kz2

[Oblivion]

dayum chow chow is one straight up internet GANGSTA 

good thing i'm on the other side of amurrica, would hate to have him bust a 187 up in my ass ya hurd

[duckman2000]

I tend to always sell games while they still have some resale value, and KZ2 is no different. Lost about $10 including sales tax, but hey. Beats trying to patch together Gamestop promotions to get some resale value out of it.

Geez, you sold KZ2 already?  I thought you immensely enjoyed the beta (and full game)?

It was awesome, but not awesome enough to keep around. As for multiplayer, it requires more time and effort than I feel I can spare these days. I'll get it again when it's $20 and I have some time to play it.

Oh yeah, and custom soundtrack feature being exclusive to MP was a disappointment. I'm getting sort of sick of the typical war game "epic" soundtrack stuff, I would have preferred a custom Bolt Thrower mix. Imagine Eternal War kicking in right at the beginning of the palace push. 

[Jansen]

the recent patch made the controls better?

i haven't noticed any great improvement

[dammitmattt]

the recent patch made the controls better?

i haven't noticed any great improvement

It's a pretty small improvement

[Kestastrophe]

And did you seriously mention that fucking abomination Resident Evil 5 in the same sentence?  The game with shitty controls, shitty gameplay, shitty everything that most everyone is considering a huge disappointment?  Take away the "Resident Evil" in the title and nobody would give a shit about that game.  It's fucking terrible.

Let me make something clear, you Xfag fuck.  I don't like you.  If I ever saw you on the street, let it be known that I wouldn't hesitate for one second to put your ass down.  It's contrarian, elitist, disingenuous, attention-starved motherfuckers like you that piss me off to no end.

 
The irony is thicker than a black penis. Only room for one KZ2 White Knight, and duckman claimed that a long time ago
duckman

Anyways, duckman when you think about the $10 that you lost, it really isn't that different than the $8 that it costs to rent from Blockbuster or other rental store. I often find myself doing the same thing, buying and reselling, as opposed to renting

[dark1x]

Heh, game feels very much like a cod game to me. At this rate i will never finish it. 30 mins gaming all week, tragic

Hmm, I find that very interesting.  Opinions aside, the way the game handles its enemy encounters and scenario design is really very different from CoD for the most part.  Enemies in CoD would either remain stationary (popping up and down to fire at the player) or continuously spawn from a random source until the player crosses a certain point.  The majority of battles in Killzone do not present the player with a stream of enemies, rather, bring them out in specifically designed groups similar to Halo.  Though there is certainly less variety, you still have a lot of elements of Halo playing out here.  Furthermore, like Halo, the game has a fairly solid close-quarters aspect with a very powerful melee and cover to cover action.  Most of the encounters are driven by the player in that their length depends heavily upon how the player executes their plan of attack.  In CoD, it doesn't matter how quickly you can tackle a group of enemies as that game is more focused on reaching specific points than it is dealing with enemies.  The enemy variety falls somewhere between Halo and CoD, however, in that there are different classes of enemies mixed together, but they are not nearly as unique as what Halo presents (though Halo lost some of this with the 3rd game thanks to the removal of the Elites from combat).

I dunno, the game felt very Halo-like to me (especially the second half of the campaign) with a military slant.  I still think Halo 3 is the better game in every aspect outside of the visuals (which Bungie really dropped the ball on).

[fistfulofmetal]

played a little multiplayer yesterday and i actually like it over the single
which is rare for me

game feels like Battlefield combined with COD.

with the ranks and squads and stuff.

i don't like how you can't choose a base class and then rank THAT up. i really don't want to be a medic when i get there just so i can be the fast light armored spec ops type dude.

[duckman2000]

Anyways, duckman when you think about the $10 that you lost, it really isn't that different than the $8 that it costs to rent from Blockbuster or other rental store. I often find myself doing the same thing, buying and reselling, as opposed to renting

Yeah, it's a pretty safe bet with big games (except Ubi games, for some reason). I actually thought I'd keep this around a bit longer, due to the MP. I think a co-op mode, local or online, would have "saved" it.

As for this COD comparison, I just plain don't see it. In terms of mission design, sure, but the combat feels more like a mix of Gears and Rainbow Six to me. That is if we are going to make direct comparisons, which I don't really think are warranted in the first place. The helghast felt more capable and alive than your average wargame enemy, and even if it's obviously the case since I did manage to mow my way through legions of helghast, I rarely actually felt like a blatantly superior super-warrior. There are a lot of things about Killzone 2 that are brutally derivative, but enemy design and combat gives it a pretty strong identity.

That said, I have only played COD 1, 2 and 4, so maybe Treyarch's COD games are very different from those three games.

[dark1x]

That said, I have only played COD 1, 2 and 4, so maybe Treyarch's COD games are very different from those three games.

No, I think it was intended as an insult.  CoD3 and 5 are quite inferior to the others (especially 3).

[Jansen]

i like how in MP you can blast a dude with the shotgun and it takes a 1/2 second before it registers the hit and then the dude blows back

[duckman2000]

The lag is made a lot more obvious thanks to the "hit response" stuff. I was also a bit annoyed to see that the murder-suicide stuff was still in effect in the game. I understand that some things can be beyond fixing, but that's not the impression we got from Guerrilla.

[drohne]

i've had this since launch but i have no desire to play anything besides sf4 -- maybe i shouldn't have bothered

[dammitmattt]

Here's a nice little story from Ars Technica on some issues they've been having with the multiplayer:

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009/03/killzone-2-multiplayer-impressions.ars

What do you think?

[duckman2000]

Killzone 2 demands and rewards coordinated team efforts, got it. Dude could have wrapped that one up in two, maybe three paragraphs.

[dammitmattt]

Killzone 2 demands and rewards coordinated team efforts, got it. Dude could have wrapped that one up in two, maybe three paragraphs.

He repeated himself way too much, but you missed many other points.  One or two asshats on a team of 16 can ruin the game for you.  That kind of sucks.

[fistfulofmetal]

there's this thing on killzone.com called gamereplay.
it allows you to view 2D top down replays of your past matches. 

[CHOW CHOW]

there's this thing on killzone.com called gamereplay.
it allows you to view 2D top down replays of your past matches. 

no shit? that's pretty cool..gonna check it out.  like a top down 2d shooter?

[fistfulofmetal]

this is it:

[CHOW CHOW]

ehh 

[Draft]

Killzone 2 demands and rewards coordinated team efforts, got it. Dude could have wrapped that one up in two, maybe three paragraphs.

A beautiful game rewards coordinated team efforts, but does not demand them.

[fistfulofmetal]

you expected to view actual gameplay? it's through a web browser dude. It's still pretty cool to me.

[CHOW CHOW]

you expected to view actual gameplay? it's through a web browser dude. It's still pretty cool to me.

halo 3 lets you save the videos onto your hdd... i dunno, i was hoping for something like that but i guess this will do

[dark1x]

you expected to view actual gameplay? it's through a web browser dude. It's still pretty cool to me.

halo 3 lets you save the videos onto your hdd... i dunno, i was hoping for something like that but i guess this will do

Right, that's realtime (which obviously saves tremendous space).  This is through a web browser.  They'd have to record video for everything if they were to allow you to view it online.  Furthermore, they'd have to save footage from everyone's perspective!  For a more advanced top down 2D view, I think it would be more possible but still pretty difficult.

[cool breeze]

playing the CoD World at war demo on 360 yesterday, it's amazing to see how responsive those controls are compared to KZ2.  I know it's what they intended with KZ2, but CoD4/WoW still have the best dual analog controls.  The demo itself was pretty awful though.

[duckman2000]

playing the CoD World at war demo on 360 yesterday, it's amazing to see how responsive those controls are compared to KZ2.  I know it's what they intended with KZ2, but CoD4/WoW still have the best dual analog controls.  The demo itself was pretty awful though.

I enjoy both styles, but for the future, I think I'd rather see more developers work towards perfection down the path Guerrilla has taken. The combination of controls/weapons handling and one-sided enemy behavior enables you to push through overwhelming enemy forces with some ease, which is satisfying in itself, but the individual kill doesn't feel nearly as satisfying as it does in KZ2. Part of it is because the hit reaction is just plain superior (and that is something I really hope we'll see in the next IW COD, along with some new ideas on enemy behavior), but also because the gunplay actually involves handling what seems like a real physical object.

As for World at War, I downloaded the demo but the 360 croaked before I even had a chance to play it. I'll give it a shot when the replacement arrives.

[CHOW CHOW]

at the palace... nearly done.

let us know when you take a shit as well, important stuff

[dark1x]

footage? you mean... input streams... right?

I was actually thinking they were talking about full on footage of the game being played, which was my mistake for skimming over the thread.

[CHOW CHOW]

let us know when you take a shit as well, important stuff

indeed it is!

so , i'm at the final encounter.

Have to say, i take it back regarding the COD3 and 5 comparisons because this utter fucking garbage of a level makes the turgid designs of COD3 and 5 look like the work of some master architect.

Sorry Sfags, this game is a mess as far as i'm concerned. The linear shuffling through levels, throwing you behind turrets too often, tossing in the obligatory shuffle-this-way-in-your-vehicle screams all the worst parts of the bad COD series and i STILL don't see anything other than COD. Same picking people off behind cover whilst dealing with rushing enemies, over and over and over. I shall try harder difficulties IF i can be arsed killing the ghei norweigan helgast quench.

Best looking game on PS3, confirmed bog standard single player experience.

Also - given that you do everything with Rico (easily one of the most annoying characters ever to have cpu cycles devoted to them), i am baffled as to why there is no Coop play. baffled.

Just tried online, that was great. Only a short game, but hey. That was much better.

it's not anything like COD unless you're speaking in extremely broad terms

you could say every shooter is like COD in that sense

and the graphics aren't just "the best on PS3", they're the best on consoles.  it's not even debatable...Guerrilla blew everyone away.

you're a disgusting little xfag

[dark1x]

It's really sad to see just how jaded people have become.  It almost seems that people around here are only playing games to prove those on the "opposite side" incorrect.  People around evilbore swear up and down that it's all tongue and cheek, but I don't buy that anymore.  It's pretty clear that people have taken sides and are playing games with expectations based entirely upon combating the loud opinions of a certain group on message boards. 

S-fegs, x-fegs, etc etc.  Everyone who has selected a side has become unreasonable and goes out of their way to either massively over hype the things available for THEIR console while trashing the hell out of the "competition".  I can understand having a preference, but I do not understand the point in playing this little game.  I've been guilty of this in the past but have ultimately realized that there is no point in acting this way.  I hate the Wii and all that it stands for, as an example, but still purchase and enjoy the few games that DO interest me.  I play them without considering what the message boards are going to say about it.  It's fun to argue about them later, but I don't enter the games with an opinion already formed (which I believe a lot of people around here are doing).

This doesn't apply specifically to Killzone 2 by any means, by the way, it's just another instance in which I've noticed it.  I myself don't think KZ2 is a AAA experience by any means, but it's still a solid shooter.  If something like this can be called "crap", well, our standards have run out of control.

Ah well, carry on.

[CHOW CHOW]

How is it not a AAA experience?  Enough with this elitist, contrarian garbage.  It's despicable.  The campaign is awesome and the multi-player mode is one of the best of this gen -- my personal favorite, right up there with COD4. 

[Draft]

Little late for meltdowns for gameplay impression meltdowns.

And too early for first month NPD meltdowns.

We're in the eye of the meltdown.

[demi]

It's really sad to see just how jaded people have become.  It almost seems that people around here are only playing games to prove those on the "opposite side" incorrect.  People around evilbore swear up and down that it's all tongue and cheek, but I don't buy that anymore.  It's pretty clear that people have taken sides and are playing games with expectations based entirely upon combating the loud opinions of a certain group on message boards. 

S-distinguished effete fellows, x-distinguished effete fellows, etc etc.  Everyone who has selected a side has become unreasonable and goes out of their way to either massively over hype the things available for THEIR console while trashing the hell out of the "competition".  I can understand having a preference, but I do not understand the point in playing this little game.  I've been guilty of this in the past but have ultimately realized that there is no point in acting this way.  I hate the Wii and all that it stands for, as an example, but still purchase and enjoy the few games that DO interest me.  I play them without considering what the message boards are going to say about it.  It's fun to argue about them later, but I don't enter the games with an opinion already formed (which I believe a lot of people around here are doing).

This doesn't apply specifically to Killzone 2 by any means, by the way, it's just another instance in which I've noticed it.  I myself don't think KZ2 is a AAA experience by any means, but it's still a solid shooter.  If something like this can be called "crap", well, our standards have run out of control.

Ah well, carry on.

Ok 60fps-cigarillo, thanks for the hypocritical post

Carry on

[archie4208]

arguing about videogames rofl

[CHOW CHOW]

How is it like COD3 and 5 and not 4?  I like how you cleverly left that out.  If it's like COD3/5, then it's also like 4 because they all play the same.

You already made your mind up about this game before it even dropped.

And no, it's really not like COD3/4/5 at all.

1.  There's a sense of weight and realism to the movement and gunplay.

2.  The enemies take way more bullets to drop than in the COD campaigns.

3.  There's a 1st person cover system that you use extensively.  I used it just as much as I used the cover in Gears.

It's nothing like COD save for it being in the same genre.

You're vile.

[dark1x]

and i do , do i?

I don't know, do you?  It comes off that way, but then again, a lot of the things I post are misconstrued as well.

[AdmiralViscen]

How many people really do that though, dark10x? Seems like WrikaWrek and dcharlie to me, and Green Man?

And even those people don't hype up the exclusives on their favorite console. How much shit do Halo 3, Gears, Fable, Rare, Ninja Blade get around here? The favorite 360 exclusives on this site seem to be Crackdown and Saints Row 1. Hardly the exclusives fanboys should pick to win arguments with their opposition.


I hope I don't get lumped in with this phantom group of fake game players just because I think KZ2's single player is up-and-down. No one accuses me of that when I talk to them about it IRL. I definitely don't think it's much like COD outside of the few enemy distinguished mentally-challenged fellow spawns I discovered. It's more like Gears if someone forgot to put effort into the cover button and situational variety.

[dark1x]

I don't know, just feels like a trend lately.  Then again, like I said, I end up saying a lot of things online that I don't really feel strongly about "IRL".  It just kind of comes with posting on a message board, I suppose.  I wasn't really singling out Killzone 2.  I just happened to post it in this thread.

[duckman2000]

and i do , do i?

Alright dude, you tell me how this looks. After playing the demo (which you had already whined about plenty after playing it at TGS), you made post after post complaining about the lack of difficulty options, yet you decided to stick with that same difficulty setting that buggered you so much before. Now you're disappointed in the gameplay and compare it to COD3 (which is just fucking ridiculous), even knowing full well that you could have yourself changed the game experience quite a bit by simply opting for a different difficulty setting.

Like COD. Get the fuck out of here. 

[bork]

well, yes, that is fair.

So let me restate : the game is a run of the mill shooter that plays and has level designs akin to a COD on the normal difficulty level.

I will try a higher difficultly level tonight, as i said, i'm getting the odd 20 mins to play games so i wanted to see things through to the end as i have RE5 sitting here.

I'm not dropping the COD thing,  it feels exactly like COD to me and that isn't going to change unless the higher difficult injects some magic.

Man, fuck this shit, get outta this thread, and go play RE5!

[duckman2000]

Well, comparing it to COD at all tells me that you are either out of your  mind, or have a seriously warped up view of COD. The gun handling, cover based gameplay and enemy behavior even on normal sees to that it is made different from any COD I have played. There are scenarios that are absolutely of the COD (and every other war-themed game) style, but the point to point combat plays nothing like it. Add a vertical quality to the encounters, and it becomes a hell of a lot more reminiscent of Rainbow Six Vegas than of COD.

That said, there are some things I wished that they had copied from COD4. The combat moments are generally much more satisfying, but it doesn't have a whole lot of memorable levels, like the AC-130 mission or the sniper mission in COD4. And every damned shooter needs a few segments where you call in air support, that should be a standard from here on.

Man, fuck this shit, get outta this thread, and go play RE5!

I feel so spoiled. I have Dawn of War II and RE5 sitting here, and I just can not decide which to play first.   

[demi]

RTS games suck shit. Problem solved

[Van Cruncheon]

re5 looks loads better

[cool breeze]

I don't know about that CoD comparison; it kinda reminds me of Killzone 1, just much better.

The CoD comparison is probably the closest with another series because the premise is similar, I just don't really understand to directly compare it to that closest series.  I guess that's just how it is; CoD was the Medal of Honor clone way back when too (thought I don't think the KZ series destroys it's predecessors like CoD did, at least not on the multiplayer side of things.)  But just comparing them on the enjoyment of the campaigns, I would say CoD1 and 2 are on par with, if not better than, KZ2.  CoD4 single player was awful and the demo of World at War I played the other day made me feel good about my decision to pass on that game.  Multiplayer in CoD4 is still amazing and KZ2 can't really compete with it; I probably enjoyed the CoDWaW multiplayer beta more than my time with KZ2 online.

re5 looks loads better

this I might agree with

KZ2 is still more impressive technically and all that, but some parts of RE5 are insane with how good they look.

[duckman2000]

Yes, i know there is a first person cover system, but the same darting in and out of cover happens in COD just without stickying to the walls the system will let you.

Which puts it well apart from COD (and again closer to Rainbow Six Vegas). Not just the cover system itself (which I personally didn't like all that much) but the way enemies actually use cover sensibly, and the fact that you can force them to adopt new strategies by chipping away at their cover, it's non-existent in COD on any difficulty. Enemy behavior (yes, even on normal) and gunplay makes it fundamentally different. COD does a great job pushing intensity and making you feel like you're in a hellish warzone, but there is rarely a sense that enemies have much individual battle (or survival) competence, or many combat abilities beyond rage and suicide tactics. Which is absolutely fine as IW does this very well, but there's really no comparing the two.

[duckman2000]

Multiplayer in CoD4 is still amazing and KZ2 can't really compete with it

It's a bit frustrating, though, because I honestly can't pinpoint what it is that makes it so good. In-game rewards have something to do with it, but that becomes less amazing as you learn to rack up 7+ killstreaks with ease. I think a lot of the things that annoy me in SP actually enhance the MP, like for example the canned death animations and lack of response to hits.

this I might agree with

KZ2 is still more impressive technically and all that, but some parts of RE5 are insane with how good they look.

Haven't played RE5 beyond the demo, so that may be true enough. Although at this point, barring technical issues or blatant shortcuts, I'm happy enough with both the technical and the artistic achievements in most high profile games that it's all starting to blur into "looks damned good." Whether it looks "better" or"worse" than the next big game is becoming irrelevant since games tend to look damned good these days.

But then again, I also thought the Riddick demo looked good. And Banjo looks damned good too, 1/3 of the time.

[CHOW CHOW]

re5 looks loads better

[dark1x]

The hyperbole on both sides will only serve to push the two opinions even further in the opposite direction.  You can't force someone who dislikes a game to suddenly change their opinion.

That's really the problem with this forum is that every alternate opinion is met with laughter or insults which only further fuels the disagreement.

[AdmiralViscen]

Multiplayer rocks period

[Smooth Groove]

I just tried out the demo for about 10 mins this morning.  What's all the hoopla about? 

The game screams "generic shooter" and the controls are uncomfortable, even by console FPS standards.

Does the final game play a lot better?  There's no way I'm spending $60 for 10 more hours of what was in the demo. 

I guess the graphics are pretty good for a console game but I'm getting sick of the muddy colors and blurry graphical filters. 

[duckman2000]

Try the final game, on Veteran difficulty. It changes the dynamics of combat quite a bit. If you aren't into it by the third level or so, then you probably won't get into it at all. There are some attempts at breaking up the action, but only one of those are actually great (the Suljeva downtempo battles), with the rest merely being sort of there. Generally, the game focuses on immediate combat, which it does very well.

[recursivelyenumerable]

My review of this game:

It's an FPS and therefore is lame because all FPSs are lame, the end.

[duckman2000]

This is true

[recursivelyenumerable]

me, cutting through the murk with the laser-sharp beam of truth

[fistfulofmetal]

killzone 2 is the rare case where the multiplayer is much more interesting than the dull single player.

[Bebpo]

Finally started this.  Did the first level and I think I enjoyed it?  It has a really nice cinematic feel in motion which separates it from all the other fps and kind of makes up for the textures being PS3-weak.  It's also really hard and intense like you're in the middle of an overwhelming battle.  Good pacing.

OTOH, the controls aren't very good.  Why did they not make cover attach/attach-off button?  I'm using Alternate 2 and the game is so glitchy about holding L2+UP+L1+R1 to shoot.  WTF why do I have to press 4 inputs to shoot a guy while in cover?!?  Because of this I'm just not using cover much and it's causing me to die a lot.  >_<  Also the tank controls at the end of the level were terrible.  I couldn't drive in the directions I wanted to so I just kind of stood around and shot. 

I also don't like how many bullets it takes to kill a guy, but then again they are wearing a ton of armor so it makes sense.

[Smooth Groove]

killzone 2 is the rare case where the multiplayer is much more interesting than the dull single player.

Really? Many would argue that MP makes every game more fun. 

WTF why do I have to press 4 inputs to shoot a guy while in cover?!? 

I think I'm gonna stick with Fear 2 for my FPS needs. 

[duckman2000]

Use the standard control configuration if cover is important.

[dark1x]

OTOH, the controls aren't very good.  Why did they not make cover attach/attach-off button?  I'm using Alternate 2 and the game is so glitchy about holding L2+UP+L1+R1 to shoot.  WTF why do I have to press 4 inputs to shoot a guy while in cover?!?  Because of this I'm just not using cover much and it's causing me to die a lot.

The solution I use is simply letting go of L2 and holding L1 while firing.  When you want to return to cover, simply press L2 again while letting off L1.  There's rarely a need to actually hold both button simultaneously (unless you want to peak out to the left or right, but in those cases you simply don't have to use iron sights).  Try not to get stuck in the rut of just hanging back and trying to pick off enemies at a distance.  While you can choose to play this way, it's a lot more fun to keep moving while trying to close in on the enemy.  They actually react fairly well to your movements and it feels pretty dynamic as a result.

The default control scheme is clearly the way they want you to play it, but I much prefer alternate 2.  I also agree that, what makes it feel special, is the way everything moves.  It makes a tremendous difference.  The animation on everything is out of this world and all of the various post processing techniques really elevate the experience even if it is a fairly basic FPS (which isn't necessarily a bad thing as far as I'm concerned).

Fortunately, the tank only shows up in that first mission.  Furthermore, I feel the second half of the game is significantly better than the first, so if you are enjoying it thus far, you should get more out of it later.

I think I'm gonna stick with Fear 2 for my FPS needs.

FEAR 2, really?  :\

[duckman2000]

I don't think I even have an FPS need anymore. It might just be an unusually persistent case of temporary shooter fatigue, but I honestly feel like I've shot all the video game opponents that I'll ever need to shoot. It's not really all thanks to KZ2, but the combination of it being purely a shooter, the gunplay and resulting hit reactions and the overall warzone atmosphere pretty much overfilled it.

[dark1x]

I'm always in the mood for first person shooting, though.  These days, while everyone loves to draw comparisons between various titles, they really ARE all fairly different from one another even when they share certain elements.  I think first and third person shooters, over the past few years, have never been better.

We've seen a lot of refinements over the years, so it's not as if the genre has stood still either.