US Politics Thread |OT| THE DARKEST TIMELINE

[brob]

Elevator pitch: West by North West, a panel show where Cornel West, Ollie North, and Allen West discuss issues of the day.

using north west's name yet pretending she doesn't exist smh #AllMalePanel

[Madrun Badrun]

He means Cornel West. 

Ah

[Phoenix Dark]

West's whole schtick on Obama feels like it's been an extended riff of the Jesse Jackson "cut his nuts off" comment, a member of the old guard feeling that Obama hasn't paid his dues and isn't really authentic.

As a honkey I generally avoid commenting on internal conflicts in other communities, but West really seemed to cross the line in how personal he got, and most of his political analysis seemed directly lifted from a #slatepitch about how Obama could've gotten a British style National Health System if only he really tried.

Honestly I don't think West and Jackson were on the same side of that disconnect. West was an early Obama supporter, an intellectual, and a far leftist. I don't think of him as a member of the "black establishment" that Sharpton, Jackson, and other civil rights relics have been a part of over the decades. You can see why Obama appealed to leftists and intellectuals - he's basically from that world. In fact he has more connection to it than the Civil Rights era. When Obama first ran for office in Illinois he was attacked for being a black elitist who didn't understand actual black people; Bobby Rush beat him in an election by making those arguments.

Basically Jackson is from that Bobby Rush cloth IMO, whereas West isn't. I think West is just a delusional leftist who is mad Obama didn't invite him to the White House enough. West isn't nearly as respected as he once was as an intellectual, and part of it has to do with him basically becoming a shitty pundit prone to hyperbole and ugly racial comments about Obama's family.

[Human Snorenado]

Clinton hasn't appealed to me at all. Voting the "lesser evil" means voting against what I believe just for the sake of the hope that the country doesn't get screwed even harder than it already is.

(To be fair, I'm waffling between not voting for once since I turned 18 or voting third party. And I've voted in mid-terms. The country in the state it is simply has made me lose faith in the democratic process of being able to have the country "move forward" instead of being totally gridlocked with no means of actually getting things done.)

Let me see if I can explain it this way:

Every year in Happy Gumdrop Fairy-Tale Land all of the sprites and elves and woodland creatures gather together to pick the Rainbow Sunshine Queen. Everyone is there: the Lollipop Guild, the Star-Twinkle Toddlers, the Sparkly Unicorns, the Cookie Baking Apple-cheeked Grandmothers, the Fluffy Bunny Bund, the Rumbly-Tumbly Pupperoos, the Snowflake Princesses, the Baby Duckies All-In-A-Row, the Laughing Babies, and the Dykes on Bikes. They have a big picnic with cupcakes and gumdrops and pudding pops, stopping only to cast their votes by throwing Magic Wishing Rocks into the Well of Laughter, Comity, and Good Intentions. Afterward they spend the rest of the night dancing and singing and waving glow sticks until dawn when they tumble sleepy-eyed into beds made of the purest and whitest goose down where they dream of angels and clouds of spun sugar.

You don’t live there.

Grow the fuck up.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

...shamelessly stolen

https://shadowproof.com/2008/02/25/your-mumia-sweatshirt-wont-get-you-into-heaven-anymore/

[close]

[benjipwns]

Whatever happened to 'ol Mumia after he got off death row?

The only thing after 2013 on his Wiki entry:

In April 10, 2015 Marylin Zuniga, a teacher at Forest Street Elementary School in Orange, New Jersey, was suspended without pay after asking her students to write letters to Abu-Jamal, who fell ill in prison due to complications from diabetes, without approval from the school or parents. Some parents and police leaders denounced her actions.[131] On the other hand, community members, parents, teachers, and professors expressed their support and condemned Zuniga’s suspension.[132] Scholars and educators nationwide including Noam Chomsky, Chris Hedges and Cornel West among others signed a letter calling for her immediate reinstatement.[133] On May 13, 2015 The Orange Preparatory Academy board voted to dismiss Marylin Zuniga after hearing from her and several of her supporters.

In a phone interview on Wednesday, Zuniga's attorney, Alan Levine, said that by firing her, school officials "abdicated their responsibility to the community and to the children of the school district."

"They lost a teacher that everybody agreed was a remarkable teacher," Levine said. "There isn't a school district around that wouldn't be happy to have Marylin Zuniga teach in it."

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1ktO2D3Vu0dbrJS9jfLH9bH5zIU4ppH74tGTxMn9vrzU/viewform

As educators, we understand that this is a multilayered and complex situation.  The introduction of a figure as polarizing as Abu-Jamal is pedagogically complicated-- challenging for any educator, but especially for a first-year teacher.  Within a social justice framework, the goal would be to present multiple perspectives and allow students to come to their own conclusions.  What was exemplary with these letters was that students were empowered to take action out of compassion and empathy for a fellow human being.  What more experience might have brought to this teachable moment would be the introduction of a fuller contextualization around Abu-Jamal’s case so that students’ could come to their own conclusions- conclusions that might very well have resulted in these same get well cards. 

Ms. Zuniga demonstrated a multitude of positive strategies that many first-year teachers struggle with: she engaged students in real world issues and developed their academic skills on a project connected to their own authentic interest (Picower, 2012), with the single missing advantage of experience.  Teachers, however, cannot gain experience without time in the classroom, and certainly removing her as a punishment for a skillset that is still in development is not the correct solution.  Given the documented strengths she has already demonstrated during her short time in the classroom, coupled with the lessons she is learning from this situation, she has the opportunity, with your support, to develop into a master teacher serving the community of Orange Public Schools. 

The issue at hand appears to be connected to the fact that the students’ letters showed sympathy toward Abu-Jamal.  As social justice education recognizes, all teaching is political (Freire, 1993; Kincheloe, 2005; Macedo, 2000).  The question that lurks in this situation is whether teachers who have taught one perspective of other controversial figures such as Christopher Columbus or Andrew Jackson (Loewen, 2008; Zinn, 2003) faced the same level of scrutiny as Ms. Zuniga.  Is this a precedent that your school board is truly interested in setting?

Code: [Select]

Marc Lamont Hill           Distinguished Professor of African American Studies Morehouse CollegePROFESSOR MARC LAMONT HILL

[benjipwns]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/mar/29/donald-trump-scott-walker-wisconsin-taxes-cruz-endorsement

Donald Trump attacked Wisconsin governor Scott Walker for failing to raise taxes in order to properly fund schools and roads on Tuesday, in a startling new break from rightwing orthodoxy from the Republican frontrunner.

The comments came after Walker endorsed Trump’s rival, Texas senator, Ted Cruz, in the GOP race.

Walker became a conservative hero for his efforts to crush public sector unions and cut government spending in the Democratic-leaning state in Wisconsin, something that led to an attempted recall of the Wisconsin governor in 2012 and became a national cause célèbre. But, in a radio interview with talkshow host Michael Koolidge on Tuesday, Trump bashed Walker’s administration.

“There’s a $2.2bn deficit and the schools were going begging and everything was going begging because he didn’t want to raise taxes ’cause he was going to run for president,” said Trump. “So instead of raising taxes, he cut back on schools, he cut back on highways, he cut back on a lot of things.”

Trump also added of the Badger State in general: “Wisconsin has a lot of problems, plus there is tremendous hatred … I wouldn’t exactly say that things are running smoothly.”

http://myfox8.com/2016/03/29/attorney-general-roy-cooper-speaks-out-on-hb2/

Attorney General Roy Cooper, who is challenging Gov. Pat McCrory for governor, spoke out against House Bill 2 Tuesday morning during a press conference.

Cooper said his office, "will not defend the constitutionality of the discrimination in House Bill 2."

McCrory signed the bill, called the Public Facilities Privacy & Security Act, last Wednesday after it was passed by the North Carolina Senate.

The law was in response to Charlotte's nondiscrimination ordinance that allowed transgender individuals to use public bathrooms of the sex with which they identify.

Cooper said HB2 is at odds with specific employment policies that are in place to protect workers based on gender identity.

"We will argue it is unconstitutional as part of our defense of existing employment policies in the Attorney General's and State Treasurer's Office," Cooper said.

Senate Leader Phil Berger (R-Rockingham) responded to the attorney general's announcement Tuesday, calling for Cooper's resignation.

Berger said Cooper's unwillingness to stand behind the law put children in North Carolina at risk.

"Roy Cooper’s refusal to defend the law makes clear he wants the ACLU to win by default in federal court what they can’t win at the ballot box and allow men to walk into locker rooms at YMCAs across our country and undress in front of young girls," Berger said

[benjipwns]

Young girls shouldn't be at the Young Men's Christian Association anyway. That's what the YWCA is for.

 

[brawndolicious]

I love the "I'm not gonna vote for Bernie because he'll never get his ideas through congress" people... As if the republican-controlled congress is gonna play nice with Hillary

In the primary or the general? I like that he forces Hillary not to be too safe and centrist but looking at the last 8 years of Obama, we've already been down this path of a moderate candidate having to fight Republicans for every stupid little thing. A lot of good changes happened in those 8 years though and in the process, the GOP just made themselves more and more irrelevant in the public eye. It's like we know this worked once basically.

[benjipwns]

[Steve Contra]

So I hate to break it to you my fellow Snake People, but a vote for Bernie Sanders is a selfish act

Fine with me. 

If I have to vote between Clinton or Trump: I'm voting third party/Sanders write in. I trust neither of those motherfuckers with the country and "but Clinton supports most of Sanders policies" is bullshit. Yeah, because she'll cut tuition and not screw over my generation. She'll just tell Universities to "cut it out!" just like she told Wall Street. How did that work out?

If she finally says something that is worth listening to and actually will follow through with it (which to be honest: I doubt she ever will, especially if the Congress is mixed) I'd consider it despite my dislike of her and her history. But there's no way that's ever happening.

Protest vote 

Never change white people, never change

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Actually please do you're fucking embarrassing

[close]

[Mr. Gundam]

"Don't blame me. I voted for Kodos."

[Phoenix Dark]

Let me defend my white brethren for a second.

Remember when Militant ModsHelp (and some other BLM types) were arguing black people shouldn't vote for Hillary if she's the nominee out of protest? 

[Mr. Gundam]

This white guy is voting for the Democrat. I don't care if it's the old white guy or the white woman.

[VomKriege]

W had better moves.

[CatsCatsCats]

Barf

[Madrun Badrun]

She's with a lesbian and a black dude and she's dressed the most flamboyant   

[TakingBackSunday]

While that is hilariously bad, I cannot wait to see Trump try to truffle shuffle or some shit

[Tasty]

Trump campaign manager Lewandowski charged with battery

[Tasty]

LOL Trump's standing by this piece of shit. Should be good for some popcorn.

[CatsCatsCats]

No, it shouldn't, stop feeding the beast

[Madrun Badrun]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/03/29/donald-trumps-campaign-managers-lied-theres-now-clear-video-proof/?wprss=rss_the-fix&tid=sm_tw_pp

This is the assault?

[Mandark]

She only ever said she was grabbed and jerked back by the guy.  Really think she wouldn't have filed charges if they hadn't decided to go on a weird campaign of publicly gaslighting her.  Even doubly weirder cause it's right on camera, on property owned by Trump.

[Madrun Badrun]

“Someone had grabbed me tightly by the arm and yanked me down,” she wrote. “I almost fell to the ground, but was able to maintain my balance. Nonetheless, I was shaken.”



Ya I don't see it.  I'd call her a liar too.

[Mandark]

Ya I don't see it.  I'd call her a liar too.

First, I wouldn't be surprised if she was in heels and did have to maintain her balance.

Second, they didn't say "oh she's exaggerating," they said nobody ever touched her and that Lewandowski had never even seen her in his life.  Just complete bullshitting, and publicly trying to ruin her reputation in the process.

[Madrun Badrun]

He hardly looks at her in the video. I think its more likely that he didn't know who she was or didn't think anything of the event probably because it looks like a non event.  How many crowds does he move through or try to get Trump through in a day?  Not saying that's the case but it seems pretty reasonable.  More so than defending her outrage of this incident because she might have been in heels, obviously putting her in the terrifying position where she might fall down while pushing her way to a crowded presidential nominee. 

She's the one that publicly called him out on it first.

[Mandark]

How many crowds does he move through or try to get Trump through in a day?

You realize he's the campaign manager, not Secret Service?  So if he's actually putting his hands on other people so frequently that it all blurs together, that's a problem.

You're twisting yourself into a pretzel to defend a dude who's been caught out blatantly, repeatedly lying about putting his hands on a woman.  Don't dig your heels in man, nobody needs to be going full Shinobi on this.

[curly]

Why are you guys talking about the election outcome as if you or username has some say in it?

But throw your vote away on Hillary if you want, President Trump will be gentle to those who repent.

It's very important that we delude ourselves into thinking voting is more than an act of self-identification for some reason I'm not really sure of.

[benjipwns]

She's just another butthurt Rand Paul supporter trying to make Trump and America look bad.

[Tasty]

No, it shouldn't, stop feeding the beast

But the popcorn is so delicious.

[Mandark]

She's just another butthurt Rand Paul supporter trying to make Trump and America look bad.

Clearly false, Rand Paul supporters are a myth.

[Madrun Badrun]

You realize he's the campaign manager, not Secret Service?

So?  If he had actually done some something to her note worthy then maybe this would be an important distinction.  Do you think she would have felt shaken had this happened on the subway?

You're twisting yourself into a pretzel to defend a dude who's been caught out blatantly, repeatedly lying about putting his hands on a woman. 

Ya I could say the same to you about defending a women who seems to have lied about getting assaulted.

Women or not, and campaign manager or not, he doesn't look to have done anything particularly outrageous in the videos.  The fact that he lied doesn't bother me when I don't feel like the event he lied about is meaningful in anyway.  Its like if he told the world his favorite colour is blue and it comes out later its actually red; it's not news worthy. 

[benjipwns]

Why is no one talking about how the media has driven this into hysteria. Do you think any Secret Service person would allow someone to jump to someone who has been so demonized by the press that protesters are actively trying to jump him at his podium. This is such low hanging fruit but once again the hysterics of the press make it sound worse than it is actually was. She was obviously narcissistic in her belief that she was allowed to approach someone who is threatened daily. Once she was brought to reality her fragile ego was shattered and she was deservedly humiliated. Her story changes weekly and its apparent that she lied but those who rabidly oppose Trump are blindly using any excuse to target him and his supporters. To be clear I don't support Trump but it's appalling that these minor things are acted on as though it was a terrorist attack. It's disgusting.

Where were all these critics and judges and accusers including Hillary and Bernie when the Baltimore Police were being battered by thugs and criminals. Anyone looking to find out who these batterers were? On the video, it looks to me like Fields got very close to DT; maybe to ask questions, I don't know and you don't either. Who knows really? There is no audio. It looks also like some one took her arm to stop her; possibly to keep her from being too close to DT as he was walking away from her? When touched, She did not seem to jolt, nor fall down or even stop completely or to glance at who was touch her. This just all seems so bogus to me. I don't even like DT or his politics or tactics or silly, redundant slogans. I believe DT will be beaten but not because of trumped up events like this. So many good reporters put themselves in dangerous, life threatening situations all the time. I think Fields should avoid Chicago, Baltimore, the middle east, Cuba and Belgium. I think she should avoid all dangerous arenas including the political one.

I don't know and you don't either. Who knows really?

[Mandark]

Wait, Dandy.  Do you go around in public places grabbing people from behind to pull them backwards?

Trying to figure out why you care so much about establishing this as totally acceptable behavior.

[benjipwns]

Wait, Dandy.  Do you go around grabbing people from behind to pull them backwards?

[Madrun Badrun]

How can you describe this as pulling them backwards from behind?



Going back to it, I don't care about the guy; maybe he lied maybe he didn't (again my post about his maybe his not remembering her was mostly to point out your pretzel defense of her being in heels).  Maybe he is a decent guy maybe he isn't.  I don't care.  What I do care about is that I don't see an assault on those videos.  I see something mildly out of the norm of public interaction in a crowded area, less so when it involves a celebrity.  Not something to try to get media hype around and certainly nothing to get the police involved over.  I rolled my eyes over her claims.  Now what worries me is, that had I not seen the video, I would have assumed he did assault her.

Not sure why you're trying to be disrespectful.  Not agreeing with the great political mind of Mandark doesn't automatically make someone a Shinobi.

[Tasty]

Back, and to the left.

Back... and to the left.

[Phoenix Dark]

Brehs, he put his hands on her. And this isn't the first time he's put his hands on someone. And Trump is defending him. I don't really care whether she fell down or not, whether she kept her balance or whatever. Brehs. Trump is rolling with savages and doesn't give a fuck.

[Human Snorenado]

It's ok, Arvie is clearly an expert on US battery laws, so if he didn't see any assault (which is not battery) then just let it go, guys

[Madrun Badrun]

Or maybe, knowing I'm not a legal expert in anything but bird law, I used a word in a common vernacular which also happens to have a precises legal meaning. 

[benjipwns]

What's on the missing frame between her moving back and hitting Terris?!?!?!?

It's missing in the video too.

[I'm a Puppy!]

To be fair, when it comes to pulling women backwards forcibly from a moving crowd Arvie is a bit of an expert

[benjipwns]

I totally forgot she was the one who was in the INTRINSICALLY PATERNALISTIC MATT DAMON video:

spoiler (click to show/hide)

SpaceManAus1 week ago
I hope Matt Damon runs for president one day we need honest people like him in Government, we need to get hold of the people who undermined the Common Law and owe constitutions and and trial them for treason and bring back the laws into alignment with the common law like it was meant to be, any law that breaches the common law is invalid and that is why it has all fallen apart, they say owe societies and not influenced be region but the common law comes from the King James Bible and proves that owe societies are based on christian values so allowing people to come into your countries without the promise to uphold owe values is nothing more then a takeover of the NWO, or UN same thing.

[close]

[chronovore]

https://variety.com/2016/tv/news/anderson-cooper-donald-trump-5-year-old-1201741634/

The argument in question was "He started it."

In fairness to Trump, this argument is widely considered valid through high school, not just 5-year-olds.

[benjipwns]

haha, cooper knows how to troll trump

SwampyTV2 hours ago
Anderson Cooper is a cia crook

MrQbenDanny1 hour ago
Anderson Cooper,
You ugly lab mouse, ask Lying Rafael the same questions about wife gate, yeah, the Canadian Cuban started it and TRUMP ends it.

[Brehvolution]

Who knew all it took was a tug on the arm to bring a rag like breitbart down?

BRB, going to trip Murdoch.

[Joe Molotov]

TRUMP ends it! (by RTing nasty tweets)

[Tasty]

http://mediamatters.org/blog/2016/03/29/washington-post-corrects-faulty-report-that-nea/209615

The Washington Post issued a correction to both their initial story on March 29, explaining that they incorrectly reported "that 147 FBI agents had been detailed to the investigation" and that multiple U.S. law enforcement officials "have since told The Washington Post that figure is too high" and the actual number of "FBI personnel involved in the case is fewer than 50"

😑

Can't wait to hear that 147 number repeated ad nauseum for the rest of the election.

The media continues to scandalize Hillary Clinton during the FBI's probe, even though legal experts have repeatedly explained that Clinton is unlikely to face prosecution and have termed an indictment "ridiculous."

Gee you think

[Am_I_Anonymous]

http://money.cnn.com/2016/03/30/news/economy/obamacare-patients-blue-cross-blue-shield/index.html


What a fucking shock.....the only thing they won't mention is the percentage actively seeking pain medications regularly. Which is assume is pretty high.

[Madrun Badrun]

Ya all those sick poor people must be drug addicts.

Obviously this was going to be the case that obamacare patients would cost more - and it was expected by the administration.  Its kind of the point really; get people who were shut out of the healthcare system to be in it. 

Do you honestly think that just because these people cost more that they don't deserve healthcare?   

[Am_I_Anonymous]

Ya all those sick poor people must be drug addicts.

Obviously this was going to be the case that obamacare patients would cost more - and it was expected by the administration.  Its kind of the point really; get people who were shut out of the healthcare system to be in it. 

Do you honestly think that just because these people cost more that they don't deserve healthcare?

National trends show rising drug use, are you purposefully being obtuse right now? I can never tell.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/obamacare-program-may-be-linked-to-er-opioid-prescriptions/article/2564111


No but I think a lot of us are toting larger bills due to this. Insurance is going to make there money somewhere, so let's punish those who work for a living as usual. It gets old. I'm tired of paying everyone else's fucking bills.

[Phoenix Dark]

People who went years without insurance or were denied coverage due to pre-existing conditions are sick? Stunning.

Every year there are sticker shock articles about insurance under the ACA, and every year the rate increase comes in lower than expected. More importantly people are realizing they can switch to a less expensive plan. I've helped quite a few family members pick decent, inexpensive plans and I'm sure I'll be helping again later this year.

Linking having insurance to opiate abuse is below the belt bullshit. A lot of people abuse opiates, some of whom have employer based insurance. And many abusers don't get them legally/with insurance.

[Madrun Badrun]

That was problem long before Obamacare and I doubt it has significanly added to the problem.  One article with the word 'may' in the headline isn't very convincing.  Also assuming this is the case, it doesn't imply obamacare is the problem, its doctors over prescribing drugs.  If your house is burning down you don't say 'I said building houses was a bad idea'. 

Insurance is going to make there money somewhere, so let's punish those who work for a living as usual.

Well there is a good solution to that - get rid of private insurance as primary healthcare insurance for everyone.   

[Am_I_Anonymous]

People who went years without insurance or were denied coverage due to pre-existing conditions are sick? Stunning.

Every year there are sticker shock articles about insurance under the ACA, and every year the rate increase comes in lower than expected. More importantly people are realizing they can switch to a less expensive plan. I've helped quite a few family members pick decent, inexpensive plans and I'm sure I'll be helping again later this year.

Linking having insurance to opiate abuse is below the belt bullshit. A lot of people abuse opiates, some of whom have employer based insurance. And many abusers don't get them legally/with insurance.

Well the Electrical Union dropped the no-copay this year for all their employees due to Obamacare influence....

Having a baby last year? You paid 300-500 dollars total out of pocket

Having a baby this year? You're paying 10,000 dollars out of pocket

Yes, such progress.

[brawndolicious]

AiA, are you assuming that a lot of people with preexisting conditions may get unintentionally addicted to painkillers during major procedures or that they game the system with their disability so they can sit around buzzed all day? I had the former happen to me once when I had a reconstructive jaw surgery that lead to a collapsed lung the following day and 24 hours of hydromorphone which was extremely addictive. I was 15.

That sort of copay is ridiculous for a birth. I've typically heard people paying up to a grand or two with insurance.

[Am_I_Anonymous]

AiA, are you assuming that a lot of people with preexisting conditions may get unintentionally addicted to painkillers during major procedures or that they game the system with their disability so they can sit around buzzed all day? I had the former happen to me once when I had a reconstructive jaw surgery that lead to a collapsed lung the following day and 24 hours of hydromorphone which was extremely addictive. I was 15.

And for every 1 of you that had legit issues there are 10 who are pill hunting. I know they have a database that tracks these people now, at least Ohio does. Which is making it harder for them to say "oh my back" and get 30 percosets.

[brawndolicious]

AiA, are you assuming that a lot of people with preexisting conditions may get unintentionally addicted to painkillers during major procedures or that they game the system with their disability so they can sit around buzzed all day? I had the former happen to me once when I had a reconstructive jaw surgery that lead to a collapsed lung the following day and 24 hours of hydromorphone which was extremely addictive. I was 15.

And for every 1 of you that had legit issues there are 10 who are pill hunting. I know they have a database that tracks these people now, at least Ohio does. Which is making it harder for them to say "oh my back" and get 30 percosets.

Typically people with lots of surgeries learn to have higher pain tolerances and try to be functional on as little meds as possible. I've heard the same story with medical marijuana where there are definitely a lot of people who abuse that as a legal backdoor for recreational use but those who need it for some condition prefer to use the lowest dosage possible. You can't work or study while stoned.

When I had my first check-up with my primary care doctor 6 months ago, she implied that if I ever wanted to smoke weed again that I should just get a card since it's so easy to do. That's a whole different argument about the addictive effects of weed but my point is it's just a stupid statement to say that people with untreated, preexisting conditions are going to be on feel-good medications all day.

[TakingBackSunday]

I had a big long write up planned for this and realized it's not worth it. AiA has his warped views and I have mine.

[Brehvolution]

People who went years without insurance or were denied coverage due to pre-existing conditions are sick? Stunning.

Every year there are sticker shock articles about insurance under the ACA, and every year the rate increase comes in lower than expected. More importantly people are realizing they can switch to a less expensive plan. I've helped quite a few family members pick decent, inexpensive plans and I'm sure I'll be helping again later this year.

Linking having insurance to opiate abuse is below the belt bullshit. A lot of people abuse opiates, some of whom have employer based insurance. And many abusers don't get them legally/with insurance.

Well the Electrical Union dropped the no-copay this year for all their employees due to Obamacare influence....

Having a baby last year? You paid 300-500 dollars total out of pocket

Having a baby this year? You're paying 10,000 dollars out of pocket

Yes, such progress.

Have a link? I find this incredibly hard to believe.

[Am_I_Anonymous]

http://www.benefitresourcesinc.com/PDF/13-14-MED-BNFTS-GUIDE.pdf


Have fun reading that garbage.

Locally our union who I support went from getting 1,000 applicants a year to less than 200, the reason most primarily listed? Insurance is too expensive.

[Brehvolution]

The highest family deductible is 3,750. Max out of pocket is 10K and to hit that you will have to incur costs of over 100K. This doesn't look any different from what my company offers and offered before the ACA.