Author Topic: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!  (Read 41552 times)

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Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #300 on: September 29, 2008, 07:09:57 PM »
W tried to do the right thing for the wrong reasons, and he did it in the wrong way
« Last Edit: September 29, 2008, 07:13:05 PM by Professor Prole »
duc

Human Snorenado

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #301 on: September 29, 2008, 07:12:23 PM »
Even my dad hates Lou Dobbs, and he's a fan of O'Reilly

OREILLY

So, this is all still a little blurry to me..but...are we all actually agreeing with W Bush?

Wow.  It feels dirty.

We're agreeing that there's a problem, not how to handle it.  Bush's initial proposition to fix it was pretty much what you'd expect- a dumb, blatant power grab.  The fact that his administration caved to so much of what the dems wanted should clue people in to the fact that YES THIS IS A FUCKING CRISIS. 
yar

TakingBackSunday

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #302 on: September 29, 2008, 07:13:04 PM »
Okay, I see.

People I guess just don't get that even fucking economic experts agree that he did the semi-right thing.  Jim Kramer even praised him, jesus.

Ugh.  This country can suck my dick so hard.
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TakingBackSunday

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #303 on: September 29, 2008, 07:18:07 PM »
Fuck this lolpublican on hardball right now

"this just shows democracy works!"
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Oblivion

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #304 on: September 29, 2008, 07:19:07 PM »
Fuck this lolpublican on hardball right now

"this just shows democracy works!"

When will people learn? Democracy never works...

Brehvolution

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #305 on: September 29, 2008, 07:50:28 PM »
Fuck this lolpublican on hardball right now

"this just shows democracy works!"

When will people learn? Democracy never works...
It's th erepubs new mantra... take something and say it is the exact opposite. They bank on the gullibility of the base.
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Human Snorenado

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #306 on: September 29, 2008, 07:51:55 PM »
Fuck this lolpublican on hardball right now

"this just shows democracy works!"

When will people learn? Democracy never works...

It's th erepubs new mantra... take something and say it is the exact opposite. They bank on the gullibility of the base.

Indeed.  "Our plan is better for the American taxpayer!"
yar

Olivia Wilde Homo

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #307 on: September 29, 2008, 07:59:19 PM »
now that we have some distance (like an hour) from the failout, it really kind of signifies the end of the Republican party as a coherent force in American politics...right?

A Republican President is unable to get the Republican members of the House to vote for a bipartisan, necessary financial proposal. McCain has somehow cast himself in opposition to Bush AND Congress, fighting his own party on two fronts. The result is total political gridlock and the largest one-day financial hit in our country's history. There's NO WAY to spin this as the Democrats' fault. They came out voting for the proposal!

The GOP was marginalized after The Great Depression and those that remained in office tended to be "New Deal Republicans"  I hope this means that we'll see more and more Republican politicians wake up and see past the bullshit partisan politics.  At the same time, I could see that some of them will be stuck in their ways and splinter off.

McCain is fucked; that is for sure.  Main Street smiles now but they will be crying once they discover that their 401k is fucked and they'll have to push back retirement several years, if ever.  They will be crying once nobody will even consider lending money to them unless you have a clean credit report or at some outrageous interest rate.  So this schadenfreude will be very temporary.  The reality hits the stupid Americans last but aiming for the wallet is the surest way to change party affiliations.  That and the draft.

I don't want to call it now but I expect a big Obama sweep, he should get at least 400 electoral votes, getting almost all but the racist Midwestern and Rocky Mountain states.
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Eric P

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #308 on: September 29, 2008, 08:44:28 PM »
Even my dad hates Lou Dobbs, and he's a fan of O'Reilly

OREILLY

So, this is all still a little blurry to me..but...are we all actually agreeing with W Bush?

Wow.  It feels dirty.

i agree with him on keeping americorps going

i love that program but wish we could expand it a bit
Tonya

TakingBackSunday

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #309 on: September 29, 2008, 09:01:04 PM »
Now another friend of mine is saying the bailout would increase even more on our national debt.

Mehhhhhhhhh
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Howard Alan Treesong

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #310 on: September 29, 2008, 09:07:03 PM »
Now another friend of mine is saying the bailout would increase even more on our national debt.

Mehhhhhhhhh

well, yes

but would you rather increase the national debt or revert to a potato-based economy
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TakingBackSunday

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #311 on: September 29, 2008, 09:08:43 PM »
Has this been posted?  Anyone watch it?

[youtube=425,350]lsC2k9opOP0[/youtube]

What do you guys think.
püp

Howard Alan Treesong

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #312 on: September 29, 2008, 09:09:49 PM »
all these people going "let these banks fail!"

I wonder if they know what happens to their money when a bank fails.

hint: you don't get to withdraw it, snickering at the fat cats all the while
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Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #313 on: September 29, 2008, 09:12:31 PM »
if you DO get to withdraw it in an ill-advised bank run, the cash you withdraw becomes cat box lining when hyperinflation/stagflation suplexes the value of the dollar into the glass table of monetary irrelevance
« Last Edit: September 29, 2008, 09:14:12 PM by Professor Prole »
duc

Howard Alan Treesong

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #314 on: September 29, 2008, 09:13:56 PM »
I think the circular reasoning actually extends to

"Let the bank fail! My money's insured."

without thinking about who's insuring it or who's paying for that insurance

HINT: YOU
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Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #315 on: September 29, 2008, 09:14:41 PM »
also the fdic is all-on near broke

bank runs ultimately tipped america '29 from ouch nasty recession into A BOXCAR IS MY HOME
duc

Brehvolution

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #316 on: September 29, 2008, 09:28:01 PM »
Maybe this is what the mobilization of that military company Patel told us about is for. Just in case martial law is imposed after the public goes ape shit at what is going to be passed. Or martial law to keep order at the food and gas lines.
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Brehvolution

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #317 on: September 29, 2008, 09:30:21 PM »
Wednsday is the big day folks. My pilthy paycheck will be deposited on Wednesday precisely @ 12:00 AM. I will let you know if I am declined the with drawl of my money around 12PM that day. Anyone have a sooner 'test'?
©ZH

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #318 on: September 29, 2008, 09:32:49 PM »
nothing stops a bank run like rubber bullets and taser blasts
duc

HyperZoneWasAwesome

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #319 on: September 29, 2008, 09:33:10 PM »
Republicans for years and years and years have played the disinformation card.  Playing up BS populists policies and nurturing and benefiting from the right-wing noise machine which has twists and distorts the public debate into baloney wedge issues and outright lies about the other side.

Now that all the braindead zealots who have been raised on nothing but junk-food information over the last twenty years are actually turning on their representatives, and in turn stabbing themselves as well as any republican in the back.  I'd like to feel smug about this, I'd like to say, they made the bed they're lying in, I'd like to see the republican party violently implode and become the marginalized voice of the few wealthy backers it actually works for.

But I can't, I can't because the stakes at the moment are too high, the consequences are deadly serious, and there's nothing amusing about a fuckup that is already earning us back nothing but tragedy and still has the potential to become a catastrophic failure.

I'm hoping some good can come of this.  Some reevaluation of how information is disseminated, or perhaps a new bedrock for some real progressive policies for the future.  But all I think is going to happen is that people in the mainstream will be further divided, and the smoking ruins left behind will only cause more finger pointing and absolved responsibility.

Arbys Roast Beef Sandwich

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #320 on: September 29, 2008, 09:33:49 PM »
I don't even get 401k at work. True story. Hate my life.
うぐう

The Fake Shemp

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #321 on: September 29, 2008, 09:34:17 PM »
You don't have a 401k?  Lucky you!  Most folks don't want one now!
PSP

Brehvolution

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #322 on: September 29, 2008, 09:35:53 PM »
Or have one.
©ZH

TakingBackSunday

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #323 on: September 29, 2008, 09:36:38 PM »
if you DO get to withdraw it in an ill-advised bank run, the cash you withdraw becomes cat box lining when hyperinflation/stagflation suplexes the value of the dollar into the glass table of monetary irrelevance

But (and this isn't me talking, this is my friends logic) wouldn't us paying this bailout off accomplish the same thing though?  Hyperinflation/monetary irrelevance and a worthless dollar?
püp

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #324 on: September 29, 2008, 09:37:38 PM »
there is a much less likely chance of it happening, because our international lending partners can float a bit longer and HOPEFULLY find their legs
duc

TakingBackSunday

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #325 on: September 29, 2008, 09:40:30 PM »
That's what I told him too.

He also says the 700 billion would add to the deficit...I don't think he realizes just how large our deficit is.  700 billion is like demi's pp compared to arvie's cockzilla monster
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Howard Alan Treesong

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #326 on: September 29, 2008, 09:42:03 PM »
eh $700 billion is not chump change but we're already at like 10 trillion, so it's like ... 7%?
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Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #327 on: September 29, 2008, 09:42:20 PM »
ask him where he was when bush was putting us 1T in deficit to fund the effort to exterminate 7000 us soldiers and 400K iraqis for no particular reason
duc

The Fake Shemp

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #328 on: September 29, 2008, 09:44:58 PM »
The Dirty Brown Solution was something all Americans loved, Drinky!
PSP

Oblivion

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #329 on: September 29, 2008, 09:50:25 PM »
One of my econ professors (from a good while ago) said that we had precautions to make sure something on the level of the Great Depression wouldn't happen again. Is that a load of hooey?

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #330 on: September 29, 2008, 09:51:27 PM »
reagan and greenspan unraveled most of those "precautions"

republicans call this "deregulating"

the rest of us call it "cutting the brakes"
duc

Olivia Wilde Homo

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #331 on: September 29, 2008, 09:51:45 PM »
One of my econ professors (from a good while ago) said that we had precautions to make sure something on the level of the Great Depression wouldn't happen again. Is that a load of hooey?

Yeah but a good portion of them have been neutralized, eliminated, or worked around courtesy of Reaganomics.
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Joe Molotov

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #332 on: September 29, 2008, 09:55:01 PM »
the rest of us call it "cutting the brakes"



Wildcard, bitches!
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Fresh Prince

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #333 on: September 29, 2008, 09:56:34 PM »
Meh. The $700 billion was supposed to give the economy a parachute now it's falling like a suicidal banker.  Will this go back and get redrafted?
888

Oblivion

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #334 on: September 29, 2008, 09:57:11 PM »
reagan and greenspan unraveled most of those "precautions"

republicans call this "deregulating"

the rest of us call it "cutting the brakes"

:O

Okay, now I'm a slightly more worried. :(

demi

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #335 on: September 29, 2008, 09:58:16 PM »
That's what I told him too.

He also says the 700 billion would add to the deficit...I don't think he realizes just how large our deficit is.  700 billion is like demi's pp compared to arvie's cockzilla monster

I don't know what this means.
fat

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #336 on: September 29, 2008, 09:59:52 PM »
he's trying to suggest that having a little dago dick is a bad thing, demi
duc

demi

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #337 on: September 29, 2008, 10:00:24 PM »
Well I like my little dago dick.
fat

Human Snorenado

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #338 on: September 29, 2008, 10:00:25 PM »
That's what I told him too.

He also says the 700 billion would add to the deficit...I don't think he realizes just how large our deficit is.  700 billion is like demi's pp compared to arvie's cockzilla monster

I don't know what this means.

YOUR PENIS IS SMALL AND LAUGHABLE
yar

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #339 on: September 29, 2008, 10:01:08 PM »
Well I like my little dago dick.

we all adore it, demi
duc

demi

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #340 on: September 29, 2008, 10:01:43 PM »
It is a nice dick. I'm going to go play with it in a bit. It is all I have left...
fat

TakingBackSunday

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #341 on: September 29, 2008, 10:02:28 PM »
 :lol

This person I speak of is also a Ron Lawl supporter.
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Oblivion

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #342 on: September 29, 2008, 10:02:46 PM »
It IS kinda cute, I suppose. Like a chinchilla.  :-[

Van Cruncheon

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #343 on: September 29, 2008, 10:03:40 PM »
yeah, sounds like he's just parroting the mises.org anti-socialism line
duc

TakingBackSunday

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #344 on: September 29, 2008, 10:04:52 PM »
yeah, sounds like he's just parroting the mises.org anti-socialism line

Yup.  I've been called a socialist a few times today by my crazy Ron Paul friends.
püp

siamesedreamer

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #345 on: September 29, 2008, 10:29:59 PM »
The credit markets are fucked. FUCKED. They have got to suspend the mark-to-market rules. Tomorrow hedge funds will be rectifying huge margin calls. There's a $62 trillion credit default swap house of cards waiting to implode. 

We are standing at the brink of the worst economic period all of us will ever know. And I'm not sure there's anything they can do to stop it.




Human Snorenado

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #346 on: September 29, 2008, 10:32:10 PM »
The credit markets are fucked. FUCKED. They have got to suspend the mark-to-market rules. Tomorrow hedge funds will be rectifying huge margin calls. There's a $62 trillion credit default swap house of cards waiting to implode. 

We are standing at the brink of the worst economic period all of us will ever know. And I'm not sure there's anything they can do to stop it.

So, it's cool that we go start killing Republican congressmen after we have to start eating our dogs and children?  Cause I am SO down for that.
yar

siamesedreamer

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #347 on: September 29, 2008, 10:37:09 PM »
I'm just as pissed as everyone else it didn't pass, but this isn't a partisan issue. The bailout would have done nothing to fix the credit markets. Read Roubini's latest post. He's now saying Morgan and Goldman cannot make it on their own. And there's a serious risk of runs on the banks from foreign banks.

tiesto

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #348 on: September 29, 2008, 10:38:17 PM »
My Ron Paul supporting friend called me up today ecstatic that the bailout plan failed... he has really drunk the Ron Paul koolaid, right down to wanting to vote for a 3rd party this election, to repeating almost verbatim what Ron Paul says about the bailout. When meanwhile, another close friend who is a major fiscal conservative and works in the accounting industry, says that the bailout is an absolute necessity.
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Phoenix Dark

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #349 on: September 29, 2008, 10:39:54 PM »
Ron Paul AND LaRouche-acolytes were on campus today handing out fliers. One of the Paul people was a fat black dude which kinda made me chuckle
010

siamesedreamer

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #350 on: September 29, 2008, 10:42:55 PM »
Look at the 2yr swap spread number:

http://www.cnbc.com/id/26905693/site/14081545

A normal high is around 30.

Olivia Wilde Homo

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #351 on: September 29, 2008, 10:47:09 PM »
So should I even bother to pay bills the next month?  I don't want to make any payments towards a bank that will fold like a sucker.
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Human Snorenado

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #352 on: September 29, 2008, 10:48:06 PM »
I'm just as pissed as everyone else it didn't pass, but this isn't a partisan issue. The bailout would have done nothing to fix the credit markets. Read Roubini's latest post. He's now saying Morgan and Goldman cannot make it on their own. And there's a serious risk of runs on the banks from foreign banks.

Oh, I know.  We're well and truly fucked.  2 Great 2 Depressing, etc etc.  But will you now admit that it might have been dumb to let these yahoos run loose with no regulations?
yar

siamesedreamer

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #353 on: September 29, 2008, 10:58:26 PM »
I'm not going to get into an argument about who's fault it was. There's nothing that I could post that would get you to even begin to see it any other way than how you're seeing it now.

AdmiralViscen

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #354 on: September 29, 2008, 11:01:55 PM »
But you might be able to come up with a better excuse than "Pelosi dissed Bush."

patrickula

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #355 on: September 29, 2008, 11:03:20 PM »
So srsly guys: to bank run or not to bank run?

Joe Molotov

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #356 on: September 29, 2008, 11:06:30 PM »
So srsly guys: to bank run or not to bank run?

Your money's secured by the FDIC. If the FDIC fails, well you're money's not going to be worth anything anyway, so might as well ride it out.
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Human Snorenado

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #357 on: September 29, 2008, 11:07:46 PM »
I'm not going to get into an argument about who's fault it was. There's nothing that I could post that would get you to even begin to see it any other way than how you're seeing it now.

You know, I'd really like to know how ANYONE could see it differently.  Sure I've got my ideas and thoughts, but I'm genuinely interested in how someone on the other side sees it.
yar

Phoenix Dark

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #358 on: September 29, 2008, 11:07:52 PM »
010

siamesedreamer

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Re: Gentlemen, we do NOT have a bailout! Dow plunges -777!
« Reply #359 on: September 29, 2008, 11:11:20 PM »
I'm not going to get into an argument about who's fault it was. There's nothing that I could post that would get you to even begin to see it any other way than how you're seeing it now.

You know, I'd really like to know how ANYONE could see it differently.  Sure I've got my ideas and thoughts, but I'm genuinely interested in how someone on the other side sees it.

Maybe you should branch out from the nutroot sites then.