GAMERGATE: Both Sides Have The Same Melt Value

[Rufus]

Men resort to physical violence a lot more readily than women, I think that goes uncontested. Now wether that's due to our biological make-up or cultural influence, eh, dunno.

List of spree killers in the western world, because it's easier to guess the gender of the perpetrators:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rampage_killers_%28Americas%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rampage_killers_%28Europe%29
School massacres specifically, worldwide:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rampage_killers_%28school_massacres%29

Honestly, I'd rather it be a cultural thing than a biological make-up thing.

PS: It's about ethics in video games journalism.

[Mr. Gundam]

Psychotic worldview? Wow, I'd love to live in your little bubble society.

[I'm a Puppy!]

Women only get 75% of the kills that men do.

[Rufus]

So what's your position then?

[I'm a Puppy!]

Meh, she's just an apologist it's what they do.
But I do sorta have to agree with her here. She's not saying "Men are toxic therefore they kill more people" She's saying the way that society raises men is toxic. And yeah in this case I agree. If men weren't expected to just "be men and just toughen up" maybe a lot of these killers would've gotten the help they needed.  Of all the arguments she makes I think this is one of the most salient (and I tend to think her arguments are sophmorish tripe)

[Mr. Gundam]

I see this mentality a lot with students at both middle and high school. I feel that she can be sensationalist with her wording, but it's still a valid criticism and concern.

So too soon, then. Then let's separate the comment from the shooting and talk about it more as a societal issue. Do you still disagree with it?

[I'm a Puppy!]

There's a difference in saying "This guys political ideals lead him to murder" and saying "If we allowed men to express their feelings and get help easier we'd see less of these."

as to "treating men as an evil to be solved" well, like I said, she's an apologist.

[Great Rumbler]

Kindly point to me where she is talking specifically about this one, singular event and not the rash of shootings of the past decade as a generalized whole.

[I'm a Puppy!]

TBH, if we were going to attack various aspects of toxic gender interactions as the root cause of mass violence i think i'd go toward attitudes towards women more than therapy. Seung Hui Cho and Aaron Rodger for example  were receiving therapy and mental help. There were indicators with all of them to indicate that they might become a threat to others. They both were reeling from various expectations about getting laid and what women should be/do.

Yeah, but I'd argue a therapist would've been like "No dude. That's not ok." and dealt with it.
Of course there's a lot more to it than just the mental health thing. There's, as you said, attitudes towards women. Feelings of ineadequacy and the feeling that showing extreme masuclinity is the only way to "fit in". There's the expectations laid upon men in general. And I'd also add on to that this narrative that views men only as either inept idiots or predators.

[Mr. Gundam]

TBH, if we were going to attack various aspects of toxic gender interactions as the root cause of mass violence i think i'd go toward attitudes towards women more than therapy. Seung Hui Cho and Aaron Rodger for example  were receiving therapy and mental help. There were indicators with all of them to indicate that they might become a threat to others. They both were reeling from various expectations about getting laid and what women should be/do.

Prole had a nice Facebook post echoing this sentiment yesterday. The rise of the internet and social media really has shone a light on this expectation that women should just give to it you since you've worked hard and "deserve it." That's not how the real world works, rejection sucks but you don't deserve anything from anyone.

[Human Snorenado]

Argue with the absolutist lunatic with no feelings, brehs

[I'm a Puppy!]

You do him wrong dude. JayDubya totally feels contempt.

[Human Snorenado]

It's funny that we're not allowed to examine race relations for patterns that might explain shitty behavior in JD's world, but in gender relations when it bugs him then it's ok!

[Great Rumbler]

immediately using a tragedy to push her agenda

[Great Rumbler]

The kid who did that shooting was a homecoming king who was facing rejection from a girl he wanted to go out with but who didn't want to go out with him. But, sure, twisted masculine expectations definitely had nothing to do with this and Anita Sarkeesian is a horrible person who is just using this as fodder in her crusade to destroy all men because she thinks they are rapists.

[Great Rumbler]

The kid who did that shooting was a prom king who was facing rejection from a girl he wanted to go out with but who didn't want to go out with him. But, sure, twisted masculine expectations definitely had nothing to do with this and Anita Sarkeesian is a horrible person who is just using this as fodder in her crusade to destroy all men because she thinks they are rapists.

Evil assholes who don't care about the rights of others are impossible, obviously. 

Where do you think those come from in the first place?

This kid wasn't borne out of some vacuum, he was raised in and around the beliefs and expectations of his parents, his peers, the media, and society. Now, none of these things together or separately "forced" him into this act, but maybe, just maybe, they had an influence on the person he was at the moment he pulled the trigger, and maybe, just maybe, focusing on at least one of these particular factors might stop someone else from falling down that same hole one day in the future.

[Great Rumbler]

An individual making moral choices.

Should've known this was where we'd end up eventually.

[Human Snorenado]

An individual making moral choices.

Should've known this was where we'd end up eventually.

It exists because it does!

 

[Human Snorenado]

ALL MEN ARE BORN ON AN ISLAND, ALONE IN THIS UNIVERSE

ALL CHOICES ARE BINARY AND PRESENTED TO YOU FREE FROM ANY PAST INFLUENCES OR ENVIRONMENTS

You know, I used to think libertopians just had no use for society, but I think I've finally realized that they don't even think it ever existed.

[Great Rumbler]

That kid was obviously torn from the thigh of Zeus, a fully formed 16-teen year old with all the knowledge and wisdom of the universe. It's unfortunate that he decided, free of outside influence, to purposefully make the wrong choice.

[Mr. Gundam]

The kid who did that shooting was a prom king who was facing rejection from a girl he wanted to go out with but who didn't want to go out with him. But, sure, twisted masculine expectations definitely had nothing to do with this and Anita Sarkeesian is a horrible person who is just using this as fodder in her crusade to destroy all men because she thinks they are rapists.

Evil assholes who don't care about the rights of others are impossible, obviously. 

As ever, it's society's fault.  "Rape culture" and "privilege" must have made him do it.   

The concept of privilege sure does grind your gears. Could you tell me why? Honest question. Just as you don't understand me, I don't understand you and would like to get it, even if I might disagree.

[Great Rumbler]

Don't be silly, as we all know it must have been video games that desensitized him to violence and hating women.  Because entertainment magically makes you do things, that's just science.

You help an alcoholic with therapy, medication, and support, not by banning alcohol.

[Human Snorenado]

Don't be silly, as we all know it must have been video games that desensitized him to violence and hating women.  Because entertainment magically makes you do things, that's just science.

You help an alcoholic with therapy, medication, and support, not by banning alcohol.

There's no such thing as alcoholism, only CHOICES AND CONSEQUENCES

[TakingBackSunday]

Christ, Jaydub must be a bundle of chucklefucks to be around IRL

[benjipwns]

See all the problems the state causes?

Just give in.

To Bob Avakian.

And synthesis. A new synthesis.  Drawing from a broad range of human experience. Synthesis. A viable vision.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Synthesis

[close]

[I'm a Puppy!]

So I'm confused.  Are videogames making everyone violent And misogynists or not? What's the current fad? Let me know and I'll jump on that bandwagon

[I'm a Puppy!]

Cool. So I should kick start that Jack Thompson fan club now right?

[FoneBone]

breaking: JayDubs still so out of touch with reality as to believe Anita is anything resembling "radical" in her views

psychotic worldview  ... Nuttier than a fruitcake.

You would be the expert there.

You're agreeing with the nutball politicizing and postulating the instant some random shooting happened somewhere, saying that isn't radical, and you think you can comment on my sanity.

Kindly fuck right off.

She's completely off the reservation.  Yes, I realize GAF was full of lunatic fringe leftists like you, and that was an unfortunate period of my life... trying to be reasonable with an insane asylum.  To you, talk about "privilege" and what not actually somehow seems reasonable in the void betwixt your ears.

Aw, I missed you, too.

[Himu]

I thought we already knew that libertarians are sociopaths?

Perhaps more intriguingly, when libertarians reacted to moral dilemmas and in other tests, they displayed less emotion, less empathy and less disgust than either conservatives or liberals. They appeared to use “cold” calculation to reach utilitarian conclusions about whether (for instance) to save lives by sacrificing fewer lives. They reached correct, rather than intuitive, answers to math and logic problems, and they enjoyed “effortful and thoughtful cognitive tasks” more than others do.

http://professional.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444358804578016291138331904.html

[FoneBone]

The Sarkeesian Effect: A Measured Response

[Rufus]

Cool. So I should kick start that Jack Thompson fan club now right?

Thompson actually believes that it's a cause and effect relationship and called for censorship. I don't remember much in the way of cultural critique from him, though I could be wrong. I don't think Sarkeesian has ever claimed video games cause misogyny, only that they lean on misogynistic tropes.

[Himu]

that's a yt video btw. fonebone we can link yt vids here.

[doctavius bonbon]

every one of aurini's videos is unintentionally hilarious.

[Himu]

um that bald goth guy is giving me gay vibes

devo back me up

[I'm a Puppy!]

um that bald goth guy is giving me gay vibes

devo back me up

Not just gay but like angry dirty gay

[Barry Egan]

I thought we already knew that libertarians are sociopaths?

Among other definitions, sociopathy is having no sense of right and wrong and / or having no respect for the rights of others.

I don't usually find "moral dilemma scenarios" to have much actual dilemma in them, because the morally correct choice is obvious.

Being able to rationally analyze things and always respect the rights of others regardless of whether you like them or their death would save 10 others... is hardly indicative of sociopathy.


But there I go, treating your post like it was serious or on-topic, when it was just a throw away ad hom.

what was your childhood like?

[doctavius bonbon]

um that bald goth guy is giving me gay vibes

devo back me up

[nudemacusers]

um that bald goth guy is giving me gay vibes

devo back me up

Not just gay but like angry dirty gay

you have awoken the beast within me

[Tasty]

that's a yt video btw. fonebone we can link yt vids here.

Is JayDub one of these guys?

[Positive Touch]

jaydub is all of those guys

[TakingBackSunday]

I'm sure you think that all the time, though

[FoneBone]

I'm sure you think that all the time, though

No, he just thinks about "those" "parasites" on welfare

[recursivelyenumerable]

if when all is said & done gamergate somehow culminates in bob avakian coming out on top that'd be great.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

how does this thread keep getting worse

[Great Rumbler]

If you're "disgusted" with me for calling out what is indisputably and nakedly awful politicizing of a tragedy, then you're the one(s) who is (are) disgusting, full stop.

I appreciate this episode if only because it established why Anita S. is a nutball unworthy of any further attention.

So, she isn't wrong, it's just improper timing. Okay, gotcha.

[Great Rumbler]

Talking about gender issues and raising an interest in them is kinda Anita Sarkeesian's thing, I don't know if you realized that yet or not.

[TakingBackSunday]

but, like, what a nutter amirite

[Barry Egan]

It's a gender issue because it is.  How's that for an argument Jaydub?

[Rahxephon91]

Probably sitting inside watching Neon Genesis Evangelion.

That's my childhood. Really good show. Really relatable.

[Howard Alan Treesong]

hope you're hongry

the buffet is now open

Gamergate Supporters Partied at a Strip Club This Weekend

[Himu]

BEBPO IS A GAME GATER NOOOOO

[Mr. Gundam]

BEBPO IS A GAME GATER NOOOOO

Huh?

[D3RANG3D]

Wait there are girls who are gaters too?

[Himu]

Click the link treesong posted and find BEBPO in the pic near the top

[Howard Alan Treesong]

Click the link treesong posted and find BEBPO in the pic near the top

what are you talking abOH MY GOD

[Human Snorenado]

First paragraph is...

Friday night at the Show Palace Gentlemen’s Club in Long Island City, Queens, a high school senior named Dieter wearing a striped blue button-down tucked into creased khakis slumped in a plush red chair, underwhelmed by his first-ever strip club experience. “I’m not as aroused as I expected. I pretty much had a woman shove a vagina in my face and it did nothing,” he said. “I guess all the porn got to me.”

[Himu]

[Howard Alan Treesong]

if he thought THIS was disappointing, just wait until he interacts with a woman in a non-strip club environment!

[Howard Alan Treesong]

A Trip to the Gent-L-man's Club

[Kara]

See all the problems the state causes?

Just give in.

To Bob Avakian.

And synthesis. A new synthesis.  Drawing from a broad range of human experience. Synthesis. A viable vision.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Synthesis

[close]

I find your lack of faith in dialectics... disturbing.