bought the Rear Admiral package and then it went all downhill from there.

 :oreilly
I get that text may be distorting what was maybe said in a playful tone, but that's a really weird way to phrase it.

There's some (warranted) snide remarks from the author, but the article does a decent job letting the backers express themselves. Also asks them how long they expect they can bother with the slipping schedule.
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bluemax

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #650 on: August 06, 2016, 12:02:03 AM »
Derek Smart did confirm today that the last vestiges of Firefall have been let go. A guy I worked with that we hired from there wouldn't even talk about how bad that place was.
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Tasty

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #653 on: August 07, 2016, 06:22:49 PM »
Quote
Quote
Quote
What does Star Citizen do that nobody else has yet?

Not trying to contribute to the craziness of that OP but the answer to your question is Localized Physics Grids.

The interiors of ships have their own physics. You can walk around them, climb ladders, sit in chairs, even if the ship is upside down and flying at 1000 m/s. Also, you can seamlessly transition between physics grids as well. It's buggy sometimes but you can absolutely jet pack through zero gravity into the cargo bay of a moving ship, land on your feet, then walk around normally as the ship you're on flies away.

I'm sure there's other things SC does that are new but this is the one that impressed me the most

Except that Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare has done localized physics grids. Space Engineers does it too. Dead Space has physics grids.

Plenty of games give you the ability to get on a ship/vehicle and do things in it while the ship itself moves around or does things independent of the player's movement.

It's not something new or groundbreaking in the industry.

:dead

benjipwns

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #654 on: August 07, 2016, 06:51:54 PM »
all [removed]  :(

benjipwns

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #655 on: August 07, 2016, 06:54:55 PM »
Derek Smart did confirm today that the last vestiges of Firefall have been let go. A guy I worked with that we hired from there wouldn't even talk about how bad that place was.
I heard that things got better at Red5 after it was bought by an incompetent Chinese conglomerate that no idea how to run an MMO or video game company.

wsippel

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #656 on: August 08, 2016, 09:39:24 AM »
Quote
Quote
Quote
What does Star Citizen do that nobody else has yet?

Not trying to contribute to the craziness of that OP but the answer to your question is Localized Physics Grids.

The interiors of ships have their own physics. You can walk around them, climb ladders, sit in chairs, even if the ship is upside down and flying at 1000 m/s. Also, you can seamlessly transition between physics grids as well. It's buggy sometimes but you can absolutely jet pack through zero gravity into the cargo bay of a moving ship, land on your feet, then walk around normally as the ship you're on flies away.

I'm sure there's other things SC does that are new but this is the one that impressed me the most

Except that Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare has done localized physics grids. Space Engineers does it too. Dead Space has physics grids.

Plenty of games give you the ability to get on a ship/vehicle and do things in it while the ship itself moves around or does things independent of the player's movement.

It's not something new or groundbreaking in the industry.

:dead

The system in SC goes a bit further than that though. It has to, because you have grids within grids within grids, and new grids can be spawned, joined, separated and destroyed on the fly. Basically, you can stand in a ship with artificial gravity that floats upside down in the hangar of a larger ship with its own gravity generator disabled, which might then land on a space station that also has its own gravity, which would then affect both ships (the small ship would suddenly fall "down" within the larger ships hangar).

I don't know about Space Engineers, but neither CoD nor Dead Space have real simulated gravity and localized physics systems. It would be complete overkill and unnecessary.

bluemax

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #657 on: August 09, 2016, 01:09:47 AM »
Derek Smart did confirm today that the last vestiges of Firefall have been let go. A guy I worked with that we hired from there wouldn't even talk about how bad that place was.
I heard that things got better at Red5 after it was bought by an incompetent Chinese conglomerate that no idea how to run an MMO or video game company.

It's possible it got better, but that place was still bad by every measure I heard.
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naff

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #658 on: August 09, 2016, 11:22:29 PM »
Derek Smart is really going hard on this line of attack, and he's trying to straddle this weird line between "Oh ho! Look at what Chris Roberts' wife was up to when she was younger!" and "But I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, I'm just providing the information." And I really don't understand how this is meant to help his crusade against RSI.

He's a gamer gate dweeb, this isn't surprising
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VomKriege

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Re: STAR CITIZEN: LES SECRETS D'UNE MACHINE À CASH
« Reply #659 on: August 12, 2016, 05:34:46 AM »
Well, Smart is doubling down on it now he's posting photos from Sandi Gardiner (I'm inferring they're captures from the videos he mentioned a few days ago ?), meanwhile she is "taking a break from social media due to harassment" and a twitter hashtag "IStandWithSandi" is being used, which Smart is trolling like there's no tomorrow.

 :doge
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