Author Topic: USA Politics Thread |OT| Blah blah facts and science blah blah deadly pandemic  (Read 94087 times)

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Joe Molotov

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Dr Pepper still supports America :salute
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Pretty sure it's the kids wanting it done


In this case, almost by definition they can't give informed consent.

Many of the potential effects are impossible to understand as a kid. If you get early puberty blocking drugs, there is no way you can truly understand the risk of reduced or eliminated sexual function 15 years later. For a natal boy, the drugs can prevent genital growth, which is doubly dangerous because it means there isn't enough tissue for the most effective surgeries if that ended up being the plan, and also means reduced or eliminated sexual function if you decide against surgery. And indeed, many trans adults don't want surgery on their functional genitals at all; it shouldn't be assumed they will.

Similarly, it is hard to argue that kids can truly understand the implications of sterilization when that is part of a procedure.

There is also very little research on how the drugs affect the brain.

Although the effects of the hormones are permanent, the claim is always that puberty blockers are reversible. This is the biggest thing that makes me skeptical, because it is clearly a lie. There isn't enough research to come anywhere near saying it is reversible as it is used in these circumstances (the research is on younger children given blockers, not on how it affects people through their teens physically and mentally). Moreover, once you start with puberty blockers, you are virtually guaranteed to continue to the permanent hormones, so the "reversible" claim is disingenuous. On the contrary, it could easily be argued that the puberty blockers put you into a suspended state where you never obtain the ability to give informed consent, because you never learn what you would be risking.

Given that the blatant lie about "reversibility" is present everywhere I look on this subject, it makes it seem likely that kids are also lied to when they are considering starting the procedure.

That said, the argument on the other side is that the benefits (such as potentially preventing suicide, and the effect on adult appearance) are so overwhelming that they outweigh informed consent and all the risks, and that can't be dismissed. It is an impossible dilemma especially with the lack of research.

Nintex

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What is needed is better education on the pro's and cons of such endeavors.

But because those advocating for gender fluidity are pushing for this to become 'normal' and see any form of criticism as a threat and those pushing against it will use the bad outcomes for their own agenda, neither side is going to do that.
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Sure we might have a vaccine rollout plan and our country is no longer a laughing stock, but this is far too big of a cost.

https://mobile.twitter.com/EARTH3R/status/1378109499513348096


Transhuman

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Pretty sure it's the kids wanting it done


In this case, almost by definition they can't give informed consent.

Many of the potential effects are impossible to understand as a kid. If you get early puberty blocking drugs, there is no way you can truly understand the risk of reduced or eliminated sexual function 15 years later. For a natal boy, the drugs can prevent genital growth, which is doubly dangerous because it means there isn't enough tissue for the most effective surgeries if that ended up being the plan, and also means reduced or eliminated sexual function if you decide against surgery. And indeed, many trans adults don't want surgery on their functional genitals at all; it shouldn't be assumed they will.

Similarly, it is hard to argue that kids can truly understand the implications of sterilization when that is part of a procedure.

There is also very little research on how the drugs affect the brain.

Although the effects of the hormones are permanent, the claim is always that puberty blockers are reversible. This is the biggest thing that makes me skeptical, because it is clearly a lie. There isn't enough research to come anywhere near saying it is reversible as it is used in these circumstances (the research is on younger children given blockers, not on how it affects people through their teens physically and mentally). Moreover, once you start with puberty blockers, you are virtually guaranteed to continue to the permanent hormones, so the "reversible" claim is disingenuous. On the contrary, it could easily be argued that the puberty blockers put you into a suspended state where you never obtain the ability to give informed consent, because you never learn what you would be risking.

Given that the blatant lie about "reversibility" is present everywhere I look on this subject, it makes it seem likely that kids are also lied to when they are considering starting the procedure.

That said, the argument on the other side is that the benefits (such as potentially preventing suicide, and the effect on adult appearance) are so overwhelming that they outweigh informed consent and all the risks, and that can't be dismissed. It is an impossible dilemma especially with the lack of research.

At the end of the day it comes down to whether a person views the surgery as necessary or not, and if 2% regret it that still leaves 98% who don't.

Madrun Badrun

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And comes down to a decision between the people affected and their doctors and not people on the internet talking about mutilations or anti-LGBTQ politicians using the issue as a faultline.  It's one of those things that if you just let the issue be the community will figure out the answer themselves and in a decade or two people will forget this was ever a thing.   
NtGay

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At the end of the day it comes down to whether a person views the surgery as necessary or not, and if 2% regret it that still leaves 98% who don't.

"Regret" doesn't cover everything here. A 12 year old can't really understand how to feel about their sexual function or fertility 20 years down the line, and they won't ever know any alternative. Nor will they ever know an alternative between starting treatment at, say, 11 compared to 14. And there is little research on the long term, or on children starting treatment very early and continuing for years. But I do agree that, given the current state of knowledge, low rates of regret are a strong argument against laws like in Arkansas.


And comes down to a decision between the people affected and their doctors and not people on the internet talking about mutilations or anti-LGBTQ politicians using the issue as a faultline.  It's one of those things that if you just let the issue be the community will figure out the answer themselves and in a decade or two people will forget this was ever a thing.


That's why I think the biggest thing to avoid is a chilling effect, which comes from the anti-LGBTQ politicians, but also from those who consider anything but uncritical support to be an enemy.

Studies have found that the kids themselves are doubtful about whether they can understand the long term ramifications of their choice, even though they agree on the necessity of the treatment's availability.

They don't need uncritical support for a given procedure, they need it to be looked at scientifically, with an eye toward both the risks and the benefits, so they can be given the best possible answers. Obviously, this is not going to come from anti-LGBTQ politicians and laws like this one. It's a bad law. But some of the concerns expressed are legitimate, and some are shared by the kids themselves.

I think it is "better" in some sense to be forthright about the lack of informed consent, the lack of knowledge about psychological effects, the risk to sexual function and effectiveness of transition, etc, even if you strongly believe it is still worthwhile. If nothing else, it just creates a climate for better science.

Nintex

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Kids want Mario one day and Fortnite the next.
Childrens menu's always have one option because decision making is difficult for them.

I say let them be kids until they're old enough to understand. I imagine a childhood of hormone therapy and gender surgery is terrible and a ruined childhood scars you forever.
XENO

Madrun Badrun

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https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56639088

Google v Oracle: Supreme Court declares Google's code copying fair
NtGay

Tasty

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https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56639088

Google v Oracle: Supreme Court declares Google's code copying fair

Even if I've become warier of Google lately, this is an absolutely fantastic ruling for every software developer. Get fucked Oracle, you evil empire pieces of shit.

The ruling itself is actually pretty limited in scope and very well-reasoned IMO. About a dozen pages into the ruling PDF right now.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/20pdf/18-956_d18f.pdf

MPAA: "This will mean the end of copyright and piracy will increase 10,000%!!!!" Lololololol

Tasty

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Quote
“If Google’s unprecedented approach to transformation were to become the law, a producer who makes an unauthorized feature film of the hit TV series Game of Thrones (HBO 2011) could claim that the use was new, innovative, and socially valuable, and therefore a transformative fair use—a preposterous legal position.”

- The Motion Picture Association of America

:mindblown :confused :wtf :sabu :dead

Lol get fucked :ufup

GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56639088

Google v Oracle: Supreme Court declares Google's code copying fair

Jesus Christ, it only took a fucking decade to get to the final decision that interoperability is not theft

Tasty

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https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56639088

Google v Oracle: Supreme Court declares Google's code copying fair

Jesus Christ, it only took a fucking decade to get to the final decision that interoperability is not theft

I'm convinced Oracle actually bribed someone/the judge at the Circuit Court of Appeals. This was settled by a jury until that ruling reversed everything.

Oddly the Supreme Court seems to take the stance that similar fair use/software copyright cases should be decided by a judge "as a matter of law, not fact," meaning juries shouldn't be the deciders in such cases. :thinking (I believe, if I understand what I'm reading so far.)

Tasty

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Even if it was painful and drawn out, there's precedential upsides to the Supreme Court being the final deciders in the case.

That said, the outcome of this will likely be increased lobbying on Oracle's part.

benjipwns

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It's one of those things that if you just let the issue be the community will figure out the answer themselves and in a decade or two people will forget this was ever a thing.   
Nah, that's about when the lawsuits will all be hitting.

From the few survivors.

benjipwns

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Great Rumbler

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This reads like a TP parody image yet it's somehow real. :notlikethis
dog

james

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:O


Tasty

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Nintex

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Well about that boycott

https://mobile.twitter.com/DJJudd/status/1379175308256022534
lmao they set up an 'oval office' so he can still be 'President'.

These fucking people  :lol

spoiler (click to show/hide)
I wonder who pretends to be Putin :thinking
[close]
XENO

benjipwns

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benjipwns

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benjipwns

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Zodiac Killer trying Castro disguise:

Nintex

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BLM MLB

 :thinking
XENO

GreatSageEqualOfHeaven

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https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-56639088

Google v Oracle: Supreme Court declares Google's code copying fair

Jesus Christ, it only took a fucking decade to get to the final decision that interoperability is not theft

I'm convinced Oracle actually bribed someone/the judge at the Circuit Court of Appeals. This was settled by a jury until that ruling reversed everything.

Oddly the Supreme Court seems to take the stance that similar fair use/software copyright cases should be decided by a judge "as a matter of law, not fact," meaning juries shouldn't be the deciders in such cases. :thinking (I believe, if I understand what I'm reading so far.)

In the original jury trial, the presiding judge was a hobbyist programmer, and gave the jury direction on what copyright actually covers as well as being able to answer questions on stuff.
In the appeal it was just a judge, who had no reason to think that things like method names are generally standardised due to function, not just because someone is jacking someones style

Rman

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kinda weird that the gop is so anti-infrastructure? have you been to bumblefuck america, their main constituency? it's a mess. gop is so anti-progress. it's a caricature as this point.

Cauliflower Of Love

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kinda weird that the gop is so anti-infrastructure? have you been to bumblefuck america, their main constituency? it's a mess. gop is so anti-progress. it's a caricature as this point.

It's easier to just give corn freebies.
titor

Tasty

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You know who uses most of that infrastructure? Poors, minorities and demoncrats!

Better to just let everyone pull their own bootstraps, that way only the whites hard-workers will prosper! True meritocracy.

obvious /s

Tasty

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"The Google platform just got bigger and market power greater — the barriers to entry higher and the ability to compete lower. They stole Java and spent a decade litigating as only a monopolist can. This behavior is exactly why regulatory authorities around the world and in the United States are examining Google's business practices."

- Dorian Daley, Executive Vice President and General Counsel, Oracle

I guess you gotta say something to save face. :dead

All these lawyers are laughing all the way to the bank, though.

Rman

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You know who uses most of that infrastructure? Poors, minorities and demoncrats!

Better to just let everyone pull their own bootstraps, that way only the whites hard-workers will prosper! True meritocracy.

obvious /s

the gop is saying stuff like water pipes and broadband are not infrastructure. they're still stuck in the agricultural age.

Nintex

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All this talk about infrastructure makes makes me excited for infrastructure week
:trumps
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tiesto

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kinda weird that the gop is so anti-infrastructure? have you been to bumblefuck america, their main constituency? it's a mess. gop is so anti-progress. it's a caricature as this point.

Unless it's a multimillion dollar bridge to nowhere in a GOP rep's district.
^_^

ToxicAdam

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kinda weird that the gop is so anti-infrastructure? have you been to bumblefuck america, their main constituency? it's a mess. gop is so anti-progress. it's a caricature as this point.

It's not that weird. Infrastructure spending happens where population centers are larger (more efficient use of tax dollars) and the upkeep costs of that can last generations. A new subway line built in NYC is going to have a far greater impact on the lives of the poor/middle class than whatever you do in rural Kansas.

Most rural infrastructure spending revolves around paving roads, more irrigation, making areas more conducive to building new homes. All things that mostly benefit those that already have money in those areas. Many times, improvements to highways means bypassing former towns/villages that relied on that thru traffic. Economically devastating them in the process.


Stro

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It's more that the GOP is opposed to anything the Dirty Dems support. Trump easily could have passed an infrastructure package with 100% GOP support but he never actually did any work to put one together or gave a shit about it anyway so nothing got done.

chronovore

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It's more that the GOP is opposed to anything the Dirty Dems support. Trump easily could have passed an infrastructure package with 100% GOP support but he never actually did any work to put one together or gave a shit about it anyway so nothing got done.

It also would have been a 100% pork product. There is no fucking way that it would have benefited anybody other than Trump and his cronies. Then again, most of the money that Bush Junior sent to Iraq pretty much evaporated into thin air as well, so maybe it’s just their groove.

benjipwns

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Everybody's running for governor!

Andrew Giuliani, the son of former New York City Mayor Rudolph Giuliani and a former aide in the Trump administration, said in interviews Wednesday that he is evaluating a run for governor of New York as a Republican.

Giuliani, 35, who has never held public office, told The New York Times that he was “strongly considering” the idea and looking to make a decision by the end of the month.

He was more emphatic in an interview with the Washington Examiner, saying he planned to run, and “I believe I can win the race.”
Former Trump campaign manager Brad Parscale is helping Caitlyn Jenner as she very seriously explores running for Governor in California, Fox News has learned.

A source familiar told Fox News that Parscale is helping Jenner. The source said the two have been friends since 2017.

The source told Fox News Parscale is helping to connect Jenner to "the best talent in the country" as she considers mounting a gubernatorial campaign.

"She is very, very, very serious," the source said about Jenner’s potential campaign.

benjipwns

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https://twitter.com/mtgreenee/status/1379817241580015616

Quote
It’s a shocking total, one that dwarfs the nearly $728,000 Rep. Alexandria Ocasio Cortez (D-NY) pulled in during the first three months of 2019
An ungodly sum for a freshman congressman in a 75% R district.

Transhuman

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Ungodly is a good word choice

Nintex

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Everybody's running for governor!

Andrew Giuliani, the son of former New York City Mayor Rudolph Giuliani and a former aide in the Trump administration, said in interviews Wednesday that he is evaluating a run for governor of New York as a Republican.

Giuliani, 35, who has never held public office, told The New York Times that he was “strongly considering” the idea and looking to make a decision by the end of the month.

He was more emphatic in an interview with the Washington Examiner, saying he planned to run, and “I believe I can win the race.”
Former Trump campaign manager Brad Parscale is helping Caitlyn Jenner as she very seriously explores running for Governor in California, Fox News has learned.

A source familiar told Fox News that Parscale is helping Jenner. The source said the two have been friends since 2017.

The source told Fox News Parscale is helping to connect Jenner to "the best talent in the country" as she considers mounting a gubernatorial campaign.

"She is very, very, very serious," the source said about Jenner’s potential campaign.

Grifters assemble :trumps
XENO

Cauliflower Of Love

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Quote
you know why?

 :sicko
titor

Joe Molotov

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Good, let GOP donors waste all their money on Owning the Libs and Da Cultoor Warz instead of races that actually matter. :jeb
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james

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Guys search Squirtle on Twitter
:O

Nintex

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Guys search Squirtle on Twitter
I'm getting pictures of my favorite Pokemon :heart



 :nsfw
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« Last Edit: April 09, 2021, 04:38:04 AM by Nintex »
XENO

Tasty

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Tasty

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Yahoo Answers to end as Trump fans see plot to “silence conservatives”

Quote
"Should Trump buy Yahoo to prevent Answers from being shut down?" user asks.

Oh lord :doge

Cauliflower Of Love

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"I think George Floyd died from HEALTH ISSUES?"

 :doge
titor

Nintex

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Trump taking over Yahoo Answers and turning it into his MAGA social media platform would be lit.

Alas, he's playing golf, doing stand-up at his club and pretending to work behind a 'fake' presidential desk.
The show goes on but further and further removed from the real world it seems.
XENO

Cauliflower Of Love

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trump still shadow president since he didn't go to inauguration and hand over the secret keys
titor

Tasty

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I'm now slightly suspicious it was Trump who posted How is babby formed back in the day.


BIONIC

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Wine

benjipwns

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Four times in recent weeks, members of the White House press corps have relayed questions to press secretary Jen Psaki from someone claiming to be a fellow reporter who was not able to be there in the room due to Covid protocols.

That colleague, who goes by the name Kacey Montagu, doesn’t exist — at least not as an actual reporter.

Since late last year, Montagu has taken on the identity of a White House correspondent extraordinaire with a fictional outlet to boot: White House News, shortened in emails to WHN.

Montagu started two real-life Twitter handles, which are followed by some top White House officials and journalists. Montagu has filed Freedom of Information Act requests and obtained Psaki’s personal financial disclosure form, along with the disclosure of at least one other official, the president’s national security adviser, Jake Sullivan.

In communications with confidants, Montagu has posed as a member of White House Correspondents Association, claiming to be a reporter for The Daily Mail, the British tabloid known for its gossipy coverage of celebrities and political figures. Montagu also communicates regularly with top White House reporters and has had several exchanges with White House officials.

But Montagu never joined WHCA and The Daily Mail. There is no Kacey Montagu, except as a digital impersonation of a White House correspondent.

“I love journalism, and I think the Press Corps is doing a pretty bad job at the moment, so I decided I would ensure some transparency and ask some questions me and some friends wanted the answer to,” Montagu said, when reached by email and asked why they were posing as a White House reporter.
Quote
Acquaintances online suspect much of the biographical information to be untrue. They believe Montagu’s White House moonlighting began as something to boast about in the online global gaming platform called ROBLOX, where users jokingly call themselves “Legos.” Within that platform is a role-playing group called nUSA, where people from across the world engage in a mock U.S. government exercise. At one point, Montagu had adopted the role of Secretary of State but resigned from that job after — as they recalled — ”the [nUSA] President went to war with some U.K. and I thought it was a pretty bad idea!”
Quote
Montagu’s play-acting as a White House reporter goes back at least to December, when he or she set up @WHschedule on Twitter. They repeatedly referenced the “schedule” account in emails as a primary duty. In March, they began sending tweets from @WHpoolreport. The accounts are rudimentary repostings of two sources of information reporters regularly consume: the president, first lady, vice president, and second gentleman’s daily schedules and the so-called pool reports, which are real time dispatches from a small group of journalists tasked with following around those principles during the course of the day and reporting back to the rest of the press corps on their movements and utterances.

“I created them as some fun but also to ensure that people know what is going on — they should be able to know what POTUS and V.P. is doing and I think the account following shows people are interested in that,” Montagu told POLITICO.

The accounts got attention from insiders, who quickly came to rely on their speed and efficiency. @WHSchedule had a following of more than 1,300, including several White House correspondents (some working at POLITICO). The new @WHPoolReport account amassed more than 600 in a few weeks' time, including some who work in the administration like Michael LaRosa, press secretary for Jill Biden and Symone Sanders, a senior advisor and chief spokesperson for Vice President Kamala Harris.
https://twitter.com/SecMontagu/status/1380683244983701507

Nintex

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Her Twitter is incredible.

There is even Roblox Fox News  :mindblown
XENO

Nintex

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Cauliflower Of Love

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Slpa your dick down Biden.
titor

Tripon

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https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/1380641708782850048

ok

We just lived though a year where I had to fucking talk to my students over a shitty web camera a year+.

If you don't think internet and a lack of connection to said internet isn't an infrastructure issue, then you need to update your terms.

HardcoreRetro

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Nintex is Dutch and probably hasn't looked into how bad the internet is in other parts of the world. I think most Americans are completely hamstrung by the way your ISPs work.

I think for a lot of poorer countries Elon Musk's starlink thing is looking pretty good.

Nintex

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I'm aware of the internet situation. I just think that the messaging is very weird.
"High speed internet is infrastructure"

Yes it is, what is your point?

You are the President with the most votes of any President in history get shit done.  :idont
XENO