US Politics Thread |OT| SAD TRUMP

[etiolate]

Title IX has created a financial trapfor schools. You follow the Title IX rules or you don't get the student loans, but you follow the Title IX rules and you break individuals rights and get sued for millions, or you follow the rules and spend thousands doing so and accomplish little.

Does this happen in a way that significantly impacts school budgets?

Wouldn't know. Still feels early in that part of the problem.

[I'm a Puppy!]

People have been told, sorry too many Asians. That might change year to year.

Well there is a large % of chinese there as a part of the whole student body and a ridiculously (almost comically) big % when compared to just international admissions.

Interesting thing though, that's only for undergrad. The percentages fall off a cliff for graduate degrees.
...or so I might/might not know

[bluemax]

The only time I see Title IX come up in lawsuits is when football teams are covering up all the rape their players are doing.

[Steve Contra]

People have been told, sorry too many Asians. That might change year to year.

Well there is a large % of chinese there as a part of the whole student body and a ridiculously (almost comically) big % when compared to just international admissions.

Interesting thing though, that's only for undergrad. The percentages fall off a cliff for graduate degrees.
...or so I might/might not know

It's weird too, because Berkeley's own data is pretty consistent for the past three years in admitting Asian students.

http://opa.berkeley.edu/uc-berkeley-fall-enrollment-data

You'd expect to see a big dropoff...

[I'm a Puppy!]

People have been told, sorry too many Asians. That might change year to year.

Well there is a large % of chinese there as a part of the whole student body and a ridiculously (almost comically) big % when compared to just international admissions.

Interesting thing though, that's only for undergrad. The percentages fall off a cliff for graduate degrees.
...or so I might/might not know

It's weird too, because Berkeley's own data is pretty consistent for the past three years in admitting Asian students.

http://opa.berkeley.edu/uc-berkeley-fall-enrollment-data

You'd expect to see a big dropoff...

That's enrollment. The admission number is about double. A lot of chinese people apply and get admitted but they have a very low acceptance rate.

[benjipwns]

I worry that studies and programs are going to spread into two extremes themselves, between profitable STEM fields and propaganda based social science fields.

Define profitable.

[etiolate]

Two ways.

1, Research in harder sciences that can be used to make money for the college.

2. Higher earning graduates that will result in better donations.

[etiolate]

The only time I see Title IX come up in lawsuits is when football teams are covering up all the rape their players are doing.

This is the most tragic of the recent lawsuits.

http://watchdog.org/292821/male-accused-student-commits-suicide-school-railroading/

[Mandark]

A quick Google search turned up these.





There does seem to be a real contrast with the Ivies, where the percentage of enrollment of Asian students has stayed flat, even as their share of the population has risen.

[benjipwns]

Two ways.

1, Research in harder sciences that can be used to make money for the college.

Which departments do you think have lower capital outlays by far across the board on their grants?

Only one place I have worked where the Education department is not the profit juggernaut that everyone could agree were just the worst. And that's because it was a community college. And didn't have an Education program. Then a university threw bags of money at it to start one.

Yeah, last place Engineering got a new building because they needed it, so Education went and bought their own absurd one that was three times as big and they didn't even wind up paying for half of it because they got all kinds of extra grants to put in solar panels or children's play areas and so on. (None of these have ever been used properly, the solar panels weren't installed properly so they don't work and the only time all the children's crap is available is in the summer when their normal school is out, aka when there's no students or staff for it.)

Higher earning graduates that will result in better donations.

[benjipwns]

To be clear, I was not speaking of the actual institution or the real population, but the mostly caricature version of the liberal activist sub-culture/institutions that the right loves to use to paint the entirety of the left right now because of the Antifa stuff going on.

It's like under Bush when I remember Rush, Hannity, and the WSJ editorial pages kept doing stories on the craziest Berkeley protests and would equivocate it with being representative of all of the left. Or use things like the tree sit-in to paint all environmentalists with. Or the whole Berkeley "tells the Marines they aren't welcome" story to claim the left clearly hates the troops.

Berkeley has groups of people that just do a lot of off the wall activist shit. Embraces and accepts some weird walks of life. Which means they are also open to at times giving those people elected offices. It's hard to make the case it's representative of much most the time.

http://quirkyberkeley.com/
https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/06/us/a-step-by-step-guide-to-berkeleys-many-quirks.html

[etiolate]

A quick Google search turned up these.

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

There does seem to be a real contrast with the Ivies, where the percentage of enrollment of Asian students has stayed flat, even as their share of the population has risen.

You would have to factor in how many qualified or overqualified applicants are there versus the acceptance rates.

[benjipwns]

You would have to factor in how many qualified or overqualified applicants are there versus the acceptance rates.

what should the qualifications be?

[etiolate]

That's what makes it tricky beyond a grade and test score standard, but I'd start there. I know there's extra curricular stuff that tends to be subjective.

[brawndolicious]

Honestly, it's ball-cruchingly myopic to worry about getting into your undergrad of choice. I chose UCSC over 3 higher ranked UCs that offered me admission and I have zero regrets because I knew it was all on me anyways to get good undergrad internships and be able to sound confident in interviews. My own anecdote about the types of people who got excited about going to Berkeley and UCLA is that they end up having zero career traction because the real world cares too little about you and has no syllabus. Ironically, they're the ones most vocal about how hard it was for a model minority from a good high school district to get accepted.

Mr. Eti, if you were arguing about PhD programs and shit then definitely the school you go to has long-term consequences but all employers care about with undergrads is your practical experience and that you didn't flunk a bunch of classes.

And the reason why a few people act like assholes when they protest at Berkeley is the same reason why a few people act like assholes when they get stoned at UCSC 4/20. They are all wrapped in that identity as a protester or a stoner and the only way they can imagine expressing themselves is as an obnoxious stereotype.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

That's why Nazis deserve to get punched.

[close]

[Brehvolution]

http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/20/donald-trump-kid-rock-ted-nugent-sarah-palin-oval-office-photo/

[benjipwns]

[benjipwns]

nation deadlocked over World War III

[Great Rumbler]

http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/20/donald-trump-kid-rock-ted-nugent-sarah-palin-oval-office-photo/

 

[toku]

https://twitter.com/Benhartman/status/855108139296985088

[agrajag]

Looks like Jason Chaffetz might be in some hot water?

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/329716-chaffetz-considering-early-departure-from-congress

[Mandark]

Usual disclaimer about partisan politics making hypocrites of all elected officials, but Chaffetz built a brand on being a bulldog investigator into shit like Benghazi then wound up having to be the "move along, nothing to see here" guy for Donald Trump.

You'd need to be some kind of black in cognitive dissonance for that.

[etiolate]

Honestly, it's ball-cruchingly myopic to worry about getting into your undergrad of choice. I chose UCSC over 3 higher ranked UCs that offered me admission and I have zero regrets because I knew it was all on me anyways to get good undergrad internships and be able to sound confident in interviews. My own anecdote about the types of people who got excited about going to Berkeley and UCLA is that they end up having zero career traction because the real world cares too little about you and has no syllabus. Ironically, they're the ones most vocal about how hard it was for a model minority from a good high school district to get accepted.

Mr. Eti, if you were arguing about PhD programs and shit then definitely the school you go to has long-term consequences but all employers care about with undergrads is your practical experience and that you didn't flunk a bunch of classes.

And the reason why a few people act like assholes when they protest at Berkeley is the same reason why a few people act like assholes when they get stoned at UCSC 4/20. They are all wrapped in that identity as a protester or a stoner and the only way they can imagine expressing themselves is as an obnoxious stereotype.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

That's why Nazis deserve to get punched.

[close]

ANTIFA isn't a few people from Berkeley. This isn't the same as people getting stoned at Santa Cruz. ANTIFA travels around to commit violence. They believe silly things, but they way they operate leads to escalation. What happens on Berkeley doesn't have to do with the kids in class. It has to do with the police, admin and mayor allowing black bloc types to trash the city. The press then does the PR work for black bloc and tends to cover up what they do. This is partially because groups like ANTIFA threaten them with violence if they don't stick to their narrative or if they film within the black bloc side.

[Joe Molotov]

http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/20/donald-trump-kid-rock-ted-nugent-sarah-palin-oval-office-photo/

Republicans love to pout about OMG HOLLYWOOD 

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/854676780527079425

while touting their own tepid star power and frequently electing tv and movie actors to high office.

[curly]

ANTIFA isn't a few people from Berkeley. This isn't the same as people getting stoned at Santa Cruz. ANTIFA travels around to commit violence. They believe silly things, but they way they operate leads to escalation. What happens on Berkeley doesn't have to do with the kids in class. It has to do with the police, admin and mayor allowing black bloc types to trash the city. The press then does the PR work for black bloc and tends to cover up what they do. This is partially because groups like ANTIFA threaten them with violence if they don't stick to their narrative or if they film within the black bloc side.

So the entire government of Berkeley lets anarchists do what they want in the city, and the press is covering up. Sounds plausible. If there's one thing that elected officials, cops, and the media all love, it's people who want to overthrow the government and abolish private property 

[Bebpo]

It's so fucking crazy & infuriating what a partisan president this is.  He's basically like "fuck half the country, you didn't vote for me LOSERS"; in my life I've never seen a President that is basically only acting as a president for half the country and disowning the other half of the country.  It's just nuts.  This is how you fuel the flames to a real civil war.

As looney toons as it is, I definitely think a civil war in America is more likely than a WWIII in the next 20 years.  The USA is just insanely divided.  Not sure what the breaking point will be.  It really felt like Obama did everything he could to bring unity between all Americans.  But you know, he was black, so that immediately shut off 35% of the USA from listening to anything he says. 

[Mandark]

Republicans Prepare To Lose On A Government Funding Bill

House GOP pours cold water over new Trumpcare rumors

[Great Rumbler]

Republicans Prepare To Lose On A Government Funding Bill

House GOP pours cold water over new Trumpcare rumors

SO MUCH WINNING
YOU WILL BE TIRED OF ALL THE WINNING

[etiolate]

ANTIFA isn't a few people from Berkeley. This isn't the same as people getting stoned at Santa Cruz. ANTIFA travels around to commit violence. They believe silly things, but they way they operate leads to escalation. What happens on Berkeley doesn't have to do with the kids in class. It has to do with the police, admin and mayor allowing black bloc types to trash the city. The press then does the PR work for black bloc and tends to cover up what they do. This is partially because groups like ANTIFA threaten them with violence if they don't stick to their narrative or if they film within the black bloc side.

So the entire government of Berkeley lets anarchists do what they want in the city, and the press is covering up. Sounds plausible. If there's one thing that elected officials, cops, and the media all love, it's people who want to overthrow the government and abolish private property 

okay

Police stand down as m80s, bricks and rocks are thrown at people.



Mayor backs police stand down.

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Berkeley-Mayor-Backs-Police-Response-to-Violence-at-Rally-419676074.html

Police chief backs stand down

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Berkeley-Mayor-Backs-Police-Response-to-Violence-at-Rally-419676074.html

ANTIFA threatening reporters




https://twitter.com/Timcast/status/853249044583297024
https://twitter.com/Timcast/status/853243079159037954
https://twitter.com/Timcast/status/853255815427309568

A thread targeting Tim Pool in a black bloc friendly Racial Justice subforum for the east bay.

https://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2017/04/14/18798317.php

[Mandark]

Still, charges against the 20 people arrested in Saturday's violence include assault with a deadly weapon, battery and committing a criminal offense while wearing a mask.

[Steve Contra]

I like that Etoilet frames this like Black Bloc traveled unnannounced and started picking fights with innocent extreme right wing Berkeley students instead of people who were also from out of town and came specifically to fight as well.

[etiolate]

Please bring better hand-waving tactics.

[Mandark]

People have been told, sorry too many Asians. That might change year to year.

What's the source on this one, while we're at it?

[Steve Contra]

Hand waving? A bunch of assholes met up, fought for a while, 20 people were arrested, the cops didn't shoot anyone or get in any trouble. Overall pretty proud of the way things were handled.

[Steve Contra]

https://twitter.com/TrueFactsStated/status/855110244040667136

Man, I wonder what's coming out of this one? Hopefully not something as boring as an affair.

[Joe Molotov]

Gay affair tho?

[Great Rumbler]

"I really am amazed that a judge sitting on an island in the Pacific can issue an order that stops the President of the United States from what appears to be clearly his statutory and Constitutional power."

 

[Brehvolution]

Looks like Jason Chaffetz might be in some hot water?

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/329716-chaffetz-considering-early-departure-from-congress

Her husband Jason, along with other Republicans, allegedly orchestrated what was supposed to be a small attack in the US Embassy in Benghazi during the 2012 Election. Using military contractors to hire insurgents, the operation spun out of control quickly, and a US Ambassador lost his life. Chaffetz was forced to resign April 20, 2017 as a result.

 

spoiler (click to show/hide)

Overheard on the internet comments section

[close]

[etiolate]

People have been told, sorry too many Asians. That might change year to year.

What's the source on this one, while we're at it?

Personal sources. Hard to verify I know.

Contra,

A group planned a free speech rally. Another group planned to beat up people at the rally. The first group fought back. I don't condone any of the violence, but you're doing false equivalency because you don't want to engage the subject.

Overall, that's the behavior pattern that I've noticed. Introduce a topic certain people are hesistant to discuss and those people will ignore the point and the topic overall to try to nitpick and distract and hand-wave away from the discussion. It's interesting to watch if still annoying to deal with.

[Steve Contra]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/20/politics/kfile-sessions-psychoanalyze/index.html

Weird, it's almost like Jeff Sessions doesn't know or doesn't consider a Hawaii a state. We have some brilliant minds running this country now.

[Steve Contra]

A group planned a free speech rally. Another group planned to beat up people at the rally. The first group fought back. I don't condone any of the violence, but you're doing false equivalency because you don't want to engage the subject.

I'm fucking dying here.

Both groups came to fight. Nathan Damigo and Identity Evropa weren't there to do anything but provoke a fight.

[Nola]

Republicans Prepare To Lose On A Government Funding Bill

House GOP pours cold water over new Trumpcare rumors

I just find it fascinating that Republicans are so out of touch with reality on healthcare(and much of anything, really) and so blatantly unconcerned with anything but helping the rich. That they think what makes things better for both sides politically is to ultimately give people even less insurance, gut guaranteed benefits further, but to make the moderates feel they have some political cover(because people are that stupid apparently), they slap on a superficial coating on top of the bill that says they are "protecting guaranteed benefits" and such, but really doing the opposite.

Its hard to know if they are just this ignorant on healthcare policy that they keep suggesting things that will make the bill less popular, this blinded by trying to get rich people tax cuts, or just have completely lost the plot....Probably all of the above.

“It’s pretty frustrating to see they’ve worked so hard to come up with another Rube Goldberg–type solution,” says Craig Garthwaite, a health economist at Northwestern University’s Kellogg School of Business.

Republicans want to let states waive two key Obamacare provisions:



Obamacare banned this so-called individual rating. It required all insurers, instead, to use “community rating”: setting one premium for the entire community of people buying coverage. This had the practical effect of driving down premiums for sick people, who no longer had to bear the full burden of covering their more expensive health needs.

It also drove up the costs for healthy people, who were suddenly asked to pay more to help cover those expensive bills from the sicker people.

The Obama administration made this change because it felt like this was a good trade-off. It prioritized getting sicker people access to health insurance.

This GOP amendment to let states waive community rating would once again allow insurers to charge people based on their expected health care costs. Insurers would not be able to deny coverage to people with preexisting conditions, but they would have free rein to charge them especially high premiums.

They could also opt out of the health care law’s essential health benefits for the same reason. This is the core set of medical services that the Affordable Care Act requires all insurers to cover, including things like doctor trips, hospital stays, maternity care, and mental health services.

The GOP amendment would allow states to opt out of these two provisions if they could show they aimed to do one of three things: “reduce premium costs, increase the number of persons with healthcare coverage, or advance the benefit to the public interest of the state.”

This does not set an especially high bar for this waiver option. It means that states could, for example, end the essential health benefits requirement because they believe it will lower premium costs. And of course it would! Tell insurers they no longer have to cover expensive mental health services or maternity care, and average prices would almost certainly drop. The same would happen if insurers had the option to charge sick patients prices they couldn’t afford. Those people would drop out of the market, and premiums would decline.

The most recent polling showed just 17 percent support for the American Health Care Act, and the changes outlined in this memo will make health insurance less generous and the bill less popular — making it hard to see how this becomes a winning approach.

http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/4/20/15369512/republican-new-health-care-plan

spoiler (click to show/hide)

  Don't you do it Benji! Don't you Vox-shame. Sarah Kliff is good people!

[close]

[etiolate]

A group planned a free speech rally. Another group planned to beat up people at the rally. The first group fought back. I don't condone any of the violence, but you're doing false equivalency because you don't want to engage the subject.

I'm fucking dying here.

Both groups came to fight. Nathan Damigo and Identity Evropa weren't there to do anything but provoke a fight.

There's livestreams of the event. Reality disagrees with you. There were white nationalists. There were people hoping for a chance to kick butt. The only reason there was a chance was because of ANTIFA. People were arguing against white nationalism on the rally side without being punched.

ANTIFA is there to cause violence. People looking for violence show up because ANTIFA is there. That is how it works.

[Steve Contra]

A group planned a free speech rally. Another group planned to beat up people at the rally. The first group fought back. I don't condone any of the violence, but you're doing false equivalency because you don't want to engage the subject.

I'm fucking dying here.

Both groups came to fight. Nathan Damigo and Identity Evropa weren't there to do anything but provoke a fight.

There's livestreams of the event. Reality disagrees with you. There were white nationalists. There were people hoping for a chance to kick butt. The only reason there was a chance was because of ANTIFA. People were arguing against white nationalism on the rally side without being punched.

ANTIFA is there to cause violence. People looking for violence show up because ANTIFA is there. That is how it works.

But not the other way around

[Syph]

It's so fucking crazy & infuriating what a partisan president this is.  He's basically like "fuck half the country, you didn't vote for me LOSERS"; in my life I've never seen a President that is basically only acting as a president for half the country and disowning the other half of the country.  It's just nuts.  This is how you fuel the flames to a real civil war.

As looney toons as it is, I definitely think a civil war in America is more likely than a WWIII in the next 20 years.  The USA is just insanely divided.  Not sure what the breaking point will be.  It really felt like Obama did everything he could to bring unity between all Americans.  But you know, he was black, so that immediately shut off 35% of the USA from listening to anything he says. 

...

[etiolate]

No, not the other way around. People who came to the Milo speaking event were there to hear Milo talk. ANTIFA came to bash their heads in. There was a second event, ANTIFA attacked again. By the third round, people learned that they would be attacked. So guess what? Violence escalates and semi-militia types show up as bodyguards.

Police could stop the escalation by having ANTIFA remove their masks or by having a better body search to find the weapons. The Mayor could stop blaming Republicans when its one group that keeps comitting the violence. The 2014 riot at Berkeley?  Black bloc. Must have been the republi... oh wait no, they were beating up fellow protesters.

TLDR: You know nothing Jon Snow

[Oblivion]

I never applied to Berkeley (got into UCLA though ) but always wondered if I would be able to if I applied.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

I'm technically Asian, btw 

[close]

[Nola]

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/20/politics/kfile-sessions-psychoanalyze/index.html

Weird, it's almost like Jeff Sessions doesn't know or doesn't consider a Hawaii a state. We have some brilliant minds running this country now.

Jeff Sessions'   in delivering that just shows me he is keenly aware of how low the bar has been set by his base: 



 

[bluemax]

https://newrepublic.com/article/142168/democrats-existential-crisis-wont-resolve

Is this guy saying Bernie is the key to everything? I'm confused.

[Nola]

https://newrepublic.com/article/142168/democrats-existential-crisis-wont-resolve

Is this guy saying Bernie is the key to everything? I'm confused.

Uh-oh

Asked by The Wall Street Journal whether Ossoff was a progressive, Sanders said, “I don’t know.” The Washington Post got a more categorical quote: “He’s not a progressive.”

Someone find Jack Remington's address so I can rush him over some ACE inhibitors before he sees this quote.

[Oblivion]

Um, isn't that good that Sanders is saying that since he's running in a pretty conservative district?

[brawndolicious]

Please bring better hand-waving tactics.

Go back and read that post of mine. That's exactly what I said and you thought I was only talking about ANTIFA. Typical students and residents in Berkeley don't give a shit enough to protest and especially not to fight. Those in government give a magnitudes less shits.

Fact is any protest is mostly made up of out of towners trying to congregate in one spot to maximize their exposure. Sometimes you get too narrowly focused on specific concepts when you are arguing.

[etiolate]

Please bring better hand-waving tactics.

Go back and read that post of mine. That's exactly what I said and you thought I was only talking about ANTIFA. Typical students and residents in Berkeley don't give a shit enough to protest and especially not to fight. Those in government give a magnitudes less shits.

Fact is any protest is mostly made up of out of towners trying to congregate in one spot to maximize their exposure. Sometimes you get too narrowly focused on specific concepts when you are arguing.

I have been to protests where it was mostly about the protest culture, but I disagreed that ANTIFA or the recent response on the right to them is the same. The approach and mentality of black bloc leads to escalation.  A bunch of people gathering for a college protest that often has a weak or vague message doesn't equate to people gearing up for war on the streets.

I don't know why you put a quip about punching nazis at the end so I ignored it.

[chronovore]

http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/20/donald-trump-kid-rock-ted-nugent-sarah-palin-oval-office-photo/

 

A friend of mine posted the pic, said "A few years ago this would've been a Photoshopped picture accompanying an Onion article."

[Raist]

[curly]

okay

Police stand down as m80s, bricks and rocks are thrown at people.



Mayor backs police stand down.

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Berkeley-Mayor-Backs-Police-Response-to-Violence-at-Rally-419676074.html

Police chief backs stand down

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Berkeley-Mayor-Backs-Police-Response-to-Violence-at-Rally-419676074.html

ANTIFA threatening reporters




https://twitter.com/Timcast/status/853249044583297024
https://twitter.com/Timcast/status/853243079159037954
https://twitter.com/Timcast/status/853255815427309568

A thread targeting Tim Pool in a black bloc friendly Racial Justice subforum for the east bay.

https://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2017/04/14/18798317.php

So some guys pushing around a dumpster, a news article that quotes people blaming ANTIFA (that terrified press) and others blaming right wingers, and Tim Pool, the guy who's scared of Swedish supermarkets. Oh and a forum thread "targeting" Tim Pool that's just saying don't talk to him, he's a shithead.

[etiolate]

^ See now that's hand-waving. Half-assed response. Doesn't engage. Irrelevant shit.

Take that L train curly, take it all the way to the final stop.

[I'm a Puppy!]

^ See now that's hand-waving. Half-assed response. Doesn't engage. Irrelevant shit.

Take that L train curly, take it all the way to the final stop.

Another potential death threat?

[etiolate]

FAIR POINT

curly, take the L train all the way to the wheelhouse so we can see you return to take more Ls

[chronovore]

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/04/iranian-american-state-department-official-demoted-after-breitbart-questions-loyalty-to-us/

Yet more instances of the stupid getting rid of everyone who knows what they're doing, in favor of blind loyalty and bad policy