star trek

[Himu]

I prefer Pulaski over Crusher. Crusher is fucking boring. And even though Pulaski is a take on Bones, I find her presence more interesting than Crusher's who has to protect her boring ass annoying son. Pulaski has a far more interesting storyline, particularly her relationship with Data and how it progresses. Crusher's main value is her relationship with Picard and the could be relationship shipping because that's the only interesting thing about her character. Shit character.

Still better than Troi.

[chronovore]

Troi's horrible and useless until later seasons. I enjoyed watching the stuff they set up with Will and Thomas Riker and, later, Worf. Then again, that fails the feminism test; she's only interesting because of her relationship with males. She also unfortunately is like the comic strip Cathy, in that interest is generated by her dysfunctional relationship with her mother.

Christ, the show would have been so much funnier if Luwaxana had been the ship's counsellor. You could have had whole episodes where Picard is hiding in one of the shuttles to avoid her.

[Himu]

Cathy I hate that artists way of drawing mouths omg

No. I would not watch the show is Luwaxana were counselor.

It's funny how progressive they try to portray TNG but all the female main characters - aside from Yar, who DIES, multiple TIMES - are boring and regressive.

When can I start watching DS9 on my rewatch? I want to watch in chronological order and I'm post-Borg Picard so I guess I'm in the green?

[Yeti]

I wish they had killed Troi or Crusher instead of Yar, she was the best character in the first season.

[Momo]

Crusher. Would make Wesley less of a crying momma's boy. You kill her, you improve two chars

[Great Rumbler]

Just kill Wesley instead.

[Himu]

Kill all three.

[Momo]

No, I still want Troi tits

[chronovore]

I wish they had killed Troi or Crusher instead of Yar, she was the best character in the first season.

...and Denise Crosby wanted to leave the show because she felt like all she ever said was, "Hailing frequencies open, Captain." I recall an interview where she later said she wished that she'd stayed put, that she felt she'd overreacted to her situation. I think the episodes where she was brought back though were some of the best.

[chronovore]

I am extra happy to be wrong! Glancing around, both the character and actress wikipedia articles, as well as the character's memory-alpha wiki article support your statement.

Thanks for the information!

[Himu]

When can I start watching DS9 on my rewatch? I want to watch in chronological order and I'm post-Borg Picard so I guess I'm in the green?

Someone?

[benjipwns]

It's on Amazon Prime Instant Video.

And apparently here? http://www.cbs.com/shows/star_trek_deep_space_9/

EDIT: Nevermind I guess, everything on that CBS link goes to some random Dynasty episode. 

EDIT2: Oh god, I read "when" as "where", it's after Chain of Command apparently according to Memory-Alpha.

Oh, yeah, the Cardassian stuff in that sets it up sorta.

[Joe Molotov]

Season 1 had that great episode with the nubian warlord kidnapping and marrying Yar because DEM WHITE WOMEN. Good times. I'm surprised it didn't get cancelled midseason.

[Himu]

I love the episode where they go to the sex planet and welsey refuses to get laid. He trips over some sacred construction cone and they try to execute him. That episode is rad.

[Joe Molotov]

I love the episode where they go to the sex planet and welsey refuses to get laid. He trips over some sacred construction cone and they try to execute him. That episode is rad.

Another fabulous Season 1 episode, along with the one where everyone gets space drunk and Data and Yar bone.

[Great Rumbler]

TNG was probably different enough from all the other scifi shows on TV at the time that people weren't as hard on it then as they are now.

[Stoney Mason]

TNG was probably different enough from all the other scifi shows on TV at the time that people weren't as hard on it then as they are now.

It was less that and more that it was the beloved return of the king of american sci-fi shows. People were going to be inherently nicer to it initially based partially on that goodwill. Even still back then there was a decent amount of criticism towards it initially. 

Also critical revisionism tends to be more critical by its very nature than people originally were.

[Joe Molotov]

I remember being a little kid and watching first run episodes with my dad and thinking every one was amazing. 

[Stoney Mason]

I remember my intial impressions of TNG as being mixed but more on the negative side. My context was growing up on TOS. So by comparison I found the initial season of TNG kind of boring. And I didn't like the characters so much. Even Picard who struck me as a boring old man in comparison to the swashbuckling Kirk.

Of course the show improved leaps and bounds as it went on. But initial impressions are often meaningless. The first season of Babylon 5 is complete horseshit outside of the context of the setup. And I distinctly remember watching the first episode of Voyager and thinking it was pretty darn good with a really interesting premise. So... yeah. First impressions don't really matter a lot of the times.

[a slime appears]

I remember being a little kid and watching first run episodes with my dad and thinking every one was amazing. 

Yeah me too. The show reminds me a lot of growing up and being with my dad because of that.

I also liked watching Gargoyles because everyone on that show was from TNG.

[benjipwns]

I love the episode where they go to the sex planet and welsey refuses to get laid. He trips over some sacred construction cone and they try to execute him. That episode is rad.

IIRC, the main writing staff fucked up so many scripts they got in the first two seasons, for example that episode started like this:

Writer John D.F. Black used his pseudonym "Ralph Willis" in the credits, because the televised episode bears little resemblance to his original first draft script. In Black's treatment, the colony of Llarof installed "punishment zones" to fight anarchy, however the zones are now enforced to abide the law, but for only those who are deemed not immune to them. An Enterprise-D security guard, Officer Tenson, protecting two children while on shore leave, happens upon a crime scene, and is shot dead by the policeman Siwel, who is also killed by his partner Oitap on the spot, for misinterpreting his duty. In his first draft, Picard decides not to help the rebels led by Reneg who fight against this system of council member Trebor. Finally, it turns out the rebels install a similarly totalitarian regime when they gain power. In the second draft, the rebel leader, called Reneg is put on trial and executed for treason. Picard muses on the topic of people having their right to decide their own justice without interference.

[Stoney Mason]

I love the episode where they go to the sex planet and welsey refuses to get laid. He trips over some sacred construction cone and they try to execute him. That episode is rad.

IIRC, the main writing staff fucked up so many scripts they got in the first two seasons, for example that episode started like this:

Writer John D.F. Black used his pseudonym "Ralph Willis" in the credits, because the televised episode bears little resemblance to his original first draft script. In Black's treatment, the colony of Llarof installed "punishment zones" to fight anarchy, however the zones are now enforced to abide the law, but for only those who are deemed not immune to them. An Enterprise-D security guard, Officer Tenson, protecting two children while on shore leave, happens upon a crime scene, and is shot dead by the policeman Siwel, who is also killed by his partner Oitap on the spot, for misinterpreting his duty. In his first draft, Picard decides not to help the rebels led by Reneg who fight against this system of council member Trebor. Finally, it turns out the rebels install a similarly totalitarian regime when they gain power. In the second draft, the rebel leader, called Reneg is put on trial and executed for treason. Picard muses on the topic of people having their right to decide their own justice without interference.

To be fair I actually understand this one from a ratings perspective. I had to read through that a few times to actually understand what the topic was at hand. Where as the TNG version is basically sexy people in skimpy outfits and DON'T STEP ON THE GRASS OR YOU DIE!

[Himu]

AHAHAHAHA Wesley running into that shit was more hilarious watching than it was in my head. For some reason I thought he ran into some weird foreign thing, when it was really just a small ass greenhouse with his blind ass. Fucking LOL.

"NO WES!"

Ahahahaha Kicking and goddamn screaming in laughter.

[Great Rumbler]

Probably the only episode that's worse is the one where Dr. Crusher has sex with a ghost:

[benjipwns]

René Echevarria recalled, "I can still reduce Brannon to shudders when I go into his office and say, 'I can travel on the power transfer beam'. But the cast loved it. Every woman on the lot who read it was coming up to Brannon and patting him. Ultimately I think it was worth doing because it was campy fun and the production values were wonderful. The sets look great and everybody threw themselves into it. Gates did a wonderful job. It just got bigger and broader and to the point of grandmother leaping out of the grave. Just having Beverly basically writhing around having an orgasm at 6 o'clock on family TV was great. For that alone it was worth doing. We got away with murder."

[Himu]

dr crusher episodes are the worst

at least troi episodes usually involve her crazy voodoo psycho powers

[Momo]

all the crushers suck

[Stoney Mason]

I was someone who generally liked a lot of the more campier episodes in Trek History. Not necessarily stupid ones but ones where you could tell the cast was having fun with it. I think the tone of Trek is such that it can often get away with it versus say Galactica which always has to maintain a certain tone or the whole thing kind of falls apart.

[benjipwns]

Was watching like one TNG episode a week for a bit then took off some time and when I came back to it for whatever reason added TOS and Enterprise to the list since they're all free on Prime. So how about some random thoughts?

-TNG Remasters look the best by far, even better than Enterprise (which seems like it's not really HD but upscaled), it's kinda crazy how good some of it looks despite budget and everything.
-TNG is also the worst by far early on, the characters suck, the pacing sucks, the plots suck
-ENT by comparison at least has a couple things going for it early on, the ship and crew is inexperienced and unready and overmatched, and the Vulcans are total dicks about this. Some of the little touches on far away from home ship life are far better done than on VOY's similar premise. It's unfortunate the show loses a lot of this as it gets eager about introducing familiar races for ratings purposes.
-TOS instantly has most of the characters there from Where No Man...the plots just range wildly from hokey to suspenseful to plodding, the pacing in particular is all over the place. Within episodes even.
-Weird thing I never noticed before about first season TOS or at least these first ten episodes or so, there are people in the corridors doing shit other than just walking around aimlessly. There's guys fixing panels, or stringing wires, or carrying random equipment around, and people standing around having conversations, or little things like Uhura telling a guy to fix her door, or random bridge members. The budget obviously really did a number on this in later seasons when it seems like the ship has maybe 25 people on it total. But the later shows never picked this thread back up to a level I thought worked aside from DS9. ENT actually does okay since it's supposed to be a small crew. Though all the shows suffer from the whole Senior Staff Does Everything.
-TOS has some weird as fuck scenes. And way more short segments of people just screaming or staring with dramatic music behind them than I remembered.
-Jolene Blalock in "Broken Bow" justifies everything about the unnecessary decon room and process.
-Best recurring "character feature" of TNG: Tasha talking about rape gangs and awkwardly forcing it into every conversation. And some kind of convoluted logic about how kidnapping on Generic African Planet isn't a big deal because rape gangs?
-Great terrible Naked Now dialogue:

"Are you saying that's why I feel so hot...so strange?"
"That's... that's a bit of adult reasoning, Wesley."
"So you mean I'm drunk! I feel strange, but also good."

-Great awesome Naked Now dialogue:

Capt. Picard: [entering Crusher's office with a little skip] Beverly.
Doctor Beverly Crusher: Yes, Jean-Luc?
Capt. Picard: *You* will address me as *Captain.*
Doctor Beverly Crusher: Captain? Well then, my dear Captain, *you* will address *me* as *Chief Medical Officer* or *Doctor.*
Capt. Picard: I will? That's true. I started off calling you Beverly, and of course, naturally, you. I'm still not thinking straight.
Doctor Beverly Crusher: Likewise. Where the hell was I headed?
Capt. Picard: If that's something you were going to test...
Doctor Beverly Crusher: [brightening] Yes, on *Geordi!* Come here.

-Horrific fan fiction found trying to search for that last quote: http://www.trekiverse.org/archive/2000/adult/tng/Scent_A

[Squiddy]

Crushed is the worst character after betazoidan whose name I can't even remember.

[Joe Molotov]

The episode were Yar gets kidnapped by Zulu warriors was

[Eli Gulgin]

The episode were Yar gets kidnapped by Zulu warriors was

I'm currently rewatching Stargate SG-1 and facepalmed so hard at a similar episode to the Zulu mess in TNG, but then it all made sense (and raised some questions) when I read some trivia about it:

This is generally considered by critics as one of the worst episodes of the series. The Sci-Fi Channel (and possibly the production team) seems to hold it in similar disdain, because it is rarely if ever re-run in syndication.

This is the first of eleven episodes of Stargate SG-1 written by Katharyn Powers. She is also responsible for the very similar (both in story and reception) Star Trek: The Next Generation Season One episode "Code of Honor". Both episode feature a female officer being abducted and later participating in a fight to the death. Given the extremely negative fan and critical reception to that episode, it seems surprising that this one was made.

The trivia for the TNG Zulu fuckery is pretty funny too:

Jonathan Frakes referred to the episode as a "racist piece of shit". At a 2007 science fiction convention in Toronto, Canada, he told the audience, "The worst and most embarrassing and one that even Gene would have been embarrassed by was that horrible racist episode from the first season... Code of Honor, oh my God in heaven!"

At the 2013 Toronto Comic Con's "An Evening With the Cast of Star Trek: The Next Generation", Michael Dorn referred to this episode as "the worst episode of Star Trek ever filmed" to agreement from the rest of the cast and the crowd.

Let a sloot who turned her own xenophobic feminazi fantasies into the worst episode of a tv series do it twice brehs

[Madrun Badrun]

I don't even remember that SG1 ep.

[Joe Molotov]

She was probably secretly thirsty for the BBC.

[chronovore]

She was probably secretly thirsty for the BBC.

Sure. Absolutely; it's a similar line towed by the republican senators who rail against homosexuality the hardest, and are then found sucking off some dude in a truckstop bathroom.

[Great Rumbler]

Season 1 of TNG is pretty awful, season 2 is a little better but not great. Season 3 and on is pretty amazing, though.

[benjipwns]

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/database/kirks_shirt.htm

 

[chronovore]

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/database/kirks_shirt.htm

 

Turnabout Intruder Janice Lester is in Kirk's body when McCoy orders him to report for a medical exam because of his (actually her) "emotional instability and erratic mental attitudes". In a way, this is the only topless woman we ever see on Star Trek.

 

[Stoney Mason]

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/69037

I love Shatner as much as you can love an actor you've never ever met, but this seems like an awful idea.

[Himu]

Please revive Trek. We got new Twin Peaks. I want to watch a new Trek with my dad one more time before he leaves this Earth.

[benjipwns]

You guys are being too negative.

What if we're taking a detour through the Shatnerverse to get back to the Prime Trek Universe?!?

[Stoney Mason]

If they bring back Shatner they need to work this into the script.

[D3RANG3D]

I am watching tng right now the episode where that scientist wants to take data apart to study him, at the part where he walks in and eye humps the shit outta data and data looks violated, and Riker is like what the fuck is going on.

 

[Great Rumbler]

[chronovore]

I am watching tng right now the episode where that scientist wants to take data apart to study him, at the part where he walks in and eye humps the shit outta data and data looks violated, and Riker is like what the fuck is going on.

 

I don't remember the leg humping, but every time I see that episode, I wonder what the hell is going on. Data is a member of Starfleet. His status as an independent being should be inviolate simply based on that. They don't make computers members of Starfleet.

[Stoney Mason]

Scotty actor Simon Pegg will be givin' her all she's got, cap'n, behind the camera as well as in front of it on Star Trek 3.

Deadline reports that Pegg, who plays the USS Enterprise's chief engineer Montgomery Scott in the rebooted film series, will co-write the script with Doug Jung, the creator of the TNT series Dark Blue. The original Trek 3 script had been worked on by Roberto Orci, who dropped out of both directing and writing the film. (Patrick McKay and John D. Payne were also writers on Trek 3.)

Pegg's no stranger to screenwriting having co-written the "Cornetto Trilogy" with director-pal Edgar Wright and the sci-fi comedy Paul with Nick Frost.

Man this movie just seems to be cursed. I like Pegg. And I like Lin. I'm just not sure this movie will be anything like what I remotely want a trek movie to be.  (Not that I thought the first two were. So maybe any change is good.)

[TakingBackSunday]

Pegg is such a huge Star Trek fan.  I have to imagine thats a good sign.

[chronovore]

Scotty actor Simon Pegg will be givin' her all she's got, cap'n, behind the camera as well as in front of it on Star Trek 3.

Deadline reports that Pegg, who plays the USS Enterprise's chief engineer Montgomery Scott in the rebooted film series, will co-write the script with Doug Jung, the creator of the TNT series Dark Blue. The original Trek 3 script had been worked on by Roberto Orci, who dropped out of both directing and writing the film. (Patrick McKay and John D. Payne were also writers on Trek 3.)

Pegg's no stranger to screenwriting having co-written the "Cornetto Trilogy" with director-pal Edgar Wright and the sci-fi comedy Paul with Nick Frost.

Man this movie just seems to be cursed. I like Pegg. And I like Lin. I'm just not sure this movie will be anything like what I remotely want a trek movie to be.  (Not that I thought the first two were. So maybe any change is good.)

Stoney, this is GREAT NEWS. Pegg knows his Trek, and will likely bring it more in line with what original trek fans enjoy about the series. I’m stoked!

[toku]

Definitely feels a bit cursed but faith restored a bit having Lin behind lens and Pegg writing

[Great Rumbler]

Orci getting dropped is probably the best thing that could happen to the Star Trek reboot series.

[benjipwns]

Watch them go out with a good film full of Trekkiness right as the reboot franchise is collapsing in on itself.

[chronovore]

Watch them go out with a good film full of Trekkiness right as the reboot franchise is collapsing in on itself.

I’d be OK with that if the film’s success is enough to spur a new TV series, with Pegg as a consultant or Exec. Prod.

[Himu]

I think this is a good thing. It's a test for new audiences and if it sales as many tickets as the last Star Trek's we may have our new Trek show.

[benjipwns]

Came to this via the King Abdullah clip, but they're actually pretty funny, especially Kate Mulgrew*:



*Which shouldn't be a surprise considering her award-winning work on NTSF:SD:SUV:: I suppose.

[Stoney Mason]

Decent read if you are a tos nerd like me.

http://io9.com/the-truth-about-what-went-wrong-with-the-third-season-o-1684057419

[Great Rumbler]

Decent read if you are a tos nerd like me.

http://io9.com/the-truth-about-what-went-wrong-with-the-third-season-o-1684057419

"I called him, told him I wanted to come speak with him, and then I went to his office to chew his ass out and to tell him that I thought he was letting everybody down... I went in there and I said, 'Gene, we've got tremendous script problems, and I really think Fred Freiberger could use your help.' Now, as I continue talking, out of the back of Gene's office comes Nichelle Nichols, who's wearing one of Gene's long cardigan sweaters, and NOTHING ELSE! No shirt, no pants, nothing... So now Nichelle says something like, 'Oh, I'm sorry, Eddie, I didn't know you were there.' I'm immediately going red and I'm completely flustered until I notice that Gene's just kind of sitting at his desk, smiling and enjoying the embarrassed look on my face."

 

[benjipwns]

Haven't read the piece yet but one funny thing I read about the third season is they kept cutting the budget but the set/prop guys kept coming up with cost saving measures (like they had originally with the transporter, etc.) and NBC came down and was like WE TOLD YOU TO CUT THE BUDGET when they had basically paired the shooting budget down to as low as they could.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

So they cut costs by getting rid of all the good writers.

[close]

[Stoney Mason]

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/simon-pegg-star-trek-3-784685

[benjipwns]

Rumor is this title got registered with the MPAA:


Also, GOG added some old Trek games: http://www.gog.com/

[chronovore]

I’ve been watching at least an ep a day of TNG while staying at my mom’s I’d forgotten how much I love this show.

I’m even enjoying the Dr. Pulaski episodes. There’s a whole run of season 3 stuff backlogged. Man, s3 is when it really found its footing.