Other Forums Containment Thread

[benjipwns]

Man, i wish we had meaningful power. I'd sleep better at night.

We ban people for crossing the line on the ToS. Not much power in that.

More lying/gaslighting from the staff.

They almost never ban for violations of the Terms of Service. They don't even consistently enforce their Rules/Guidelines. (Which are not part of the Terms of Service!)

[ShutUp]

Ban people for crossing the line on the ToS? Then why are the likes of incelchief and Kyuuji not banned? 

[railGUN]

This is going to end so badly and the amount of egg on these douchebag mods/admins faces will be glorious.

[HaughtyFrank]

Man, i wish we had meaningful power. I'd sleep better at night.

We ban people for crossing the line on the ToS. Not much power in that.

More lying/gaslighting from the staff.

They almost never ban for violations of the Terms of Service. They don't even consistently enforce their Rules/Guidelines. (Which are not part of the Terms of Service!)

And yet he can't quote the TOS labor broke 

[ShutUp]

So we won’t be forced? Does that mean it’s happening willingly? The people have a right to know!

It’s this mocking tone that is pissing people off in there. Also, who on the mod team is this person, Fuzzy, fucking I wonder. Not even a mod but doing their work for them.

[ShutUp]

Once again this reads as “the only reason more people aren’t freaking out is because they just don’t know!” even though we’re closing in on 7K posts in here. Somehow all of us found this thread but nobody else did. If there were stickied threads in Gaming and Etc you’d have the same people who ignored the alert scrolling past them because they don’t care. #1 thread in Trending? This one.

And who do you think has the majority of those 7k posts, you fucking idiot?

[Risible]

anyone need a tag? haha, tags are a means of expression, but if only i was doing the expressing for you. you dont actually have any say on this. haha

Haha that would be so crazy if you gave me a tag I don't want one but imagine how funny it would be haha lmao this place cracks me up that's why I love the mods I mean tags are stupid but I guess if I had to have one I'd take it haha lmao.

Please.

[HaughtyFrank]

Once again this reads as “the only reason more people aren’t freaking out is because they just don’t know!” even though we’re closing in on 7K posts in here. Somehow all of us found this thread but nobody else did. If there were stickied threads in Gaming and Etc you’d have the same people who ignored the alert scrolling past them because they don’t care. #1 thread in Trending? This one.

And who do you think has the majority of those 7k posts, you fucking idiot?

If this were true then why the fuck are they scared of allowing a new thread, or moving the thread? What a blatant lie

[benjipwns]

And yet he can't quote the TOS labor broke 

It must have been a really important ToS violation if Hecht had pings setup to warn him to get up in the middle of the night for a ban.

[remy]

Imagining hecht shooting upright in the middle of the night running to his computer to close the thread and hand out more unfunny tags

i was close but he just banned a game developer person of colour and valued community member (tm) instead

[Taco Bell Tower]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/thank-you-sakurai-beautiful-smash-tribute-video-just-posted-by-gvg.502425/post-75464937/

 

https://www.resetera.com/threads/thank-you-sakurai-beautiful-smash-tribute-video-just-posted-by-gvg.502425/page-2#post-75471456

Guy that made the video isn't happy.  We might have another Dark1x situation on our hands.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/thank-you-sakurai-beautiful-smash-tribute-video-just-posted-by-gvg.502425/page-2#post-75471537

None of us believe that any of you are bad people, let me make that 100% clear. The only issues we have are more with Scott the Woz as well as Smash's anti-Blackness as a whole, the latter of which isn't your fault & the former could have easily been out of ignorance (especially considering how quickly you condemned RelaxAlax, the person Scott defended). We otherwise respect the effort you all put into the video.

God the thread could be about something that's so wholesome and have 0 problems and somehow era would find something negative within it.

Good to know to never expect a thread to be all positive no matter how wholesome the subject of the thread is.

don't feature trash in the thread then

[nobody of note]

So we won’t be forced? Does that mean it’s happening willingly? The people have a right to know!

It’s this mocking tone that is pissing people off in there. Also, who on the mod team is this person, Fuzzy, fucking I wonder. Not even a mod but doing their work for them.

To go with a dated reference that's been eating at my brain all weekend: A lot of their dismissive jokey stuff carries big Mean Girls vibes, complete with weird cadre of hangers-on and a seeming complete lack of real self-reflection or realization that people *not* in the group are actually just as complex and varied as the people in the group. Like, they're trying to make things 'fun' in that thread, but only fun for the people with the right opinion. You've even got the main mods doing the Regina George decrees, and then the 'who?' mods dropping the shitty one-liners to show they're part of the team.

Maybe the MOBA buyout will be the bus hit they need to all get brought back to reality.

[Crumb]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/thank-you-sakurai-beautiful-smash-tribute-video-just-posted-by-gvg.502425/post-75476112

If it makes you feel better, this reaction is mainly because of the toxic YouTuber in your video and Smash's general anti-blackness. One problem doesn't involve you at all but in the future please consider not featuring any toxic YouTubers in your videos.

"Next time you make a piece of media you run it by us FIRST, okay? Thank you"

[Snoopycat_]

So what are all the Rees who spammed gore and porn going to do now their Gaf accounts are banned? Do they actually think Lore has forgotten?

[BIONIC]

So we won’t be forced? Does that mean it’s happening willingly? The people have a right to know!

It’s this mocking tone that is pissing people off in there. Also, who on the mod team is this person, Fuzzy, fucking I wonder. Not even a mod but doing their work for them.

To go with a dated reference that's been eating at my brain all weekend: A lot of their dismissive jokey stuff carries big Mean Girls vibes, complete with weird cadre of hangers-on and a seeming complete lack of real self-reflection or realization that people *not* in the group are actually just as complex and varied as the people in the group. Like, they're trying to make things 'fun' in that thread, but only fun for the people with the right opinion. You've even got the main mods doing the Regina George decrees, and then the 'who?' mods dropping the shitty one-liners to show they're part of the team.

Maybe the MOBA buyout will be the bus hit they need to all get brought back to reality.

Mean Girls is now dated   

[ShutUp]

I’d love it so much if in that Smash thread people suddenly started talking about tags to drown out the whining about the game being fucking anti-black. Some of the people I have seen in the site sale thread making fun of asking questions are in that Smash thread “just asking questions”.

[bork]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/thank-you-sakurai-beautiful-smash-tribute-video-just-posted-by-gvg.502425/post-75464937/

 

https://www.resetera.com/threads/thank-you-sakurai-beautiful-smash-tribute-video-just-posted-by-gvg.502425/page-2#post-75471456

Guy that made the video isn't happy.  We might have another Dark1x situation on our hands.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/thank-you-sakurai-beautiful-smash-tribute-video-just-posted-by-gvg.502425/page-2#post-75471537

None of us believe that any of you are bad people, let me make that 100% clear. The only issues we have are more with Scott the Woz as well as Smash's anti-Blackness as a whole, the latter of which isn't your fault & the former could have easily been out of ignorance (especially considering how quickly you condemned RelaxAlax, the person Scott defended). We otherwise respect the effort you all put into the video.

God the thread could be about something that's so wholesome and have 0 problems and somehow era would find something negative within it.

Good to know to never expect a thread to be all positive no matter how wholesome the subject of the thread is.

don't feature trash in the thread then

"ResetEra: We can't enjoy anything!"

[remy]

I’d love it so much if in that Smash thread people suddenly started talking about tags to drown out the whining about the game being fucking anti-black. Some of the people I have seen in the site sale thread making fun of asking questions are in that Smash thread “just asking questions”.

No, when they do it its different !

[bork]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/thank-you-sakurai-beautiful-smash-tribute-video-just-posted-by-gvg.502425/page-2#post-75478398

I don't think it's a terrible thing to voice that frustration, I think it's thoughtless to do it in a thread not even about Smash itself where the guy who helped make it says he got upset reading the initial reactions here where the only involvement he has in the product that's constantly failed in this regard is that he bought a copy and likes it.

It's not even about "celebrating Smash" as a thread, it's one where a thread about a fan video about that is getting used to have this conversation.

This is where I'm at. Smash does deserve pushback for its lack of diversity... But God damn this thread is a perfect example of why almost everyone in the industry no longer posts here.

 

Suggestion: Follow their example. 

[ShutUp]

At this point this thread is just free entertainment at what people are mad at every few pages.

Wanting questions answered that have not at all been answered yet is “free entertainment” 

And who is this latest bootlicker? Seen them pop up in that thread right around when the tag shit started.

[remy]

At this point this thread is just free entertainment at what people are mad at every few pages.

Wanting questions answered that have not at all been answered yet is “free entertainment” 

And who is this latest bootlicker? Seen them pop up in that thread right around when the tag shit started.

I'm sure just a proud member of the board and not someone with a vested interest in sticking up for current and ex staff members, and not at all android sophia's intimate partner

you can tell they're not part of a clique with the mods (which don't exist) because they were able to get a tag they didn't like changed for one they chose. which is just standard practice of course

[railGUN]

MOBA Network represents everything that REE hates. But they’re so hopelessly addicted to that forum, and the staff need that small nugget of power so badly, that they’re doing everything in their power to convince each other, and more pathetically, themselves, that that isn’t the case.

Circus doesn’t even begin to describe that place, and its inhabitants.

[bork]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-ownership-update.499677/page-138#post-75479964

We ban people for crossing the line on the ToS.

No, you don't.  Why don't you guys just admit that you ignore it and just do whatever the hell you like?

[benjipwns]

This person brought receipts
(Image removed from quote.)

What in that screenshot that's being posted is false, exactly? I don't get it.

[james]

 

[zomgee]

So what are all the Rees who spammed gore and porn going to do now their Gaf accounts are banned? Do they actually think Lore has forgotten?

bire

[benjipwns]

Even if you grant "he just was talking about moderation, not the site overall", would you describe the treatment of Seik, Labor and Morrigan in this thread as "fair, transparent and reasonable"?

I haven't been keeping up with it as much since I am back at work so I don't know what happened, I know Morrigan was doing her damnedest to help elucidate stuff from her time as a mod, Seik was pretty over the top with their posts, no idea what happened with Labor, it's hard to keep up. If people were banned there are likely ban messages telling you why which is transparent, or you can message the mods to have a reasonable discussion, this doesn't seem like a thread meant to litigate mod actions or whatever.

I like how even during his boot licking over a topic he claims to know nothing about RedMercury admits the mods aren't always transparent.

[Averon]

RedMercuy in there trying his hardest to suck the last shitty nugget out of the mods' assholes.

[Lonewulfeus]

anyone need a tag? haha, tags are a means of expression, but if only i was doing the expressing for you. you dont actually have any say on this. haha

Haha that would be so crazy if you gave me a tag I don't want one but imagine how funny it would be haha lmao this place cracks me up that's why I love the mods I mean tags are stupid but I guess if I had to have one I'd take it haha lmao.

Please.

Haha could you imagine if his tag was “Fat Boy” haha that would be hilarious.  Imagine…

[Yulwei]

  

[FUME5]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-ownership-update.499677/post-75484260

It'll never cease to amaze me how many people truly believe that by being aggressive and going after mods they're making a valiant stand against an oppressive force.

When really they're just screaming at the help

Uh

[benjipwns]

It'll never cease to amaze me how many people truly believe that by being aggressive and going after cops they're making a valiant stand against an oppressive force.

When really they're just screaming at the help.

#FreeKetKat

[nobody of note]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-ownership-update.499677/post-75484260

It'll never cease to amaze me how many people truly believe that by being aggressive and going after mods they're making a valiant stand against an oppressive force.

When really they're just screaming at the help

Uh

Setting aside the unpaid help angle because... uh... wow

The only context in which most of the staff will ever be worth noticing for most of the users is on-forum interaction. In those cases, the staff actually does have power--meaningless power in the great life scope of things, but still power within the tiny shell of RE. This means, in the only context most of these people will ever register, they have the power. And they misuse it, frequently, when they feel threatened, questioned, or cranky. It's not that hard to comprehend, and people accusing them of power tripping don't mean to imply that they're actual people of consequence outside RE.

[Taco Bell Tower]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/conservatives-use-very-effective-tactics-to-spread-misinformation-why-cant-liberals-just-use-the-same-tactics-but-to-spread-truth.502581/#post-75480954

Because the truth is more complicated than a lie.

 

[bork]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-ownership-update.499677/page-138#post-75483735

Mods aren’t perfect and are sometimes mean to people. lol

 

[Tektonic]

brb pounding sand
 

[bork]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-ownership-update.499677/post-75484260

It'll never cease to amaze me how many people truly believe that by being aggressive and going after mods they're making a valiant stand against an oppressive force.

When really they're just screaming at the help

Uh

Help?  What help? 

[bork]

brb pounding sand
 

[benjipwns]

Since he wants attention, let's see what he's up to on the Twitter:
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1450257870805774339
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1450260741995606023
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1450274193438818306
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1450262922547052551

Look at this white supremacist piece of shit claiming it wasn't the ResetERA.com thread that made him take down the linked tweet:

桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai
@Sora_Sakurai
なぜか同じ投稿が二重にされたようです｡
ひとつ消させていただきました…
Translated from Japanese by
It seems that the same post was duplicated for some reason.
 I erased one ...

spoiler (click to show/hide)

https://twitter.com/tomathius/status/1449595179665608707
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1449767347212935177

[close]

[Tektonic]

seriously nintendo fans are the worst

[benjipwns]

Since the staff are currently trying to distract again with "wacky hijinks" let's spotlight this post:

On the first day of this forum users were pushing to make sure Admins/Moderators got a fair share if the site was ever profitable. The thread was locked after two days with this statement from the team:

"We appreciate everyone's input into this matter. All of your suggestions have been read and will be taken into consideration in any future direction this board may take. Thanks again!"

You say that you would have taken a deal to make it community owned, and it was stated that it would be taken into consideration. Since you would have taken a share, if offered, I can only assume this was not discussed among all of the Admins before the sale, which indeed is a large shift in the direction of the board.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-revenue-should-go-back-to-the-community-and-gaming-charity-causes.826/post-146901

I know I was the one to bring this thread up in the first place, and I agree with most of this. I also wish that thread got a thread mark in here because I think everyone deserves to read it.

I’d also like to personally point out this was being discussed in the main and other discords during site formation. This isn’t an out of the blue idea. All of these core ideas were talked about during site formation and ultimately shot down by ownership or soon to be ownership at the time.

Part of the issue with this thread is I’d say a good 3/4th of the posters in this thread weren’t there at the time of these discussions. Not that all of y’all weren’t, but many weren’t. Hell I’d say 3/4th of the current mod list weren’t really part of the site discussion back in the day. A lot of those people have moved on, rarely post, been banned ect…

I say this not to hate on anyone, but it’s hard to have real context if you weren’t actually there.

[Taco Bell Tower]

Since he wants attention, let's see what he's up to on the Twitter:
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1450257870805774339
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1450260741995606023
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1450274193438818306
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1450262922547052551

Look at this white supremacist piece of shit claiming it wasn't the ResetERA.com thread that made him take down the linked tweet:

桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai
@Sora_Sakurai
なぜか同じ投稿が二重にされたようです｡
ひとつ消させていただきました…
Translated from Japanese by
It seems that the same post was duplicated for some reason.
 I erased one ...

spoiler (click to show/hide)

https://twitter.com/tomathius/status/1449595179665608707
https://twitter.com/Neoxon619/status/1449767347212935177

[close]

Uninstalling Smash, he ain't slick 

[ShutUp]

And just like that, the ultimate ass kissers have shown up and its time to mock legit concerns again.

[Risible]

(Image removed from quote.)

Damn Will getting into Demi-approved territory.

[Risible]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-ownership-update.499677/post-75484260

It'll never cease to amaze me how many people truly believe that by being aggressive and going after mods they're making a valiant stand against an oppressive force.

When really they're just screaming at the help

Uh

This, boys and girls, is what is known as a "backhanded compliment."

[benjipwns]

The entire concept of a privately owned forum being "by the community, for the community" is bullshit and I think realistically most people knew that at the point it was formed. People like to throw the word "community" out and demand transparency and feel entitled to being part of a successful thing, but who is anyone kidding? Those who actually invest the time and money into something legally owns and controls it, everyone else is freely contributing to get some benefit out of it (being able to post in a large community of mostly the same people without actually having to worry about backend stuff, being able to complain and bitch and moan about things without actually having to fix them, being able to bookmark a forum to go to without needing to set it up, maintain it, and host it, etc).

Yes this was talked about before in the past. Yes it was mostly dismissed by the ownership. Should have given you a hint then. Those of us who were mods and admins for GAF knew the drill, and in private conversations when ERA was being formed we expected that whoever successfully got the replacement off the ground would probably profit well off it eventually. If the "community" really wanted to have true control so badly, someone should have taken the initiative to crowdfund the resources and actually do the legwork to put up a platform. Not wait for others to do it and trust on their goodwill when they are spending 100% of their own money and resources. The reality is that internet communities want the convenience but not the responsibility, and also want the entitlement to appeal to moral authority when things don't go the way they expect. That's why boycotts largely don't work. That's also why despite hating Facebook, Twitter, and whatever toxic social media giants, most people are still on them.

That's the context from my perspective as someone who was there from the start.

These idiots seriously expect people to believe that running a forum (with ads and a subscription!) is some kind of elaborate expensive endeavor that only Cerium could have pulled off.

[bork]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-ownership-update.499677/page-138#post-75486147

So competing sites didn’t get off the ground.

They sure are getting off the ground now.

[Taco Bell Tower]

The entire concept of a privately owned forum being "by the community, for the community" is bullshit and I think realistically most people knew that at the point it was formed. People like to throw the word "community" out and demand transparency and feel entitled to being part of a successful thing, but who is anyone kidding? Those who actually invest the time and money into something legally owns and controls it, everyone else is freely contributing to get some benefit out of it (being able to post in a large community of mostly the same people without actually having to worry about backend stuff, being able to complain and bitch and moan about things without actually having to fix them, being able to bookmark a forum to go to without needing to set it up, maintain it, and host it, etc).

Yes this was talked about before in the past. Yes it was mostly dismissed by the ownership. Should have given you a hint then. Those of us who were mods and admins for GAF knew the drill, and in private conversations when ERA was being formed we expected that whoever successfully got the replacement off the ground would probably profit well off it eventually. If the "community" really wanted to have true control so badly, someone should have taken the initiative to crowdfund the resources and actually do the legwork to put up a platform. Not wait for others to do it and trust on their goodwill when they are spending 100% of their own money and resources. The reality is that internet communities want the convenience but not the responsibility, and also want the entitlement to appeal to moral authority when things don't go the way they expect. That's why boycotts largely don't work. That's also why despite hating Facebook, Twitter, and whatever toxic social media giants, most people are still on them.

That's the context from my perspective as someone who was there from the start.

These idiots seriously expect people to believe that running a forum (with ads and a subscription!) is some kind of elaborate expensive endeavor that only Cerium could have pulled off.

It’s why I never considered paying for Era Clear for one second.

 

[Taco Bell Tower]

https://www.resetera.com/threads/work-got-ransomwared-they-didnt-couldnt-pay-we-lost-15-years-of-data-advice.502266/

What a disaster. Our corporate head office and all of its North American subsidiaries were hacked.

I am just a mid-level manager at one of the subsidiaries and I am not privy to all of the details, but it sounds like they were in our network for weeks and even deleted our server backups. 15 years of data gone, including all of the systems I developed over the last 6 years internally for our team's processes.

How does this happen to a multi-million dollar corporation that employs thousands of people? I don't know much about ransomware, but this screams incompetence to me on the IT side. It's infuriating.

Thankfully, I did keep a few personal backups of my files, but I trusted (perhaps naively) that we would always have server backups if something happened.

What make it worse is that it's now my responsibility to rebuild everything. I'm pretty upset about that. I was proud of what we developed and now we have to do it all again.

Does anybody have any advice for dealing with this? Do I leverage the situation to get more resources? A raise? Do I walk? I'm just so stressed thinking about all the work ahead.

[Potato]

Has any of this shit hit the gaming media yet? Seems like a pretty big story, but fuckwits like JShiller are probably too busy on press junkets to actually do some journalism.

What fucking big story? Asshole sells his dying forum to a shell company while his mods are in denial?

Unless anyone can confirm that MOBA is truly shady or willing to sell info, I don’t think is a big story at all.

No matter what we think of it, it is the biggest internet gaming forum and $4.5 million is a lot of money. Also, the current situation is in direct contrast to the stated philosophy of the now-former owner and the mods and community at large and the general population is revolting over it. This crowd also has history of turning on the owner of a forum and jumping ship.

There is a clear story for the enthusiast press and if the new owners do turn out to be shonky as fuck then there is a clear story for the mainstream press.

I may have never worked as a journalist, but I did study journalism at University. I have 20 years experience in communications and media work and I think that qualifies me to know what constitutes a newsworthy story.

[benjipwns]

Some stuff from earlier since I'm for some stupid reason reading the pages I skipped past and this is just hilarious, a near master class in a complete morons trying to lie, obfuscate, gaslight, victim blame and dissemble in the face of simple questions all to distract from the issues and turn attention back to themselves: https://www.resetera.com/threads/resetera-ownership-update.499677/post-75435057

As it's been explained:

This is the first time the community has largely appeared to be in the staff's favor... literally ever. Just weeks ago tons of members were calling us out-of-touch morons deliberately trying to drive a gaming community away, and arguing down anyone who defended us during the kerfuffle. Just as well, no one has cared about our compensation before now, even with the knowledge that Era Clear is a thing, and the fact that we've admitted plenty of times that we're complete volunteers.

What this comes across to us is a roundabout way to attack Cerium's character by positioning him as some asshole who tricked us. "How dare he run off with so much money! You poor mods; oh so taken advantage of!" Rings hollow, especially since some of the same usernames here trying to knight for us are some of the same people always making our jobs harder.

That's originally why I started that tip jar- to force people's hand and tell them to make the difference for the people who served their community. I even gave it all away to charity. And guess what? Some members got mad as hell, and refusal to pay basically came down to "No, no, no, we want you paid, but we don't want to do it; fuck that." Some chucklehead last night even drudged it up a day later to try and make me out like I did anything wrong. And after that I was further trolled by folks who I know good and well would've ran off with the money to buy useless gaming shit if they were in my position.

And the cherry on top of this nonsense? Staff have said they understand why people might feel that way in an ahistorical vacuum (but ultimately compensation is our business to work out), but said the thing we want most is for people to just treat us better. Don't take big announcements like this as a call to arms. Be about appreciating us all the time. Do you think the majority have listened?

Lol.

This is all theater.

This is literally all theater.

We honestly don't feel people truly care like that. I mean, thanks I guess, for thinking I should be paid a salary for you to call me a fascist when I ban someone popular or lock the wrong thread, versus getting called a fascist for free. Really feeling the love.

Uh yes unironically? Do you not understand the difference between begging for tips from users and being compensated by the guy pulling 500k a year from the site?

Again, no one cared about our compensation until now. You all knew Era Clear was a thing. You also knew we were volunteers. This should not have come out of left field for you, (and if it did, wow at people effectively acting like Karens to employed labor all the time!) You only care now that you see the sum the site sold for, all the while not knowing exactly what Ceri has done for us behind the scenes anyway because you don't actually know anything about him at all. (All I'll say is that Cerium has interfered on my behalf to the point that he prevented me from randomly disappearing from Era altogether due to hardship.)

Again, we don't believe this argument is out of genuine concern. That doesn't mean you don't have an argument, of course! But we don't think you guys love us like you are acting now. If you did, you would've shown it before now. Take this as a lesson to just appreciate us in the future.

This is just not true. I'm sorry that the relationship between staff and users has broken down, I am trying to understand the apprehension from your side. But it's simply not true that this has never been talked about before, that nobody cares, or that there's never been a time that most people supported staff.

You should be asking what has happened then that 99% of staff do not feel like they can trust that these arguments are coming from a place of good-heartedness then.

Is it easier to call the argument a bad faith argument than to just evaluate its merit? Does it make the point less true?

We're thousands of posts in and you actually think you're bringing up a new argument worthy of entertaining.

While I’m not certain if this was aimed at me or not (I don’t think so? I’ve never called you a fascist).

But the two things aren’t mutually exclusive.

I can dislike a particular mod for whatever reason (and I do) and still think they they deserve something in this particular context.

Again, the amount of vitriol we've received for years from the same community trying to defend us is not irrelevant to this situation. Trying to pretend it is us insulting. Again, I'm not even saying you don't have an argument. I'm saying it's been employed opportunistically. And I implore you to ask why most staff feel like that.

I'm going to engage with you on this in good faith. If I don't respond further, don't take it personally. It's now Monday morning, I'm at my day job.

Believe me when I tell you that nobody wishes this thread could have stayed on track more than the mod team. We brainstormed for days before this thread was posted ways that we could best keep this thread a good natured addressing of concerns between members and staff. If for no other reason than it would have resulted in less stress for us. Rest assured, we don't like what this thread has become.

But there are a few factors to contend with here.

The first is that threads of this nature (discussing the very nature and existence of ResetEra) tends to attract bad actors.

The second is that moderation of any kind in these sorts of threads (be it bans, threadbans, or even warnings) almost often results in conspiracy and what can only be described as something akin to panic. Heck, I will say personally that when a handful of us mods finally decided to break the ice and assure members that we knew about the sale and we were fine being volunteers, it wasn't without fear of what we knew would occur (and what did): pages upon pages of us being infantilized and outright attacked.

Keeping that in mind, I want you to reread the first 80 (80) pages of this thread and honestly ask yourself what would have happened if we moderated this thread in the manner required to keep the discussion on track. I know, and you do too.

Heck, by my count the number of actions taken in this thread can still be counted on one hand, and that has not stopped pages upon pages of conspiracy.

People can feel how they want about the tag fishing. I can do nothing about that but reassert that the only intent behind it was to insert some levity into a thread that was becoming quite contentious. Nothing more, nothing less.

But what can't be said in good faith, is that after 80 pages, 2 days, and 30 pages (and an additional day) since, it was the handful of pages of tagfishing that derailed this thing. It was not.

New information does have a habit of changing reasonable people's opinions, yes.

What you think the users know about ResetEra's financials and and what we actually know are not the same thing. This whole thread is full of examples of people being totally blindsided by the ownership structure, by the money being made, by a lot of things... because why and how would any of us have known any of that before now?

Take this as a lesson to just appreciate us in the future.

The only lesson here is that the relationship between the site's users and its staff is fucked, and has been for a good long time. There's no trust, no benefit of the doubt, no appreciation, no understanding. We argue that y'all deserve a slice of a $4.5 million pie and it's taken as another attack on the staff by toxic users looking for a fight.

If you wanna pin that all on one side then you do you, I'm sure claiming no fault and expecting things to get better will work out great.

I neither love, like, nor appreciate you but that's not relevant to the fact that there is a massive difference between distributing 500k of profit (generated on advertisements from mega corps) fairly among staff and begging for donations from the userbase.

Era clear was advertised as helping to keep the lights on. That's why this constant refrain of "ohhhh nooooo why didnt you guys care about us before!!!!" is bizarre. Users didn't think or know that there was 500k+ profit coming into the site yearly and I'm going to assume the mods didn't either. If they did, and still chose to beg for donations from the userbase in multiple threads, then that's pretty strange.

I have admitted staff fault for our mistakes and apologized to the community for years. Just go back through my post history. This is far more than members ever have for their own behavior.

That's another thing I hate, by the way. I can't point out member toxicity without someone making the strawman that doing so is putting all of the onus on the community for the breakdown in the relationship.

Again, this is doing nothing for morale. Like goddamn, y'all really can't admit we deserve a little more respect, can you?

But scolding those who are saying you deserve something seems odd.

Because, from our point of view, we don't view a lot of the calls for compensation as good faith advocacy for us so much as it is a way to attack Cerium (mainly because a lot of people still go on to insult us in the same breadth anyway). That doesn't mean demands for compensation aren't valid. It means there is definitely some weaponization going on, and it's happening regardless of if you- the actual you, not a general you- are doing it yourself. At a certain threshold it becomes impossible to tell individual intent when you're dealing with hundreds of people weighing in on something simultaneously. But you can tell, from personal history and the hostility towards you for daring to say "I'm okay, don't worry about me," that bad faith is evident. And that shouldn't be ignored like it has.

Again, this is why I keep joking that people want us to be paid to be called incompetent fascists, instead of realizing that we don't want to be called incompetent fascists, as if the money will make it better. Like, have you worked retail lol? You think the paycheck absolves the customer's behavior?

One flaw I see in their planning stages was that you focused so much on the possible reaction of members that you failed to actually have a response for any of the issues presented in the thread. While it's easy to just say bad faith and bad actors, and I'm sure that's played a role, none of that is at the root of the issue the community, the good and bad ones as you perceive them, are bringing up. And maybe it's because you don't have the answers, only cerium does, and once again we can go back to pointing fingers and yelling at each other when the actual trigger here: the sale of what was branded as a community site for the sole benefit of one individual and to an entity that no one is comfortable with, continues to get glossed over by moderation in favor of deflection.

You think that us asking why you guys didn't get compensated is just everyone pretending to care about you because why? That's the first step in us asking for accountability, and if that basic step was never even addressed, then how can broader questions about the effects of this move be considered. It's the powerless collaborators asking why not even the more powerful collaborators had a say or stake in this endeavor.

I had always (perhaps naively) assumed that the site was operated on a break-even basis. No one ever let the users know otherwise, and any discussion of the site's ownership was locked by Cerium, so how could we know? No reason to demand staff get paid when you are lead to believe it's basically a volunteer-driven site that doesn't make money.

Another thing to consider is that the pay issue *has* come up before... In a very specific kind of context. Typically, people will get angry at staff, and we'll ask them to dial it down. This request will usually include the phrase "we're just volunteers," because we are. Then we'll start hearing that mods should be paid... As a specific rejoinder to that. The sentiment seems to be "you should be paid so we can yell at you more." Which, if you're doing that, lemme tell you, I'd hate to be your waiter.

That's why the team generally regards the discussion of mod payment as bad faith. Even setting aside the infantilizing nature of a lot of the posts - when people say they do not want your help, the correct response is to *listen to them*, if you have any respect at all for the person you're nominally trying to help - mod pay is something that exclusively comes up to be used as a cudgel. Here it's people getting angry or scared about the sale and channeling that into some economic argument. Before, it was usually an attempt to brush aside a request for some basic human kindness. Either way, it never comes up in any other context. Nobody asks to pay the mods when we're doing a good job in public. That's why we tend not to believe people when they say they're doing it out of the goodness of your hearts.

Simple as.

We can be treated better for free. And that would be nicer than either choice in the above dilemma.

You cannot speak for the entire community though. We do our best to engage in people who are coming at us on respectful footing when we catch those posts or are pinged about them, because they deserve that in return. But just because you- Rover- are being sincere, doesn't mean we don't have a bunch of blame spaces to deal with on top of it (you were finally acknowledged lol). We are going to keep some distance at this point because trust is broken, but that doesn't mean your behavior is meaningless or unappreciated! Keep doing what you're doing, and... You know... maybe go out of your way to tell the drama mongers and trolls to shut the fuck up every now and again, or at least report them. Solidarity with one another will help a bunch too!

Why don't you engage the post and explain why people shouldn't have these concerns instead of saying that a poster knows nothing. From Cerium's op, the staff that Era does have has to talk with MOBA directly to discuss what the relationship is like going forward. That too me doesn't sound like all of this is all set up and there is nothing to talk about.

You guys changed the messaging of Era clear because it became evident that the revenue this site generates is far more than just sustaining server costs. You should forgive people from thinking that other stuff is going on and maybe that just saying postersknow nothing is not the best way to tackle this.

We even just had a mod admit to potential insider trading by knowing of things days before hand. Nothing about the messaging from staff has been clear about this sale. The public information that the brokerage firm put out and moba themselves have been more open with information than what has come from Era.

4 days is a long time to sleep and the fact that he's not made contact with either the forum or staff is concerning .

Where are you getting that he hasn't been in contact with us?

This happens? I never felt pressured to pay for anything here, I don't even know what the sub does.

I had been paying for Era clear ever since it launched, since it was pitched as something to “help keep the lights on.” I had no idea one motherfucker was pocketing a staggeringly massive salary and just fleecing shmucks like me to keep his margins up.

Literally nothing about how we handle your data has changed at all. Nothing. I'll thank you to not just make random threads when you don't actually know anything.

Imagine being the "General Manager" of a subsidiary of a publicly traded company and talking down to a user/customer like this

Literally nothing about how we handle your data has changed at all. Nothing. I'll thank you to not just make random threads when you don't actually know anything.

I don't know enough about the ins and outs of this situation to have an argument but regardless of that, taken only in the context of this post, this feels like an incredibly unprofessional way for staff to speak to its users, ESPECIALLY after a major change like this.

We're "alt-right adjacent" under the new ownership. If anything the fact that no staffer has told anyone "fuck off, you prick" is actually not in our favor.

Staff cannot remove themselves from being staff when interacting with the community, it just doesnt work. You arent part of the community in the same way, you are in a position of power over everyone else and not represent a multi million dollar corporation.

That position of power doesn't mean we are obligated to always be nice. I don't get paid enough to put up with you all like that =P. If you think we should, email our new bosses to get us to shape up.

We give out respectful responses to the people who are respectful in turn. Plenty of members have received courteous responses to the questions we can answer, and have thanked us for it.

The ones who haven't should think about why that is.

[remy]

Basically, you deserve to have cerium run with the 4.5 milly you ungrateful swine 

[benjipwns]

Has any of this shit hit the gaming media yet? Seems like a pretty big story, but fuckwits like JShiller are probably too busy on press junkets to actually do some journalism.

What fucking big story? Asshole sells his dying forum to a shell company while his mods are in denial?

Unless anyone can confirm that MOBA is truly shady or willing to sell info, I don’t think is a big story at all.

No matter what we think of it, it is the biggest internet gaming forum and $4.5 million is a lot of money. Also, the current situation is in direct contrast to the stated philosophy of the now-former owner and the mods and community at large and the general population is revolting over it. This crowd also has history of turning on the owner of a forum and jumping ship.

There is a clear story for the enthusiast press and if the new owners do turn out to be shonky as fuck then there is a clear story for the mainstream press.

I may have never worked as a journalist, but I did study journalism at University. I have 20 years experience in communications and media work and I think that qualifies me to know what constitutes a newsworthy story.

Tons of gaming sites have run a story about the acquisition. Here are three you may have heard of:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2021-10-14-gaming-forum-resetera-acquired-for-a-cool-usd4-5m
https://kotaku.com/resetera-owner-cashes-out-gaming-forum-for-4-5-million-1847862831
https://www.vg247.com/resetera-sold-4-5-million-usd-moba-network

Nobody has run a story about the ins and outs of this all that myself, Maiden Voyage and multiple others (like FeD on ResetERA.com who was one of their few users to dig into Magic Find's complicated structure) have dug up because they're games journalists. They can't read press releases accurately let alone do any kind of actual investigation. Also, I doubt any of their readers would find it very interesting. Even the vast vast majority of ResetERA.com doesn't care about it.

I don't expect Schreier to write about it because it's technically not his beat. I can't find anything from Bloomberg Gaming but then it's probably not a big enough acquisition to grab their attention, they're still a small niche within a large company rather than a dedicated outlet.

[tuna_love]

4.5 millionaires shouldn't exist!! are any of the 'staff' actually pissed off about being used for free Labor at all lol? also I thought royalan was banned for being biphobic or something.

[tuna_love]

how does moba feel about furries is the real question we need to be asking.

[Potato]

At this point, the only feasible explanation is that select mods and admins are getting some under the table crypto payments with the caveat that they have to keep the whole shitshow together until the final payment comes through.

Anything else is just too farfetched to believe, especially that these nincompoops are actually caping for an absentee owner who made $500k a year and then sold the whole shebang for $4.5m based on the investment of a few hundred dollars and slave labour.

[benjipwns]

As someone who works with non-profits and charities as a day job, the idea that a lot of people really truly thought the money Era brought in was going to charity rings incredibly hollow to me.

Really? You thought that? Based on what? I'm honestly asking.

What charities?

Where were they being advertised?

I don't think I've ever worked for a fundraiser or charitable non-profit that didn't list, explicitly and obviously, what specific charity (or class of charities) the funds raised were going to.

And whenever Era HAS partnered with a charity for a specific purpose, we've made it known.

This man literally has no self respect.

[benjipwns]

4.5 millionaires shouldn't exist!! are any of the 'staff' actually pissed off about being used for free Labor at all lol? also I thought royalan was banned for being biphobic or something.

One member of the staff (Pau) resigned rather than continue to work for free now that a larger corporation had purchased the site from a single owner.

The rest of the staff are currently vehemently angry at the users for daring to say they think Cerium should give the staff any money.

Royalan publicly stepped down from being a moderator due to NeoGAF.com posts where he had questioned the seriousness of asexuals facing bigotry. He later snuck back in quietly as a moderator.

[Boredfrom]

As someone who works with non-profits and charities as a day job, the idea that a lot of people really truly thought the money Era brought in was going to charity rings incredibly hollow to me.

Really? You thought that? Based on what? I'm honestly asking.

What charities?

Where were they being advertised?

I don't think I've ever worked for a fundraiser or charitable non-profit that didn't list, explicitly and obviously, what specific charity (or class of charities) the funds raised were going to.

And whenever Era HAS partnered with a charity for a specific purpose, we've made it known.

This man literally has no self respect.

The dude was burn at a stake by the community because KetKat and the mods did nothing but watch it happen. And he comeback as nothing happened.

[Boredfrom]

4.5 millionaires shouldn't exist!! are any of the 'staff' actually pissed off about being used for free Labor at all lol? also I thought royalan was banned for being biphobic or something.

One member of the staff (Pau) resigned rather than continue to work for free now that a larger corporation had purchased the site from a single owner.

People keep mentioning Pau but she admitted she didn’t do shit in any case. At least Slayven post shit threads.