Author Topic: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread  (Read 17168 times)

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Mandark

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #240 on: December 21, 2019, 07:52:44 PM »
being a densely populated country makes it easier to lower emissions, not harder

ya dumbfuck

OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #241 on: December 21, 2019, 07:54:37 PM »
The challenge for our country has always been its size.

???

From this spot I can reach any of our borders within 3 hours or less.

:noooo

curly

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #242 on: December 21, 2019, 08:28:32 PM »
We must invade the Netherlands and put a stop to their emission of greenhouse gases and garbage posters

Mandark

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #243 on: December 21, 2019, 08:39:15 PM »
We're already at a 23% reduction since the 1990's

btw this is a lie

OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #244 on: December 21, 2019, 08:49:16 PM »
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-50864569

he probably is referring to
Quote
The highest court in the Netherlands has upheld a ruling requiring the government to slash greenhouse gas emissions by at least 25% of 1990 levels by the end of next year.

The case was brought six years ago by the Urgenda environment group in a bid to force ministers to go well beyond EU targets.

However, the chances of the government reaching the target look slim.

By the end of 2018, emissions were down only 15% on 1990 levels.

Dutch environment researchers believe that levels could be cut by 23% by the end of 2020 but believe the reduction could be as low as 19%.

run that by everyone 1 year from now, dutchie

Mandark

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #245 on: December 21, 2019, 08:51:51 PM »
I know, I looked it up.

The actual reduction so far is just under 15%.

Raist

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #246 on: December 22, 2019, 03:44:08 AM »
Let's be real. The NL could be covered by the Channel / North Sea tomorrow, and no one would notice. Or care.

Nintex

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #247 on: December 22, 2019, 02:36:39 PM »
We're already at a 23% reduction since the 1990's

btw this is a lie
I got it from RTL Nieuws. They made a calculation that we needed to close 1 or 2 coal plants that were due for closure.
It would cost 50 million to reimburse the energy companies that own the plants and it would make us more depended on German / Russian energy.

For their calculation they used the 23% expected reduction by 2020 if we stay on this course. So 25% would be attainable by closing 1 or 2 of those plants.

Here's the source:
https://www.rtlnieuws.nl/nieuws/nederland/artikel/4962261/urgenda-co2-nederlandse-staat

At the bottom there's a video below a line that says: "We've found the solution for the CO2 problem [...]"

Let's be real. The NL could be covered by the Channel / North Sea tomorrow, and no one would notice. Or care.
We are the second biggest agri-food exporter in the world.
You would notice the famines.

XENO

Rufus

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #248 on: December 22, 2019, 02:51:31 PM »
*in the EU, not the world.

And your watery tomatoes have no nutritional value, anyway. :ufup

OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #249 on: December 22, 2019, 02:56:14 PM »
Literally says "world" in the graphic...?
Or is it an implication of erroneous graphics.

Rufus

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #250 on: December 22, 2019, 03:18:48 PM »
It's an implication of my growing myopia. :fbm


OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #251 on: December 22, 2019, 03:21:01 PM »

Rufus

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #252 on: December 22, 2019, 03:26:32 PM »
:stahp

...Still, charting by monetary value has my BS sensors tingling. Not enough to look shit up, but I very much doubt that there'd be famines. Let's see the chart by volume or whatever. :hmph
« Last Edit: December 22, 2019, 03:38:09 PM by Rufus »

Mandark

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #253 on: December 22, 2019, 03:34:29 PM »
nintex, you said "already at"

which makes it a lie

OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #254 on: December 22, 2019, 03:37:05 PM »
:stahp

...Still, charting by monetary value has my BS sensors tingling. Not enough to look shit up, but I very much doubt that there'd be famines. Let's see the chart by volume or whatever. :hmph

Oh I for sure am a bit skeptical about it too so I floated the option of you challenging its veracity. But yeah, first, second, 11th, last agri-food exporter, whatever I don't care.

Rufus

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #255 on: December 22, 2019, 03:38:15 PM »
And exported from doesn't necessarily mean produced in, come to think of it. Imported then traded on goods would count as exports, too. :hmm
« Last Edit: December 22, 2019, 03:45:08 PM by Rufus »

Nintex

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #256 on: December 22, 2019, 03:51:45 PM »
:stahp

...Still, charting by monetary value has my BS sensors tingling. Not enough to look shit up, but I very much doubt that there'd be famines. Let's see the chart by volume or whatever. :hmph
You can learn more about how we do it here:
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/magazine/2017/09/holland-agriculture-sustainable-farming/

Basically our yields are much higher because of our efficient methods, innovation and technology.

But yeah whatever, just let the planet starve to death and waste tons more water with inefficient farming practices. Who needs the Dutch anyway :trumps
« Last Edit: December 22, 2019, 03:59:03 PM by Nintex »
XENO

OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #257 on: December 22, 2019, 04:00:13 PM »

Rufus

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #258 on: December 22, 2019, 04:11:19 PM »
That aritcle is thin on detail and only talks about value. Efficient farming is nice though, yeah.

Quote
The Dutch are also the world’s top exporter of potatoes and onions and the second largest exporter of vegetables overall in terms of value.
Value looks great, but by volume the Netherlands don't chart anywhere in the top 5. :hmm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_producing_countries_of_agricultural_commodities
(the cited source won't load for me :doge )

Quote
More than a third of all global trade in vegetable seeds originates in the Netherlands.
This though... Seeds must have a great value/weight ratio. Would help explain the discrepancy.

But yeah whatever, just let the planet starve to death and waste tons more water with inefficient farming practices. Who needs the Dutch anyway :trumps
It's these weasely superlatives that have me permantently side-eyeing anything you say.

Mandark

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #259 on: December 22, 2019, 04:25:35 PM »
Regional industrial cluster + capital intensive approach + focus on relatively higher value exports + access to EU market.

You're looking at overall production of staples vs. value of exports. A small country like NL is never going to show up on a list of top producers. On the flip side, larger countries are mostly using their production to feed themselves; food from Iowa and Nebraska shipped to New York doesn't count as an export.

Rufus

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #260 on: December 22, 2019, 04:40:16 PM »
You're looking at overall production of staples vs. value of exports. A small country like NL is never going to show up on a list of top producers.
I suspected it wouldn't, but the ranking by value had me doubting myself. The implication that anybody would starve if not for the NL is dubious, either way. That was my main point of contention.

Mandark

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #261 on: December 22, 2019, 06:06:59 PM »
You can make some inferences from the chart Nintex posted (from a top google result of "Netherlands agriculture exports") which are pretty quick to confirm and undermine his point.

Notice how meat and related products are a much bigger export than vegetables. For all the efficiency hype, it doesn't seem possible that the Netherlands produces the feed needed to support that. Sure enough, NL's the #3 importer of soybeans and #8 importer of corn. They can support a lot of livestock because they've outsourced the production of feed. Of course meat production is wildly inefficient and sacrificing all that feed for livestock is a net negative for the overall food supply.

So EU-hating Nintex is bragging about an agricultural sector that's wholly dependent on its place in a global supply chain* and oriented towards calorie-inefficient profit centers, while fantasizing that it's the world's breadbasket and we're all going to come begging them for food when shit goes down.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
*Kinda funny for a guy who fucking hates the EU and cheerleads for rightwing antiglobalism.
[close]

Raist

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #262 on: December 22, 2019, 06:23:22 PM »
We are the second biggest agri-food exporter in the world.
You would notice the famines.

(Image removed from quote.)

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

Yes, I'm sure you're some kind of wizards producing so much food for the world while you're probably in the bottom 50 countries in terms of land area, and it's got nothing to do with your ports ::)


Rufus

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #264 on: December 27, 2019, 07:45:42 AM »
The entire article is a bit handwavey and sparse on actual numbers (Britain used less stuff? Great. What about everywhere else? Re-forestation in developed nations? Great. What about globally?), but this bit had me rolling my eyes violently:
Quote
In fact, all this energy-saving might cause problems. Innovation requires experiments (most of which fail). Experiments require energy. So cheap energy is crucial — as shown by the industrial revolution. Thus, energy may be the one resource that a prospering population should be using more of. Fortunately, it is now possible that nuclear fusion will one day deliver energy in minimalist form, using very little fuel and land.
Probably. Any time now. It will be ready when we need it. Definitely maybe.

Until then, nothing bad will happen.

Nintex

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #265 on: December 27, 2019, 08:05:25 AM »
The article is right you know.

6 years:
Genesis '88
Game Gear '90
Sega CD '91
Sega Pico '93
32X '94
Saturn '94
+ various licensed models

6 years (reusing much of the same hardware, which is already reused PC hardware as opposed to a fully custom design):
Xbox One '13
Xbox One S/X '17
Xbox One D '19

Not to mention a lot of production processes are automated, saving more resources.
30 - 40 years ago, we didn't have recycling. Now we recycle pretty much everything and turn old things into new things.

Also imagine the resources we save by people and organizations who used to need a ton of resources to achieve their goals.
The USSR needed to upkeep an army of tens of thousands of military vehicles, tanks, planes, missiles, border fences, infantry weapons etc. to be relevant in geo politics.
All that can now be replaced by a single boi with a laptop with access to a Facebook ad account.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2019, 08:10:39 AM by Nintex »
XENO

Nintex

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #266 on: February 22, 2020, 02:37:52 PM »
Our government is investing in bio mass as a renewable energy source but we don't have that many large forests. And we aren't going to ruin our landscape.  :snob
So instead Dutch tax payers directly fund cutting down forests in the United States for our bio mass demand.  :trumps

https://twitter.com/tomvanteinde/status/1231138544040718337
XENO

Madrun Badrun

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #267 on: March 26, 2020, 10:52:44 AM »
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-52043554

Australia's Great Barrier Reef has suffered another mass bleaching event - the third in just five years.
NtGay

toku

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CatsCatsCats

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #270 on: April 15, 2020, 09:50:44 PM »
toku, get outta there

shosta

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Nintex

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #272 on: April 18, 2020, 06:49:50 AM »
Let the virus ride. Mother Nature is saving us from ourselves.

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD QUEEN
XENO

VomKriege

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #273 on: April 18, 2020, 10:45:42 AM »
https://www.ft.com/content/da821c64-b2f8-4119-afa1-fdafa9a57918

EU has awarded a contract to BlackRock to give them counsel on "green" regulations.
European green deputies are not happy about that, citing the assets they own in fossil energies, among other things.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2020, 11:49:53 AM by VomKriege »
ὕβρις

Rufus

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #274 on: April 18, 2020, 11:01:14 AM »
I can't muster a stupid Von der Leyen handing off to consultants joke.

Madrun Badrun

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #275 on: April 18, 2020, 11:45:32 AM »
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-52312260

Climate change: US megadrought 'already under way'


California is going to be one big fire this summer. 
NtGay

OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #276 on: April 18, 2020, 04:45:06 PM »
there is no reasoning with some people
got people talking out both corners of their mouth mid pandemic and people act surprised climate change skepticism is a big thing, some people will pied piper into a mass grave no matter the crisis

Stro

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #277 on: April 18, 2020, 04:53:04 PM »
https://twitter.com/johnmoralesnbc6/status/1250513598788575234

 :-\

Neat, Indiana went from 80 degrees 2 weeks ago to freeze warnings every night/morning and 10-25mph winds every fucking day for 2 god damn weeks now. It snowed twice this week.

OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #278 on: April 18, 2020, 04:56:48 PM »
here it hasn't gone above ~65 Fahrenheit in almost 7 months
snowed a bunch recently too


shosta

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #280 on: May 03, 2020, 03:55:55 PM »
no link on hand but new study out confirming Greenland ice melt is in exponential feedback territory now. Not "runaway" yet but pretty serious.
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OnlyRegret

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #281 on: June 23, 2020, 01:57:44 AM »

shosta

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #284 on: October 28, 2020, 10:04:31 AM »
 :piss :gaas :piss2
*****

Madrun Badrun

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NtGay



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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #288 on: April 01, 2021, 11:56:05 AM »
Whelp it was fun breathing air for a few decades.

Tasty

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #289 on: April 01, 2021, 12:11:39 PM »
Whelp it was fun breathing air for a few decades.


Transhuman

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #290 on: April 01, 2021, 12:12:57 PM »
The biggest thing you can do to decrease your carbon footprint is to stop eating meat.

So yeah, we're all doomed

Madrun Badrun

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #291 on: April 01, 2021, 12:46:24 PM »
I've reduced my meat consumption a lot over the last year, mostly because of environmental issues.
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Tasty

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #292 on: April 01, 2021, 01:42:37 PM »
I think I'll go fish + vegetarian in a few years. :)

BIONIC

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #293 on: April 01, 2021, 01:44:33 PM »
How about switching to man meat?  :drool  :shaq
Wine

Tasty

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #294 on: April 01, 2021, 01:58:50 PM »
How about switching to man meat?  :drool  :shaq

Too much protein.

Transhuman

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #295 on: April 01, 2021, 04:14:25 PM »
I think I'll go fish + vegetarian in a few years. :)

You can do it now, I believe in you

:heartbeat

Tasty

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #296 on: April 01, 2021, 04:26:28 PM »
I think I'll go fish + vegetarian in a few years. :)

You can do it now, I believe in you

:heartbeat

R-really? :uguu Have you given up red meat too?

Transhuman

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #297 on: April 01, 2021, 04:41:29 PM »
Full vegan. It ain't that hard tbh, even though I live somewhere where there isn't a lot of vegan options. Turning down free weed brownies though, I admit that hurt a lot

Tasty

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #298 on: April 01, 2021, 05:00:02 PM »
:uguu

Ok I promise to strongly consider it for my birthday in September. 😚 I'd have to have carve out a mom exception tho. :heart

It would be difficult to near impossible to give up dairy products and fish for me. 🐄🧈🥛🍨🐟🍣🦞🦀🦑🍤🍢

chronovore

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Re: Nothing is Constant Except Change: The Global Climate Thread
« Reply #299 on: April 01, 2021, 07:52:22 PM »
Meat is remarkably impractical to raise, and the increasing deforestation for cattle is harmful. Dairy and eggs are on a different scale, by several orders of magnitude. I'll never go vegan, but may go vegetarian. I'm already cutting back substantially on meat.