Official *Consoles Are For Losers* thread

[Oblivion]

Whoops, posted the wrong video. Meant what the hell is THIS:

[Human Snorenado]

I don't understand the point of the Wii U if they release it just to be a generation behind again. All this talk in the early going was about being viable for ports and having the same multiplatform titles, and now they back out of that? Why? What is the point of the console existing then? And as I said before, the tablet is just the same double screen method of the DS that never went anywhere interesting.

The Wii, for all the hate thrown at it, was a focused concept that succeeded. The Wii U is a confused mess that's not forging any new ground.

Fishie from OA says that the wiiU is more powerful than what these rumors say, surprised he even revealed that much.  Besides who the fuck believes that Activision wont be making games for the Wii U, they defnitely will make a Kung Fu Panda game for the console.

Fishie 

Why don't we ask Johnny Nighttrain what he thinks next

[Damian79]

Come on, Fishie isnt even close to Johnny Nightrain.  Devs actually to to him because Fishie can actually keep secrets, much to the anger of OA because he teases them but witholds info.  I am surprised he said anthing at all regarding this.

[Human Snorenado]

Believe him if you want, but in the past he's proven to be not entirely reliable.

[Human Snorenado]

Yeah, I remember when I used to post at/read OA on the semi-regular and leading up to the current gen Fishie "passed on" some "tips" that were uh yeah no.

That said, if I needed to use one of them to meet stupid models, I would definitely use Fraudtrain for that.

[maxy]

pastebin rumor correcting previous pastebin rumor

How expensive would something like that be? Guessing MS would have to take another $100 loss or whatever?

Bumping the RAM to 4GB would cost them billions through console lifespan.Currently they would need 16 GDDR5 chips or 8 DDR3 chips.Not to mention increased motherboard complexity,increased power consumption,heat.
They will probably try to push for higher density GDDR5 chips,8 chips would be reasonable.Launch 360 had 8 chips---4 at top,4 at bottom

In either case,not something that would be easily green-lighted.

[maxy]

Fudzilla commenting on IGN rumors
SNIP

Wait. That's the PS4, right? "On par with current gen systems"? Quick, someone tell GAF, this needs at least three threads to discuss. 

Not surprising if you look at IGN specs and read prole post.People that expect magic from some budget gpus are in for a huge shock.Especially if res is bumped

[EmCeeGrammar]

 I would at least wish Nintendo has a better contingency plan this time around if third party support never materialises.  In the twilight years they might have been able to keep the wii afloat better with more internal software being released at a better clip, but that may require some expansion of their studios.  They've done a good job so far of releasing quite a few new ip on eshop from collaborations with smaller devs, and there have been some success stories (Mutant Mudds, despite what I think of the game's quality) so if they can get their online store all elegant and shiz the WiiU might be able to stubbornly stick around and carve out its own niche.

[Human Snorenado]

I would at least wish Nintendo has a better contingency plan this time around if third party support never materialises.  In the twilight years they might have been able to keep the wii afloat better with more internal software being released at a better clip, but that may require some expansion of their studios.  They've done a good job so far of releasing quite a few new ip on eshop from collaborations with smaller devs, and there have been some success stories (Mutant Mudds, despite what I think of the game's quality) so if they can get their online store all elegant and shiz the WiiU might be able to stubbornly stick around and carve out its own niche.

Interesting, so this is what battered spousal syndrome looks like.

[Phoenix Dark]

"The same source concluded, bluntly: "I suppose you don't need sophisticated physics to make a Mario game."

KEEP HOPE ALIVE

At some point Ntards have to move the goal posts from "of course it will be more powerful than current gen systems" to "I never expected a powerful system, I just want to play Mario in HD"

[Tasty]

"The same source concluded, bluntly: "I suppose you don't need sophisticated physics to make a Mario game."

KEEP HOPE ALIVE

At some point Ntards have to move the goal posts from "of course it will be more powerful than current gen systems" to "I never expected a powerful system, I just want to play Mario in HD"

This is the second post like this, but I dare you to find anyone who actually reverses gears like this. I mean if it's such an inevitability it shouldn't be hard.

If Wii U is only just as powerful as current systems I'll be disappointed, but considering what we know about the RAM and processor I find that to be highly unlikely. Is it likely that it won't be as powerful as Xbox 3 and PS4? Yes, but that was always the case since we knew it was coming out at least a year ahead of those systems.

[Cerveza mas fina]

Emcee still thinks WiiU will get 3rd party support, never change!

[EmCeeGrammar]

Someone can't read.

[Cerveza mas fina]

I would at least wish Nintendo has a better contingency plan this time around if third party support never materialises.  I

IF being the keyword here. Yeah you believe.

Or you don't know what you're saying.

[EmCeeGrammar]

Yeah that's a conclusive assertion... Not.

[Cerveza mas fina]

Great comeback.

Reminds me of how Nintendo got 3rd parties to support the N64, Gamecube and Wii.

You know, all the Nintendo home consoles in the past 16 years.

[Cerveza mas fina]

Bu bu bu

[Phoenix Dark]

Remember when the Wii had a monopoly on PS2 and PSP ports initially? We'll see that with the WiiU getting gimped PS3/360 ports, while developers shun the system in terms of new content.

[Cerveza mas fina]

Bu bu more better

[Tasty]

You know I was joking when I said that right?  It was a dig at the moron who said Wii U's games won't have "powerful" graphics. 

[Eel O'Brian]

I think the Wii U will actually have a decent first couple of years, as far as game library goes. Most games for the next-gen systems are going to be port-ups for the first year or so, anyway. Take a look at the first couple of years for the 360, all those games look a bit archaic now. That early stuff will likely be a lot easier to scale down to Wii U specs. After that, it's anyone's guess, really.  Could be that a lot of what you'd consider B-level games may end up on the Wii U instead of the newer systems because it'll be cheaper and less risky to develop for.

[EmCeeGrammar]

Great comeback.

Reminds me of how Nintendo got 3rd parties to support the N64, Gamecube and Wii.

You know, all the Nintendo home consoles in the past 16 years.

It wasn't a comeback, it was stating that it wasn't a supreme declaration from my mighty mighty self.  You really need to work on your reading comprehension because I'm beginning to understand why everyone makes so many jokes about Pollacks being stupid. And thats not fair to Borys.

[EmCeeGrammar]

I think Nintendo schmaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyybeeeeee has a chance to dominate in Japan, as its looking to come out much earlier than the ps4.  Sony's in so much deep shit as it is that I can't imagine an easy transition for them.

In the west, the xbox demographic has grown leaps and bounds and that userbase SHOULD transfer over nicely unless they royally screw up in some unforseen way.  I personally don't believe the anti-used games thing but I'll use it for my devilish advocating.  Anyway, the brand has momentum into next gen so third party support will follow those users.  My concern is if the 40 millionish Wii owners will want to upgrade or not to the WiiU, and nintendo is going to have to clearly communicate its differentiations in the marketing.  I mean, sure, they have Mario and that should sell 20 million boxes alone.  They need to play hardball beyond that.

[Olivia Wilde Homo]

One of the lessons I gathered from this generation is to never make assumptions about the next generation.  Back in 2006, it was assumed PS3 would destroy the competition like the PS2 did.  Most of the people predicting the Wii would win are Nintards who assume that their console of choice will always win - these were the same clowns who thought the Game Cube would do gangbusters, so they don't really count.

[EmCeeGrammar]

But this time around Sony is in complete shambles.  The Vita is dead in the water and the ps3 has been limping along for the entire generation.  The parent company itself is struggling and I can't imagine that their fortunes are going to reverse unless ...TOP SECRET FEATURE. 

And assuming is fun, don't tread on me.

[Stoney Mason]

Being in first has a tendency to breed arrogance and laziness. We all saw how it hobbled and humbled Sony this gen. We'll see how MS handles it next go around.

Edit: referencing the hd consoles since the wii technically came in first.

[Tasty]

Yeah GameCube got a majority of the cross-platform games, plus some good third party exclusives. It just wasn't enough, PS2 was a behemoth and Nintendo didn't have their act together enough.

[cool breeze]

I'm confused when people talk about third party support, whether they mean exclusives or just getting what the other guys get.

Wii U should get everything the PS3/360/PC get, no? and when Durango/Orbis come around, there's still the Vita, 3DS, and hell, iOS.  I'd imagine if Wii had been as powerful as 360/PS3, it too would have had third party support.  These days is just makes sense to put your game on wherever you can.

I mean, personally I don't care.  I have a PC and both current gen consoles.  When I get a Wii U, it will be for Nintendo games.  The when just depends on the price; maybe $200 or something.

How much do consoles even cost these days? last one I bought was a replacement arcade 360 for $100 on sale, back in 2009.

[Stoney Mason]

Wii U should get everything the PS3/360/PC get, no?

They will get everything unless they get very draconian (which is why they didn't get some things in the past) or unless their consoles skews as very young or too "casual". That's what happened with the Wii. Yeah there were tech limits there but devs also came to believe that the same ports that people were buying on 360 and PS3, the Wii audience wasn't into for various reasons.

[Tasty]

As for cross-ports with Vita, that's making the assumption that the Vita's going to be getting decent third party support down the road.

Never thought of it like that. Maybe I should be cheering the Vita on more than I have been.

[cool breeze]

checking amazon/gamestop,

360:
$200 for 4 gig
$300 for 250 gig + 2 games
+$100 on top of both for Kinect versions

PS3:
$250 for 160 gig
$300 for 320 gig + 1 game
+$50 for PS Eye and Move

Wii: 
$150 + NSMB

these are honestly more expensive than I thought they'd be.  granted, hard drive sizes are much larger than the skus years ago.  I think my launch 360 was 20 gig and my PS3 was 60 gig.

Both, I'd think.

And it *should*, but that doesn't mean it *will*.  I mean, in the category of *shoulds*, the Wii probably *should* have gotten some version of Assassin's Creed, given there was a PSP version.  But it didn't.  Some companies look at the figures and reckon even a port isn't worth it.

As for cross-ports with Vita, that's making the assumption that the Vita's going to be getting decent third party support down the road.  Cross-porting with the 3DS is probably a stretch, and iOS cross-stuff will probably happen but be just as embarrassing in the cost difference as it is now with console/iOS cross-ports.

Vita/3DS is more like how a lot of PSP games were on PS2 and Wii.  easier to justify building it in the first place if you have more than just portable with shaky sales.  or something like that.  Even in the later years you had silent hill shattered memories and tenchu 4 coming out on both PSP and Wii.

Didn't know there wasn't an assassin's creed game on wii.  That's surprising since ubisoft made unique versions of Prince of Persia for each system, to tie into the movie, but still.  The Wii version of forgotten sands is a solid game.  Ass creed PSP was ass; the 2D DS versions were better.

[Tasty]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=469574

Sony kicked in the nads hard before next gen even starts.

[maxy]

Take it with a grain of salt

http://www.forgetthebox.net/mag/culture/forum-m/rumor-wii-u-price.php

Speaking with sources closely involved with manufacturing and distributing Nintendo products, the total cost of materials to manufacture the Wii U console (includes cost of controller) is estimated to be around $180. On top of this, our source tells us the controller’s total bill of materials and components cost no more than $50.

The source goes on to say that Nintendo is assessing the overall market and finalizing costs to determine the price for the Wii U, but it will be no less than $300 retail price when it launches.

According to our sources:

“Cutting production costs to maximize profits is Nintendo’s main concern with the Wii U. They are cutting costs in the Wii U’s hardware to build back confidence in investors. Nintendo wants investors to view Wii U as a less risky proposition. ”

The new NFC capabilities for each new Wii U controller costs no more than $5 to implement, and the prices of NFC implementation in mobile devices is expected to fall below $1 in the near future. Our source explained: “NFC capabilities are a drop in the bucket for Nintendo. As NFC becomes more mainstream in mobile devices, the price for NFC implementation will rapidly decline. Nintendo is jumping on NFC because of a projected cost decline in the technology.”

When we asked about the controller’s other manufacturing costs:

“The cameras in the Wii U controller are an estimated manufacturing cost of $6. They are slightly better quality than the 3DS and DSi cameras. The touch screen has a manufacturing cost estimated at $14.”

[Tasty]

I still think the controller will be $70 max.

[maxy]

Wii U should get everything the PS3/360/PC get, no? and when Durango/Orbis come around, there's still the Vita, 3DS, and hell, iOS.  I'd imagine if Wii had been as powerful as 360/PS3, it too would have had third party support.  These days is just makes sense to put your game on wherever you can.

Performance of WiiU day and date games will be closely watched,i think.
If WiiU audience buys those games in droves then pretty much everything will be on WiiU.If not,I expect few third party exclusives and cheap late ports here or there.
Games that sell a lot(Fifa,COD) are 100% guaranteed---not necessarily at exact day and date.

In short,audience is the key.



some news

http://www.360magazine.co.uk/interview/dead-space-dev-next-gen-should-be-always-be-on-and-connected/

Steve Papoutsis, of Visceral Games and Dead Space fame, has spent the most his time pushing the current generation of consoles to their creative limits.

From changing the way action and scares work in Dead Space to developing a no holds barred hack ‘n slash from an age-old epic poem in the form of Dante’s Inferno.

It’s safe to say he knows a thing or two when it comes to the current consoles and where the games industry is headed.

So, just what would he want out of a next-gen machine?

Steve Papoutsis: “I’d love the convenience of installing your games like you do now but making that process automatic, as I want to avoid having to change discs. Microsoft has made a lot of nice improvements to the dashboard over the years so I’m expecting an even more refined and streamlined user interface for people to interact with when checking out stuff on the marketplace.

I’m hoping the next Xbox will be up to speed with the cutting edge PCs of today. I’m looking for 60 FPS gameplay across the board with outstanding visuals and more processing power for physics. In terms of features, I hope the new system will always be on and connected, because it would be awesome to have games load up super-fast and take me back to where I was the last time I played.”

He must be reading next xbox rumors.

[Human Snorenado]

I still think the controller will be $70 max.

A separate one?  It will be $100.

[tiesto]

I vaguely remember Fishie from back in the day, where does he work that he is privy to inside info?

  Johnny Nighttrain 

[Phoenix Dark]

I vaguely remember Fishie from back in the day, where does he work that he is privy to inside info?

  Johnny Nighttrain 

RETRO FPS CONFIRMED

[maxy]

next xbox cpu
could be fake

Apparently it's shopped,spoilers

spoiler (click to show/hide)

[close]

[Damian79]

I vaguely remember Fishie from back in the day, where does he work that he is privy to inside info?

  Johnny Nighttrain 

He used to work for one of those gaming mags until he had some kind of fallout with milkman.  Anyway he still goes to E3 and such and is apparently repsected among among devs for some reason.

[Joe Molotov]

OMG Xbox 720 spoilers!

[Tasty]

I still think the controller will be $70 max.

A separate one?  It will be $100.

Nah it'll be $80 max.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

I got Fishie's Mii in StreetPass during GDC

I set the 3DS on fire

[tiesto]

I vaguely remember Fishie from back in the day, where does he work that he is privy to inside info?

  Johnny Nighttrain 

RETRO FPS CONFIRMED

The N-fan's anthem during E3 '05:

[Flannel Boy]

total cost of materials to manufacture the Wii U console (includes cost of controller) is estimated to be around $180. On top of this, our source tells us the controller’s total bill of materials and components cost no more than $50.

Nintendo is assessing the overall market and finalizing costs to determine the price for the Wii U, but it will be no less than $300 retail

Good old Nintendo.

[EmCeeGrammar]

I seem to remember they weren't even making that much profit off the wii after all the other stuff to account for.   I mean, the volume of sales added up to billions in bank, but the profit per unit wasn't as astronomical as say, an apple product.

[Flannel Boy]

erm, bit more to the cost of a finished, on-the-shelf product than the cost of materials, yeah?

Obviously, but "no less than $300 retail."

Is the additional cost of assembly etc. going to get the price near $300? 

[Tasty]

Too late Oscar, we're already speeding down the "Nintendo are greedy bastards! (implication: not like Sony or Microsoft!)" slope and there's no stopping the sled.

[Fifstar]

How can the people that do those component cost estimations come up with such exact figures? Wouldn't the deals that companies like Sony, Nintendo and Microsoft get on hardware parts be up for negotation? Obviously those deals would be in a certain ballpark but can they be estimated to the dollar? I'd also assume that the other costs to get the systems in the shelves (like shipping, manufacturing and retailer cut) would be just as easy to get, but for some reason they rarely seem to pop up.

Are the numbers for the 3DS and Vita also estimations or to they come from the companies themselves?

[Momo]

-like shipping, manufacturing and retailer cut

I'm pretty sure it wouldnt be difficult to get costs on this

[Fifstar]

-like shipping, manufacturing and retailer cut

I'm pretty sure it wouldnt be difficult to get costs on this

?

That's what I wanted to say.

[Momo]

The places that do these breakdowns are usually more interested in just the price of the tech inside, they can't be arsed as to the total cost to business.

[Momo]

R&D is pretty impossible to estimate I think, it's not like we'd ever know the extent of the R&D and which R&D they attribute to which product.

Manufacturing cost (assuming this factory only assembles this one thing) i'd estimate at (total cost of salaries)/number of product +25% (to cover stuff like misc materials etc). Thats my best guess, it's very speculative and makes unreasonable assumptions.

[Fifstar]

Well it's almost impossible to put r&d and marketing into a price and cost per unit equation. Could probably only been done after a generation is done with a comparison of dollars spent on advertising/r&d per unit sold and win/loss per unit.

To me the comparison was more about what has the company to spent on a unit vs what they are charging. That may be a bit dumb, because obviously for the companies only the baseline with all costs included matters, but most people seem to get worked up over the difference between direct costs and price of the system.

Regarding the manufacturing costs, I assumed that the costs of production typical consumer products wouldn't be that hard to estimate for someone in the know, given how many similar products are built in Taiwan or China under similar circumstances; at least to the level of estimation on the cost of the tech parts (e.g. there is a certain scope of negotation involved). Maybe I'm totally wrong there.

[Momo]

If you are desperate enough for information you can always source a quote from foxconn or whatever to build a hypothetical device of similar complexity.   

[maxy]

http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/05/03/is-microsoft-already-manufacturing-the-next-xbox

The next Xbox console is apparently in the manufacturing stages. According to an IGN source, assembly of the next-generation Xbox hardware started recently at the Austin, Texas branch of Flextronics. This is the same electronics company currently assembling Xbox 360 hardware, and is the manufacturer of the original Xbox.

Prior to reaching the manufacturing stage, Flextronics created a new testing group separate from the rest of the company. This team was solely dedicated to comprehensive marketing, software, and hardware tests of the next Xbox. With that activity concluded, Flextronics started building the hardware -- but that doesn’t necessarily mean we’ll see the Durango soon.

Texas?

Rumors say that updated next Xbox dev kits are expected in August.

[maxy]

Some shocking news,courtesy of Mr.Pachter

MS told him that their E3 focus is on services over games. .Chance of 720 at E3 is like zero.

Sony is planning to launch first--from his talks with Sony,MS


fwiw some people still stand at something new at E3,outside of WiiU

[Momo]

Sony shot first

[maxy]

I want some juicy next gen trailers,dammit



 

[Himu]

THis may be the wrong hobby for you maxy