FitnessBore - 2018 edition

[Cormacaroni]

I was afraid of eggs for awhile, but after some research, it seems that the cholesterol isn't really an issue? I'm going to increase my egg consumption and dial back on bananas and soy milk. I've got to get used to drinking only water.

As far as the carb backloading goes, how often do you do it? I'm sure it's been answered in this thread more than once, but I wouldn't know where to begin looking.

Cholesterol levels don't really correlate to dietary cholesterol. Improve your diet and fitness and your cholesterol levels will improve also. Carb backloading is done after lifting weights in the evening unless you are Smooth Groove when it is performed after waking and throughout the rest of the day

Carb backloading leverages hormonal changes throughout the course of the day (which Carb Nite does not). So the timing is important. You want to be burning fat in the a.m. when cortisol is high and building muscle in the evening after working out and slamming some carbs to spike insulin.

[Groogrux]

Nobody asked you your opinion on why your body has become gross, inefficient, and weak. If you knew what you were doing, you wouldn't be in this mess. This is me:

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Now look at yourself in the mirror. Stop crying. Now read this entire thread and implement the suggested diet and exercise changes or LEAVE. I ONCE WAS LOST BUT NOW AM FOUND. CORMAC DIED FOR YOUR SINS. LONG LIVE CORMAC.

you're kind of an asshole.

 

You just have to understand the ridicule we go through in this thread while trying to please Cormac  Father  Fit Jesus.

[Cormacaroni]

c'mon now, The Biz arrived fully-formed, all I did was at most supply some new ammo

[Cormacaroni]

Here's the bit from Chris Kresser recommending whey protein for general health, specifically glutathione.

The TL; DR takeaway is that whey protein is the cheapest, most convenient way of maintaining gluathione, which is key to a healthy auto-immune system. (Kiefer would probably add that whey is also the best researched method as well)

http://chriskresser.com/adrenal-fatigue-glutathione-status-and-rheumatoid-arthritis

Chris Kresser:  Yeah.  Glutathione is extremely important.  It’s the master antioxidant in the body, and a lot of studies show that glutathione depletion is associated with everything from autoimmune disease to cardiovascular disease.  I actually talk about that in the High Cholesterol Action Plan a little bit.  One of the main functions of glutathione is to promote healthy T regulatory cell function, and the T regulatory cells’ job is to, as the name would suggest, regulate and balance the immune system.  So if you don’t have enough T regulatory cells or they’re not functioning properly, then the immune system is gonna go out of whack, and of course, that’s happens in autoimmune disease.  And there aren’t too many diseases that don’t have some immunological basis, so glutathione is extremely important.  And then we have studies that show that people who have autoimmune disease and cardiovascular disease often have low levels of glutathione.

So we want to do what we can to keep our glutathione levels up, and the best way to do that if you’re not ill and you don’t have glutathione depletion already is just eat a healthy diet.  Glutathione precursors are present in a lot of nutrient-dense foods.  Particularly, though, raw dairy has a lot of glutathione precursors in it and raw meats.  Now I’m not necessarily recommending that people consume raw meat because there are some risks associated with that, but what I’m trying to point out is that pasteurization and cooking of meat and dairy dramatically reduces the glutathione content of those foods.  Sulfur-rich vegetables, like onions, those also are good glutathione precursors in the diet.  But probably the best glutathione precursor that’s accessible to people is the biologically active whey protein, like non-denatured, grass-fed whey protein made from raw milk.  That’s the best way to naturally boost glutathione levels using a kind of a food-based thing.  I mean, it’s a supplement, but it’s derived from a food.

[MyNameIsMethodis]

brand new beer doesnt instincitely make you gain weight unless you're drinking it EVERY night. the way it works is that alcohol is the bodys preferred fuel to burn, so while you're drinking alcohol you won't be burning fat; you'll just be burning alcohol. the reason youre gaining weight , and if you're really only having like 1 or 3 a week is because you ate fukkin potatoes and bread.

ps im ready to be proven wrong

[TakingBackSunday]

I was drinking too heavily, let's just leave it at that.

[FlameofCallandorReturns]

Is deadlifting in the squat rack a thing now? Some dude got all pissy at me when I asked him if he was doing squat (cause I wanted to ask if I could work in with him.)

I hate university gyms.

[BlueTsunami]

Is deadlifting in the squat rack a thing now? Some dude got all pissy at me when I asked him if he was doing squat (cause I wanted to ask if I could work in with him.)

I hate university gyms.

I deadlift in front of the squatrack since its easier to load and unload weights as needed on the rack. But its me and my father so weights are constantly being switched around between sets. If I was by myself id load the bar on the floor.

[MyNameIsMethodis]

god much respect to you carb nite guys. even doing less than 50g of carbs a day for the past year , going down to 30 or below is fucking torture.  :'( :'(

[Smooth Groove]

Nobody asked you your opinion on why your body has become gross, inefficient, and weak. If you knew what you were doing, you wouldn't be in this mess. This is me:

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Now look at yourself in the mirror. Stop crying. Now read this entire thread and implement the suggested diet and exercise changes or LEAVE. I ONCE WAS LOST BUT NOW AM FOUND. CORMAC DIED FOR YOUR SINS. LONG LIVE CORMAC.

You still haven't found your legs

:kylielaff

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JK  your glorious abs blinded me like the sun, no homo 

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[Smooth Groove]

Is deadlifting in the squat rack a thing now? Some dude got all pissy at me when I asked him if he was doing squat (cause I wanted to ask if I could work in with him.)

I hate university gyms.

is there any other place to do it at that gym?

most gym members find it even more annoying when someone takes the bar from an upper-body station and use it for deadlifts

[Cormacaroni]

Don't really see the big deal about DLs in the squat rack. If you are using the bar, no-one can squat there anyway. If you Dl in the squat rack, you at least aren't taking up floorspace. Then again, the only gym I ever go to is dead, and has two squat cages so it's never been an issue...I could probably DL in the lobby

[BlueTsunami]

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Are you fucking serious. I'm not worthy.

You've probably posted it already Biz but what the fuck is your average meal plan? I'm pretty sure if I eat just like you I'll morph into you (not serious)

[Cormacaroni]

you do not follow on tumblr? ffs blue

http://richardsdiet.tumblr.com/

[Cormacaroni]

I should post a pic of what is considered a typical ice cream serving in Japan for comparison It's maybe 150-200ml?

[Smooth Groove]

I'm trying to cut for two weeks.  Today I balled for about 45 mins and had a protein shake then I lifted for another 45.

Right after, I had a burger and fries for about 2500 calories.  I was planning to make it my only meal of the day but now I'm hungry again.  Should I just sleep through it or get some no-carb meal?

[Cormacaroni]

you'll only wake up starving, with your metabolism. Then you'll pig out tomorrow. Ice cream works well as a pre-bedtime snack on a backload for me, give that a shot.

[Cormacaroni]

My other go-to late night snack is some banana with greek yoghurt and cinnamon. It's not for everybody though

[Smooth Groove]

Ok, I'll eat something then but is more carbs a good idea?  I already ate two buns and a ton of cheese and fries

[Cormacaroni]

well, that's what Kiefer recommends...sure doesn't seem to hurt him or me. Then again you are trying to cut fast so you have to get hungry at some point. CBL isn't really designed for that...I think you'd have to run it for a month or so before really seeing a lot of fat loss, and like I said to Blue, the amount you backload is what tips CBL towards either mass gain or fat loss. If you do it consistently and are moderate with portions, you can do both at the same time (not really, but it FEELS like it) but it won't be dramatic like CNS can be.

I'd recommend CNS but it's supposedly really tough to do with the amount of glycolytic stuff you like to do...no carbs for 6 days out of the week combined with hoops would have you feeling like utter shit I bet. 

[Smooth Groove]

Ok thanks

Also I'm trying to cut down on activity for the next two weeks so I'll eat less.  Guess I'll just cut on carbs more gradually.

[Cormacaroni]

how is the Dunk Quest coming by the way

[Smooth Groove]

ha ha, that's stalling a bit because I've gained so much weight.   I get about 2 inches above rim, which is not bad for my current weight of 205lbs but obviously not close to dunking.

My goal right now is to increase my strength significantly before I train for explosiveness again.  I also plan to back to 180 when I've hit my strength goals.


I've become good friends with this dude who used to play for Argentina's junior team.  He could have at least been a pro in Europe if he hadn't broke both ankles by age 22.   He said he could help me work on my hops when I'm ready.

His buddy could barely touch rim coming out of high school, but this is him now without having grown any taller,

[Cormacaroni]

you just need a very small ball!

[Cormacaroni]

pretty damn sure this came up before and i probably posted this same exact thing but just in case

[Cormacaroni]

what is this talk of 'breakfast'

[Boogie]

Cormac, you may have gotten me off of cereal in the morning.

You may even have gotten me to stop drinking orange juice in the morning.

But you can take my morning eggs when you pry them from my cold, dead fingers.   

[MyNameIsMethodis]

I'm actually confused; nothing in Carb Nite book siad anything about fasting except for the actual Carb Nite itself. Has this changed to be so that every day is now a fast day?

[Groogrux]

Kiefer posted a while back that he recommended EVERYONE, whether they're on CBL or CNS to not consume carbs in the morning.  That doesn't mean you have to fast necessarily, just don't have carb laden foods until later in the evening.

And honestly, if you were going to eat something in the morning, bacon and eggs would be an excellent choice.  An egg only has .4g carbs in it and bacon has none.

[BlueTsunami]

I just eat eggs in the morning during the week but I've moved my breakfast consumption two hours after I've woken up. You get hunger pangs for the two hours after you've woken up but you ravish the food you've set aside.

[Mupepe]

carb nite solution

[Mr. Gundam]

Getting back on the running wagon after holiday inactivity. Up to six miles, should be great by the time the 1/2 marathon rolls around in June. This will be my fourth year doing it, but I still don't think I could handle a full marathon.

[Mr. Gundam]

Unless you have some specific health problem that I don't know about, you could definitely run a full marathon. It's just a massive, massive timesink to train for one.

No health problems. I just can't imagine doing another 13.1 miles. Plus, like you said, training for it would be insane.

[Dickie Dee]

If you can run a 1/2 marathon, running a full is no problem - but dear god the time it takes to train so offputting. Such drudgery.

[ToxicAdam]

I'm running a half marathon in May as a big fuck you to all dedicated runners.

Isn't all this anger actually towards the father that never loved you?

[Mr. Gundam]

I'm running a half marathon in May as a big fuck you to all dedicated runners.

Cool.

[Groogrux]

Kiefer posted a while back that he recommended EVERYONE, whether they're on CBL or CNS to not consume carbs in the morning.  That doesn't mean you have to fast necessarily, just don't have carb laden foods until later in the evening.

And honestly, if you were going to eat something in the morning, bacon and eggs would be an excellent choice.  An egg only has .4g carbs in it and bacon has none.

Everyone who wants to lose weight or everyone?

EVERYONE   

[Groogrux]

I can't tell if you're being serious because of the laugh gif. If you are, that doesn't make any sense to me, and I'd like to read about it.

http://www.dangerouslyhardcore.com/3249/7-tips-for-fast-weight-loss-in-the-new-year/

1. Only eat carbs at night. I don’t care what lifestyle you’re looking to maintain, but if you resistance train, and especially if you’re doing Carb Nite or Carb Back-Loading, you should only be eating carbohydrates at night. The less active you are, the fewer carbs you should eat, and the closer to bedtime you should eat them. Researchers publish papers every day supporting this conclusion. This statement has been tested over and over again, and guess what? It works, period. This, by far, is the most powerful rule you can use to achieve your perfect body and maintain it forever.

[MyNameIsMethodis]

I don't know, for most normal people thats impossible and it just stinks of the Mark Sisson syndrome of "We live in beach houses and have no jobs, so we have acess to food at any time"

[Cormacaroni]

well, most normal people don't have the perfect body and keep it forever, do they

what's your point

[Cormacaroni]

Before the breakfast thing gets out of hand, Kiefer recommends you never go without food for more than 12 hours, since catabolysis is anathema to him. But he is also recommending eating a lot late at night too! So think about it. You're just not going to be as hungry at 7 a.m. as you would be normally. Also, he doesn't forbid EATING, just eating carbs. And even on waking, he is recommending some fat intake and protein in the form of a shake + coffee and coconut oil or some other combo of those. So 'breakfast' is just pushed back a few hours, and is mostly protein and fat. For me, this was basically unchanged from my typical 'Paleo' eating habits except I had my bacon, eggs and veggies closer to noon than to 8am.

[MyNameIsMethodis]

i dont actually know what my point is i just posted without thinking like i usually do

[Groogrux]

Don't confuse this with Paleo.  This is more science than evolution.  He's recommending it to help keep from putting fat on as well. 

I can't speak for CBL, but he clearly states that this is not a long-term diet.  This is something that's meant to be used up to a few months at a time before returning to a "normal" diet.

[Smooth Groove]

Antler spray is surprisingly cheap, http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=antler+spray

Livestrong and prosper, my friends

[Smooth Groove]

Even old farts can do a full marathon with proper training so call me unimpressed.  But how many of you can go full-speed for 1 hr without busting a nut?  That's true endurance. 

[Mr. Gundam]

My wife is a workout fiend. She's at the gym 6 days a week.

When I'm done I'm going to deadlift twice my bodyweight and then key all the cars with 13.1 stickers in the parking lot.

I can support this.

[Smooth Groove]

My wife is a workout fiend. She's at the gym 6 days a week.

you're that bad?

sincere condolences

[Cormacaroni]

The Kiefer post still confuses me because it's on a page with tips for losing weight. I am not interested in losing weight, just running the most efficient (extremely active) machine. If he's saying fat sedentary people should eat no carbs, and if they do only at night, that's fine, I hope it works for them. But for the rest of us, I don't understand why humans would evolve to only eat carbs at certain times of the day.

Cause they didn't have fridges! Or mills to make flour! Or plastic bags to put stuff in! Or any of the other convenient stores of carbs we have now. They ate after a day of hunting and gathering, typically, not from stores of food. And they ate mostly meat.

But the exact reasons or causes are of course irrelevant. The factors that CBL leverages are hormonal - cortisol is released in substantial amounts in the morning (which makes sense - a stress hormone to wake us up and start mobilizing fat stores for energy). So this is when we are naturally best at burning fat. If you take in carbs at this time though, you stop this process dead and a whole cascade of negative effects start.

You also have to remember that Kiefer is pretty hardcore about body fat. He's trying to maintain 6% BF with over 220lbs year-round. So he always wants to be using fat for fuel except during those times of the day when he is targeting muscle growth (post workout, at night). That's not to say that it is impossible to be jacked and ripped via any other protocol; of course it is. He just makes a compelling case that CBL is easiest and most efficient way to get there (or close to it) yet discovered.

[Cormacaroni]

Conventional Wisdom takes some overturning - check your PMs!

[Cormacaroni]

also best tag ever

[Groogrux]

Just noticed the tag.  That's good stuff!

(Cormac, thanks for saving my ass when I talked myself into a corner again.)

[Cormacaroni]

no doubt about it though, Kiefer asks for two big buy-ins - believing carbs are useful, even essential and removing breakfast, which just about everybody holds sacred. But it is also self-evident to me that you don't get radical results without trying some radical approaches.

It is also worth pointing out that while the IF crowd are with Kiefer on eating in the evening, most of the Paleo crowd are still big fans of 3 squares. Then again, there are a lot of fat Paleo people. I saw a pic of a big Paleo dinner on Robb Wolf's site and he basically the only person there who had good body comp...everyone else looked either pudgy (for the most part) or had no muscle. This is hard to explain using only Paleo orthodoxy, right?

[cool breeze]

Browsing the last couple pages, watching the videos and whatnot, the gist of this theory is like (and I might be completely off here. Apologies if this is all ignorant.):

Carb nite is to lose weight (and maintain strength?).  Low carb 6 days a week; on day 7 eat high carb towards the end of the day.  Repeat.
Carb back-load is for strength and leaning out if you're already in shape.  Day before workout eat high card towards the end of the day.  Otherwise, keep a low carb diet.

The 'eating high carb food' part isn't just a single meal, but stretched throughout the evening.  A bit confused about what foods are better, and the volume you're supposed to eat.  Sugary foods (candies, certain fruits), certain vegetables, desert foods (like brownies, ice cream...vague category), or pasta, rice and breads? do you just go mad on it and gorge, or do you have a slice of pizza or two bananas or something?

[Cormacaroni]

you're not asking anything that hasn't already been covered ad infinitum, or isn't covered on Kiefer's site. There is a limit to how many times I will type this stuff out so go read. One immediate misconception you have is that the backload in CBL comes AFTER the workout except when it has been 2-3 days or so since your last workout.

[cool breeze]

that's all I was hoping for.  knowing whether or not what I've read in this thread is close to correct or way off.  the two questions at the end were because I couldn't find a concrete answer.  closest would be about low fat foods on carb nite/back-load, where it's briefly mentioned that you need enough carbohydrates to be effective.   anyway, thanks for that last bit.  happy to be the proverbial straw. 

and the before/after cbl comes from that one video where the gentleman mentions that carbs are for the next days workout.  I realize he said that's if you work out in the morning, but he adds that he'll eat carbs later that day for the following day's morning workout.  now, I did a quick search and the dude said both work.

[Cormacaroni]

just 'cause it's quicker to type again than search the last few pages - volume of food is what tips CBL into either fat loss or mass gain. I KNOW I said this to awesome-o yesterday There is a sweet spot where you can do both. I can't find it for you.

And Kiefer is advocating a bodybuilding split type of routine, around 5 workouts per week, 2hrs per session. Most people won't need to backload before their workout. I can have a good workout 3 days after the last backload no problem. Just try the base protocol wherein you backload after the workout for a while and see how you do. If your workouts are bad, you may try doing a backload the night before. Again, there is a sweet spot, only you can determine where it lies.

If you ask a specific question I am happy to answer it, but I can't summarize two books in a single post.

[MyNameIsMethodis]

My only problem with the book of atleast CNS is he never gives you macros to aim for except for the carb count. This cues like thirty threads on DangerouslyHardcore arguing about if its a 1:1 ratio fat to protein or 1:5 or so and so. 

[Groogrux]

I meant to ask you, Cormac, and everyone else, if you're chewing nicotine gum yet?  I listened to Kiefer talk about it, and it makes sense, but it's just too far for me.

[Boogie]

Nicotine gum?  Tha fuck?

[Groogrux]

http://www.dangerouslyhardcore.com/2521/can-nicotine-safely-burn-fat-and-build-muscle-the-surprising-facts/#more-2521

The science is there.  Like I said, it's just too far for me.