Final Fantasy VII Remake |OT| The Unknown Journey Will Continue

[mormapope]

The idea Square Enix and the team that made this game isn't bad, it's actually quite interesting. The problem is the execution is convulted and messy to put it lightly.

OG Final Fantasy fans after beating this: "what the fuck just happened"

Newcomer fans of Final Fantasy or VII specifically: "what the fuck just happened, was the original game this stupid?  "

[TakingBackSunday]

I'm so excited for this fuckery

[Coffee Dog]

spoiler (click to show/hide)

i mean the only reason people wanted the game to be a slavish remake was because if you give these people too long a leash they end up putting angry time travel fandom ghosts in the game 

People are mad it isnt closer to the original because the original's script was fine and this is awful

[close]

[Himu]

spoiler (click to show/hide)

i mean the only reason people wanted the game to be a slavish remake was because if you give these people too long a leash they end up putting angry time travel fandom ghosts in the game 

People are mad it isnt closer to the original because the original's script was fine and this is awful

[close]

The original had a good concept and could use a little more detail.

Nomura? Nomura doesn't do that. 

[tiesto]

Extreme? That's standard jrpg game design. Jrpg design is built on scarcity. It's a genre about resource management. That is the game.

Really...? Not to Rhax my way into an argument, but can you name more than one JRPG released in the last decade and a half that was actually hard and required resource management?

JRPGs are, imo, cheesecake as hell games that I turn to. Persona 5, for example, is this easy ass game on its hardest difficulty and I hang out with my bros for useless stat boosts just to see the character interactions (of which, in the OG, there were almost none). Dragon Quest & most Final Fantasy games are just about introducing a bunch of variety into your mash X games, same goes for all other JRPGs I've played.

The only JRPGs I go to for difficulty and resource management are SMT games up until the release of Persona 4.

So many years have passed that I can't honestly think you believe that you think JRPGs are hallmarks of level design/difficulty/resource management. There are vastly more years/games that point to the contrary.

I mean, even old JRPGs are only hard because of savepoints and jank encounter rates.

Maybe not in the resource management side of things (as you're given ample recovery items, can save anywhere, and there are several recovery points in the larger dungeons), but Trails of Cold Steel 2 (and to a lesser extent, Trails in the Sky SC and the 3rd) had some really difficult battles requiring mastery of the battle system and the quartz system (basically like Materia).

Octopath Traveler is also super challenging, and although I haven't played it yet, I'd imagine SaGa Scarlet Grace is no slouch in the difficulty department.

[Mr Gilhaney]

This sounds amazingly stupid. I cant wait to play it.

What the fuck were they thinking!?

This shit sounds about as dumb as good guy Pyramid Head in the second Silent Hill movie.

well silent hill is great art, yeah you heard me ebert.

while final fantasy has always been enjoyable trash.

so it really isnt as offensive at all imo

[Rahxephon91]

Don’t like the implications of what could happen, but I do like those spoilers. I like it when products like a remake have meta story elements like this. I don’t know if I trust Square to carry it out though.

Really...? Not to Rhax my way into an argument, but can you name more than one JRPG released in the last decade and a half that was actually hard and required resource management?

Can you keep my name out of your mouth? Just because you don't like to argue about things you have an intrests in like I do, dosen't mean you're a smarter or better poster and I'm tired of you saying shit like this.

[MMaRsu]

Trusting Square Enix to do anything right 

[Rahxephon91]

Trusting Square Enix to do anything right 

I mean I guess if you don't like anything sure, they've done nothing right this gen...Except pretty much most of thier output this gen.

[Tasty]

Trusting Square Enix to do anything right 

Crystal Chronicles HD wil be good

[nachobro]

FF14 put out its best expansion yet this gen

[MMaRsu]

Trusting Square Enix to do anything right 

I mean I guess if you just want to be an ass and don't like anything sure, they've done nothing right this gen...Except pretty much most of thier output this gen.

[HardcoreRetro]

well silent hill is great art, yeah you heard me ebert.

while final fantasy has always been enjoyable trash.

so it really isnt as offensive at all imo

Didn't even get my name right.

The only Final Fantasy I actually care about is VI. Game should be here tomorrow afternoon.

[Don Rumata]

So if i never played 7, and play this, i won't understand shit? (No, i'm not playing the original, i've tried already and it was too ugly looking).

[Great Rumbler]

SO HYPED 

[mormapope]

So if i never played 7, and play this, i won't understand shit? (No, i'm not playing the original, i've tried already and it was too ugly looking).

Even if you played the original, shit ends up being convulted and confusing, we're all in the same camp.

[Coffee Dog]

spoiler (click to show/hide)

I get why they did this, it's because speculation is a part of a AAA hype cycle, they want people to make 40+ minute theory crafting videos like they do for kingdom hearts. At any moment, time can stop and these Subversion Ghosts can determine who lives and who dies, who does what and when. Let alone alternate timeline/universe bullshit. Infinite possibilities! Speculation and questions abound!

Is that really what we're into? Destroying the narrative stakes of what is going to be a 100+ hour RPG series purely for the benefit of speculation about Square playing Mad Libs with people and locations?

[close]

It's lazy hype building.

So if i never played 7, and play this, i won't understand shit? (No, i'm not playing the original, i've tried already and it was too ugly looking).

You'll understand it just fine, you'll even be able to tell where the new shit is bolted on. It stands out

[Rahxephon91]

Jesus these characters are probably the best renderd Normura designs the series has ever done. The art direction for this remake is incredible. Can’t wait to play this.

And sounds like they took ques from those shit Evangelion movies but this time without the bs. Makes me even more excited about the story if now I think a certain thing will be changed.

[bluemax]

Extreme? That's standard jrpg game design. Jrpg design is built on scarcity. It's a genre about resource management. That is the game.

Really...? Not to Rhax my way into an argument, but can you name more than one JRPG released in the last decade and a half that was actually hard and required resource management?

JRPGs are, imo, cheesecake as hell games that I turn to. Persona 5, for example, is this easy ass game on its hardest difficulty and I hang out with my bros for useless stat boosts just to see the character interactions (of which, in the OG, there were almost none). Dragon Quest & most Final Fantasy games are just about introducing a bunch of variety into your mash X games, same goes for all other JRPGs I've played.

The only JRPGs I go to for difficulty and resource management are SMT games up until the release of Persona 4.

So many years have passed that I can't honestly think you believe that you think JRPGs are hallmarks of level design/difficulty/resource management. There are vastly more years/games that point to the contrary.

I mean, even old JRPGs are only hard because of savepoints and jank encounter rates.

Maybe not in the resource management side of things (as you're given ample recovery items, can save anywhere, and there are several recovery points in the larger dungeons), but Trails of Cold Steel 2 (and to a lesser extent, Trails in the Sky SC and the 3rd) had some really difficult battles requiring mastery of the battle system and the quartz system (basically like Materia).

Octopath Traveler is also super challenging, and although I haven't played it yet, I'd imagine SaGa Scarlet Grace is no slouch in the difficulty department.

Alliance Alive can also kick your ass if you don't understand what is going on.

[Himu]

FF's are rarely balanced. You'll rarely get one where both the gameplay and story are up to par. Usually if the gameplay is great the story is okay or serviceable. For the reason, I divide final fantasy games into story FF's (VII, IX, VI and X) with gameplay FF's (I-V, VIII, Tactics, XII, XIII). The FF's that rise to the top are the ones with both a good mix of story and gameplay (IV, VI, Tactics, X) or its strength is so good it it's above and beyond the rest of the series (the gameplay in V and XII, the story in X).

With that in mind, I was really hoping with this remake to make the gameplay up to par with the story. FFVII's isn't the best but it's enjoyable and has lots of great moments all the same while telling a pretty ballsy, relevant narrative that few games would even approach (being environmental terrorists for one). Where it's lacking is the gameplay. FF remakes normally are much, much better than their original versions (FFII in FFOrigins being the best example, but also IV ds, and if we are including them International versions of X, X-2, and XII). So I was hoping a remake if there ever were one, would push the gameplay to make it at least on par with the rest of the package.

It probably won't happen so the story is the only reason to get this. Seeing old scenes with new graphics is the the only reason tbh.

At least I can go to sleep with the knowledge that if this were Dragon Quest remaking its most popular game it'd go balls out and perfect the gameplay with a kiss. Once again proving it to be the superior franchise. DQIII sfam and DQVII 3ds  I can only imagine the eventual DQIX remake. They'll style the living fuck on FF's grave

[bluemax]

Trusting Square Enix to do anything right 

This gen they've given me:

DQB 1 and 2
DQH
DQXI
RS 2 and 3 HD
I am Setsuna
FFXII HD
FFXIV
FFXV (I'm one of the weirdos who likes it)
Nier Automata
Mana Collection
Trials of Mana HD

And that's just the stuff I bought and liked, I also bought a few misses like Star Ocean Integrity and Faithlessness...

[MMaRsu]

Of that list I only know of dq and nier and those are indeed great games.

maybe I should have said trusting Nomura

[HardcoreRetro]

Booted up the game. PS4 sounding like a jet engine.

[Nintex]

Booted up the game. PS4 sounding like a jet engine.

No you can't play this early everything should be multi-platform, microsoft paid for it.
The Xbox is an easier development platform 


PS4 goes
BRRRRRRRRRRR 

[HardcoreRetro]

Talked to some random dude in the slums. Gave me a cd of chocobo trap music. Maybe this game is good?

[Himu]

Booted up the game. PS4 sounding like a jet engine.

This is just psx nostalgia my man. The other month I booted up my old psx and bruh. The SCRITCH and SCRATCH of that system doing its work in the atmospheric confines of a dark room...

[HardcoreRetro]

Wasn't a joke btw.

[demi]

No lyrics, dogshit

[Svejk]

Gonna be a long week 

[Himu]

Is the guy that looks like he's jacking off and at his "secret place" still in the game

[Himu]

Will Walmart stock this? lol

[Himu]

Tell me about:

-NPC interaction
- World building
- exploration
- resource management (how much Gill you make, the average cost of items including materia and weapons)
- are ethers sold in stores?
- what is the functionality of tents? Are there tents?
- describe the encounter design outside of dungeons. How many enemies do you usually fight at once? Are they avoidable? Do they feel scripted?
- how is the dungeon design? Has it been further developed from the very minimal dungeons of the original?

[Himu]

Let's get more advanced.

Tell me about:

- Materia as a system in the remake. How customizable is it so far if at all? Of course this will be limited to the type  of materia you have. But what are your options? Can you place them strategically like in the original? Does materia still have levels and AP? Do materia slots on specific gear still have specific abilities? For example, this piece of armor has slots that connect allowing the use of All or Elemental materia or this weapon allows normal growth of ability points and that armor uses double growth.

In what manner has the system been upgraded or downgraded and in what capacity?

This is could go towards any type of system so if they've replaced it altogether what's the system like in general?

[HardcoreRetro]

More important than all that shit. I got the trophy for the darts minigame!

[Himu]

Is darts relaxing

[Joe Molotov]

Talked to some random dude in the slums. Gave me a cd of chocobo trap music. Maybe this game is good?

are he sick?

[HardcoreRetro]

I've played like 4 hours so far.

NPC interaction seems fairly limited. On par with the original with them just spouting one or two lines of dialogue. Since they do it automatically it gets pretty annoying since a bunch of em say their lines at the same time. Stand still in a place and they start repeating the lines.

Haven't seen enough of the world to really talk about worldbuilding. Jessie's exposition dump about the way midgar is structured is still in the train section.

Isn't much exploration to be done with the game using markers for everything. You got a map and you walk towards the symbol.

The economy seems fine so far. You don't get enough gil to buy everything, so you gotta decide what you want.

Can't check if ethers are sold at the moment, but if they are, higher end items seem to be sold in limited supply. They're also quite expensive.

Tents seem to be gone. There's rest spots on the map now. You also get your own hotel room in the slums.

Combat mostly takes place in either set pieces or sectioned off areas. (dungeons I guess.) Mostly been real bare-bones so far. The ammount of enemies you fight at once has ranged from a single enemy up to a group of ten. Finding the enemies' weaknesses has been pretty important since it works in conjunction with the stagger mechanic. You won't be just mashing square in later encounters. Positioning also seems important for certain enemies. Weapons each have their own special ability. Once you gain 100% proficiency with a weapon it's skill will be added to your overall pool of abilities and you can use it while equiped with another weapon.

The materia system seems mostly intact. Cloud's weapons so far has single notches but Tifa's got a linked one. I don't know which materia are in the game though.

[Himu]

I've played like 4 hours so far.

NPC interaction seems fairly limited. On par with the original with them just spouting one or two lines of dialogue. Since they do it automatically it gets pretty annoying since a bunch of em say their lines at the same time. Stand still in a place and they start repeating the lines.

Haven't seen enough of the world to really talk about worldbuilding. Jessie's exposition dump about the way midgar is structured is still in the train section.

Isn't much exploration to be done with the game using markers for everything. You got a map and you walk towards the symbol.

The economy seems fine so far. You don't get enough gil to buy everything, so you gotta decide what you want.

Can't check if ethers are sold at the moment, but if they are, higher end items seem to be sold in limited supply. They're also quite expensive.

Tents seem to be gone. There's rest spots on the map now. You also get your own hotel room in the slums.

Combat mostly takes place in either set pieces or sectioned off areas. (dungeons I guess.) Mostly been real bare-bones so far. The ammount of enemies you fight at once has ranged from a single enemy up to a group of ten. Finding the enemies' weaknesses has been pretty important since it works in conjunction with the stagger mechanic. You won't be just mashing square in later encounters. Positioning also seems important for certain enemies. Weapons each have their own special ability. Once you gain 100% proficiency with a weapon it's skill will be added to your overall pool of abilities and you can use it while equiped with another weapon.

The materia system seems mostly intact. Cloud's weapons so far has single notches but Tifa's got a linked one. I don't know which materia are in the game though.

Sounds good. Can you supply a video of the church getaway from Reno? I'd like to see how elaborate it is and what they've changed (from the barrel part).

Materia system still being intact is the biggest surprise. Given the change to action, they had no reason to keep it. The rest sounds either okay to great. Ten enemies at once is pretty 3d FF, aside from FFXII the GAWD, typically limits enemy numbers to three. Paltry numbers compared to the 6-9 enemy numbers you'd face in 2d FF.

So ten enemies at once...

[Mr Gilhaney]

No lyrics, dogshit

what the fuck how have i never heard this 

[Himu]

Is the Johnny side story still in?

[Himu]

[HardcoreRetro]

Game doesn't allow me to use the share function. Not up to that part yet anyways.

If I do end up capturing it, I'll see if I can transfer it to usb and then just upload it on the pc.

[Mr Gilhaney]

i cant stop listening to this crazy chocobo song

[Himu]

Game doesn't allow me to use the share function. Not up to that part yet anyways.

If I do end up capturing it, I'll see if I can transfer it to usb and then just upload it on the pc.

Thank you for your service.

Have you tried running away during battle?

Let's say, compare it with FFXII. In FFXII, if you aggro an enemy they'll keep chasing. And then you'll pull more enemies. You might have started fighting two enemies, but now? You're fighting six. It works like an MMO. It has the single greatest encounter design I've seen from a single player turn based RPG. Going from that to FFXIII was like going from a five star meal to dinner at Arby's. In the FFVII demo I tested it out and the enemies didn't chase very far but that was the opening area, so I'm wiling to be leeway.

What's the AI like? I noticed potential against the Grunts that showed up during the bombing escape. I liked fighting them.

[Himu]

Speaking of AI, the party AI in the demo was dog shit.

Does the full game have more customizable party AI? On a scale of dog shit to god like, or Kingdom Hearts to Final Fantasy XII with Tales Of as an in-between, how much freedom do we have towards party AI?

[mormapope]

Tfw you read the spoiler thread and know how much of the game may end up being filler to pad a 15 hour game to a 30-40 hour one 

Similar criticism that was thrown at MGS V, but that game has a phenomenal gameplay loop and gameplay in general. We'll see how much mileage this remake has for it's combat.

[Himu]

If the dungeons and combat are up to par it won't matter much. Hopefully dungeons are actually fun. I would love to see a deep labyrinth of a dungeon but I'm not expecting it. That'd be the best way to "pad" the game though. Let's see if they're up to the task.

[mormapope]

If the dungeons and combat are up to par it won't matter much. Hopefully dungeons are actually fun. I would love to see a deep labyrinth of a dungeon but I'm not expecting it. That'd be the best way to "pad" the game though. Let's see if they're up to the task.

Think more like MGS V's side ops and ops than dungeon crawling. 

Basically, to progress further in the main storyline, you need to get blank, and give it to blank.

[Himu]

If the dungeons and combat are up to par it won't matter much. Hopefully dungeons are actually fun. I would love to see a deep labyrinth of a dungeon but I'm not expecting it. That'd be the best way to "pad" the game though. Let's see if they're up to the task.

Think more like MGS V's side ops and ops than dungeon crawling. 

Basically, to progress further in the main storyline, you need to get blank, and give it to blank.

SMH.

More this



See all those red dots?

Less fetch quests please.

I wanna crawl baby

Describe the fetch quests in spoiler tags please. I liked MGSV's ops so

[mormapope]

From what I've read, it's pretty much straight up "go to this area and fight these blanks" to "talk to these blanks and then these blanks and pick up blank". There's obviously not much freedom or decision making, this isn't a WRPG. Basically rote activities that'd be side quests are thrown into the mix for main story progression.

The spoiler thread has gone apeshit over the story spoilers over anything else. Gameplay and such isn't the main attraction here, no one has really praised how deep combat can get, nor that there's cool endgame content (which seems to be DLC after launch for the majority of Square Enix games at this point).

[Himu]

Are there marks? I mean "go here and fight this" is literally marks from FFXII and the other games that were inspired by it. So it's not really negative outright as a large part of the fun is traveling to fight the mark. If they are hunts then it's good. If it's just menial crap then :shit

Not sure why you brought up wrpgs as no one in their right mind would expect that.

[demi]

You should probably stop wondering if it's like FF12 before you disappoint yourself further

[Himu]

You should probably stop wondering if it's like FF12 before you disappoint yourself further

The fact FFXII gameplay isn't series standard after its release is a disappointment in itself.

Square going to step 1 and remaking a new game from scratch and getting rid of every single good thing the previous game did  every single new entry is the definition of excess.

[Himu]

XIII and XV also have hunts. It's pretty reasonable to expect them in FFVIIR.

"Go here and fight this" is literally what hunts have always been so it doesn't sound bad to me. That is, assuming they are hunts.

[mormapope]

XIII and XV also have hunts. It's pretty reasonable to expect them in FFVIIR.

"Go here and fight this" is literally what hunts have always been so it doesn't sound bad to me. That is, assuming they are hunts.

In those games though, that was side activity to get cool weapons/accessories, earn gil and loot to sell or craft with, earn XP to spend on getting new abilities. XII, XIII, and XV are certainly more challenging games if you skip side content, but it's not required in main story scenarios or progression.

Progression in this remake is tied to doing not only hunt type stuff, but straight up fetch quests. The side content in XV is awful, and it sounds like they made that type of content matter with main scenario progression.

This is going to be a 30-40 hour game for most, and after that, it sounds like there's very little to do after the game is over. 

[Himu]

I see.

I wonder what the reaction will be like.

I'm looking forward to it.

[Himu]

If this is true, it greatly speaks of the remake teams incompetence.

If you had a say, a lot of side quests with hunts, you wouldn't need to pad with filler stuff like fetch quests. When you force people to do something they notice. But if it's an optional side diversion they won't. Things like marks are really popular and pretty easy to implement while filling the game substantially with content. People were still playing FFXIII after they beat it for the marks alone, trying to farm Adamantoises. It's a good way to give a game more bite for your buck and more sizzle to your steak. FFXIII was a 40 hour game but people kept playing it for like an additional 40 hours because of that. I won't even get into FFXII clock lengths. You can easily hit 120 hours due to the amount of marks and dungeon/side content.

If you're going to remake the most popular entry, and you're going to limit it to the beginning area, you should outright spoil your players with content because they now have an established standard.

Putting filler in the game but leaving out marks, which at this point are an established series tradition, makes me question their priorities.

Can't wait to see it for myself.

[HardcoreRetro]

Chapter 4 was entirely new stuff. Should be going to the sector 5 reactor next. 6 hours played so far.

If you're expecting proper dungeons from this you'll be disappointed. Mormapope is right about the fetch quests. One of em had me finding three cats in the slums.

[Himu]

Chapter 4 was entirely new stuff. Should be going to the sector 5 reactor next. 6 hours played so far.

If you're expecting proper dungeons from this you'll be disappointed. Mormapope is right about the fetch quests. One of em had me finding three cats in the slums.

Amateur hour.

Were the cats cute?

[Coffee Dog]

Do you ever get more moves to do when you dont have ATB?