Author Topic: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw  (Read 937713 times)

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Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10380 on: May 11, 2020, 08:30:35 PM »
https://twitter.com/people/status/1260001704453574656

Expecting in Dec. Probably explains why Lynch's WM match wasn't that crazy.

nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10381 on: May 11, 2020, 08:33:34 PM »
street profits vs vikings in basketball :foxx

El Babua

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10382 on: May 11, 2020, 08:55:46 PM »
Especially embarrassing when it was after your father got pancaked by some chubby French Canadian  :doge

nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10383 on: May 11, 2020, 09:09:17 PM »
raw so hard up for heels they are calling corbin over to fight drew

and charlotte on smackdown :lol cabrona killing the brand split

nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10384 on: May 11, 2020, 09:18:06 PM »
:rejoice :drudge iiconics back bitches :drudge :rejoice


nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10386 on: May 11, 2020, 10:01:46 PM »
seth is now a sad dad :gloomy

Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10387 on: May 11, 2020, 10:14:44 PM »
Seth poked Rey's eyes out with the steps..
 Yikes

dkdk

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10388 on: May 11, 2020, 10:31:23 PM »
this basketball bit is awesome

nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10389 on: May 11, 2020, 10:37:18 PM »
the fat dude dunking it :rofl

now time for nattie to die rip

nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10390 on: May 11, 2020, 10:52:33 PM »
edge looking better without the gray/white beard

nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10391 on: May 11, 2020, 11:01:48 PM »
that closing line what the fuck :rofl


Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10393 on: May 11, 2020, 11:33:16 PM »

bork

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10394 on: May 12, 2020, 12:09:01 AM »
How can the man be pregnant? :thinking
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Tripon

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bork

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10396 on: May 12, 2020, 12:44:00 AM »
Their Twitter has Drew as the banner and is full of Raw stuff- brand split over?
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bork

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Pissy F Benny

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10398 on: May 12, 2020, 07:26:31 AM »
Better character models than wwe 2k20 :lol
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nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10399 on: May 12, 2020, 10:17:30 AM »
Their Twitter has Drew as the banner and is full of Raw stuff- brand split over?
probably temporarily suspended since everyone is in the same place and they are missing a bunch of folks

drew and corbin having a match next week and charlotte is on sd friday so they are just putting names on whatever show they can

bork

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10400 on: May 12, 2020, 03:31:40 PM »
Asuka and most of the crew didn't know Becky was pregnant- Asuka definitely broke character there for a minute, lol.

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Pissy F Benny

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10401 on: May 12, 2020, 03:56:07 PM »
God I hope Trump decrees that we need our crowds back :trumps

The empty arena stuff is painful to watch :tocry
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Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10402 on: May 12, 2020, 09:40:52 PM »

nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10403 on: May 12, 2020, 10:03:25 PM »
i forgot he calls corbin "possum" :lol

Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10404 on: May 12, 2020, 10:17:03 PM »
i forgot he calls corbin "possum" :lol

I was trying to figure out who was Possum was for most of the video.

Tripon

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« Last Edit: May 13, 2020, 01:14:06 AM by Tripon »

Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10406 on: May 13, 2020, 03:17:27 AM »
Got back into wrestling after months of delay. Wow. I've missed wrestling.

I started tonight by watching this years Mania, part 1. It's awkward without a crowd but I loved it anyways. Then I watched part of my first Nitro ever, the show that got me into wrasslin. I had a fucking BLAST watching it. Then I watched some old faves like Owen vs Bret (WMX) and Austin vs Rock.

I'll finish Mania part 2 tomorrow and then Mondays Raw. I'll also be watching NXT and AEW.

Basically tomorrow will be nothing but wrasslin. I really need it now to destress.

The fact that they have every Nitro and basically every Raw on the WWE Network is insane. All this for 10 bucks a month. One of the best deals I've ever fucking seen.

Once I'm caught up on WWE and NXT I'm catching up on NJPW. So basically two or three years of PPVs.
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Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10407 on: May 13, 2020, 03:27:28 AM »
If I have a critique on modern WWE style after years away and watching lots of 90's wrestling tonight it's that so much of the modern WWE style feels too choreographed and fake. I admit I'm a big fan of the simple beat the shit out of them style from the 90's, chairshots excluded. I like the the raw strong arming style over flips and stuff. A lot of the pace of modern WWE matches is predictable. Especially when it's a tag match. I dunno. Although I critique I still enjoy it after time away (four years).
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Tripon

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Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10409 on: May 13, 2020, 09:01:43 PM »
I'm not impressed with the psychology or in ring storytelling by any of the matches at this years Mania. It's flat out average. I'm not sure if this is a result of covid and them limiting the stories (doubtful) or due to the lack of a crowd (also doubtful) but it's mediocre and feels no different than Raw wrestling.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2020, 09:06:45 PM by Cindi Mayweather »
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Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10410 on: May 13, 2020, 09:20:05 PM »
I hate WWE's characterizations. Almost every heel is a chicken shit. STOP. Let me get this straight. Seth fucking Rollins squares up with KO and the first thing he does is run away as soon as the bell rings? I had to deal with five fucking minutes of Sami Zayn do chicken shit and run away from Bryan. FUCK.

For comparison.



« Last Edit: May 13, 2020, 09:34:10 PM by Cindi Mayweather »
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Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10411 on: May 13, 2020, 09:28:35 PM »
lmao, AEW going to do a 5v5 match in the Jacksonville Jaguars stadium. That's going to be so bad. I want to watch it.

Edit: AEW going to fly in Mike Tyson and risk Corona so he can present a mid card belt.  :corona_mj
« Last Edit: May 13, 2020, 09:38:32 PM by Tripon »

Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10412 on: May 13, 2020, 09:36:00 PM »
The Bret vs Owen match also shows how utterly PISS POOR modern WWE in ring psychology truly is. Owen starts out attacking Bret's neck. Sharp shooter places tension on where? THE NECK. So he leads up every attack that hurts the neck, either via punch or a hold. Then he does a TOMBSTONE. Bret ends up hitting his leg against something so he transitions from neck (which is already believably hurt) to that leg. So you keep on thinking "when he gets a sharpshooter on, it's gonna wreck Bret."

Meanwhile Bret fucks with Owen psychologically by doing quick pins out of nowhere to tire him.

So you have a back and forth. Bret's injuries vs Owen's endurance. Then Owen flips it and doesn't even win via the sharpshooter but reverses it on Bret and does a quick pin. The match delicately plays with the viewers expectations and just crashes the storytelling with an in-ring plot twist.

Then you have someone like Okada. Okada's finisher is the Rainmaker - a simple clothesline. Except EVERY. SINGLE. MOVE in his moveset ATTACKS THE NECK.

So he's got:

- A DDT



- a fucking jumping kick



- A tombstone



He goes at the neck so hard that when you see a Rainmaker you can truly feel it.



That's the sell.

And if the opponent kicks out of it despite that it makes the match even more hype because of all he's done to their upper head.

With modern WWE I am not seeing this classical in-ring storytelling or psychology. It's truly bizarre and average wrestle work that doesn't sell me on wins or losses, which completely makes me less invested in the match.

If I were to rate the matches from this years Mania I would give them a D. I can only hope the low quality is due to the coronavirus or maybe I forgot how average WWE's wrestling truly is.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2020, 09:42:15 PM by Cindi Mayweather »
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El Babua

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10413 on: May 13, 2020, 09:42:37 PM »
A serious problem for WWE has always been them emphasizing a certain sort of in-ring style. Safe, with a certain tone and formula - unless it's a PPV match. And even if it is a PPV match, wrestling psychology is pretty much dead there lol

It's gotten more pronounced now that they have the performance center churning out talent that all work the same way.

Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10414 on: May 13, 2020, 09:52:31 PM »
A serious problem for WWE has always been them emphasizing a certain sort of in-ring style. Safe, with a certain tone and formula - unless it's a PPV match. And even if it is a PPV match, wrestling psychology is pretty much dead there lol

It's gotten more pronounced now that they have the performance center churning out talent that all work the same way.

It feels like a few years ago there was still some psychology. Take Daniel Bryan's moveset. Like his yes kicks attack attack the head which leads to his LeBell Lock, which is a submission that puts strain on the head. But even within Daniel Bryan's match I'm not seeing any of that kind of stuff. It's so disappointing.

Seth vs KO thankfully had psychology so I wasn't bored.

Best match was Taker vs Styles. The entire Mania should have been taped like that.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2020, 11:20:38 PM by Cindi Mayweather »
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Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10415 on: May 13, 2020, 10:27:03 PM »
I simply do not understand it.

Let's look at Stone Cold Steve Austin's moveset.



Every single attack hits the upper body or the spine. He's got a DDT in that moveset as well. The Stunner is great, but the stunner without this arrangement of moves doesn't sell unless they're jobbers. What makes the Stunner so devastating is Stone Cold hitting you with a spine buster and then doing an elbow drop on your fucking neck after punching the shit out of your face. So when he puts that Stunner on your back and neck are fucking DONE. A finisher is only supposed to help balance and support a move set. This is what makes a complete wrestler and helps sell a storyline inside the confines of a match.

It's a simple moveset but it has a logical sense of flow.

Despite being known for more brutal, hardcore wrestling the Attitude Era might just have overall actual better wrestling than today's spot fests.



/ralph wiggum voice

"I like spot fests!"
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nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10416 on: May 13, 2020, 11:38:46 PM »
:leon


Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10417 on: May 14, 2020, 10:39:30 AM »
AEW was okay, but Jake Roberts running a heel promo on women in general was  :delicious

Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10418 on: May 14, 2020, 10:47:26 AM »
AEW is in front of a crowd again? Jesus Christ.
IYKYK

Pissy F Benny

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10419 on: May 14, 2020, 10:53:57 AM »
i think its just some of the wrestlers/crew not a public crowd :yeshrug
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Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10420 on: May 14, 2020, 10:54:16 AM »
I simply do not understand it.

Let's look at Stone Cold Steve Austin's moveset.



Every single attack hits the upper body or the spine. He's got a DDT in that moveset as well. The Stunner is great, but the stunner without this arrangement of moves doesn't sell unless they're jobbers. What makes the Stunner so devastating is Stone Cold hitting you with a spine buster and then doing an elbow drop on your fucking neck after punching the shit out of your face. So when he puts that Stunner on your back and neck are fucking DONE. A finisher is only supposed to help balance and support a move set. This is what makes a complete wrestler and helps sell a storyline inside the confines of a match.

It's a simple moveset but it has a logical sense of flow.

Despite being known for more brutal, hardcore wrestling the Attitude Era might just have overall actual better wrestling than today's spot fests.

(Image removed from quote.)

/ralph wiggum voice

"I like spot fests!"

I hate to break it to you, but Austin's moveset in particular was not built around psychology to set up the stunner, it was pretty much the same stuff he was doing in the early 90s but with more brawling thrown in after the neck and knee injuries. Also...the sharpshooter is primarily lower back focused, although sometimes overly portrayed as a leg hold. It's a fancy boston crab, why do you think it's a neck hold?  ???

Psychology and storytelling are overused buzzwords that I think often even people in the wrestling business don't really understand. Psychology and storytelling aren't about moves. There are only a handful of in ring "stories" in pro wrestling and they're all very simple templates:

Straight wrestling contest
Good guy struggles against bad guy cheating
Good guy struggles against bigger bad guy who may or may not be cheating
Good guy out for revenge
Younger talent vs Vet
Squash matches
Spot fests
Bloodfeud


None of those except spot fests are really about the moves themselves, but the ebbs and flow of momentum swings and changes. Selling and being able to garner empathy or hatred is is more important than your moveset being built from the ground up to make your finish work better. Now, does that help? It can. Using Okada as an example, yeah his moveset is all built around moves to set up the Rainmaker, but it's the personality and passion and ebbs and flows in his matches, not that the dropkick sets up the Rainmaker but when he hits the dropkick in terms of story beats that makes it work the way it does.

I myself have shit on Ric Flair a lot in a lot of places over his shitty psychology, but he's the prime example of why "psychology" is misunderstood and bogged down in details when pro wrestling isn't about details but emotion and momentum. Basically 3 generations of people in and out of the business consider him the GOAT. But his "psychology" was trash. 90% of his offense had nothing to do with the figure four, his matches rarely ever built up to a MOVE finish, a lot of his heat segments were really pretty aimless in terms of what he was physically doing, and he frequently used his template of a match and just plugged guys into what he did.

But it always worked because 1. His personality was entertaining as a heel or a face so crowds always wanted to see him 2. His matches were built like roller coasters of the slow clicking ride up the hill (his heat segments) followed by a short burst of a steep drop or loop (the face explodes back), followed by slowing things back down to build back up for another drop or loop, followed by slowing things back down, then a sprint to an often out of control finish and halting stop. The actual moves and what they were building to didn't matter, because the psychology was just to take the audience on an up and down ride. Ricky Steamboat was also an expert at this, as his "psychology" in terms of moves was pretty scattershot (like 80% of his matches ended with roll ups or the crossbody, which were built to by...chops and arm drags, see what I mean?) but his selling and being able to take audiences on the emotional ride was far more important than the moves themselves. And that's why when you combine Ric Flair and Ricky Steamboat, you get greatness.


This is also why Terry is much better than Dory, why Hogan/Mach drew much more than HBK/Bret, why Dusty was such a big draw despite having such a bad body and not much in ring skill, why Eddie was more beloved than Benoit (pre-deaths of course), why Rey was more over than 100 other lucha dudes who did the same stuff or crazier stuff. Of course there are subdivisions for the templates and different countries have different styles, expectations, and audiences. But even in Japan, the guys who became the biggest stars from Rikidozan all the way through Okada were guys whose matches were about emotional rides as opposed to getting bogged down in every move making perfect sense and building to specific finisher. Okada's 50 step finishing stretches aren't about the moves and counters themselves, but the excitement of building to something finally hitting and ending the fight. There are a million guys that are technically perfect, all their moves make sense for their finish, but those have never been the guys to be big stars anywhere in the world no matter the style.

I'm explaining why I personally get enjoyment out of some wrestlers movesets which helps sell the story for me. I have no idea what it is but I feel like I'm watching neutered wrestling and this is Wrestlemania. I swear the wrestling quality was much better even just a few years ago. But maybe my own fandom clouded it. I don't know. I'm bored.

And in no way am I saying it's just the moves. I watched Austin vs Rock matches and there's far less psychology than a Bret Hart match. Ultimately I love wrestling as a story and so many matches in Mania ended abruptly, had no sense of flow, no lead up or even a climax. The match just ends.

Is it because of Covid?

I'm really hoping that NXT is still on the ball because :snore
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Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10421 on: May 14, 2020, 10:57:05 AM »
A serious problem for WWE has always been them emphasizing a certain sort of in-ring style. Safe, with a certain tone and formula - unless it's a PPV match. And even if it is a PPV match, wrestling psychology is pretty much dead there lol

It's gotten more pronounced now that they have the performance center churning out talent that all work the same way.

My last favorite PPV match gimmick became the whole endlessly kicking out of finishers for an "epic" match. That shit seems to be their go to for event matches and I sleep.

This can be handled well if done right. Tanahashi usually does like 5-6 frog splashes in big matches and it just works.
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Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10422 on: May 14, 2020, 11:11:29 AM »
I figured it'd still have Wrestlemania quality. I mean, why do it otherwise if it's not?
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Pissy F Benny

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10423 on: May 14, 2020, 12:09:07 PM »
Wrestlemania was worth it for the boneyard match, the rest may as well have not happened :lol
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nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10424 on: May 14, 2020, 12:34:36 PM »
It was kind of like the SD/Raws immediately after 9/11 that were WE'RE HERE TO ENTERTAIN YOU IN THESE TRYING TIMES but happened to be WM
pretty much exactly what prichard said on his show about wm

Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10425 on: May 14, 2020, 02:36:00 PM »

Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10426 on: May 14, 2020, 02:56:31 PM »


I need to start watching that show. Is it WWE focused?
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Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10427 on: May 14, 2020, 03:09:51 PM »


I need to start watching that show. Is it WWE focused?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Side_of_the_Ring

Half seem to focus on WWE parts, half is other promotions. New Jack is focused more on his ECW run. Herb Abrams focused on his failed promotion that was the UWF.

Human Snorenado

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10428 on: May 14, 2020, 04:57:15 PM »
Wrestlemania was worth it for the boneyard match, the rest may as well have not happened :lol

That and the single greatest moment in the history of our sport, the Firefly Fun House Match
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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10429 on: May 14, 2020, 05:45:09 PM »
i don’t think there is anything that sums up the fall of the biz as much as aew cultists pretending Dallas from TNA aka the trailer park test is a big deal :tocry
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Human Snorenado

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10430 on: May 14, 2020, 06:07:19 PM »
AEW stans/people that hate anything WWE does (a Venn diagram of which is a single overlapping circle, natch)
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Tripon

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10432 on: May 14, 2020, 06:24:52 PM »
People just don't have, for lack of a better term, the "bandwidth" to give a shit about wrasslin seriously right now. The lack of crowd reaction doesn't help in a lot of situations, tho honestly as I was watching the RAW after mania I did have the thought "it's nice not having to hear these fucking morons chant for CM Punk for 3 hours"
yar

nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10433 on: May 14, 2020, 11:23:33 PM »
nwa super power available on youtube and is pre-corona footage so there's actually a crowd 8)


Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10434 on: May 15, 2020, 01:43:30 AM »
Holy shit, NWA has the best crowd lighting, belts, and feel than any other American fed right now. :o
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bork

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10435 on: May 15, 2020, 02:53:54 AM »
EDIT: In regards to people not giving a shit about wrasslin right now, I am at an all time low interest in watching ANY wrestling, even old classic shit. Absolutely no interest whatsoever. I checked in for WM and the MITB match but you couldn't get me to watch a wrestling show right now.

Same, at least in regards to the current shows.
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nachobro

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10436 on: May 15, 2020, 09:03:37 AM »
Holy shit, NWA has the best crowd lighting, belts, and feel than any other American fed right now. :o
yeah power is easily my favorite show. its stopped production for now but its all on youtube for a catch up

Human Snorenado

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10437 on: May 15, 2020, 01:37:29 PM »
Holy shit, NWA has the best crowd lighting, belts, and feel than any other American fed right now. :o

BISH I *TOLD* YOU TO WATCH IT FOREVER AGO
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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: When It Reigns, It Bores
« Reply #10438 on: May 15, 2020, 01:50:26 PM »
time to begin the nwa power journey 8)

NWA airs 24/7 on youtube dot com baybayyyy. start it off here:



Himu

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Re: Pro Wrasslin' Thread: I don't know what I just saw
« Reply #10439 on: May 15, 2020, 02:03:34 PM »
Yeah it was two months ago. I didn't watch it though. You guys basically gave me the rundown on the current wrasslin status quo. I didn't follow up on it and delayed. But now I'm watching in earnest. I basically procrastinated. I'll watch Power today.
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