Author Topic: Other Forums Containment Thread  (Read 3127787 times)

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GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46320 on: April 02, 2023, 07:39:04 AM »
granting rights to a group can absolutely diminish rights of another

I mean, yeah, even things like diversity quotas and affirmative action are discriminatory policies intended to increase opportunities for one group at the expense of another, and everyone knows this is true, but the rationale is that it is a temporary measure to combat existing systemic inequalities that cannot fix themselves.

A freshly transitioned woman smashing all existing records and obliterating the olympic team in their first competition is not the someone who needs extra help to keep things fair.

GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46321 on: April 02, 2023, 07:41:42 AM »
Quote
Whenever someone like Aniston makes such a foolish and ignorant comment I just want to ask them if they've seen It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. That show single handedly dismantles that silly belief you can't be offensive or comedy has gotten too safe. Anyone making that comment just sounds ignorant or like they want to do something actually bigoted but know they'll get shit for it, deservedly so.

The show that literally had to pull a bunch of episodes from streaming services as too offensive is your exemplar for modern comedy is still allowed to be edgy and push boundaries...?

GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46322 on: April 02, 2023, 07:43:57 AM »
Actually, what's the oldest sitcom that holds up? First one that comes to my mind is Yes, Minister but I know there's got to be something older that I'm forgetting.

FACT CHECK: Yes, Minister promotes white supremacy extremists :wag

paprikastaude

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46323 on: April 02, 2023, 08:14:12 AM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/i-need-help-i-can’t-bring-myself-to-be-excited-for-ffxvi.704321/

Quote
Every time I read about this game I want to be excited. But then I read the internet “gamer” excitement about this game being less “SJWy” and “YoshiP taking a stand” and crap like that and then I lost interest quickly.

I stopped playing FFXIV too for very similar reason I can’t bring myself to support this.

Not a critique to my favorite Japanese dev who I even worked with for a while when I was still in gamedev! I’m just sick and tired of the “fandom”.

Those damned GAMERS are ruining my shill time  :walkaway :gamer

GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46324 on: April 02, 2023, 08:43:45 AM »
Maybe some education about what HRT does to the sex drive and information about how trans women identify sexually would put some minds at ease.

Only a third of trans women identify as woman-attracted.

This leaves less than ¼, or 23%, of transgender survey respondents identifying as straight. Trans people who are straight – trans women who are only romantically and sexually interested in men and trans men who are only romantically and sexually interested in women

Trans Activists in the BitchEatingCrackersAndOtherAssortedDisinformation thread lying about their own cited statistics again :pika

e: because theres been multiple studies on this, and its literally the rationale behind why the Ts should be lobbied by the LGB umbrella - because you might assume someone who has spent their entire life believing they are a woman in a mans body would fall under 'normal' sexuality demographics of a majority finding men sexually attractive, but its actually the opposite - the vast majority are 'gay' after (and before) transition, ie are attracted to their identified sex.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2023, 08:54:33 AM by GreatSageEqualOfHeaven »

Straight Edge

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46325 on: April 02, 2023, 09:18:33 AM »
Quote
Depictions in porn of trans women with functioning penises are viagra-assisted or the actor is not on hrt, in order to perform for the camera, from what I have read (I have never seen trans porn).

 :science
Oi Oi

Vertigo

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46326 on: April 02, 2023, 01:27:36 PM »
That Ashley as a mouse thread is legit disturbing.

But when you have furries on the mod team they obviously get a pass.

Boredfrom

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46327 on: April 02, 2023, 01:34:29 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/ada-wongs-new-va-gets-thousands-of-hate-comments-disables-instagram-comments.704180/page-8#post-103572230

Quote
I’m not a fan of the casting but why would you attack her over this ?

Quote from: ZeoTheVagina
Stop. Doing. This.

RE never learns, doesn’t it? Saying that the actress is shit at her job doesn’t mean harassment.

Quote
"Constructive criticism" often isn't warranted either, particularly if you're directly reaching out to an individual on social media. Does such criticism need to be shared at all, especially from randos with probably next to no professional insight? Probably not.

People should close RE, then.



Uncle

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46328 on: April 02, 2023, 01:54:38 PM »
then marvel unexpectedly casts gina carano as the new captain marvel and suddenly era falls all over itself to talk about what a horrible actor she is in comparison to brie
Uncle

Boredfrom

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46329 on: April 02, 2023, 02:06:11 PM »
Quote
Yes, that is a fair point. There are way too many people on the internet who try to use a larger vocabulary and act with the attitude of a food critic that their "criticism" is on the same level as an industry professional and therefore should be taken seriously and have as much weight or value.

Wah?


Kevtones

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46330 on: April 02, 2023, 02:23:07 PM »
Oh man, that how long to wait to get engaged thread is going to be full of terrible advice. Can’t wait.
wrong

Nintex

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46331 on: April 02, 2023, 02:36:43 PM »
So what exactly is the problem with the new Ada VA?
Honestly, I don't think Ada Wong had an iconic voice to start with.

They replaced the Merchant voice too and it's fine? I would say overall the voice work is better because characters are no longer repeating the same 3 or 4 lines and Leon and Ashley now react in context :idont

Luis Serra is probably the biggest change he's no longer an Antonio Banderas voice-alike.
🤴

Uncle

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46332 on: April 02, 2023, 02:51:11 PM »
she didn't have an iconic voice but she pulled off generic sultry and the new one just doesn't

Uncle

Uncle

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46333 on: April 02, 2023, 02:52:06 PM »
oh boy they've started banning people for a month for saying "yeah harassment is never justified but I prefer the old voice actress"
Uncle

HaughtyFrank

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46334 on: April 02, 2023, 03:00:42 PM »
Going to an actors social media and telling them their acting sucks is quite a dick move, saying it on a random internet forum seems fair to me though

HardcoreRetro

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46335 on: April 02, 2023, 03:03:56 PM »
So what exactly is the problem with the new Ada VA?

The fact that the woman that did her voice can't voice act? She seems to be a b-list actor. They're different skills. It's one of the flattest deliveries I've heard in a big budget game in a while.

I was shocked when I found out Daniel Craig voiced himself in one of the James Bond games. I thought it was someone doing a bad impersonation of him.

Nintex

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46336 on: April 02, 2023, 03:16:03 PM »
she didn't have an iconic voice but she pulled off generic sultry and the new one just doesn't


I liked Ada's voice in Resident Evil 2 Remake the best, I think that was already a different person shame she couldn't be cast for this remake too.
Apart from that in the comparison it bothers me more that they changed: "I don't kiss and tell" to "I don't work and tell". Seems like overall they wanted to make her less flirty and more stoic, which makes little sense story wise as Leon having mommy issues whenever he runs into Ada and her double crossing Leon multiple times but feeling bad about it at the last second and saving him is the basis of her entire character arc.

I wonder if they changed the voice lines in the Japanese version too or if it was just a thing they did during localization.
🤴

HaughtyFrank

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46337 on: April 02, 2023, 03:19:00 PM »
she didn't have an iconic voice but she pulled off generic sultry and the new one just doesn't


Apart from that in the comparison it bothers me more that they changed: "I don't kiss and tell" to "I don't work and tell". Seems like overall they wanted to make her less flirty and more stoic, which makes little sense story wise as Leon having mommy issues whenever he runs into Ada and her double crossing Leon multiple times but feeling bad about it at the last second and saving him is the basis of her entire character arc.

I wonder if they changed the voice lines in the Japanese version too.
Can't have the femme fatale character flirting  :exxy

(meanwhile stares at the giant breasts in the thumbnail  :-X)

NekoFever

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46338 on: April 02, 2023, 03:28:31 PM »
Apart from that in the comparison it bothers me more that they changed: "I don't kiss and tell" to "I don't work and tell".

Coupled with the not great VA, that line sounds like it’s from a TV edit of an R-rated movie. It doesn’t even make sense — just rewrite the whole line.

Boredfrom

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46339 on: April 02, 2023, 03:38:38 PM »
oh boy they've started banning people for a month for saying "yeah harassment is never justified but I prefer the old voice actress"


Boredfrom

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46340 on: April 02, 2023, 03:46:34 PM »
So what exactly is the problem with the new Ada VA?
Honestly, I don't think Ada Wong had an iconic voice to start with.

They replaced the Merchant voice too and it's fine? I would say overall the voice work is better because characters are no longer repeating the same 3 or 4 lines and Leon and Ashley now react in context :idont

Luis Serra is probably the biggest change he's no longer an Antonio Banderas voice-alike.

I think that is why it sucks so much more for many: everyone gets better voice actors and “improved” script (for the people that don’t like cheesy storylines in their Resident Evil) while she gets stuck with a bad voice actress. And people cannot blame the voice director because most others sound fine.

Harassing her because of this is not okay, obviously. But RE is so stupid and disingenuous that they go for: don’t dare to say shit about her!

Hap Shaughnessy

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46341 on: April 02, 2023, 03:49:09 PM »
OBE

HaughtyFrank

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46342 on: April 02, 2023, 03:50:56 PM »

Hap Shaughnessy

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46343 on: April 02, 2023, 03:56:40 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/ada-wongs-new-va-gets-thousands-of-hate-comments-disables-instagram-comments.704180/page-2#post-103538663
Quote
:cop User Banned (1 Month): Inappropriate commentary given the subject matter (Harassment). Multiple recent infractions.
Quote from:  PolygonalDude
Awful behavior but her performance is still terrible. Worst i have heard lately


https://www.resetera.com/threads/ada-wongs-new-va-gets-thousands-of-hate-comments-disables-instagram-comments.704180/page-3#post-103538870
Quote
:cop User banned (1 month): inappropriate commentary in a thread on harassment
Quote from:  Arklite
Capcom has some fault with setting up this whole situation for failure. Both recasting and bad casting. Nobody needs to suffer hate like that for a VA performance, no matter the quality.


https://www.resetera.com/threads/ada-wongs-new-va-gets-thousands-of-hate-comments-disables-instagram-comments.704180/page-3#post-103539734
Quote
:cop User banned (1 month): inappropriate commentary in a thread on harassment
Quote from: Akainu
Quote from: AdaWong
*CAPCOM replaced Jolene Anderson (Ada's RE2 Remake voice) with Lily because Jolene joined a Union and CAPCOM decided to go non-union as well as going on an initiative to hire actors of the same ethnicities as the characters - applicable for all of their games from here on out.
Fuck capcom and these people, shame she's a scab, but no one deserves this.


https://www.resetera.com/threads/ada-wongs-new-va-gets-thousands-of-hate-comments-disables-instagram-comments.704180/page-4#post-103541966
Quote
:cop User banned (1 month): inappropriate commentary in a thread on harassment
Quote from:  Blade24070
Going non-union is such a shit move. It should be celebrated that they decided to act ethnic-appropriate, too bad they did it by taking the cheap route.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2023, 04:06:48 PM by Hap Shaughnessy »
OBE

BIONIC

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46344 on: April 02, 2023, 03:57:46 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/keir-starmer-trans-rights-can’t-override-women’s-rights-the-times.704153/page-4#post-103572731

Quote from: Jessi77, post: 103572731, member: 25606
It's not scapegoating and of course it's absurd. They literally want us dead and the only way they can get what they want is if the convince the mainstream we really are that big of a threat. And they have the upper hand in that and it's why representation matters, and why I get so mad at era with for instance that Friends thread saying it's not a problem or offensive, because at roughly one percent of the population unlike other minority's including in the LGBT camp, most people never will meet a trans person, or be around one, leading to the media being their only frame of reference, so they say we are bullies and some powerful lobby and there is no one to dissent but us and we are not allowed a voice.

But make no mistake, it's not scapegoating, pandering, playing to the base, or any political play. They want us dead, full stop, no exaggeration, they want us dead.
Margs

Boredfrom

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46345 on: April 02, 2023, 04:00:14 PM »
So what exactly is the problem with the new Ada VA?

The fact that the woman that did her voice can't voice act? She seems to be a b-list actor. They're different skills. It's one of the flattest deliveries I've heard in a big budget game in a while.

I was shocked when I found out Daniel Craig voiced himself in one of the James Bond games. I thought it was someone doing a bad impersonation of him.

That’s the main reason why many people don’t like celebrity casting for voice roles, many of them don’t have the skills or the experience to do a good job. But it should be noted that there is also a lot of celebrities that are from decent to excellent voice actors.

Hap Shaughnessy

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46346 on: April 02, 2023, 04:02:40 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/insane-carjacking-attempt-in-wealthy-california-neighborhood-video.704429/

                     Shock thread
 :isthis

That will depend on the race of the criminal  :wag

I think she's black.

Edit:
https://www.resetera.com/threads/insane-carjacking-attempt-in-wealthy-california-neighborhood-video.704429/#post-103575347
Quote from: Vonocourt
Quote from: NinjaScooter
Even if you change the video source OP, you should wonder why someone like Andy Ngo is sharing and trying to platform and share this video in particular.
Can't possibly think of a reason why.

Quote from:  WhiteRabbitEXE
This content has no actual value and solely exists to push Republican narratives. I wish people would stop with this shit.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2023, 04:07:03 PM by Hap Shaughnessy »
OBE

BIONIC

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46347 on: April 02, 2023, 04:04:04 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/insane-carjacking-attempt-in-wealthy-california-neighborhood-video.704429/

                     Shock thread
 :isthis

Quote from: Sullivan, post: 103573814, member: 93062
Fuck her. May she rot in prison.

Quote from: Plumbob, post: 103574195, member: 4614
No what you see is, no criminal is responsible for their actions, it’s all structural issues

:kermit
Margs

Boredfrom

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46348 on: April 02, 2023, 04:04:44 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/keir-starmer-trans-rights-can’t-override-women’s-rights-the-times.704153/page-4#post-103572731

Quote from: Jessi77, post: 103572731, member: 25606
It's not scapegoating and of course it's absurd. They literally want us dead and the only way they can get what they want is if the convince the mainstream we really are that big of a threat. And they have the upper hand in that and it's why representation matters, and why I get so mad at era with for instance that Friends thread saying it's not a problem or offensive, because at roughly one percent of the population unlike other minority's including in the LGBT camp, most people never will meet a trans person, or be around one, leading to the media being their only frame of reference, so they say we are bullies and some powerful lobby and there is no one to dissent but us and we are not allowed a voice.

But make no mistake, it's not scapegoating, pandering, playing to the base, or any political play. They want us dead, full stop, no exaggeration, they want us dead.

Man, this is like TransRE greatest hits.

Propagandhim

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46349 on: April 02, 2023, 04:07:16 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/insane-carjacking-attempt-in-wealthy-california-neighborhood-video.704429/

Why are they going on and on about Andy Ngo?!  The tweet in the OP is clearly from a different source.  Are they seriously mad that Suppressive Person Andy Ngo just happened to see the video and retweeted it?  Or do they think he created a fake video and it was tweeted out by the OP source?  What the fuck is the matter with these cultist fucks?  Why is he even part of the conversation?

Hap Shaughnessy

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46350 on: April 02, 2023, 04:11:11 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/xbox-storage-prices-are-still-fucked.703483/page-2#post-103462036

Quote
:cop User Banned (2 Weeks): Dismissive Commentary Around Disability
Quote from: writhingcorpse897
Quote from: GameAddict411
Also the convenience argument is laughable at best.
If someone has a disability that makes it difficult to work with small screws or dealing with installing stuff like SSDs then it could go from being a minor inconvenience to becoming almost impossible to do. Then they'd have to take it to a store and have them pay to do it if they don't have a friend or family member that can do it for them.

 ???

https://www.resetera.com/threads/xbox-storage-prices-are-still-fucked.703483/page-4#post-103467475
Quote
:cop User Banned (2 Weeks): Dismissive Commentary Around Disability
Quote from: horkrux
This hypotheoretical disabled person without friends, family, neighbours or caregivers to help them with this one time task of using a screwdriver doesn't really make it more convincing lol
OBE

Boredfrom

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46351 on: April 02, 2023, 04:14:37 PM »
Quote from: NinjaScooter
Even if you change the video source OP, you should wonder why someone like Andy Ngo is sharing and trying to platform and share this video in particular.

Why the OP should know who the fuck Andy NGO is. The thread is about someone doing some crazy shit not about Andy Ngo.

TacoWallace

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46352 on: April 02, 2023, 04:31:16 PM »
she didn't have an iconic voice but she pulled off generic sultry and the new one just doesn't


I liked Ada's voice in Resident Evil 2 Remake the best, I think that was already a different person shame she couldn't be cast for this remake too.

Capcom doesn't want to pay for union actors.

These games sell 5+ million copies, yet the company cuts corners however they can. Sometimes they do their best impression of EA by charging people for cheat codes.

Won't stop that forum from worshipping them regardless. Not until bonus Cammy outfits for SF6 start dropping...

Hap Shaughnessy

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46353 on: April 02, 2023, 05:25:15 PM »
OBE

railGUN

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46354 on: April 02, 2023, 06:07:09 PM »
Holy fuck I went to another gaming forum where there were a bunch of reactions to some casting choices.

Quote
Eww

Quote
How fucking dreadful. All these casting announcements sound bad.

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What the fuck

Quote
trash tbh

Quote
Kill me.

Quote
Oh no.

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Fucking terrible

Quote
OH FUCK OFF

Quote
I can't
I can't
I can't

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The cast is a nightmare tbh.

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I.............. I am so confused as to who thought this was a good idea

Quote
I can get behind the whole cast except this.

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How do they have SUCH a bad mario when LITERALLY the rest of the cast is perfect??

Oh wait, sorry, this is just the first page of REE's response to Chris Pratt being announced as the voice of Mario.
Fish<

HaughtyFrank

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Colonel Mustard

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46356 on: April 02, 2023, 06:24:48 PM »
Holy fuck I went to another gaming forum where there were a bunch of reactions to some casting choices.

-snip-

Oh wait, sorry, this is just the first page of REE's response to Chris Pratt being announced as the voice of Mario.

I remember they used a $7 dad hat from Amazon as evidence that he was a white supremacist or III%’r or something. 

Potato

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46357 on: April 02, 2023, 06:55:39 PM »
Maybe some education about what HRT does to the sex drive and information about how trans women identify sexually would put some minds at ease.

Only a third of trans women identify as woman-attracted.

This leaves less than ¼, or 23%, of transgender survey respondents identifying as straight. Trans people who are straight – trans women who are only romantically and sexually interested in men and trans men who are only romantically and sexually interested in women

Trans Activists in the BitchEatingCrackersAndOtherAssortedDisinformation thread lying about their own cited statistics again :pika

e: because theres been multiple studies on this, and its literally the rationale behind why the Ts should be lobbied by the LGB umbrella - because you might assume someone who has spent their entire life believing they are a woman in a mans body would fall under 'normal' sexuality demographics of a majority finding men sexually attractive, but its actually the opposite - the vast majority are 'gay' after (and before) transition, ie are attracted to their identified sex.
Every time someone posts science regarding trans identities I become less convinced that they are genuinely "in the wrong body" and more convinced they are just suffering from mental illness that should be treated with therapy.



 :elon
Spud

Uncle

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46358 on: April 02, 2023, 07:12:15 PM »
Every time someone posts science regarding trans identities I become less convinced that they are genuinely "in the wrong body" and more convinced they are just suffering from mental illness that should be treated with therapy.



 :elon

this is really problematic of me to say but I think there's something to the idea that some people really do feel overwhelming disgust at the body they were born in, and a strong pull to change it to match how they feel inside, similar to BIID

while some people are so attracted to women/horny that they fetishize the idea of inhabiting that body, they're not in any persistent discomfort, they just dream of being able to squeeze their own titties and jill off

this may have a mirror in BIID cases where the person doesn't want their arm cut off due to dysmorphia or a sense of wrongness, but because they fetishize the idea of being helpless/disabled and want others to pity them and care for them (Munchausen)

I'm not prescribing any particular solution to any of this, I just think these different categories exist and help explain the people who are outspoken, hypersexual, and don't appear to suffer from dysmorphia

spoiler (click to show/hide)
it may also help to explain why SRS sometimes makes things worse, since it often reduces/removes the ability to feel sexual stimulation, and being confronted with the prospect of the maintenance for the rest of your life afterward is all-too-real compared to one's idealized fantasies
[close]
Uncle

Uncle

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46359 on: April 02, 2023, 07:24:33 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/happy-trans-day-of-visibility-2023.703664/#post-103489664

Thread’s not public before anyone asks

Quote from: Bufbaf, post: 103489664, member: 1860
(Image removed from quote.)

Happy T-Day :)

:mike

(this is an example of the second type of person)

spoiler (click to show/hide)
(if you're "under the assumption that you're a cis guy" and puttering along through life just fine, then you don't already feel strongly that you're a woman, and your "dreams" are just an active imagination. wondering what it feels like to be a horse doesn't mean you're a trans-horse)
[close]
« Last Edit: April 02, 2023, 07:33:07 PM by Uncle »
Uncle

BIONIC

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46360 on: April 02, 2023, 08:07:35 PM »
Just give it a couple of years. Then you’ll figure it out  :-*
Margs

benjipwns

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46361 on: April 02, 2023, 08:50:22 PM »
I mean, yeah, even things like diversity quotas and affirmative action are discriminatory policies intended to increase opportunities for one group at the expense of another, and everyone knows this is true, but the rationale is that it is a temporary measure to combat existing systemic inequalities that cannot fix themselves.
Nice try, white supremacist, that may have been what centrists aka fascists preached in the past as part of their capitalist plans but now we who fight against colonialism know better:
The only remedy to racist discrimination is antiracist discrimination. The only remedy to past discrimination is present discrimination. The only remedy to present discrimination is future discrimination. As President Lyndon B. Johnson said in 1965, “You do not take a person who, for years, has been hobbled by chains and liberate him, bring him up to the starting line of a race and then say, ‘You are free to compete with all the others,’ and still justly believe that you have been completely fair.” As U.S. Supreme Court Justice Harry Blackmun wrote in 1978, “In order to get beyond racism, we must first take account of race. There is no other way. And in order to treat some persons equally, we must treat them differently.”

The racist champions of racist discrimination engineered to maintain racial inequities before the 1960s are now the racist opponents of antiracist discrimination engineered to dismantle those racial inequities. The most threatening racist movement is not the alt right’s unlikely drive for a White ethnostate but the regular American’s drive for a “race-neutral” one. The construct of race neutrality actually feeds White nationalist victimhood by positing the notion that any policy protecting or advancing non-White Americans toward equity is “reverse discrimination.

That is how racist power can call affirmative action policies that succeed in reducing racial inequities “race conscious” and standardized tests that produce racial inequities “race neutral.” That is how they can blame the behavior of entire racial groups for the inequities between different racial groups and still say their ideas are “not racist.” But there is no such thing as a not-racist idea, only racist ideas and antiracist ideas.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46362 on: April 02, 2023, 08:53:10 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/keir-starmer-trans-rights-can’t-override-women’s-rights-the-times.704153/page-4#post-103572731

Quote from: Jessi77, post: 103572731, member: 25606
It's not scapegoating and of course it's absurd. They literally want us dead and the only way they can get what they want is if the convince the mainstream we really are that big of a threat. And they have the upper hand in that and it's why representation matters, and why I get so mad at era with for instance that Friends thread saying it's not a problem or offensive, because at roughly one percent of the population unlike other minority's including in the LGBT camp, most people never will meet a trans person, or be around one, leading to the media being their only frame of reference, so they say we are bullies and some powerful lobby and there is no one to dissent but us and we are not allowed a voice.

But make no mistake, it's not scapegoating, pandering, playing to the base, or any political play. They want us dead, full stop, no exaggeration, they want us dead.
With cis allies like these, who needs enemies?

Hap Shaughnessy

  • Canadian Ambassador to Guam (Ret.)
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46363 on: April 02, 2023, 08:53:14 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/page-5#post-103584944

Quote from: IceCrashRadio
They still haven't deleted my account yet. Reminder to make your calls tomorrow

The shitstorm surrounding Hogwarts appears to have backfired on trans Era.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2023, 09:04:19 PM by Hap Shaughnessy »
OBE

Hap Shaughnessy

  • Canadian Ambassador to Guam (Ret.)
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46364 on: April 02, 2023, 09:02:51 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/jennifer-aniston-says-comedy-has-changed-some-today-find-%E2%80%98friends%E2%80%99-offensive-%E2%80%9Ci-don%E2%80%99t-think-there-was-a-sensitivity-like-there-is-now%E2%80%9D.704021/page-7#post-103569623

Quote from: L Thammy
The reckoning that I'm surprised hasn't happened with sitcoms of this period is how many of them thought that grooming situations and similar scenarios were hilarious. Basically all of the shows had something along those lines and they were always played for laughs.


Friends - Monica and her boyfriend are lying about their ages, and as a result, Monica has sex with a 17 year old high school student. She jokes about how she's now a felon in several states. She doesn't say it, but the felony she's talking about is presumably about how she would now qualify as a statutory rapist if she was in California where the show was filmed. At another point, Joey mentions having had sex with his teacher for grades in high school.

Cheers - In at least two episodes Sam brags that one of his first times having sex was with his crossing guard, with the suggestion being that he was in elementary school. The first instance is about Sam's unhealthy relationship with sex but this particularly point isn't scrutinized, it's just viewed as another brag. At another point an old-again-off-again lover of his comes in with her daughter, who he is now seeing as an adult for the first time, and Sam spends the entire time trying to have sex with the daughter until she says that she's getting married and wants Sam to give her away because she considers him a father.

Frasier - A popular romance is published based on Frasier's first time having sex with his piano teacher when he was a kid. Throughout most of the episode, Frasier is either made fun of or guilt tripped for ending the relationship. The only one who shows any concern is his father who had hired the piano teacher, but no one takes his concerns seriously and Frasier is adamant that this was a real relationship. At the end, Frasier acts on his guilt and tries to start the relationship again, only for the teacher to be dating another younger, although this time seemingly adult, man. She admits that she just never had any interest in men her age.

The Drew Carey Show - Drew is revealed to have had sex with his high school teacher. Kate is the only person in any of these shows who actually explicitly refers to someone as a statutory rapist for it, but Drew insists that it was a real relationship. At the end the punchline is that he goes to a school reunion to meet her and meets a whole crowd of her former students that she was having sex with.

Married with Children - Bud Bundy is attracted to his substitute teacher at high school and starts a relationship, which makes him popular with all of the girls his age because they think he can please an old woman. Then she runs off with a football student because Bud couldn't satisfy her and he loses his popularity. This is the only one where a character actually acts on this situation since Bud mentions this to his father Al, and Al runs to into his class to accuse his teacher. It's all a big joke, though, since Bud has a new substitute teacher who is significantly older, leading Al to both express disgust at Bud for supposedly being attracted to such an old woman and to embarrass Bud in front of his classmates.

Seems to know a lot about this in sitcoms. :thinking
OBE

Potato

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46365 on: April 02, 2023, 09:24:28 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/insane-carjacking-attempt-in-wealthy-california-neighborhood-video.704429/

                     Shock thread
 :isthis

That will depend on the race of the criminal  :wag

I think she's black.

Edit:
https://www.resetera.com/threads/insane-carjacking-attempt-in-wealthy-california-neighborhood-video.704429/#post-103575347
Quote from: Vonocourt
Quote from: NinjaScooter
Even if you change the video source OP, you should wonder why someone like Andy Ngo is sharing and trying to platform and share this video in particular.
Can't possibly think of a reason why.

Quote from:  WhiteRabbitEXE
This content has no actual value and solely exists to push Republican narratives. I wish people would stop with this shit.
Unironically said while the thread title was editorialised to include "wealthy" as if that isn't a dogwhistle for white...
Spud

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46366 on: April 02, 2023, 09:27:33 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/page-5#post-103584944

Quote from: IceCrashRadio
They still haven't deleted my account yet. Reminder to make your calls tomorrow

The shitstorm surrounding Hogwarts appears to have backfired on trans Era.

Just don't log back in :ego

Snoopycat_

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46367 on: April 02, 2023, 09:31:48 PM »
On the one side there's the ree nutters and on the other there's this lot -




The absolute state of it.

clothedmacuser

  • Defender of Centrist Scum
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46368 on: April 02, 2023, 09:45:21 PM »
So what exactly is the problem with the new Ada VA?

The fact that the woman that did her voice can't voice act? She seems to be a b-list actor. They're different skills. It's one of the flattest deliveries I've heard in a big budget game in a while.

I was shocked when I found out Daniel Craig voiced himself in one of the James Bond games. I thought it was someone doing a bad impersonation of him.

I think it started with Shrek.  Michael Meyers had a unique voice, Eddie Murphy has a hilarious voice as himself, and as much as I love Cameron Diaz she's got a boring voice. After Shrek Voice Artists (VA) said they would be called in to auditions to make a unique voice and get rejected and the see their voice being impersonated by a famous person.


That’s the main reason why many people don’t like celebrity casting for voice roles, many of them don’t have the skills or the experience to do a good job
sigh

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46369 on: April 02, 2023, 09:53:20 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/jennifer-aniston-says-comedy-has-changed-some-today-find-%E2%80%98friends%E2%80%99-offensive-%E2%80%9Ci-don%E2%80%99t-think-there-was-a-sensitivity-like-there-is-now%E2%80%9D.704021/page-7#post-103569623

Quote from: L Thammy
The reckoning that I'm surprised hasn't happened with sitcoms of this period is how many of them thought that grooming situations and similar scenarios were hilarious. Basically all of the shows had something along those lines and they were always played for laughs.


Friends - Monica and her boyfriend are lying about their ages, and as a result, Monica has sex with a 17 year old high school student. She jokes about how she's now a felon in several states. She doesn't say it, but the felony she's talking about is presumably about how she would now qualify as a statutory rapist if she was in California where the show was filmed. At another point, Joey mentions having had sex with his teacher for grades in high school.

Cheers - In at least two episodes Sam brags that one of his first times having sex was with his crossing guard, with the suggestion being that he was in elementary school. The first instance is about Sam's unhealthy relationship with sex but this particularly point isn't scrutinized, it's just viewed as another brag. At another point an old-again-off-again lover of his comes in with her daughter, who he is now seeing as an adult for the first time, and Sam spends the entire time trying to have sex with the daughter until she says that she's getting married and wants Sam to give her away because she considers him a father.

Frasier - A popular romance is published based on Frasier's first time having sex with his piano teacher when he was a kid. Throughout most of the episode, Frasier is either made fun of or guilt tripped for ending the relationship. The only one who shows any concern is his father who had hired the piano teacher, but no one takes his concerns seriously and Frasier is adamant that this was a real relationship. At the end, Frasier acts on his guilt and tries to start the relationship again, only for the teacher to be dating another younger, although this time seemingly adult, man. She admits that she just never had any interest in men her age.

The Drew Carey Show - Drew is revealed to have had sex with his high school teacher. Kate is the only person in any of these shows who actually explicitly refers to someone as a statutory rapist for it, but Drew insists that it was a real relationship. At the end the punchline is that he goes to a school reunion to meet her and meets a whole crowd of her former students that she was having sex with.

Married with Children - Bud Bundy is attracted to his substitute teacher at high school and starts a relationship, which makes him popular with all of the girls his age because they think he can please an old woman. Then she runs off with a football student because Bud couldn't satisfy her and he loses his popularity. This is the only one where a character actually acts on this situation since Bud mentions this to his father Al, and Al runs to into his class to accuse his teacher. It's all a big joke, though, since Bud has a new substitute teacher who is significantly older, leading Al to both express disgust at Bud for supposedly being attracted to such an old woman and to embarrass Bud in front of his classmates.

Seems to know a lot about this in sitcoms. :thinking
For a forum that is full of experts on both gender roles and comedy he sure did miss who the butt of the jokes were in these examples and what the joke was. Especially since he's waiting for a "reckoning" from people with no sense of humor who continue to insist that Johnny Depp was the only possible abuser in his relationship and that he fronted an elaborate conspiracy with high level political actors to cover this up through a public trial.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46370 on: April 02, 2023, 09:54:26 PM »
On the one side there's the ree nutters and on the other there's this lot -

(Image removed from quote.)


The absolute state of it.
Putting it in the child protective binder is a nice touch though.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46371 on: April 02, 2023, 10:55:46 PM »
For the setup to this joke I'm going to pick on Jessi77, but I just want to make clear that this isn't targeted at just them, you can't expect me to emotionally labor by finding more people to quote on the day after the day after the last day of women's history month in the middle of a hype period for a movie starring Chris Pratt based on a video game even if I could have gone a bit further back to get more examples just from that "if you don't want trans people dead" thread that all the cis "allies" were ignoring:
https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/page-3#post-103406242

Quote from: Jessi77
I ranted somewhere else about this earlier. There is no ideology. No TRA. There is no agenda. It's not a cause, it's not a debate.it's not a political debate. We are real humans living our real human lives trying to live them to the best of our ability which to truly be happy and free thanks to being transgender especially those of us with Dysphoria (in my case literally life disrupting and destroying my quality of life and ability to hold romantic relationships) involves living openly about who we are and in a lot of cases medically transitioning.

When I say there is no TRA, I mean most of us don't want to be activists of any sort. Most would like to go stealth not for passing sake, and even though it helps not for safety. Mostly so we can just go on with our fucking lives without being reminded we are trans twenty four hours a day and able to just be people. As I like to say me being trans is probably the least most interesting thing about me, but due to the current world it's the only thing that matters to most people to the point they see me as an object not a person. And that includes allies and people on the same political side because while they are on the side of support, they still see us as objects or a cause to support, not actual people.

So you end up in a situation where we are forced to be activists against our will, and standing up to speak for ourselves because we are the only ones who will. Of course we are angry and yell and don't care about the high road or "how we come off" because we are a community that isn't a bunch of activists but we're forced to be, speaking up for ourselves while not being listened to and forcing ourselves in is the only way to be heard and we are also scared because we are on the eighth step of the ten recognized steps of genocide. So we are screaming and yelling for our survival with no true allies with a world that at best thinks of us as a political cause and worst trash to be eliminated and we are stuck at one percent of population with not enough numbers to affect anything forced to stand up and yell anyway because it's our literal lives and no one stands with us.

So yes we are mostly not activists that are scared, tired, have been treated inhumanely and just want to live our lives in peace, so yes it's not pretty, and if you cannot handle that or thinks it drives people away you were never an allie and they never were going to be.

We need action.Donating and voting is great, but we need bodies that are willing to stand up and also risk persecution and arrest, that will speak with us (not for us) that understand we are only one percent of the population and without cis allies willing to do actual work and scream along with us loud and constantly we are fucked, because we literally will never number enough to have voting or economic power.And it has to be loud and constant and uncomfortable or nothing changes. For all the talk about peaceful protests and the right way to do things (and I am not condoning violence) nothing ever changes unless the people being protested feel super uncomfortable and their lives are disrupted I'm pretty sure lunch counter sit ins did more than 100 marches, because it actually grinded business to a halt and stopped the flow of white people money. Same principle, it needs to bring consequences back on them and often, and that can be done legally and non-violently but only if you're willing to throw out decorum and high road bullshit. If your wrestling pigs your going to get muddy.

I don't know if this post is helpful or not but the thread and IceCrashRadio 's passion made me think of all this, which has actually been on my mind a lot, especially in the last few days with everything going on and the ramping up of rhetoric against us, mixed with the fact I have hit the point in transition there is no more hiding, even boy mode hoodies are failing to hide my breasts. And it doesn't matter even if I could hide I won't, I'm out and I am never going back and I will fight for that and even if I have to die even though don't want to I'll happily give my life through all this so in the future some other trans person doesn't have to through the same shit, because I love and care about my community, both in general worldwide and my personal friends many who I met right here and more than a few I have taken the transition journey with, they are my family now, and we deserve to be seen as human and live our human lives just like anyone else and that's a hill I would literally die on.
Quote from: Jessi77
Yeah it is, you can fuck right off. You're saying our identities are only valid if we behave the way you want. Which says you don't really think we are the gender we say. And using "it" is user disrespectful, transphobic, and the language used by people that kill trans people. Yes the shooter is a horrible person that deserves no respect, but their gender identity is a reality like blonde or tall, not something you can give or take. Katelyn Jenner is a horrible person and people are dead because of her, but she is still a woman.

So yeah, go crawl back in your transphobic hole we don't need you here, especially when your behavior is the same type as those who would genocide people like me, so by your logic I could call you a terrorist and decide your not human.
https://www.resetera.com/threads/keir-starmer-trans-rights-can’t-override-women’s-rights-the-times.704153/page-4#post-103572731

Quote from: Jessi77, post: 103572731, member: 25606
It's not scapegoating and of course it's absurd. They literally want us dead and the only way they can get what they want is if the convince the mainstream we really are that big of a threat. And they have the upper hand in that and it's why representation matters, and why I get so mad at era with for instance that Friends thread saying it's not a problem or offensive, because at roughly one percent of the population unlike other minority's including in the LGBT camp, most people never will meet a trans person, or be around one, leading to the media being their only frame of reference, so they say we are bullies and some powerful lobby and there is no one to dissent but us and we are not allowed a voice.

But make no mistake, it's not scapegoating, pandering, playing to the base, or any political play. They want us dead, full stop, no exaggeration, they want us dead.
In an essay published in the New York Review of Books, Eco distilled the 14 typical elements of “Ur-Fascism or Eternal Fascism,” while warning that, “These features cannot be organized into a system; many of them contradict each other and are also typical of other kinds of despotism or fanaticism. But it is enough that one of them be present to allow fascism to coagulate around it.”

The cult of tradition. “One has only to look at the syllabus of every fascist movement to find the major traditionalist thinkers. The Nazi gnosis was nourished by traditionalist, syncretistic, occult elements.”
The rejection of modernism. “The Enlightenment, the Age of Reason, is seen as the beginning of modern depravity. In this sense, Ur-Fascism can be defined as irrationalism.”
The cult of action for action’s sale. “Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, any previous reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation.”
Disagreement is treason. “The critical spirit makes distinctions, and to distinguish is a sign of modernism. In modern culture, the scientific community praises disagreement as a way to improve knowledge.”
Fear of difference. “The first appeal of a fascist or prematurely fascist movement is an appeal against the intruders. Thus Ur-Fascism is racist by definition.”
Appeal to social frustration. “[…] one of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups.
The obsession with a plot. “The followers must feel besieged. The easiest way to solve the plot is the appeal to xenophobia.”
The enemy is both weak and strong. “[…] the followers must be convinced that they can overwhelm the enemies. Thus, by a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.”
Pacifism is trafficking with the enemy. “For Ur-Fascism there is no struggle for life but, rather, life is lived for struggle.”
Contempt for the weak. “Elitism is a typical aspect of any reactionary ideology.”
Everybody is educated to become a hero. “in Ur-Fascist ideology, heroism is the norm. This cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.”
Machismo and Weaponry. “This is the origin of machismo (which implies both disdain for women and intolerance and condemnation of nonstandard sexual habits, from chastity to homosexuality). Since even sex is a difficult game to play, the Ur-Fascist hero tends to play with weapons—doing so becomes an ersatz phallic exercise.”
Selective Populism. “There is in our future a TV or Internet populism, in which the emotional response of a selected group of citizens can be presented and accepted as the Voice of the People.
Ur-Fascism speaks Newspeak. “All the Nazi or Fascist schoolbooks made use of an impoverished vocabulary, and an elementary syntax, in order to limit the instruments for complex and critical reasoning.”
:hmm

HaughtyFrank

  • Haughty and a little naughty
  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46372 on: April 02, 2023, 11:11:08 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/twitter-is-reportedly-quietly-demphasizing-and-deboosting-tweets-with-lgbt-terminology-in-them-including-disabling-dm-embeds.704039/

Anytime people talk about Twitter censorship they sound like conspiracy nuts. Isn't the algorithm public now anyway? Recently saw a tweet about how people's assumption had been completely wrong and how likes were boosting content much more than retweets

Edit:
https://twitter.com/aakashg0/status/1641976892885540865

BIONIC

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46373 on: April 02, 2023, 11:16:18 PM »
Quote from: Voras, post: 103535585, member: 10715
I think that cis people should consider shutting the fuck up about trans issues. It's not your lane you don't need to always have a take.

Quote from: Voras, post: 103536614, member: 10715
seriously if you are a cis person using an instance of transphobia to tell people what to do you are also being transphobic. We are not a convenient excuse for you to talk down to other people. You do not speak for us.

Quote from: Voras, post: 103592507, member: 10715
It’s wild how people pretend to care about trans people here and then completely ignore what trans people have to say

:insane

Literally talking to nobody on that last page.
Margs

benjipwns

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46374 on: April 02, 2023, 11:41:48 PM »
Quote from: Voras, post: 103535585, member: 10715
I think that cis people should consider shutting the fuck up about trans issues. It's not your lane you don't need to always have a take.
SILENCE = DEATH, we need bodies :bolo

Averon

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46375 on: April 02, 2023, 11:56:16 PM »
Quote from: Voras, post: 103535585, member: 10715
I think that cis people should consider shutting the fuck up about trans issues. It's not your lane you don't need to always have a take.

Quote from: Voras, post: 103536614, member: 10715
seriously if you are a cis person using an instance of transphobia to tell people what to do you are also being transphobic. We are not a convenient excuse for you to talk down to other people. You do not speak for us.

Quote from: Voras, post: 103592507, member: 10715
It’s wild how people pretend to care about trans people here and then completely ignore what trans people have to say

:insane

Literally talking to nobody on that last page.

And yet they still wonder--and whine--why less and less people are bothering to interact with them.

Hap Shaughnessy

  • Canadian Ambassador to Guam (Ret.)
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46376 on: April 02, 2023, 11:57:46 PM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/#post-103374478
Quote from: heathen earth
318 views, 1 reply. If that doesn’t say it all, then I don’t know what does. I know the vast majority of you won’t give a shit until it affects you personally, but if you think they’re going to stop with us, you’ve got another thing coming. SILENCE = DEATH, just like it did back then, and your silence is resounding.


https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/page-3#post-103408039
Quote from: Kyuuji
Anyway, isn't this the time when some of you cisgender Americans lurking this topic and reading this post are awake? I sure as shit shouldn't be, but here I am. Where's your post tho? 👀


https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/page-4#post-103476635
Quote from: IceCrashRadio, post: 103476635, member: 21411
I need to see more cis people in here, I'm calling out the allies you making your calls today? You don't get to go silent on trans visibility day.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/twitter-is-reportedly-quietly-demphasizing-and-deboosting-tweets-with-lgbt-terminology-in-them-including-disabling-dm-embeds.704039/page-3#post-103535585
Quote from: Voras, post: 103535585, member: 10715
I think that cis people should consider shutting the fuck up about trans issues. It's not your lane you don't need to always have a take.


 :thinking
« Last Edit: April 03, 2023, 12:58:49 AM by Hap Shaughnessy »
OBE

Averon

  • Senior Member
Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46377 on: April 03, 2023, 12:02:49 AM »
TransERA: "Shut the fuck up, you cis people. Stay in your lane!!!!"

Also TransERA: "Where the fuck are you, cis people? Your silence is perpetuating our genocide!! Blood's on your hands!!"

D3RANG3D

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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46378 on: April 03, 2023, 12:03:53 AM »

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
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Re: Other Forums Containment Thread
« Reply #46379 on: April 03, 2023, 12:22:12 AM »
https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/#post-103374478
Quote from: heathen earth
318 views, 1 reply. If that doesn’t say it all, then I don’t know what does. I know the vast majority of you won’t give a shit until it affects you personally, but if you think they’re going to stop with us, you’ve got another thing coming. SILENCE = DEATH, just like it did back then, and your silence is resounding.


https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/page-3#post-103408039
Quote from: Kyuuji
Anyway, isn't this the time when some of you cisgender Americans lurking this topic and reading this post are awake? I sure as shit shouldn't be, but here I am. Where's your post tho? 👀


https://www.resetera.com/threads/if-you-dont-want-trans-people-to-die.702811/page-4#post-103476635
Quote from: IceCrashRadio
I need to see more cis people in here, I'm calling out the allies you making your calls today? You don't get to go silent on trans visibility day.


https://www.resetera.com/threads/twitter-is-reportedly-quietly-demphasizing-and-deboosting-tweets-with-lgbt-terminology-in-them-including-disabling-dm-embeds.704039/page-3#post-103535585
Quote from: Voras
I think that cis people should consider shutting the fuck up about trans issues. It's not your lane you don't need to always have a take.

 :thinking
TransERA: "Shut the fuck up, you cis people. Stay in your lane!!!!"

Also TransERA: "Where the fuck are you, cis people? Your silence is perpetuating our genocide!! Blood's on your hands!!"
Maybe STAY IN YOUR LANE and post WHERE YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO about WHAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO in the WAY YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO! This is just basic kindness and respect people, they just want to be left alone in peace and you're putting them in harm's way. :bolo