International Politics Thread - Disease and Disaster

[Broseidon]

Uzhhorod today




Lviv today and last night

[Broseidon]

Another BTR (accompanied by a truck this time) gets more than it bargained for

From  a different perspective

[Broseidon]

Volyn

[Brehvolution]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-02-20/ukraine-situation-explained-one-map

    BOTH the USA and EU will now fund the rebels as Russia will fund Yanukovych. At the political level, Ukraine is the pawn on the chessboard. The propaganda war is East v West. However, those power plays are masking the core issue that began with the Orange Revolution – corruption. Yanukovych is a dictator who will NEVER leave office. It is simple as that. There will be no REAL elections again in Ukraine. This is starting to spiral down into a confrontation that the entire world cannot ignore.

[Diunx]

http://www.euronews.com/2014/02/19/venezuelan-protester-dies-from-bullet-wound-5th-fatality-of-unrest/

A 22-year-old student from the central city of Valencia in Venezuela died on Wednesday after being shot in the head during an anti-government demonstration, her family said.

Genesis Carmona, who was studying tourism and was also a local beauty queen, was shot during a demonstration on Tuesday.

“How long are we going to live like this? How long do we have to tolerate this pressure, with them killing us?” a relative who asked not to be named told Reuters. “She only needed one more semester to graduate,” he added.

She is one of six victims of the political unrest that has gripped the South American country since imprisoned protest leader Leopoldo Lopez urged supporters to keep fighting for the departure of the socialist government.

She was a cutie

[Diunx]

Shut your racist CAC ass borys no one cares about a bunch of dead commies.

[Great Rumbler]

Bad business going down in Venezuela:

[Great Rumbler]

Reading the comments sections for any of the news articles on either country, regardless of the website hosting it, is an absolute nightmare. I'd suggest avoidance as a universal policy.

[Rufus]

Absolutely. Misanthropy alert.

Go look at pictures of kittens or something.

[Great Rumbler]

Absolutely. Misanthropy alert.

Go look at pictures of kittens or something.

I like reading them for the political spectrum tardery. Look at all the libertarian cornballs gloating over Venezuela turning into shit.

(Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)(Image removed from quote.)

Also, basically every protest is being secretly funded by America, because we hate benevolent democratically-elected governments and want to take them down by supporting money-grubbing thugs.

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Which...well...we have done before on occasion, admittedly.

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[Great Rumbler]

Every dictator is really a hero of the people and just wants to do what's right, protesters are traitorous thugs and just want to hand their country over to capitalist bankers who will gut the country's resources for their own profits.

[Phoenix Dark]

I'm sorry, but Kim Qong Ill

[Human Snorenado]

Our long global nightmare is over, brehs

[Steve Contra]

The DEA finally captured am nintenho

(Image removed from quote.)


http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/23/world/americas/joaquin-guzman-loera-sinaloa-drug-cartel-leader-is-captured-in-mexico.html?_r=0

They're going to waterboard him until he explains what the hell his posts mean.  It might take a while.

[Boogie]

Bu-bu-but what about that article Eric P posted a month ago stating that Guzman coordinates his activities with American authorities in return for them not going after him?   

[Diunx]

He is of no more use to them, shit happened with our last dictator too

[Sman]

The Venezuelan opposition is a joke. An eccletic collection of mostly well off people and big interests in this deeply divided country. They have little to offer the majority of the poor who have been the Chavez power base. They keep losing, they keep complaining and fail to present themselves as a credible alternative for the majority to vote for. That's why even gaffe-prone Maduro is in power instead of them.

[Boogie]

He is of no more use to them, shit happened with our last dictator too

Like I said:

[Madrun Badrun]

Bu-bu-but what about that article Eric P posted a month ago stating that Guzman coordinates his activities with American authorities in return for them not going after him?   

They had to capture him once the news was out.  Obviously. 

[Great Rumbler]

Ukraine's acting government issued an arrest warrant Monday for President Viktor Yanukovych, accusing him of mass crimes against the protesters who stood up for months against his rule. Russia sharply questioned its authority, calling it an "armed mutiny."

Yanukovych himself has reportedly fled to the Black Sea peninsula of Crimea, a pro-Russian area in Ukraine.

[benjipwns]

Look, and this applies in general not just in Ukraine and Venezuela, just hold elections again, let the opposition see how much of an increasing minority they really are and proclaim the great victory of the ruling party in the fair and free elections. Then everyone accepts it and peace happens and the revolution continues its triumph over the shadowy outside forces trying to undermine it.

Repeat until the protests stop or the U.S. imports democracy.

[Great Rumbler]

Ukraine's Parliament agreed to hold elections in May during the same vote to boot out Yanukovych.

[benjipwns]

Hopefully he wins a commanding mandate in the first round that properly expresses the trust that the people have in him and his actions to stamp out these troublemakers.

[Rufus]

Egypt's military leaders unveil devices they claim can detect and cure Aids

Oh boy...

[Broseidon]

Some weird post-modern occupation shit going on.

[Rufus]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/28/technology/british-spies-said-to-have-intercepted-yahoo-webcam-images.html?hpw&rref=technology&_r=0




and once again thank you Edward Snowden (pbuh)

I love the fact that they caught so many nudes they don't really know what to do with them.

Couple decades ago the Stasi was the worst thing ever, now look at this shit. Sigh.

[benjipwns]

The world will look up and shout "Save us, Sarah!" and she'll look down and whisper "no":
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2014/02/28/Flashback-Palin-Mocked-in-2008-for-Warning-Putin-May-Invade-Ukraine-if-Obama-Elected-President

[Mandark]

I remember one of the earliest warning signs with Palin was the interview where she said she favored NATO membership for Georgia and the Ukraine, when I think the McCain campaign itself didn't go that far, and when the implication was committing the US to possible military action against Russia down the line.  It was also the first time we went through her fans defending her against an elitist, "gotcha" news media.

Wonder how an actual McCain administration would have responded to the shit in Georgia, Libya, Syria, Egypt, the Ukraine, Iran.  Pretty sure I'm glad it's a hypothetical.

[Great Rumbler]

Wonder how an actual McCain administration would have responded to the shit in Georgia, Libya, Syria, Egypt, the Ukraine, Iran.  Pretty sure I'm glad it's a hypothetical.

If McCain's rhetoric is anything to go by, we'd already have troops deployed in all six of those countries by now.

[Phoenix Dark]

Thank god for Obama. I prefer a president who handles global matters like he's playing a western RPG, constantly pausing, sometimes doing nothing. Much better than a McCain administration, which would look like a modern C&C match: ugly and ineffective.

[Great Rumbler]

Videogame representation of the McCain administration on foreign policy:

[Phoenix Dark]

Well if you want to make mmo references during a gaming discussion that's ok, no one is judging.

[Great Rumbler]

Well if you want to make mmo references during a gaming discussion that's ok, no one is judging.

Exactly.

[Madrun Badrun]

I don't get the importance of the Crimean; it's not like Russia would loss Black sea access without it and they have to have a different port for their Navy.  Being a punitive action seems a little silly as it risks pushing the Ukraine even closer to the west.

[benjipwns]

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/03/8-things-obama-must-do-about-ukraine-104128.html

Second, President Obama should dispatch Secretary of State John Kerry and Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel to Kiev

Jeez, kick a country while they're down.

[Mandark]

Well, that incident is going to be brought up FOREVER by people who could otherwise give a shit about who lives or dies halfway across the planet.  Wheeeeeeeeeee(gur).

Whatever happened to the Uygur separatists at Guantanamo, where they weren't connected to terrorism but nobody wanted to take them (except maybe China, to immediately arrest)?

[Mandark]

Mando: http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2013/12/31/last-uyghur-captives-leave-guantanamo-bay/

Thanks.  Slovakia, eh?  Assume they were getting brownie points for taking them off our hands.

Also, didn't the Norway shooter at the kids camp a few years back have some absolutely hideous death toll?  I don't feel like looking it up cause I'll just get depressed.

[StealthFan]

Only mass shooter to get a 30+ k/d ratio was the VT shooter

Breivik?

EDIT: Already covered. Man fuck that taco. Complaining about his PS2. Dude should be in a hole for the rest of his life.

[Human Snorenado]

So, what you're telling me is that if a sovereign state the US had a major base in went all revolution style, with a population that was 25% American in a region that was over 50% American, we wouldn't be sending troops in? To say nothing of the natural gas pipelines...

How quickly we forget the coalition of the willing, brehs.

[Fifstar]

I am really amazed that four guys could kill 33 and injure over 100 with knives, though.

Most recent news say that up to ten were involved, only 5 were killed/captured. Still crazy though.

[Himu]

We're comparing knives to guns now?

[milchs evil twin]

I kinda don't feel like getting bombed by Vladimir.

I think he only does this cause I drank this beer yesterday

(Image removed from quote.)

I think it hurt his feelings

[Madrun Badrun]

http://www.dancarlin.com//disp.php/csarchive/Show-270---Poking-the-Bear/Ukraine-Russia-Putin

[Joe Molotov]

Poking bears is not allowed in Russia, Comrade.

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But on The Bore it is. 

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[chronovore]

I think he invaded because I laughed at his picture in this article:

http://dangerousminds.net/comments/controversial_male_political_figures_reimagined_as_fabulous_drag_queens

[Phoenix Dark]

gotta love the war monger criticism and hand wringing over Obama "not acting." What exactly do these people want. Well, I take that back - Charles Krauthammer wants Obama to send a naval fleet...to the Black Sea, you know, where Russia's fleet is. I can at least respect him for showing his hand - he wants war, period.

Everyone else needs to stop the hand wringing and say exactly what they want to see happen.

[benjipwns]

You have to stand up to bullies. You hit them hard when they aren't expecting it and they'll back down. You have to get in their face. You can't let your fear allow them to run the schoolyard. This is a red line we cannot allow tyrants to cross. If they bring a knife, we bring a gun.

We're the United States of America. We don't do pinpricks.

[Great Rumbler]

We should probably nuke Moscow, that would show Putin that we're serious.

[benjipwns]

Now, I'm not saying that we should launch a massive invasion of Russia from Poland before the spring. I'm just saying that:

1. We should keep all our options on the table.
b. They wouldn't expect it.

[Phoenix Dark]

I will say that Obama probably needs to stop promising consequences/red lines/etc if he's not going to do anything. Outside of that I'm fine with how this has been handled.

BTW I love how Lindsey Graham made such a big deal about kicking Russia out the G8, which technically isn't even possible. Now the G7 has been formed...the G8 still exists, it just won't be having any meetings anytime soon. As if Putin cares.

[Joe Molotov]

"You just don't in the 21st century behave in 19th century fashion by invading another country on completely trumped up pre-text," Kerry told the CBS program "Face the Nation."

[benjipwns]

The only reason Russia was/is included in any of those G# groups in the first place was because they whined about it and the lingering Cold War habits of including them in everything. (And nukes.) I don't even think they meet the criteria* for the G20, let alone the G7.

*EDIT: Should note that I'm referring to a few studies that have tried to create some kind of objective criteria, the groups themselves have no formal criteria which is one complaint they often face. Despite its size Russia usually drops down to like 40th in most of these, Indonesia is another country that drops a ton IIRC. (This could have changed more in recent years, Russia back in the early days wasn't even close to the G7 in plain ol GDP like it is now so I would imagine it would also do better in these constructed metrics.)

tldr: shut up dummy be more exacting instead of glib

[a slime appears]

Former ambassador jack matlock breaks Ukraine down:

http://jackmatlock.com/2014/03/ukraine-the-price-of-internal-division/

Good piece.

That was really good, thank you.

[Brehvolution]

It's easy to call for war when you won't have to fight in it. Get Krauthammer, Graham, and all those fuck on the front line and see if their opinion changes.

[Broseidon]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Dugin

[Steve Contra]

Watching the reaction from the right is depressing.  They want America to look strong, but Obama to come out of this with egg on his face

[Phoenix Dark]

Usually Obama's comments on foreign affairs are calculated and vetted, which makes it even more baffling that he has made the same mistake of threatening another leader of state without actual plans of doing anything. Why threaten Putin if all you're going to do is institute sanctions and form the G7, ie shit he clearly doesn't care about?

Even McCain doesn't think we should consider military options right now; however if Obama said that yesterday, you can bet your ass McCain would be calling it cowardly.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/mccain-no-military-action-ukraine

[Mandark]

Eh, what's the alternative?  Openly saying that Russia has a free hand in Eastern Europe and nobody's going to do shit?

Even if the US has very little actual leverage, there are domestic and political reasons for Obama to make a bit of a rhetorical show, and to join in any small or symbolic gestures made by the EU.  From the western perspective, respecting sovereign borders* is a pretty important norm and it's worth doing something to reinforce that idea.  There's really very little downside to what the administration's done so far.

spoiler (click to show/hide)

*in Europe

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[Great Rumbler]

Even McCain doesn't think we should consider military options right now; however if Obama said that yesterday, you can bet your ass McCain would be calling it cowardly.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/mccain-no-military-action-ukraine

McCain's smart enough to know that putting American troops on the ground within shooting distance of Russian soldiers is an exceedingly bad idea, but he'll still find away to twist it around to where Obama is being weak an ineffectual by not doing something or other.

[Cerveza mas fina]

Yeah it sucks what russia is doing, but the usa throwing a hissy fit over this after iraq and afghanistan is sad.

That said I hope someone sets the ruskies straigth.

Get it?