Author Topic: Horizon Forbidden Waifu  (Read 5475 times)

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Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #180 on: March 08, 2022, 08:39:26 PM »
I took a breather away from games and the internet for a day. Just was not in a good mood last few days, hence the ranting.

Sat down last night and just warped around fighting the toughest enemies over and over again getting more comfortable with taking them out quickly. Felt a lot better about the combat after.


But definitely a few (or more than a few) bad changes like Tycoon wrote:

-Concentration is nerfed hard. Either enemies move faster or it's not as slow, but if you're not a quick aimer, close-range/mid-range combat is a nightmare for precision aiming. This was not an issue in the first game. GG could fix this with an accessibility slider to allow you to change the slowdown speed for concentration mode.

-All the variants with different weaknesses are stupid. In Horizon 1 you can just memorize how to take out all the enemies. In H2 good luck memorizing 40 enemies and their 20+ variant versions along with like 6 potential elemental weaknesses. Pretty much always have to stop and read notebook, and adjust gear (since too many element types for weapon wheel) which kills the pacing. GG could fix this by ditching the variants and doing a Ratchet & Clank weapon wheel where you have 2 wheels to flip between without going into your menu.

-Game balance is whack. Mounted combat is way too OP with the +50% damage modifier + defense modifier + mobility. But the problem is that bow aiming on a moving mount sucks and is not fun. So if you want an easier experience you can grapple with the controls and try to aim while moving and ehhh I'll just lose the bonus damage and play without a mount. Stealth and long-range are fun but the main story & arena constantly force you into close-range/mid-range so good luck if your build is for long-range/stealth.


And honestly most glitchy game I've ever played in my life at this point. Hit another glitch last night at the end of lvl.19 sidequest Blood for Blood where I'm supposed to talk to two NPCs after a fight to trigger a cutscene, but in my game one NPC was dead on the ground and the other was frozen in place with no way to interact. Warping and coming back didn't fix it. But closing the game and reloading did.

I get at least one soft-crash per night and then there's the random blue screens, black screens, video glitches, loading taking 3x as long some random times, etc... I don't think this game should have been released in this state. It makes Ubisoft/Obsidian/Bethesda games look good.

The crazy thing is that Forbidden West isn't doing anything crazy sandbox and open and complex AI enough that should be causing all this. I mean the graphics look amazing, but underneath that it's a normal game. Feels like it just needed another 3 months of QA but they shipped it just because? Should've been delayed. Was just not ready for release.


And yeah it's weird how there is no combat or anything with the swimming. It looks nice and it's cool to swim but like they could've done a lot more with it.


Svejk

  • Senior Member
Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #181 on: March 08, 2022, 09:17:14 PM »
I get at least one soft-crash per night and then there's the random blue screens, black screens, video glitches, loading taking 3x as long some random times, etc... I don't think this game should have been released in this state. It makes Ubisoft/Obsidian/Bethesda games look good.
:dayum  that's pretty unacceptable for a Sony 1st party title..
The crazy thing is that Forbidden West isn't doing anything crazy sandbox and open and complex AI enough that should be causing all this. I mean the graphics look amazing, but underneath that it's a normal game. Feels like it just needed another 3 months of QA but they shipped it just because? Should've been delayed. Was just not ready for release.
Every game during that release window should have postponed.  Saints Row was smart (or too dumb) to push their release to August. 

Elden Ring to every other game be like...



Still, I'm still shocked FW is that glitchy.  Granted I didn't play ZD till a year after launch, so I guess what I played was ironed out much better.

Kestastrophe

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #182 on: March 08, 2022, 10:21:59 PM »
Game is awesome, yall nitpickin. This first thunderjaw is kicking my ass. Just hit level 20 but he's one hit me multiple times
jon

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #183 on: March 08, 2022, 10:55:31 PM »
Game is awesome, yall nitpickin. This first thunderjaw is kicking my ass. Just hit level 20 but he's one hit me multiple times

I'm lvl.45 with every stat skill obtained in the game, endgame armor and I still get one shot sometime.

Those HP potions that give you above normal health & food that extends HP by 20% are pretty useful.


I go back and forth between loving & hating with this game. Will do a full review when I finish it but at this point I'm feeling like Horizon 1 ZD = 9.5/10, Frozen wilds = 9/10, H2 Forbidden West = 8/10 playing them all back to back. I really think the game is steps forward in some ways but back in others. I still think ZD is some of the best combat in a non-character action game, West is not that to me. It's just ok.

Svejk

  • Senior Member
Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #184 on: March 09, 2022, 08:34:42 AM »
Things might be smoothed out some now...

https://twitter.com/Guerrilla/status/1501515053597532166

Quote
    UI/UX

        Added an 'Always Off' option for weapons & ammo, and tools & potions in the Custom HUD options.
        Fixed several outfit icons that used the incorrect assets in the inventory menu.
        Fixed an issue with the map where unnatural movement would occur when centering the view on the player or a quest objective.

    Graphics

        Added smoother transition between Tropospheric and Cirrus cloud layers, and better matching of the coloring of the supercell Anvil and Cirrus clouds.
        Fixed an issue with the Very Large Array Tallneck where the model would display low level detail at a certain distance.
        Made multiple tweaks to vegetation to improve image quality in the Favor Performance mode.
        Fixed an instance of flickering white lights in main quest 'Death's Door'.
        Improved stability of depth of field during cinematics.
        Reduced stepping artifacts from SSAO in extreme closeup situations
        Reduced changes to saturation on motion blur.
        Improved quality and stability of shadows.
        Improved quality of grass in specific situations.

    Performance and Stability

        Multiple crash fixes.
        Fixed several instances where NPCs and textures would visibly stream in on PS4™ when the player approached a settlement at high speed.
        Fixed several instances where loading screens or black screens would trigger unintentionally.
        Fixed an issue with streaming after the end credits sequence was skipped.

    Photo Mode improvements

        Increased precision in precision mode to allow for much more control when orienting and moving the camera, especially when using long focal lengths and large apertures.
        The minimum focus distance has been reduced to 5cm allowing for more creative shots and macro photography.
        Changed the film back to 35mm full frame, for more clear focal length and DOF translation, and more intuitive selection of focal lengths for virtual photographers.
        Added many more focal lengths to cover the range between 10mm and 300mm in 35mm full frame allowing for more creative expressions.
        Added a FoV match for the default camera.
        Increased the radius that photographers can use around Aloy from 5 to 10 meters.
        Various small quality of life improvements.
        The Auto Focus rectangle and the Rule of Third grid are now hidden when using the Hide UI option.
        Fixed an issue where a moire effect could be visible on characters' skin during close-up shots.

    Other

        Fixed a camera collision issue that would sometimes occur when the player was mounted and maneuvering near obstacles of a certain height.
        Fixed several animation issues with NPCs in settlements.
        Slightly increased the ammo cost of the Propelled Spike weapon technique for game balance reasons.
        Fixed an instance where Aloy could get stuck inside geometry in the Memorial Grove settlement when trying to jump out through a gap in the wall.
        Fixed an issue where the game would appear to hang briefly after skipping through the end credits sequence.
        Fixed an issue where the PS5 Operating System "Game Presets" difficulty would override the difficulty level in-game.
        Fixed an issue where interactable objects would sometimes lose collision, causing the player to fall through the object.
        Fixed an issue where the player might fall through the world when fast traveling while on a mount.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #185 on: March 09, 2022, 11:08:35 AM »
I still feel like the combat in this game's a step down from the original. There's more options but everything just feels more tedious and less fun. Game reminds me of how the Killzone games were pretty annoying/frustrating at parts. I felt like the original and Frozen Wilds were pretty much perfect gameplay balance.

Game is great, questing is much better, story is much better, but platforming is wonky and combat is more annoying.
What weapons, skills and valor surge are you using, bebpo?

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #186 on: March 09, 2022, 11:19:15 AM »
I've had one hard crash in over 80 hours and it was several patches ago.  :doge  Haven't had a lot of issues, to be honest. Your mileage may vary.

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #187 on: March 09, 2022, 12:23:49 PM »
I still feel like the combat in this game's a step down from the original. There's more options but everything just feels more tedious and less fun. Game reminds me of how the Killzone games were pretty annoying/frustrating at parts. I felt like the original and Frozen Wilds were pretty much perfect gameplay balance.

Game is great, questing is much better, story is much better, but platforming is wonky and combat is more annoying.
What weapons, skills and valor surge are you using, bebpo?

Every single goddamn one, because you need to for this one.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #188 on: March 09, 2022, 12:50:16 PM »
Do you? I've being using the same valor surge for 90% of the game and I've played 99.99% of the game on Very Hard. I'm not running into the problems you are. I mean, if you're attempting to get an outfit leveled up for EVERY playstyle and constantly changing up how you play, I can see why you'd be pulling your hair out.

Honestly once I got my purple sharpshot bow and purple tripcaster, I felt right at home. The combat feels like a natural evolution to Zero Dawn and surpasses it just based on the number of options you have now. I love the javelins. I prefer straight hunter and sharpshot bows but the shredder gauntlets and boltblasters are fantastic in certain situations.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2022, 12:56:27 PM by Let's Cyber »

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #189 on: March 09, 2022, 03:32:33 PM »
Gauntlets are the only weapon I don't use. Never found them useful in terms of damage or tear vs sharpshot bow or javelin. Javelin's are definitely OP and make grenades pointless in this game since they're just another more powerful grenade. They should've removed the slingshot entirely and replaced it with the javelin in this.

What tripcaster are you using and what ammo? I haven't found a great use for most enemies. Easier to stun/fire/corrode whatever from just a couple of arrows than trying to get them to run over something. The shield tripcaster seems like it could be useful if you stand still and sharpshot but since most enemies will just rush you with melee if you stand still that doesn't seem like it'd work.

Also don't find much use for the warrior bow in late game since advanced elemental arrows from a hunter bow will one or two shot any status with more precision.

I mean yeah my main weapons are my high impact sharpshot bow for exploding weakpoints, my high tear sharpshot bow for tearing off stuff, Javelin for exploding things and hunter bow with elements for elemental stuff. Boltblaster is good on occasion but I find it less fun because the slow reload speed if you can't stop an enemy in one clip.

Valor surges all have their uses. Mostly powershots for ranged combat, melee for melee w/humans, stealth invisibility for bases or certain stealth bits, stealth explosion when surrounded, the tear damage one isn't bad if you are fighting something where you can't one shot tear on your own with a 450 tear arrow since that surge will guarantee a one-shot tear on any part. The trap one is probably good if you use tripcaster since 200% trap damage is good and you can have tons of traps out. The heal/shield ones are probably useful if you are getting one-shotted and just need to survive multiple rounds of enemy hordes incoming.

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #190 on: March 09, 2022, 03:41:52 PM »
The combat has more options, but is designed in ways that are just less fun than the first game.

-Enemy weakpoints tend to be hidden/hard to hit/blocked by armor when they are facing you. This is fine for stealth, but makes combat less fun during non-stealth for precision.

-Concentration nerfed and enemies too fast. Again in non-stealth makes precision aiming at spots very difficult.

-Ropecaster still being mostly useless where I'm at nerfs stealth in favor of action. Still waiting to find a good purple or orange tier ropecaster that has far stronger attach ropes. (at the coast already).

-Too many ammo types, needs a 2nd weapon wheel to switch in real time to cover all basis without pausing and breaking the flow.

-Too many skills and armors, to be efficient you really want to pause and change armor/coils based on what you're fighting/doing. Again this breaks the flow. Horizon 1 you almost never need to touch the pause menu for hours. You just use your set of the best weapons and best armor and you're good against everything.

-Ammo limits and real-time crafting sucks now. real-time fast crafting ammo was one of the best parts of the first game. Now it's slow and cumbersome and you have very limited ammo for stuff like tear shots and impact shots. Means you have to go back to a shelter every few ammos and restock. Just less fun and another thing that hurts the flow.

-This one's just a nitpick, but potions are weird. Should have just replaced berry healing entirely with drinking potions if they wanted to go the monster hunter route. Also when you run out and restock it tends to stock ones you don't want (a bunch of cleanse potions) and you have to waste time switching them out.

-In general the stash was a good item for running out of resource space, but instead now you spend a bunch of time in your stash box moving things back and forth.

-The new enemies just aren't as fun to fight as the originals and they made some of the returning ones more annoying.

-Like I said, too many variant types so you can't memorize all the weaknesses without having to keep pulling up your notebook which messes with pacing.

-Too many food types and too specific in only getting certain foods from certain merchants and need certain ingredients. It's way too complicated. Should've just had every food available at every vendor and just cost shards and not grind ingredients.

-Not even going to get into the grind requirements for gear. Most of my purple armor/weapons I use are stuck at lvl.1/2/3 because the part grind. They absolutely turned H2 into a grind game when H1 was not. It wouldn't be a big deal to stick with lvl.1/2 rank for your weapons if they didn't lock half the skills for the weapon behind the higher ranks. Like my orange-tier hunter bow stuck at lvl.1 still doesn't have overdraw which sucks.


The original game was a stealth survival game. You sneak around and one shot stuff at weakpoints and tear off weapons and use it against things, tie-enemies down, keep getting new skills/armor/weapons and becoming more powerful as the new stuff replaces the old and stronger mods replace weaker ones.

This game is more an action game with tons of builds, you micro-manage a shitload of stuff to make your own high damage build and you dodge around a bunch shooting and exploding things. It's less precise and far more chaotic.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2022, 03:59:03 PM by Bebpo »

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #191 on: March 09, 2022, 04:01:58 PM »
In short, the original game was very much "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" for the main combat loop. Just needed better questing, better writing/VA/cutscenes, more varied activities, more stuff to mount, swimming, more dinos, etc...to expand on the game.

Forbidden West added a bunch of that but instead of being an Uncharted 1->2 or Assassin's Creed 1->2 sequel that's just bigger and iterative, they basically changed the core combat and combat/crafting loop into its own unique thing. Forbidden West is a very different playing combat game than Zero Dawn. Some people like Cyber prefer the new combat, some people like me liked the ZD combat better. They're just very different in combat. I think a big part comes down to what kind of player you are. ZD rewarded slow aiming stealth gaming players, FW rewards fast action, fast aiming players.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #192 on: March 09, 2022, 04:27:31 PM »
What tripcaster are you using and what ammo? I haven't found a great use for most enemies. Easier to stun/fire/corrode whatever from just a couple of arrows than trying to get them to run over something. The shield tripcaster seems like it could be useful if you stand still and sharpshot but since most enemies will just rush you with melee if you stand still that doesn't seem like it'd work.
I'm using Glowblast tripcaster now for the plasma wires and advanced explosive wires. I used Perimeter for a long time but I have bows with advanced electric and advanced fire so I don't really need it as much anymore.

Shieldwires are cool in concept but a bit too situational. Against stuff like Scorchers just laugh at them. 

I do agree the new ammo limits for stuff like Tearblast arrows suck. It was my go-to ammo in the first game and I don't use it as much as I used too.

But I'm still playing it primarily like a stealth game. I'm using Winterweave infiltrator armor, set up my traps, take advantage of my extra stealth damage, pop my invis, set up my traps, rinse and repeat. I am using more and more of my machine override kit but there are a lot of times it isn't viable just because everything is an Apex.  :lol I also agree this game is more action oriented than the first. They force you into the open more here than before.

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #193 on: March 10, 2022, 03:40:14 AM »
The new patch fixed photo mode. It's pretty much perfect now. I tried the new performance 60fps mode and it looks worse to me. Like weird motion blur artifacting when you move. Resolution mode still fine.

The coast is pretty nice looking. Did the lvl.24 main quest to get the final tool so probably go around mopping up those treasures.

What settlements start selling good endgame gear? I think the furthest settlements I've found are Fall's Edge and Cliffside and still don't have a purple ropecaster and the only advanced element arrow I have is ice. The arena weapons are ok but the fact they're all stuck at lvl.1 and don't have any skills at this point because I don't have access to some of the enemies I need parts from makes them a bit less amazing. My upgraded purple weapons tend to be a bit better.

And Shellsnappers will always be my most hated enemies. Only time I died tonight was in a long fight against a dumb apex shellsnapper on the beach after killing two snapmaws for fun. Like most of my deaths in combat have just been fighting Shellsnappers because I like to fight most enemies I run across instead of just running past things when I'm exploring around the world. I heard people found Clamberjaw's annoying but I haven't had any issue with them..., easy access shock cannisters on their back and low HP make them pretty simple. Shellsnappers seem the hardest of all enemies because until you get rid of the shell (which is a lot of work) they basically have zero weakspots the whole fight. My best strategy at this point is just hit them with acid element for normal, freeze element for apex and then just fucking explode spears on them until they get knocked upside down and then finish them off on their belly with impact arrows.

Also I tried that skill they nerfed in today's patch. I see why it's good and it's still good. It's brace arrow but with spears. Seems to do less damage comparing it 1:1 with brace arrow on a single target (pretty close, but a bit less), but it has a wider explosion radius that can take out multiple enemies whereas Brace arrow basically just hits a single enemy.



I never had a good stealth way to take out multiple humans in one spot without alerts. Explosion grenades wouldn't do enough damage to one-shot everyone. So this javelin brace shot thing seems good for that.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #194 on: March 10, 2022, 12:54:43 PM »
Thornmarsh is the spot for the best armor and weapons on sale. I don't remember if the settlement in San Francisco has good stuff at the shops or not.

naff

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #195 on: March 10, 2022, 02:11:58 PM »
In short, the original game was very much "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" for the main combat loop.

eh, I liked the combat well enough in HZD bu feel like you're being a bit too charitable to it. it was extremely basic and repetitive. I was pretty sick of jump slowmo arrow shooting by the end :p

HFW I find myself actually enjoying using melee, triggering that explosion bubble and dealing damage like that alongside slowing down enemies with goop and just smashing with acid arrows or javelins. enemies patterns are more engaging, less predictable. combat is more hectic but you still learn patterns after a few fights. I think it's a decent step up. in HZD I was usually a little intimidated by an enemy first time I met it, but then you'd learn their pattern / weakness, exploit it and the challenge was just gone.

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naff

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #196 on: March 10, 2022, 02:19:05 PM »
the big part I think I find more engaging in HFW is how much more diverse the movesets for enemies are and how much more diverse enemies are generally. I like that I don't just want to fight every pack I see because that would be a pain in the ass. it makes the world feel a bit mroe dangerous at higher difficulties. that said, you can always knock the difficulty down a bit and play it like hzd just triggering higher damage with acid and going to town with hardshots or something.
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Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #197 on: March 10, 2022, 04:26:53 PM »
I don't know, in both games I don't like using melee. Like in West it's fine if I'm against humans and I can roll around slashing and getting blue orbs on them and jumping back off them, but against robos who just tank the hits and smack you in the face melee still feels useless. I only really use it against burrowers or scroungers. Anything bigger just means getting hit in the face while I'm slashing it.

naff

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #198 on: March 10, 2022, 05:30:46 PM »
hmm. i've found it pretty good against smaller to mid tier enemies, can charge the blast bubble by roll cancelling out of the charge move then just smash and blow em up too

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Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #199 on: March 11, 2022, 01:38:22 AM »
Any tricks for votaile sludge resource? All the advanced ammo including sharpshot impact bow and explody javelin and electric hunter arrows and advanced ice, etc... use it and I've burned through all that I've collected in 70 hours because I fight and kill so much (stats say I'm ~700 machines killed at this point, 245 animals lol).

I have a decent amount of money so I just bought a whole bunch but they ain't cheap. ~600 shards for 15 of them. Feels like it's the only resource that's not given at the rate you use it with all the later weapons.

Or maybe I'm not killing tough enough enemies in the last 1/3rd areas yet that drop it more freely.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #200 on: March 11, 2022, 12:54:53 PM »
Yeah I've been buying it but the economy is busted once you've bought all the outfits and weapons you want. I was sitting on 15k at one point.

You could also drop the difficulty to story and farm out rockbreakers and Apex machines for mats but that doesn't sound like a lot of fun.


Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #201 on: March 11, 2022, 09:14:38 PM »
Tried to fight the lvl.60 apex fireclaw outside thornmarsh and got one-shotted :|

Guess I gotta upgrade those orange armors. I figured at lvl.50 with like every skill on the skill tree and endgame weapons I could take on anything left in the game at this point, but maybe not. Though may just need a good food/potion/valor strategy.

The heavy weapons trial at the final hunting grounds seemed kinda annoying/hard until I ropecasted the tremortusk so it would leave me the fuck alone while I took out the other enemies. Got the purple ropecaster in thornmarch and FINALLY ropecaster is decent lol, ropecaster really sucks until endgame. Did a little grinding to almost max it out so can rope thunderjaws and stuff in about 3 shots which is helpful for taking enemies out of the fight or getting them to fight on your side.

Just wrapping up the last few sidequests I have and then will probably will finish out the story this weekend. Platinum seems jokingly easy, as does 100% like the first game (you don't even need to max your pouches lol) so should get those by the time I clear it.

I'm definitely burnt out on this game though and ready to move on to Elden Ring or something else. I used to play really slow and carefully exploring every inch of the map and now I'm just advancing text on every cutscene and fast traveling around and just knocking quests out as fast as possible to get it done. Game could've been about 1/3rd smaller. Yes they added a few more types of side activities and more depth to them which keeps it feeling fresh longer, but by this point it definitely has the ubisoft copy & repeat feeling for side stuff.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #202 on: March 12, 2022, 06:13:51 AM »
Tried to fight the lvl.60 apex fireclaw outside thornmarsh and got one-shotted :|
I tried for almost 2 hours to get Fireclaw sac webbing and stupidly attempted most of it on Apex types. It was a nightmare.

There is zero shame in dropping the difficulty to get these late game mats. An Apex Thunderjaw fight can be Monster Hunter length if you're DPS isn't high enough. I just want my outfits maxed out, damn it.  :maf

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #203 on: March 12, 2022, 12:37:36 PM »
Yeah, I dropped the difficulty last night to clear out the last few arena fights and then later in the session I was like why I am killing a Dreadwing with a stun -> brace shot? So I checked and I never took the difficulty off easy.

…and honestly I had a lot more fun with the combat last night  :lol


I think damage-wise for these bigger/apex enemies easy mode in H2 is equivalent to normal mode in Frozen Wilds in terms of enemy HP and your damage output. Maybe it evens out when you have your Orange weapons all max level but using purple stuff at lvl.4 or Orange lvl.1 that seems about right.

Another issue I have with all the nerfing is in the last 1/3rd everything is fucking apex version which means you can’t override them. The first game had that with corrupted and daemonic but this feels way worse.

So much of the game design just feels anti-player & anti-fun imo. I think this is a good game held back by lots of small design decisions, often in the name of balance.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #204 on: March 12, 2022, 06:38:31 PM »
Grinding fireclaws and slaughtspines to get their override unlocks.

...like when the hell am I ever gonna fight a non-apex version of them in a story/quest part where I'll actually be able to override them in a useful way to make this worth it?


Also apparently lvl.50 is max level. Seems pretty low. Hit 50 yesterday and only 75% completion.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #205 on: March 13, 2022, 08:11:07 PM »
After playing a vast majority on Very Hard, I have to say I should have been using Custom difficulty. I like having Very Hard damage for Aloy but some of these Apex fights have been a grind. For new players I'd recommend Normal or Hard for damage done to machines. Having a setting for extra concentration is nice too.

Just have a few bandit camps and jungle sidequests to go. Have been dabbling in Elden Ring lately but I need to finish this off before I commit to another game.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #206 on: March 13, 2022, 08:41:37 PM »
After playing a vast majority on Very Hard, I have to say I should have been using Custom difficulty. I like having Very Hard damage for Aloy but some of these Apex fights have been a grind. For new players I'd recommend Normal or Hard for damage done to machines. Having a setting for extra concentration is nice too.

Just have a few bandit camps and jungle sidequests to go. Have been dabbling in Elden Ring lately but I need to finish this off before I commit to another game.

Idk, I feel like shit hits hard on normal.

I figured it out though. In Horizon 1 you had stealth gear when stealthing, and then otherwise you just had one gear with high defense to melee/ranged and you could just throw on some coils for elements if needed.

In H2, when in combat it's like which of these 6 outfits should I equip for this fight. Do I equip the element defense one that will defend against the elemental attacks? But then maybe it has low melee defense so when they swipe me I get one shotted, etc...

Like here I am at lvl.50 able to take down these endgame dinos and I go to grind a thunderjaw for the override tail. Ez pz. I do good DPS, stealth tear off the tail, corrode it, open up the heart and start doing massive damage on it. No problem. Then when it's like 30% HP or something it rams me and I don't dodge in time and I get one shotted because the armor I had on wasn't high in melee defense whoops.

I can't imagine doing damage to Aloy at very hard. I'm still playing on normal but at this point I run around 100% of the time with a health potion drank so I am always walking around with like 500 HP beyond my max HP. Sometimes I'll eat that 20% food too so I'll have like 700 extra HP. Then I drink an overdraw potion before each battle for the extra 25% DPS. But in combat any time my HP dips into my actual red HP bar I run off and monster hunter style down another health potion to get my HP back in the yellow. This has been keeping me from getting one-shotted by things. I'd put on second chance skill but I don't have it yet and not sure if I wanna waste a slot on it. On my stealth gear I have last override +2 for infinite override duration and silent strike + 2 for like 150% strike damage on stunned enemies.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #207 on: March 14, 2022, 02:57:49 PM »
I can't imagine doing damage to Aloy at very hard.
After buying my legendary outfits, I've only been OHKO'd twice on Very hard.

Once was an Apex Thunderjaw during it's charge attack. The other was an Apex Scorcher when I was wearing the Winterweave outfit, which is super weak to fire. 

I mostly just switch between the Winterweave and Tenakth Tactician outfits depending upon the situation, I don't see the point in anything else.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #208 on: March 14, 2022, 03:31:45 PM »
I can't imagine doing damage to Aloy at very hard.
After buying my legendary outfits, I've only been OHKO'd twice on Very hard.

Once was an Apex Thunderjaw during it's charge attack. The other was an Apex Scorcher when I was wearing the Winterweave outfit, which is super weak to fire. 

I mostly just switch between the Winterweave and Tenakth Tactician outfits depending upon the situation, I don't see the point in anything else.

I think I still need to unlock Winterweave. For combat I'm using the orange-tier arena ones but at lvl.1 since I don't have the enemies available to upgrade them to lvl.2 yet. For my main stealth I'm using purple gear Nora Huntress from Thornmarch at like lvl.3 which has quiet movement + 2, low profile + 2 built in and then I add lasting override +2 and silent strike +2 on top of it. I would add stealth damage +2 instead of silent strike but I don't have a stealth damage coil mod.

If I'm fighting anything that will actually potentially kill me I'll switch out of that and into the orange gear once fighting starts.


Rahxephon91

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #209 on: March 14, 2022, 11:54:26 PM »
I just finished it.

My negatives would be that the human combat is still pretty bad, to the point that I think they should just drop it. The robots could be a bit obnoxious in how aggressive they are and the weapons should really be streamlined. Too many things on a weapon wheel. Also the old world lore was lacking and in general, I think the story is missing the engaging mystery and a bit more nuanced story of the first one. Ted Faro had a bit more character in him and in this, he's a joke as are most of the villains. Which seem to sit on "rich snooby people are snobs".

That said it continues to be the open-world for people like me.

The side quests don't feel copy and paste. Instead unique with their out legit stories and set pieces.

Side stuff like the Cauldrons and Tallknecks also are always unique, though it did seem like they had less ideas for them this time.

The pace of the open world is not that overbearing. Its a long game, maybe too long. But it's not overwhelming. It least in the main story, it feels like your are in an area and not just running all over.

And the world just looks fantastic and it feels good to just journey through it. Honestly, Guerilla may be the best at creating a highly detailed open world.


Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #210 on: March 15, 2022, 12:18:42 AM »
The pace of the open world is not that overbearing. Its a long game, maybe too long. But it's not overwhelming. It least in the main story, it feels like your are in an area and not just running all over.

But that's because the main story hardly uses a lot of the world. Main story is like the same length as Zero Dawn and the map is like 2x as big.
When you do side stuff it definitely starts to feel like you're just running all over.

And I gotta disagree on open world game for people who don't like open world games. That it's mostly unique vs copy pasta. I'd say it's 50/50 in this one. There's a bunch of unique stuff, but then there is a ton of copy pasta with all the rebel bases, the survey drones, the black boxes. Even the relic ruins while being different are just the same environmental puzzles for 10-20 mins of pulling and pushing which gets tedious after enough of them. I definitely don't think there's enough unique variety in the side content here. The game became too much of a traditional open world game with copy pasta activities in this one imo.

Rahxephon91

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #211 on: March 15, 2022, 12:31:29 AM »
 :trumps

I didn't do that stuff. If its not fun to me and seems pointless I ignore it. I don't even know what the drone stuff does. The Enemy camps are pretty open world cliche though yes.

But the stuff I chose to do the Cauldrons, Side Quests, Tallknecks, Main story, and even the arena were worthwhile content.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #212 on: March 15, 2022, 03:16:36 AM »
I do like this more when I'm not rushing and just take my time. Everything takes a while to do so if you're rushing trying to knock out a bunch of side stuff each session the small annoyances can add up.

I've just accepted at this point that I'll be the last person on earth to finish this and I'll get to Elden Ring when I get to it. Generally knock out about 2% completion a night. At 82% now, so end is in sight but still a ways out. Main story-wise, only at Faro's Tomb. Still have like 2 sidequests from Tide's Reach, 1 guantlet race near the Bulwark and a salvage contract to do first, but then I'm done with every map icon on the main continent and just have the small off-coast areas left.

demi

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #213 on: March 15, 2022, 03:27:37 AM »
Game is 40 hour estimate for platinum. Can't be that long of a game  :yeshrug
fat

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #214 on: March 15, 2022, 01:25:23 PM »
A lot of the side stuff isn't required for the platinum (just 3 relic ruins and one of each other type for a bronze), it almost feels like the collectibles are just there to appease the players that expect there to be a bunch of collectibles. .

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #215 on: March 15, 2022, 01:33:22 PM »
Game is 40 hour estimate for platinum. Can't be that long of a game  :yeshrug

Platinum is a joke in this. Basically just main story (~25-40 hours) + a few other things.

100% game progression is like 80-100 hours. Howlongtobeat.com has it at 82 hours right now. For me it'll be between 90-100 hours since I'm already at 80 hours with 82% completion.

naff

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #216 on: March 15, 2022, 05:01:22 PM »
Platinum is a joke in this. Basically just main story (~25-40 hours) + a few other things.

 :gladbron

after going for plat in elden ring, i'll be happy to come back and claim this easily haha
◕‿◕

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #217 on: March 16, 2022, 04:21:18 AM »
Had another bug tonight where a quest turn in NPC was stuck and couldn't finish the quest. Closing and reloading the game seems to fix these.

Got everything on the main continent done. Man, fuck those gauntlet races. The latter ones are just a mess with your horse getting stuck on objects and nothing but enemy spam. Glad those are done. Finally got to SF, looks great. Feel like the end is getting close.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #218 on: March 16, 2022, 05:52:15 AM »
Yeah the gauntlet missions were super hit or miss. The one on the coast and the final one in the desert were fun, mostly because I beat them on my first try.  :lol They were also in beautiful locations.

The one in the snow area took me 8-10 tries and was incredibly frustrating. Rubberbanding AI plus your mount getting stuck in the rocks is a bad combo for a racing mini game. I swear to god there was a race where I knocked every single rider off their mount AT LEAST ONCE but at the end I still had 6 NPC riders pumping arrows into my ass near the finish line. 

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #219 on: March 16, 2022, 06:40:52 AM »
Yeah, the snow one was the only one that took a handful of tries. The last one was more open but the AI was pretty bullshit.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #220 on: March 16, 2022, 08:18:43 AM »
Platinum done. The final mission was good.

Big, BIG Mass Effect vibes. The first game had a "collect allies for final mission" too but this was very, very Mass Effect 2 inspired. There obviously isn't the component of random allies deaths and whatnot but the template is there. I love the sci-fi core in these games. Super interested to see how Guerilla handles the third game in terms of location and content.

I think most of my unfinished completion percentage is behind expert machine strike players and Arena fights. I've cleared the rest of the map and all side-quests and errands are done, can't imagine what else I might have missed. I might go back to clean those up eventually but some of the expert machine strike players are annoying as hell to play against. The just turtle in the corner and wait for you to make a mistake.

Edit: ok, nevermind...
spoiler (click to show/hide)
There is post-game content?!?
[close]
« Last Edit: March 16, 2022, 08:43:49 AM by Let's Cyber »

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #221 on: March 16, 2022, 06:16:07 PM »
For the arena, just drop the difficulty down. It's not a very fun arena the way it's setup.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #222 on: March 16, 2022, 08:51:39 PM »
New patch today is supposed to fix firegleam icons being stuck on map.

Also

Quote
Several balancing changes to weapons and enemies.

Curious to what the details of this are.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #223 on: March 18, 2022, 04:25:52 AM »
Got to the final mission and went to close the game and it hard crashed my PS5 for the 2nd time. Enjoying the game but definitely ready to finish this up and move on from this before it breaks my PS5.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #224 on: March 18, 2022, 12:57:09 PM »
Physical or digital? Really shouldn't matter but it is weird.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #225 on: March 18, 2022, 06:01:06 PM »
Digital. Crashes seem really rare. I posted on era and a few people said they've had no crashes in a 100 hours and a few people said they had like 3-5 crashes.

The weird thing for me is that both crashes were the same way, but hitting start on the icon from the UI and hitting "close game" and it just goes to black screen and the PS5 shuts down. I mean I've also done that same thing 100 other times with no crash, but seems like they have some bug in there that crashes the PS5 on close very rarely. Seems more repeatable and fixable than a random crash while playing and doing stuff.

Anyhow, was like 92% last night. Gonna wrap up the couple of sidequests that were blocked off until now and I have 6 machine strikes left to clear (skilled & expert) and then will finish. Sounds like there will be a few things afterwards to wrap up for 100% but shouldn't be too much further. Might finish the story tonight and 100% tomorrow.

For the Plat, on the scanning all enemies trophy, looking at my list the biggest problem is I'm missing a ton of burrower variants :(  Can you find all of them post-game to scan them?

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #226 on: March 18, 2022, 06:42:34 PM »
I don't think you need every variant just the 43 main type of machines.

I really doubt I found every burrower type, there are a ton.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #227 on: March 18, 2022, 06:50:34 PM »
Oh, I heard the only out of the way thing for the plat is scanning all enemies which made it sound like you need to scan every variant. Otherwise that's pretty easy. I've had all of them outside what I assume is the final boss ? for a long while in my notebook.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #228 on: March 18, 2022, 07:03:35 PM »
Yup, you're good then.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #229 on: March 18, 2022, 07:18:01 PM »
Also now that I'm before the final mission, I gotta say the story in this game is weird. It's more "epic" maybe? And bigger scope, but feels way more videogame-y.

I think Zero Dawn is one of the dozen or so videogames with legit good stories that would work just as well as a movie/novel/tv series. Felt pretty original and good mystery and good reveals.

I think I liked the concept of Forbidden West's plot better in this "go around half the USA chasing after self-aware AIs who got loose" but in actuality the self-aware AIs mostly don't do anything other than just be a box you touch somewhere and they have like 1 line. I think I was expecting more MGS bosses were they would be characters like how Hades was and Hephaestus is and would actually be doing themed stuff to keep you away. The closest to that is Poseidon just with the water. Also the other real bosses which are more like MGS bosses are super underdeveloped and if they were gonna be the real antagonists I would have liked them to be more frequent in the story and you take down one at a time through unique boss fights like MGS bosses.

I think the best part of Forbidden West's story is the Grove/Kulrut arc with the different tribes. The Bulwark section in particular was good.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #230 on: March 18, 2022, 09:36:40 PM »
Oh and Kotallo is the best acted character and most interesting character in the game.

I think Sylens being missing most of the game is actually a negative. Having him in your earpiece and their dynamic for a good chunk of Zero Dawn and some Frozen Wilds worked a lot better.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #231 on: March 19, 2022, 12:31:23 AM »
I was looking up that Winterweave armor you were talking about because I don't have it and then I saw there were two legendary armors that are just vendor sells but I never got them because I didn't have the Apex dreadwing/slitherfang parts because I'd never encountered those yet.

Then I looked up where to find them and

what the flying fuck, the game never tells you that apex version of enemies spawn at normal version sites at night and that it's RNG based and the higher the difficulty setting the more likely they are to appear??

Like I haven't upgraded a single weapon or armor in like 30 hours and all my orange gear is lvl.0 because everything in the last 1/3rd needs apex parts to upgrade and it kept telling me "site unknown" so I figured I'd just run across the Apex sites later in the game.

No real point now, but yeah if I had known this 30-50 hours ago I would have grinded some mats and upgraded some of these weapons/armors!

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #232 on: March 19, 2022, 02:28:00 AM »
Final mission was good.

Ending/Sequel hook is terrible. Not really interested in Horizon 3 with this plot :\

spoiler (click to show/hide)
If they were going this route, why couldn't they have at least had cool real aliens be the threat.
Fighting off the Singularity AI of the Far Zenith people sounds lame af
[close]

Solid sequel, not as groundbreaking as the first or good as the first in a lot of ways, but does some stuff better and looks pretty. Feels about an 8.5/10 to me. The 89 metacritic is fair, but Zero Dawn's 89 metacritic is underrated. ZD should've been like a low 90s metacritic.

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #233 on: March 19, 2022, 03:01:50 AM »
Went to look at 100% and that's where scanning all the variants is. Each one adds to the game percentage.

I'm at 96.60% and content-wise it looks like I'm missing a single errand in Arrowhead and that's not gonna give much completion. Otherwise I have everything that counts towards 100% outside scanning all the variants which I'm gonna pass on.

Will do that one quest tomorrow and the machine strikes I have left and then I'm fully done with this. Got the plat. Was just missing the glide for 60 secs trophy.

Looks like these are the variants I'm missing
spoiler (click to show/hide)
Apex tremortusk
Apex Behemoth
Apex Rockbreaker
Apex Rollerback
Apex Glinthawk
Apex Fire Bristleback
Apex Plowhorn
Apex Sentry Scrounger

Shock Burrow
Apex Fire Canister Burrower
Apex Frost Canister Burrower
Apex Shock Canister Burrower
Apex Acid Canister Burrower
Apex Purgewater Canister Burrower
[close]
« Last Edit: March 19, 2022, 03:07:06 AM by Bebpo »

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #234 on: March 19, 2022, 09:06:28 AM »
what the flying fuck, the game never tells you that apex version of enemies spawn at normal version sites at night and that it's RNG based and the higher the difficulty setting the more likely they are to appear??
I think it does during the load screens, but they are so brief on PS5 it's pretty easy to miss.  :doge

Honestly I was seeing so many Apex on Very Hard, it was never and issue. I'd usually just faster travel back and forth or change time of day to get things to respawn.

Let's Cyber

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #235 on: March 19, 2022, 09:25:13 AM »
Final mission was good.

Ending/Sequel hook is terrible. Not really interested in Horizon 3 with this plot :\

spoiler (click to show/hide)
If they were going this route, why couldn't they have at least had cool real aliens be the threat.
Fighting off the Singularity AI of the Far Zenith people sounds lame af
[close]
They've established with GAIA's subordinate functions that self-aware AIs left in isolation really don't do well. By the time you find most of them, they're in a terrible state and more than willing to re-merge with GAIA. They essentially breakdown like a human being's mental health would in extended isolation. CYAN was super lonely and desperate for connection as well, which is why she was so quick to start a friendship with Ourea after centuries alone.  I think having a purpose is the only real thing that saved HADES and HEPHAESTUS from the same fate. They were both down a path (destructive or genocidal as it was) with a goal to strive for.

So the idea of
spoiler (click to show/hide)
an isolated and tortured AI coming back for revenge fits in line with the logic of the universe they've established.  I don't really have a problem with it. We'll probably also get to see/hear from Erik, Gerard and Tilda again, or at least their digitally replicated selves within Nemesis.

We also don't know what form Nemesis will take. We do know it used the replicator tech the Zeniths had to make machines to kill everyone on Sirius. What did those machines look like? Maybe they were just a bunch of Specters but Guerilla can get weird and imaginative with the designs. The Nemesis army, in terms of function and appearance, is the instrument of an alien invasion.  It's basically going to be Faro Plague 2.0 with more advanced robots from outer space. That sounds cool as hell to me.
[close]




demi

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #236 on: March 19, 2022, 12:47:53 PM »
Avoiding reading those spoilers

Been playing on Base PS4. Game looks just like Horizon 1 pretty much. Feels good to save $600 just to be able to play this

Just reached Plainsong, after encountering the "new threat"
fat

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #237 on: March 19, 2022, 01:52:45 PM »
Went around scanning machines this morning. Didn't realize they've never fixed the bug of the Apex Sentry Scrounger making 100% impossible. Just missing that and non-apex shock cannister burrower which feels like it would take hours of going to an RNG spawn site south of bulwark that shoots out mostly apex versions of cannister burrowers but occasionally a non-apex version of an RNG element.

98.59% without those two scans. Feels bad.

demi

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #238 on: March 20, 2022, 03:50:52 PM »
Arena is terrible design

Why does the listing say "1x enemy, 1x enemy" but there are little enemies strewn throughout anyway

And why does it cost me money to retry the thing

And why are spike throwers OP as shit why am I using bows
fat

Bebpo

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Re: Horizon Forbidden Waifu
« Reply #239 on: March 20, 2022, 04:13:40 PM »
Because the Arena is a terrible design. It is also why you can change the difficulty mode to story with no penalties and full trophies/100%.

Worst is they sacrificed the Hunting Ground missions that used to be good & challenging in the original to make them all easy tutorials in this one figuring the arena would be the challenge version. Except the arena sucks. No idea why they thought making it cost money and you don't get to keep any of the mats is a good idea. Though I guess the latter because it would become the best farming spot which I think would be ok since farming in this game is dumb anyhow and might as well make it where you can just spawn what you need and grind it in the arena to speed up the farm.

Also Javelins are good but they're slow. I still used them a lot until the end, but there are times when they're too slow and you're getting wrecked and grenades are better at those times for getting shit out of your face. I put on close-range damage mods for grenades because of that. In terms of pure damage the sharpshot bows outdo them pretty easily later on and hunter bows really only exist for elemental arrows to inflict status.

It's also kind of ironic that my problem in Frozen Wilds was that in Horizon 1 I relied on sharpshot slow bows for damage shots when I should have been using triple arrow hunter bow shots for damage and once I changed to that Frozen Wilds was fine. But in Horizon 2 even triple arrow hunter bow shots just don't do enough damage so basically was just using slow sharpshot bows for damage like I did for 90% of Horizon 1 here. At least you can throw "draw speed + %" mods on the sharpshot bows to make them a bit quicker.