Laissez-faire Politics Thread - Praxis? I didn't play Deus Ex, sorry.

[team filler]

 

[Tripon]

https://twitter.com/famiconsumer/status/1205692843634782208

[Great Rumbler]

https://twitter.com/famiconsumer/status/1205692843634782208

[Rufus]

https://twitter.com/famiconsumer/status/1205692843634782208

Any flip-floppers who went from "it's secretly alt-right" to... this?

[curly]

[Kara]

any good articles etc on hypermodernity?

Aron Nimzowitsch's "My System"

[team filler]

 

[Kara]

Filler signal boosting Canary Mission.

[team filler]

https://twitter.com/qamaaraa/status/1205856826757177345

 

[OnlyRegret]

[Kara]

Will doubling down on BERNIE OR BARBARISM in this week's free Chapo.

I did nearly drive off the road when Matt described Melenchon as "anti-NATO, genuinely antisemitic" though.

[OnlyRegret]

demsocs ain't slick

https://twitter.com/kirstiealley/status/1207028067849396224

[Joe Molotov]

But Scientology tho, that's the good stuff.

[Brehvolution]

demsocs ain't slick

https://twitter.com/kirstiealley/status/1207028067849396224

Where did all these roads, bridges, farm subsidies, middle east nation building, and world police come from? 
You might not want to call is socialism, but it's still redistribution of wealth.

[jakefromstatefarm]

https://twitter.com/thefouchoe/status/1206964476056088579

[curly]

Will doubling down on BERNIE OR BARBARISM in this week's free Chapo.

I did nearly drive off the road when Matt described Melenchon as "anti-NATO, genuinely antisemitic" though.

Interesting how the only hopes for humankind are white succdems from the imperial core

[benjipwns]

https://twitter.com/TitaniaMcGrath/status/1206959362050265089

https://twitter.com/TitaniaMcGrath/status/1205256289816895490

 

spoiler (click to show/hide)

https://twitter.com/TitaniaMcGrath/status/1204187161140121600

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[benjipwns]

okay I quite liked this line: https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/december-2019/block-boris/

Everyone mocked Anna Soubry when she tweeted that Brexit is “the most important decision facing our country since WW3”, but I have no doubt whatsoever that Brexit could lead to a fourth world war. They won’t be laughing then.

[Kara]

Titania McGrath is a Spiked employee's joke alt.

This post brought to you by the Lunch Pail Doxer Gang.

[benjipwns]

Titania McGrath is a Spiked employee's joke alt.

Why would you go on the internet and tell lies like this, Kara? I really thought better of you.

[Kara]

Titania McGrath is a Spiked employee's joke alt.

Why would you go on the internet and tell lies like this, Kara? I really thought better of you.

It's OK I assume you don't read the "Funded by Koch" Slack channel you're in.

Speaking of, imagine going from being a Trot rag to this.

https://twitter.com/SayeedaWarsi/status/1207024669880135686

Is this Militant 2.0?

 

[OnlyRegret]

 
https://twitter.com/TitaniaMcGrath/status/1204800574602072066

[curly]

that account 

[curly]

Sam Kriss rose from the grave of canceldom to write about Corbynism and while it's 90% barely readable shit there are a few good nuggets hidden within:

The failure of Corbynism was a failure on the level of theory. It’s important to contextualise the decline of the Labour party. This wasn’t an isolated incident; the traditional centre-left is dying across Europe and across the world. Social-democratic politics are (mostly) a mass politics, and the last forty years have conspired to shatter all masses. Neoliberalism and deindustrialisation and the assault on the unions have disrupted collective subjects and collective solidarity – but new technologies do the same thing. Marxism was the ideological expression of the printed word, and we’re all illiterates now.

https://samkriss.com/2019/12/19/the-case-for-giving-up/

[curly]

It's all masturbatory with him. He was in the pits over the Brexit vote as well.

[Pissy F Benny]

I'm sure he was wiping his tears away with £50 notes in his dads million quid house 

[Kara]

One of my nü Labour mutuals mentioned him out of the blue the other day before the election so I went to his Twitter to see if he was back to posting and it was all Liberal Democrat retweets for the most part.

Then I went to his blog and read his post about antisemitism in the United KKKingdom and had a similar reaction to curly with the Corbyn post.

[curly]

That twitter's not him

[Kara]

  owned

[OnlyRegret]

google gave me this as the closest meme

[Kara]

http://www.thebore.com/forum/index.php?topic=46734.msg2751319#msg2751319

CW: the shite thread

benji, my version of this story involves convincing my lovable but clueless friend to run for school president in our senior year.

I wrote a pretty funny speech for him (even after it was censored by the mods school administrators--the speeches had to be preapproved ) that was the product of paying a nontrivial amount of attention during the prior 3 elections (nerd). I also had him deliver the speech in a particular manner to "heighten the comedy" (it didn't and it sucks that I asked him to do that).

He beat a cheerleader and some nerd and became president. The mods administrators passed a rule after the election that required klanidates give their speeches in their normal manner of speaking because of our campaign that I assume is still on the books.

One of my friend's new duties was to give morning announcements on our school's television channel. (Each of the other elected officials also had to do this on different days.) One week we had Wednesday and Friday off but not Thursday. That Thursday was of course going to be senior ditch day. He gave announcements on Monday or Tuesday with a girl in a different year. At the end of their broadcast she said, "Enjoy your 3 day weekend everyone!" and my friend deadass said, "And to you seniors, enjoy your 5 day weekend." She looked absolutely mortified as the feed cut to credits.

He of course got in hot water, became the object of much contempt by the senior class, and only the most foolish seniors didn't show up to school on Thursday.

There's probably a historical metaphor to make here but 99% of historical analogies are bullshit except for the ones that are developed by Friedrich Engels and Matt Karp.

[benjipwns]

everybody probably already seen this but it's new to me

[Great Rumbler]

everybody probably already seen this but it's new to me

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Slavs or western spies?

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Corn in the video so they are clearly revisionists

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[close]

[team filler]

https://twitter.com/RT_com/status/1208246968927080448

[team filler]

https://twitter.com/SameeraKhan/status/1208261407847960577

[Tripon]

https://twitter.com/chicxlunar/status/1208657704815738880

[Crash Dummy]

And here I thought g/acc was just a meme
https://twitter.com/stephaniehazen/status/1209559753854242816?s=21

[nachobro]

article sourced from
https://www.tsln.com/news/stangle-impossible-burgers-are-made-of-what/

By Dr. James Stangle, DVM

[team filler]

https://twitter.com/Garou_Hidalgo/status/1209690226907656192

 

[team filler]

[team filler]

https://twitter.com/jaymart222/status/1210266716128841731

[OnlyRegret]

https://twitter.com/JillFilipovic/status/1210666706449784832

https://twitter.com/ebruenig/status/1210603498917765121

[OnlyRegret]

https://twitter.com/feggnews/status/1210609694835953665

[Tripon]

https://twitter.com/jaymart222/status/1210266716128841731

https://twitter.com/CmndrBunny/status/1210638800122081280

[Great Rumbler]

https://twitter.com/feggnews/status/1210609694835953665

You can't abort a fetus, but you can put a child in a closet and let it starve to death.

[OnlyRegret]

https://twitter.com/feggnews/status/1210609694835953665

You can't abort a fetus, but you can put a child in a closet and let it starve to death.

bonus:

https://twitter.com/LeftIsBlest/status/1210611851043622912

[Tripon]

Don Hughes should be elevated to Wank Dad status.

[team filler]

https://twitter.com/ComradePraveenK/status/1211508426414538753

 

[team filler]

https://twitter.com/USAmbPoland/status/1211588565475430400

https://twitter.com/Garou_Hidalgo/status/1211751519869112320

[Tripon]

https://twitter.com/HarryShostta/status/1210043043975454721

Shosta's twitter account is wild.

[toku]

 

spoiler (click to show/hide)

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[OnlyRegret]

spent some time listening to conservative voting relatives veer into discussing how the rich avoid taxes over the holidays 

[team filler]

conservative relatives feeln dat bern 

[benjipwns]

https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2020/01/what-libertarianism-has-become-and-will-become-state-capacity-libertarianism.html

Having tracked the libertarian “movement” for much of my life, I believe it is now pretty much hollowed out, at least in terms of flow.  One branch split off into Ron Paul-ism and less savory alt right directions, and another, more establishment branch remains out there in force but not really commanding new adherents.  For one thing, it doesn’t seem that old-style libertarianism can solve or even very well address a number of major problems, most significantly climate change.  For another, smart people are on the internet, and the internet seems to encourage synthetic and eclectic views, at least among the smart and curious.  Unlike the mass culture of the 1970s, it does not tend to breed “capital L Libertarianism.”  On top of all that, the out-migration from narrowly libertarian views has been severe, most of all from educated women.

There is also the word “classical liberal,” but what is “classical” supposed to mean that is not question-begging?  The classical liberalism of its time focused on 19th century problems — appropriate for the 19th century of course — but from WWII onwards it has been a very different ballgame.

Along the way, I believe the smart classical liberals and libertarians have, as if guided by an invisible hand, evolved into a view that I dub with the entirely non-sticky name of State Capacity Libertarianism.  I define State Capacity Libertarianism in terms of a number of propositions:

1. Markets and capitalism are very powerful, give them their due.

2. Earlier in history, a strong state was necessary to back the formation of capitalism and also to protect individual rights (do read Koyama and Johnson on state capacity).  Strong states remain necessary to maintain and extend capitalism and markets.  This includes keeping China at bay abroad and keeping elections free from foreign interference, as well as developing effective laws and regulations for intangible capital, intellectual property, and the new world of the internet.  (If you’ve read my other works, you will know this is not a call for massive regulation of Big Tech.)

3. A strong state is distinct from a very large or tyrannical state.  A good strong state should see the maintenance and extension of capitalism as one of its primary duties, in many cases its #1 duty.

4. Rapid increases in state capacity can be very dangerous (earlier Japan, Germany), but high levels of state capacity are not inherently tyrannical.  Denmark should in fact have a smaller government, but it is still one of the freer and more secure places in the world, at least for Danish citizens albeit not for everybody.

5. Many of the failures of today’s America are failures of excess regulation, but many others are failures of state capacity.  Our governments cannot address climate change, much improve K-12 education, fix traffic congestion, or improve the quality of their discretionary spending.  Much of our physical infrastructure is stagnant or declining in quality.  I favor much more immigration, nonetheless I think our government needs clear standards for who cannot get in, who will be forced to leave, and a workable court system to back all that up and today we do not have that either.

Those problems require state capacity — albeit to boost markets — in a way that classical libertarianism is poorly suited to deal with.  Furthermore, libertarianism is parasitic upon State Capacity Libertarianism to some degree.  For instance, even if you favor education privatization, in the shorter run we still need to make the current system much better.  That would even make privatization easier, if that is your goal.

6. I will cite again the philosophical framework of my book Stubborn Attachments: A Vision for a Society of Free, Prosperous, and Responsible Individuals.

7. The fundamental growth experience of recent decades has been the rise of capitalism, markets, and high living standards in East Asia, and State Capacity Libertarianism has no problem or embarrassment in endorsing those developments.  It remains the case that such progress (or better) could have been made with more markets and less government.  Still, state capacity had to grow in those countries and indeed it did.  Public health improvements are another major success story of our time, and those have relied heavily on state capacity — let’s just admit it.

8. The major problem areas of our time have been Africa and South Asia.  They are both lacking in markets and also in state capacity.

9. State Capacity Libertarians are more likely to have positive views of infrastructure, science subsidies, nuclear power (requires state support!), and space programs than are mainstream libertarians or modern Democrats.  Modern Democrats often claim to favor those items, and sincerely in my view, but de facto they are very willing to sacrifice them for redistribution, egalitarian and fairness concerns, mood affiliation, and serving traditional Democratic interest groups.  For instance, modern Democrats have run New York for some time now, and they’ve done a terrible job building and fixing things.  Nor are Democrats doing much to boost nuclear power as a partial solution to climate change, if anything the contrary.

10. State Capacity Libertarianism has no problem endorsing higher quality government and governance, whereas traditional libertarianism is more likely to embrace or at least be wishy-washy toward small, corrupt regimes, due to some of the residual liberties they leave behind.

11. State Capacity Libertarianism is not non-interventionist in foreign policy, as it believes in strong alliances with other relatively free nations, when feasible.  That said, the usual libertarian “problems of intervention because government makes a lot of mistakes” bar still should be applied to specific military actions.  But the alliances can be hugely beneficial, as illustrated by much of 20th century foreign policy and today much of Asia — which still relies on Pax Americana.

It is interesting to contrast State Capacity Libertarianism to liberaltarianism, another offshoot of libertarianism.  On most substantive issues, the liberaltarians might be very close to State Capacity Libertarians.  But emphasis and focus really matter, and I would offer this (partial) list of differences:

a. The liberaltarian starts by assuring “the left” that they favor lots of government transfer programs.  The State Capacity Libertarian recognizes that demands of mercy are never ending, that economic growth can benefit people more than transfers, and, within the governmental sphere, it is willing to emphasize an analytical, “cold-hearted” comparison between government discretionary spending and transfer spending.  Discretionary spending might well win out at many margins.

b. The “polarizing Left” is explicitly opposed to a lot of capitalism, and de facto standing in opposition to state capacity, due to the polarization, which tends to thwart problem-solving.  The polarizing Left is thus a bigger villain for State Capacity Libertarianism than it is for liberaltarianism.  For the liberaltarians, temporary alliances with the polarizing Left are possible because both oppose Trump and other bad elements of the right wing.  It is easy — maybe too easy — to market liberaltarianism to the Left as a critique and revision of libertarians and conservatives.

c. Liberaltarian Will Wilkinson made the mistake of expressing enthusiasm for Elizabeth Warren.  It is hard to imagine a State Capacity Libertarian making this same mistake, since so much of Warren’s energy is directed toward tearing down American business.  Ban fracking? Really?  Send money to Russia, Saudi Arabia, lose American jobs, and make climate change worse, all at the same time?  Nope.

d. State Capacity Libertarianism is more likely to make a mistake of say endorsing high-speed rail from LA to Sf (if indeed that is a mistake), and decrying the ability of U.S. governments to get such a thing done.  “Which mistakes they are most likely to commit” is an underrated way of assessing political philosophies.

You will note the influence of Peter Thiel on State Capacity Libertarianism, though I have never heard him frame the issues in this way.

Furthermore, “which ideas survive well in internet debate” has been an important filter on the evolution of the doctrine.  That point is under-discussed, for all sorts of issues, and it may get a blog post of its own.

F

 

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Daniel Klein
January 1, 2020 at 5:44 am
Here, on January 1, 2020, you diss "classical liberalism" as a "question-begging" expression, ill-suited to modern times.

Yesterday, December 31, 2019, in your Modi post, you identified, without qualification, as classical liberal.

Pedagogical esotericism? Does Homer nod? Other?



God of Thunder
January 1, 2020 at 11:25 am
What a difference a year makes!

[close]

[Mandark]

For one thing, it doesn’t seem that old-style libertarianism can solve or even very well address a number of major problems, most significantly climate change.

this is true

[OnlyRegret]

why solve a problem when you can profit handsomely from said problem

spoiler (click to show/hide)

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-vitality-air-sales-update-bottled-air-1.5073762

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[OnlyRegret]

your kind is a blight, benji
https://twitter.com/YALiberty

if I had the misfortune of seeing this, you will too


lmao

[OnlyRegret]

rand paul
ron paul
my gunzzz
b-but the founding principles
"welfare is killing the american dream"

 

[Rufus]

https://old.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/ejk48x/til_research_shows_that_children_as_young_as_4/?sort=controversial

[OnlyRegret]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Libertarian/comments/ejhb55/just_a_quick_shoutout_to_all_the_libertarians/