kz2

[duckman2000]

A friend of mine did an online pre-order from Gamestop, and still doesn't have the game. I'd feel bad for him if he hadn't been so annoying with his lectures on the greatness of pre-ordering. I got my game from walking into Best Buy and picking it up on the 27th.

[duckman2000]

Urgh. Playing COD4 was a big mistake. As cool as KZ2 MP is, it really doesn't have shit on this.

[dark1x]

Urgh. Playing COD4 was a big mistake. As cool as KZ2 MP is, it really doesn't have shit on this.

What makes you say that, out of curiosity.  I never actually enjoyed CoD4 in multi all that much, to be honest (though I can't say I love playing KZ2 online all that much either).

[duckman2000]

I have no idea. I suppose it's a mix of satisfying combat and accessibility. I'm not sure what exactly it is about it, but there's something irresistible about COD4 online. KZ2 crushes COD4's campaign with great fury, but even with all its options, depth and obviously incredible visuals, it really doesn't have anything on COD4 online.

[AdmiralViscen]

Accessibility? 

Being weak and proud

[duckman2000]

Accessibility? 

Being weak and proud

Yeah, imagine the weakness in wanting to enjoy the game at its fullest without having to trudge through an upgrade path. At least they give you the ISA rifle right away, but I'm not sold on the set-up.

Are you guys actually experiencing it, or are you convincing yourselves of it based on a Youtube video?

what?
if you look back in this thread , people mentioned it was slow and clunky ages back.

Question, as i still cannot connect or create any online games, does MP have the same lag?

So let me make sure I have the story straight. People who mention the slowness and clunkiness, they were all then referring to this 150ms lag? Not that it really matters, as it's still a matter of adaptation. The only real issue here would be the alleged misfires, but then that must be a case to case issue as I couldn't replicate it myself. And I saw plenty of that shit in the beta.

As for testing out MP, I think you can create skirmishes without even going online. Be prepared to fiddle with the control settings though, as it doesn't transfer well to MP. A simple option of allowing the player to save multiple control configurations would help there.

[Jansen]

why didn't i rent this game

the shit eating controls damn near ruin what would have otherwise been a great game

at what level in mp do i get to switch characters?

[cool breeze]

One thing that is misleading in that video is flicking the analog stick to prove there is controller lag; I don't think that's so much controller lag as it's the acceleration oddities.  It's just a different kind of bad.

[Jansen]

love how you're practically dead in mp if someone's shooting you from the side because you can't turn fast enough to respond

[duckman2000]

love how you're practically dead in mp if someone's shooting you from the side because you can't turn fast enough to respond

Adapt or die.

[AdmiralViscen]

lol

[duckman2000]

I'm starting to get sick of spawn grenades. Maybe it wouldn't be so fucking annoying if the turrets in your base were indestructible.

[duckman2000]

Something something conservative pussy something something adapt or die something

It's mostly "die" in these situations, with little chance to adapt.

By the way, have you tried just selecting a different warzone, or use another user account with a US or EU address? Or is that typically locked to the actual consoles? Sounds weird.

[rubber feathers]

I have no idea. I suppose it's a mix of satisfying combat and accessibility. I'm not sure what exactly it is about it, but there's something irresistible about COD4 online. KZ2 crushes COD4's campaign with great fury, but even with all its options, depth and obviously incredible visuals, it really doesn't have anything on COD4 online.

Eh, CoD4 doesn't have the variety and utility of all the classes, you're also playing with only 11 other people and not 31 so you don't have the feeling of an all-out war, maps are much smaller, and the level of depth doesn't even compare to KZ2.

I think the actual gameplay is better though, and when MW2 comes out I'm not playing anything else, period.  (except maybe mass effect 2 if it comes out.)  I've just played CoD4 so much – at least around 250 hours – and I'm just tired of it for now, and KZ2 is really filling that void.  I think I've used my PS3 more in the past few weeks than I did for the 5 months before it.

[duckman2000]

When Killzone 2 works, it really works. When you can get a good squad feel going, and you execute ambushes beautifully as a team, then it's some of the best MP I've had. And calling out a sniper for the rest of the team, and then see a few of your team mates catch the guy unawares, it's a beautiful thing. But it's just not as satisfying as COD4, to me. This will sound alarmingly geeky, but playing a round of COD4 gives you a real mental kick, and I haven't gotten that from KZ2 yet. And aside from maybe when someone calls in a chopper on shipment, I have never experienced the kind of clusterfuck that KZ2 throws you into when you're in a generally shitty game.

It's also lacking airstrikes. Big deal to me, for some odd reason. I have to say, though, having a guy in your sight only to have your view realistically obscured by passing gusts of dust, that's annoying in a very cool way.

[Purple Filth]

they released a patch (rumor is that EU has it first, US later?) and it supposedly fixed these issues.

Below is a list of fixes included in this patch. There is no new content or new features, but the list is pretty expansive. Check it out:

 Stability issue regarding randomly named games resolved.

 Stability fix when rapidly tapping (X) can cause crash on spawn-select.

Stability issue regarding Saboteur’s disguise ability resolved.

Stability fix on ‘Creating game’ with a blank name.

Stability fix for repeatedly entering exiting game.

The Ignore list functionality corrected.

Unlock of “Frontrunner” Medal now functioning correctly.

Fix for incorrect award of win to clan not showing for game resolved.

Battle Replay for Corinth Crossing not appearing correctly on www.killzone.com.

Issue with not being able to defuse the Search and Destroy objective resolved.

HUD issue correction during Assassination mode when playing as a Medic.

Controller input tweaks and modifications. 

Fix for auto-lock on of shotgun exploit.

Fix for D-Charge issues in Campaign mode.

hmmm @ bold

[AdmiralViscen]

How the hell was shotgun lock-on an exploit? They couldn't find that within 5 minutes of QA?

[Purple Filth]

How the hell was shotgun lock-on an exploit? They couldn't find that within 5 minutes of QA?

I guess they didnt think the assist to be that huge 

reports on gaf are that the controls feels quicker.

[cool breeze]

I'll try it later today and see if it's better or not.

[rubber feathers]

So where's the fix that lets me turn down the voice chat volume?

[AdmiralViscen]

You can do that in the settings.

[duckman2000]

How the hell was shotgun lock-on an exploit? They couldn't find that within 5 minutes of QA?

I guess they didnt think the assist to be that huge 

reports on gaf are that the controls feels quicker.

I don't recall there even being a flashlight on the shotgun in the beta.

[rubber feathers]

You can do that in the settings.

I can't, actually.  I try and move the slider and, well, it won't move.  And I have no idea why.

[AdmiralViscen]

Hold the stick for a really long time, for some reason that one moves slow as shit instead of being split into 10 blocks.

[duckman2000]

Where was this patch released, exactly? I logged in with my EU account, set warzone to EU, and there was no patch available. Unless it's determining location in some other way.

Not sure how smart it is to believe GAFers, but apparently, there is now strong auto-aim and they toned down a good chunk of the weightiness.

[dark1x]

love how you're practically dead in mp if someone's shooting you from the side because you can't turn fast enough to respond

That's hardly an issue.  Was similar in Halo, actually.  The ability to surprise someone from behind is OK provided you understand this limitation and work with it.  This isn't a defense in favor of Killzone, rather, the slower paced console FPS genre.

Of course, Halo even offered weapons that could further decrease turning speed (the plasma pistols) of the player.  People always used to get angry and claim the game was broken when I'd pull that off. 

Killzone 2 does bring death very quickly, however.  I haven't decided if I like that or not.  Honestly, I still think Halo nailed this in a way that no other shooter has.

Not sure how smart it is to believe GAFers, but apparently, there is now strong auto-aim and they toned down a good chunk of the weightiness.

I think it's great that they responded so quickly.  I hope it actually addresses the input lag, however, which was really the issue from the beginning.

Hold the stick for a really long time, for some reason that one moves slow as shit instead of being split into 10 blocks.

Due to the nature of headsets and microphones, I'd imagine they wanted to avoid potential squeals depending on the type of mic/headset you are using so it forces you to adjust with caution.  That's an obvious downside of using an open mic system (rather than supplying a standard mic ala XBOX360).

[duckman2000]

Not sure how smart it is to believe GAFers, but apparently, there is now strong auto-aim and they toned down a good chunk of the weightiness.

I think it's great that they responded so quickly.  I hope it actually addresses the input lag, however, which was really the issue from the beginning.

Right, but I doesn't sound like that's what they are actually addressing. Judging by what some are saying, they are compromising movement and aiming. But then I'm not sure who to believe here, and I think maybe TTP is the most trustworthy on that. It's great if they are fixing bugs, but if they are as some claim changing the way the game controls, then that's a bit sad, yet understandable.

[duckman2000]

there is now strong auto-aim

Oh great, continue the trend of console games holding your hand with everything. Fucking bitch ass pussies.

Well, it remains to be seen how much truth there is to that. The group of people reporting this aren't exactly strangers to exaggeration and drama. TTP claims that there is more of a subtle difference to the controls.

[dammitmattt]

The last level has some of the worst-designed sections I've ever seen in a video game.  Re-spawning enemies mixed with shitty cover is never, ever fun.  I'm so annoyed that I'm about to break my disc.  Fuck Guerilla right up the ass, demi-style

[FatalT]

Just made it to the bridge level. This one is supposed to be hell, right? Oh boy...

[dammitmattt]

Just made it to the bridge level. This one is supposed to be hell, right? Oh boy...

It's not bad except for the part with re-spawning enemies.  That part sucks.

[duckman2000]

That AA section was a bit weird, very "gamey." They stop coming eventually, but you definitely have to face more enemies if you play defensively. The bridge was balls awesome, though.

[rubber feathers]

Hold the stick for a really long time, for some reason that one moves slow as shit instead of being split into 10 blocks.

haha, if that's how it really works I want to give you a medal for saving my eardrums.

[dammitmattt]

The last level is the worst level in the history of video games.

[AdmiralViscen]

told ya

[dammitmattt]

The re-spawning enemies were bad enough, but I got through those parts.  The waves and waves with no cover and no help from your AI buddy are unforgivable.  What terrible game design.  I'm playing on Veteran, by the way, which was almost completely fair until the last 3% of the game.

I hate this fucking game.

[duckman2000]

The last level is the worst level in the history of video games.

I still have some ways to go before getting there, but I can't imagine it being worse than Cortana. I've been playing through Halo 3 on Heroic this time, and I absolutely dread getting to that level.

Killzone 2 does bring death very quickly, however.  I haven't decided if I like that or not.  Honestly, I still think Halo nailed this in a way that no other shooter has.

It's a lot more forgiving than COD4, though. The difference is that regeneration is a slow process, so if you manage to get away, you have to either stay hidden or be damned sure that you have the upper hand when you launch a counter-attack.

I have really grown to hate snipers, though.

[duckman2000]

Patch is up, but I won't have a chance to check it out until late, late night.

[fistfulofmetal]

what an awesome moment ruined by shitty gamey "story telling"

spoiler (click to show/hide)

nuke goes off suddenly. I wasn't expecting it so I was pretty surprised. Then I sit and watch a load screen with an explanation of what just happened. Pulled me out of the moment and made the entire scenario lame. gg, GG

[close]

[duckman2000]

I absolutely dread getting to that level.

try it on legendary, it truly is 

That will never happen. I honestly don't ever want to see that level ever again, but I want to complete the game again. That fucking level is so shitty and so out of place in an otherwise well designed game that it feels like Bungie accidentally left some internal gag level in the game. If the ending of KZ2 is worse even than that, then I will probably regret picking Veteran real quick.

[cool breeze]

I really can't tell a different after the patch.  Granted that the last time I played was 3 or 4 days ago, but it still isn't perfect.

[FatalT]

I can tell a huge difference after the patch. Granted, I played it before it was patched and then as soon as it was patched played it again so I had the before-patch controls fresh in my mind.

[cool breeze]

Playing some round of body count, I think might be more precise now.  I was getting headshots and generally able to tag an enemy even if they surprised me from the side much quicker/better now.  I haven't tried single player to tell if that changed.  Also, I just figured out that there is a crouch toggle in mutliplayer; that really helps a lot and they should patch that into single player.

[fistfulofmetal]

controls are better. not a huge difference but it's there

also: am I on the infamous "last part" of the game?

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Just entered some building and the bad dude in the game went invisible.

[close]

[cool breeze]

I just tried the Killzone 1 demo to remember what that game was like (i returned it a long time ago) and pretty much everything about KZ2 is way better except the lack of multiple characters.  Just playing the demo mission with Luger (stealthy), Templar (tactical shooter) and Rico (guns blazing) was a reminder of how different each level felt with each character.  It's also hilarious to see all the problems, like not being able to fucking jump over a small ledge, or the frame rate going to shit, or the many other problems the game has.  Still, if there is a KZ3, they should really go back to multiple characters with unique play styles. 

And surprisingly, the game isn't unplayable on the Dual Shock 3.  The Dual Shock 2 really was complete shit for shooters.

[dammitmattt]

controls are better. not a huge difference but it's there

also: am I on the infamous "last part" of the game?

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Just entered some building and the bad dude in the game went invisible.

[close]

Yep.  If you're playing on normal, then you're fine.  Normal seems to be easy enough that even the re-spawning enemies shouldn't be too much of a problem.  If you're playing on Veteran, good luck!  You've got some annoyance ahead of you.

[rubber feathers]

controls are better. not a huge difference but it's there

also: am I on the infamous "last part" of the game?

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Just entered some building and the bad dude in the game went invisible.

[close]

Are you fighting in the same room that he's in?  If so, yes.

Also, the patch definitely improved the controls, imo.  It still retains the "weightiness" of the old controls but you also don't feel like you trying to control a wet fish with your bare hands.

[fistfulofmetal]

Good, I am playing on normal because I want to actually finish the game.

The big push before this part was awesome. Best part of the game.

[duckman2000]

Playing some round of body count, I think might be more precise now.  I was getting headshots and generally able to tag an enemy even if they surprised me from the side much quicker/better now.  I haven't tried single player to tell if that changed.  Also, I just figured out that there is a crouch toggle in mutliplayer; that really helps a lot and they should patch that into single player.

I'm not noticing a whole lot of difference. If I was pressed to list differences, it would be that it seems to generally be easier to track enemies, and to make fine adjustments while using the holographic sight and ironsight. It doesn't feel compromised.

I just tried the Killzone 1 demo to remember what that game was like (i returned it a long time ago) and pretty much everything about KZ2 is way better except the lack of multiple characters.  Just playing the demo mission with Luger (stealthy), Templar (tactical shooter) and Rico (guns blazing) was a reminder of how different each level felt with each character.  It's also hilarious to see all the problems, like not being able to fucking jump over a small ledge, or the frame rate going to shit, or the many other problems the game has.  Still, if there is a KZ3, they should really go back to multiple characters with unique play styles. 

I was hoping that they would be able to actually meld all character types into one badass elite operative. You know, the stealth and silent kills of Luger the Shadow Marshal, the brute force of Rico and the general battle ability of Templar. Instead we got, well, Templar. It's a shame, especially since a few of the level sections seemed made for stealth and death from the shadows. Hence why I'm really hoping for expansions to this, at least a Shadow Marshal one. Those knife kills 

[duckman2000]

Cruiser The AA stuff was alright, although I think keeping it brief saved it. Mech segment was also good, but it did little more than make me wish for a new, dirty and brutal mech game.

Oh, and fistfulmetal, I agree with you about that scene.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

It's as if they put so much time into the actual explosion (which was hot) that they ran out of time and had to go with a text explanation.

[close]

[fistfulofmetal]

A terrible last boss battle followed by a terrible ending. God. Can that even be called an "ending"?

And the game is really really short. Total play time was 5 hours 35 minutes. What the fuck.

Game is better than the first but it's still just a sheep in wolfs clothing. All the gloss and shin put on top of a fairly decent shooter. Also better than R2 and COD:WaW.

[duckman2000]

As a shooter, it's overall fuck awesome, has some of the best skirmishes around, with weapons that feel great and enemies that offer up a real fight for their turf. And obviously the atmosphere helps a lot there. As a complete modern game, however, including things like writing and pacing, it's merely good (but then the medium isn't exactly flourishing with brilliant writing and character development). It's as if the company has matured to become one of the absolute top studios around when it comes to raw combat, but hasn't quite grasped the whole thing with storytelling, and the importance of likable characters. Which is honestly a bit odd, as I don't remember having much of a problem with any of the characters in Killzone, other than Rico. I even liked Luger, which I can't say about any of the characters in this game. The helghast have a hell of a lot more personality.

I think that, much like Halo 2 and 3, I'm going to be enjoying future playthroughs more, on account of being able to focus squarely on the combat without feeling like I might miss out on story by skipping the cutscenes. It's not even that the story is bad, it just feels poorly presented.


About game length, I don't understand how anyone can get through this game that fast. I'm at 8 hours, and I still have some ways to go.

[cool breeze]

I really don't care about the story in games like this, and as for the characters, their existence in the story exceeded my expectations.  It's not totally empty like CoD, it doesn't have a main character like Master Chief, and it doesn't have a squad like Gears; KZ2 just has these guys there doing their thing that you don't care about.  The best thing I can say is that with the exception of Natiko, none of the characters weren't bad to look at in cutscenes or gameplay.

And I finished it in roughly the same time as fistfulofmetal.  I only played it on normal and don't see myself ever trying something harder unless it comes out on PC.  I also don't think I will replay the entire game again, but some battles I will go back and play for sure.  I'm glad the mission select even lets you choose specific checkpoints.

[Purple Filth]

As a shooter, it's overall fuck awesome, has some of the best skirmishes around, with weapons that feel great and enemies that offer up a real fight for their turf. And obviously the atmosphere helps a lot there. As a complete modern game, however, including things like writing and pacing, it's merely good (but then the medium isn't exactly flourishing with brilliant writing and character development). It's as if the company has matured to become one of the absolute top studios around when it comes to raw combat, but hasn't quite grasped the whole thing with storytelling, and the importance of likable characters. Which is honestly a bit odd, as I don't remember having much of a problem with any of the characters in Killzone, other than Rico. I even liked Luger, which I can't say about any of the characters in this game. The helghast have a hell of a lot more personality.

I think that, much like Halo 2 and 3, I'm going to be enjoying future playthroughs more, on account of being able to focus squarely on the combat without feeling like I might miss out on story by skipping the cutscenes. It's not even that the story is bad, it just feels poorly presented.


About game length, I don't understand how anyone can get through this game that fast. I'm at 8 hours, and I still have some ways to go.

I think what makes it worse was that the backstory seemed so fleshed out and interesting but it was nowhere hinted in the game.

[duckman2000]

Well, you guys are missing out by playing on Normal. It's not really even about it being more difficult (as in a game like Resistance 2), it just makes the engagements more interesting. Although if reports are to be trusted, I'm about to regret the chosen difficulty setting. So far, so good.

As for characters, the times they have gotten on my nerves have been almost exclusively when the game has attempted to make them out to be very important characters that I should care about. As long as they are in the background, I don't care either way.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

But I felt more of a loss when Jackson and Co. were nuked in COD4 than I did when the guy that had fought alongside me through half of KZ2 got killed, which I think was a slight failure on Guerrilla's part.

[close]

I think what makes it worse was that the backstory seemed so fleshed out and interesting but it was nowhere hinted in the game.

It reeks of a corporate decision, to avoid potential conflict. It could also just be that they didn't feel up to the task of pursuing anything more profound than what was there and instead wanted to focus on getting the meat of the game right, which I think they have absolutely succeeded in. But then they should have completely dropped it, and not half-assed it like with those lame "emotional" scenes.

[cool breeze]

I don't even know who Jackson and Co. were in CoD4.  Only person I remember was the black guy who rapped at the end.
 

[duckman2000]

Well, you were. Until you died in the nuke blast. Nothing amazing, but it beats KZ2's closest equivalent.

[dammitmattt]

Well, you guys are missing out by playing on Normal. It's not really even about it being more difficult (as in a game like Resistance 2), it just makes the engagements more interesting. Although if reports are to be trusted, I'm about to regret the chosen difficulty setting. So far, so good.

As for characters, the times they have gotten on my nerves have been almost exclusively when the game has attempted to make them out to be very important characters that I should care about. As long as they are in the background, I don't care either way.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

But I felt more of a loss when Jackson and Co. were nuked in COD4 than I did when the guy that had fought alongside me through half of KZ2 got killed, which I think was a slight failure on Guerrilla's part.

[close]

Why in the hell couldn't I just use my magic healing gun during that part?  So stupid.

[duckman2000]

Urgh, so much for my positive k/d ratio. Rocket launchers + air support + uneven teams + skilled tacticians on the opposing team = massacre.

[duckman2000]

Jesus shitmonkey Christ, the GOD DAMNED rocket launcher STOP USING IT you fucks

Dog shit, only a few matches back this was a totally awesome game, lots of tactics and team efforts for the great win, and now it's just fucking rockets rocket rockets fuck

Oh good, now there are grenade launchers. Fuck this game up its fucking ass. I think I'm going to have to start creating my own games and lock some classes the hell out.