Soulsborne games thread - Demon's Souls PS5

[Don Rumata]

No offense but that doesn't sound fun.

Also a brand new save file > new game +

We all have preferences though so I won't belabor it.

Same, i find ng+ boring, better try out fresh new builds.
Exception being DS2 ofc. with its approach to ng+ being a tad different.

[Himu]

I'm at a point where I consider these jrpgs. I see them as no different from and am playing it like an SMT game. The only difference is that it's an action rpg to me and not turn based.

[Himu]

Holy fuck.

[Himu]

Wish more went glitchless, though.

[Himu]

DS1 > BB

[Bebpo]

Boss fights in BB are better
Combat is tighter in BB but more options in DS1
Map is better in DS1
Story is great in both

 

[Himu]

I think the combat is on par with each other. Boss fights I'll give you with BB but BB has less says to approach the fights themselves. DS1's area design, decision making, options. I also don't understand he w BB's story is on par. I had to look up YouTube videos to understand BB whereas youtube videos just reinforced my already held views of DS1's story. I feel DS1 communicates itself better as a story but that was probably the point - making BB confusing, I mean.

That said they're both great games but DS1 is very For me it's like choosing Pinot noir and Merlot.

I have no complaint about either. Basically From might be the best developer out there now. They make games that are decidedly for my tastes and unlike other Japanese developers (atlus, SE) they haven't sacrificed what made them good to begin with once they became popular.

[Don Rumata]

Boss fights in BB are better
Combat is tighter in BB but more options in DS1
Map is better in DS1
Story is great in both

 

Debatable.
They're great but get somewhat samey.
DS1 is very unpolished on that front tho.

DS3 is the best at bossfights, imo.

[Himu]

This second run is more about beating DS1 as fast as possible.

Third run will be a lore run.

Drake sword is by far my favorite weapon.

[Himu]

When you beat Sen's in one sitting after multiple attempts the first run. Only died once. 

[Himu]

Whoever said S&O are easy on replays is a dirty liar. 

[Himu]

I shot Gwynevere in the titty with an arrow, she "died", and now Anor Londo is in perpetual night.



It was all an image. Bah gawd. Killed all her guards too, including the fire keeper.

[Bebpo]

I shot Gwynevere in the titty with an arrow, she "died", and now Anor Londo is in perpetual night.



It was all an image. Bah gawd. Killed all her guards too, including the fire keeper.

 

[Himu]

Gwndolin at night is TERRIBLE GAME DESIGN

[Himu]

FUCK YOU BEBPO AND FROM SOFT

THIS IS BULLSHIT

[bluemax]

Gwndolin at night is TERRIBLE GAME DESIGN

FROM Soft with terrible Game Design? I am Jack's lack of surprise.

[Himu]

Gwndolin at night is TERRIBLE GAME DESIGN

FROM Soft with terrible Game Design? I am Jack's lack of surprise.

This is the only moment in any From title I can legitimately say is bad.

[Bebpo]

What's bad about it? I don't remember the fight other than it being a cool looking boss & lore.

[Himu]

What's bad about it? I don't remember the fight other than it being a cool looking boss & lore.

When you kill Gwenevere it turns into night and you aggro the fire keeper.

The fire keeper is on the way to the stairs. I killed them.

Now when I fight Gwndolin and lose, even if I use the bonfire before the fog wall, I'm sent to the first bonfire of Anor Londo since the Firekeeper is dead. You cannot use this bonfire however so you cannot warp or anything.

So I travel, but in order to get to Gwyndolin, you have to turn the stair case, which is in a different position than coming from the first bonfire. So you have to travel from the first bonfire to the rafters, then turn the stairs, and then fight Gwndolin.

Fuck you Bebpo.

[Thirty-Ought-Six]

It would probably be faster to run to a different bonfire (either Duke’s Archives or Sen’s Fortress, not sure which is closer) and warp from there.

[Himu]

I'll have to buy black firebombs to take the stupid tusks out

[Himu]

Beat Gwybdolin, finishing off this run of DS1.

Started DS2

[Himu]

Impressions of DS2 so far:

This sucks.

Control changes for absolutely no reason. Jump run is L3? What the fuck. Confusing bad interface. Some thing with a torch with just has you go around a place you've already been to light torches. Very bloated. Weird/broken messaging/bloodstain system. I'll see a room full of messages and blood stains with zero enemies there and none of the messages make any sense. The layout of the place sucks balls so far. The controls are more weighted and just don't feel as good as DS1, BB, or Sekiro. Lifegems are INFERIOR to Estus. "Hey give me the slippery rock!" No one is there. The ability to fast travel out the gate after DS1 is a massive turn off. I can't level up at bonfires? What in the fuck.

So far? I don't like it. But I'll keep going.



I love the dark ass intro and all, but this is not making a good first impression at all.

At least it looks nice.

[El Babua]

At least get to the DLC 

[Svejk]

And DSII(SOTFS) was my gateway Souls game.    Never finished it though and don't really plan on it.   I would suggest skipping and going to DS3... but that's just me.  Time's too short and valuable.

Here's a small snippet of my time with it..



I died 2 consecutive bowlshit deaths because of platforming... or lack thereof.

[Don Rumata]

Jump run is L3? What the fuck.

This is actually a good and needed change, and it became standard in subsequent games (although they let you choose i think).
Rolls and parries in DS2 are dog shit though.

Other elements like life gems or not leveling at bonfires are also somewhat standards in other games.
Demon's Souls had grass to cure yourself, and DS3 also uses the hub + maiden formula (from Demon's, BB etc) to level up.

[Himu]

You find a way to level up asap in BB because bonfires transfer you to the dream. So that's an awful comparison. I have not found anywhere I can level up in DS2 yet. Demons or BB don't have estus but it's not bad like lifegems.

How is L3 to jump good? I use circle to jump in BB too. It's natural and simple.

[HardcoreRetro]

You are probably still in the tutorial area.

[Himu]

No, I found the emerald herald.

Took multiple talks but finally can level up.

Everyone ...in...this....game ..talks....so.....slooooowww.

[Himu]

Why do NPCs not stick out in this game? Why do they blend into the environment? What is wrong with the developers of this game?

[Himu]

Thank God you can change jump controls.

Also apparently you have to drop the the stone for the birds. Point me to a time when you ever have to drop anything for an NPC in DS1. DS2 is stupid because it breaks rules established in the previous game. Like how torches are handled.

I accidentally used up my first torch. Now not all the torches are lit and I have no other torch. I've looked all over the "town" for someone to sell a torch to no avail. The firekeepers also don't have torches. So now I can't best the tutorial area because I have no torches.

Game is stupid and so far, booty cheeks. Dark Souls 1 is a master class game of teaching by environment and context clues. DS2 is random shit with zero natural progression.

[Don Rumata]

You find a way to level up asap in BB because bonfires transfer you to the dream. So that's an awful comparison. I have not found anywhere I can level up in DS2 yet. Demons or BB don't have estus but it's not bad like lifegems.

How is L3 to jump good? I use circle to jump in BB too. It's natural and simple.

DkS2 also has Estus, life gems are a bonus, even if they make the healing sort of trivial (exactly like in Demon's).
Also Emerald is exactly the same as the Doll in BB, the maiden in Demon and DkS3, i'm not sure why it's an awful comparison.

I'm not even defending the game, it's the roughest of the bunch and has clear problems that have been talked to death, i'm just saying many of those things have either become standard, or carried over from other games.

Also jump with L3 is the way to go, release and press again with O is such a stupidly convoluted way to do it.

[Himu]

It's a bad comparison because in BB you go to the dream and instantly see a doll. It's hard to miss. Same as the maiden in Demons.

In DS2 you go to the second bonfire and have to wander all over the damn place and talk to some npc. She doesn't reveal you can level up with her until you talk to her an upward of THREE TIMES. Once again showing DS2's bafflingly stupid game design.

[Himu]

I'm constantly having to Google what to do in this and this is the beginning and I have three soulsborne games under my belt.

Like "where do I get more torches dark souls 2"

"Smooth and silky stone dark souls 2"

"Where do I level up dark souls 2"

Game is ass

[Don Rumata]

It's a bad comparison because in BB you go to the dream and instantly see a doll. It's hard to miss. Same as the maiden in Demons.

In DS2 you go to the second bonfire and have to wander all over the damn place and talk to some npc. She doesn't reveal you can level up with her until you talk to her an upward of THREE TIMES. Once again showing DS2's bafflingly stupid game design.

Oh, i thought you meant the system in itself (having to talk to an NPC to lvl up).
Yeah that type of shit plagues this game, buckle up.

Also, remember to bring your Agility to >90 if you want to use rolls at all, because they geniously tied iframes to it.
I kept it between 100 and 110, IIRC, having a roll based character.

[Himu]

Installed Dark Souls III and made it to firelink in a short run.

That's the stuff. Feels so much better than DS2 already and doesn't appear to be designed by morons. It runs at 30 fps but combat feels so good. Control feel good again. Parry isn't worthless. There's no convoluted dog shit. Oh look, someone who levels you up and they're IN THE CENTER OF THE SCREEN AND NOT OFF ON SOME SIDE PATH.

It was just a taste and it'll be hard going back to the drek that is Dark Souls 2.

Oh well.

[Don Rumata]

Needs to be said that DkS2 has a lot of good stuff, among all the shit.
It's still a good game, just not amazing.

Still well worth going through it and its dlc.

[Himu]

Definitely gets a bit better.

[Himu]

Once you get used to the quirks it's not bad. It's actually pretty good. I've reached Last Bastille. The first two bosses were pretty easy. I enjoy the exploration. The exploration here isn't as good as DS1's but it's still pretty good in how the game smartly teases and allows new unlocks. I've unpetrified a pyromancer for instance. You have to note there's someone petrified and then actively buy a cure. Then you get a new character at the camp. Unlocking things seems to take a bit more effort in this game and it almost always feels rewarding so far.

There's a lot of things to miss in this too. Like, I couldn't beat the fire frog and I'm sure it has something special. There's lots of missables that really require searching beyond the beaten track to find such as the stamina ring I found. I've leveled up adaptability to 20 and now combat feels pretty damn smooth with no clothes on. I'm really enjoying this even if, so far, it's not as good as 1. But it's probably about as good as Bloodborne so far. I really enjoy the fact that you continuously get hollow and lose hp the more you die. It puts an even bigger price on death and makes you play better.

Negatives include:

- adaptability. Just a ridiculous stat requirement.
- enemy tracking, I would get hit by moves that the second boss did that should have never hit me.
- poor hit detection and hit stun. Often I'm hit and my character doesn't even react and yet I've taken damage. This is a really big flaw.
- slow speed in general, from the speed of the character as they run, to how slow downing an estus takes. Even with the stamina ring it felt like I wouldn't have a full stamina bar even if I didn't have my shield up and hadn't done an action in 5 seconds. It's just a very slow pace.
- even with light clothes my character is weighed down to normal roll. I can only get fast roll naked. This enhances the slow speed complaint.

And yet, at times, that slow pace is somehow a boon. Some times it feels truly like a turn based game in action form. I like that at times because it makes each decision have more weight.

Heard the beginning was hard as balls and I'm frankly confused as to why. It's standard Souls.

In fact, I'd say the game has a lot more dungeon crawl elements added, from the sheer numbers you often face. It reminds me of enemies using reinforcements in SMT, where you really, really need to be prepared and consider each encounter. Good shit.

Great game. Glad I've stuck with it and forced myself to get used to the game.

[Himu]

Oh, one complaint.

Nothing really feels like home.

In DS1, firelink shrine feels like home away from madness. The soothing, almost melancholy music that hints as a smidgen of optimism? DS2's home place has no such music. It feels so empty and spread out. It's whatever. I really miss Firelink Shrine.



Don't you dare go hollow 

[Don Rumata]

The music in Majula is similar.
I definitely warmed up to it, especially after you reach the toughest parts of the game, and you go back to it.

Also this is by far the most packed FROM game to date (for better or worse, as there's a lot of jank and some copy paste) by the time you've seen everything, it definitely feels like a massive journey.
I think to this day it's still the one i've sunk the most time into (about 500 hours?), despite 1 still being my favorite.

[Svejk]

From what I've played, I absolutely loved the music in DSII. 

As for Majula, never felt safe there with that little pig.

[Himu]

I haven't heard any music at Majula.

So I went back to the beginning and fixed the petrified zombie, fought some basilisks, and and then lit all the torches. Then I go fight the big cyclops hippo and turns out there's TWO cyclops hippos. I turn back and there's a red invader?!?! I kill red invader and get a present. Heal up, go back to fight cyclops hippos, die a couple of times. Then a Pursuer spawns?!!? I get in the coffin and it changes my gender?!

 

What the fuck.

Also Pursuer's are over used. I've fought three already. Just beat one at Lost Bastille. Also the idea of the game adding a random enemy when I'm trying to beat the regular enemies is baffling from a Soulsborne game design perspective.

On the other hand, I love that Humanity is actually USEFUL in DS2. I never needed it in 1 because I never summon. Humanity serves actual utility now.

[Himu]

Also kudos to the developers for putting a Yoshitaka Amano character in Souls?

[Don Rumata]

Cindi are you playing the regular game or the Scholar version? Because i don't remember any Pursuer in Bastille, but i remember Scholar reshuffled the enemy position of a lot of stuff, so that could be it.
Also weird about no music in Majula, it should start as soon as you get there at the start of the game, IIRC.

[Himu]

Scholar

[Don Rumata]

Ah, i see i played the regular game, so a lot of enemy placements will probably be different.
I think they spammed a lot of enemies in the Scholar to try and make it "more interesting" unfortunately, i'm not sure if there's a way to play in regular mode, so to speak.

[Himu]

I beat some beach with a bunch of knights, found a cleric.

Honestly, the more I play the more I find it underwhelming. By this point in the gsme DS1 was incredible. It's okay and standard Souls, so I like it. But is it a great Souls game? At least so far, no.

To extrapolate this point, I beat the forest of the Giants. Okay. So I get carried off to Lost Bastille like how you are carried off to Anor Londo after beating Sen's. Okay. So I do some stuff and get to a dead end. I can't unlock the door. There's a statue. I ran out of tree so I can't unpetrify it without spending lots of cash. So now I've been carried to some place only to get stuck. Which is baffling because the only reason to get carried off to begin with is because to continue the story.

But nope. Everything in this game appears to be a grind. Have to beat pursuers, have to pay highly expensive items to regularly unlock new items or characters. It's like regularly having to buy Crest of Artorias'. It's such baffling design.

I fought the boss of the beach place and almost fell asleep. Take the back, for free?? Okay. Wail on him, wait for him to attack, dodge, punish, repeat. By this point in Bloodborne I would have fought Blood Starved Beast.

This almost feels less like a B team game and more like a C team game.

It's a sequel that doesn't remotely understand why people love the first one.

I'm starting to think people that feel DS2 is the best Souls game are sniffing glue.

[Don Rumata]

It's less to do with the whole "B-Team" nonsense, and more to do with the fact that they had to scrap and start over halfway through development, so it's basically rushed through, and you can tell since it doesn't lack ideas, just polish.
It's still the worst soul game tho.

[Himu]

The more I play the game the more it reveals itself to be dog shit.

I watched this review and it is spot on.

I'll push through good god can't wait for DS3.



I will say that in some examples I see some reviewers saying enemy placement is bad and mobs:;etc. When they're clearly rushing and not examining their environments. I saw someone bitch about the beginning of the forest of Giants and being ganged up on when I took those dudes out one by one because I'm not dumb and it was easy as shit.

In fact, that's my biggest complaint. Game is smooth brain Souls.  That's not to say previous games were hard as fuck but they challenged me and I felt accomplished. I have yet to feel celebratory playing DS2. And the challenges I do have make no sense and make me say,"this game is fucking stupid."

Oh look another stoned person I'll have to spend 12k to save. Stupid fucking grind ass grind brainless game.

If you can't tell,  I dislike it.

[Bebpo]

DS2 is a pretty good game.

Has the largest build variety, interesting lore and settings, has some cool areas/bosses.


It has a few bad sections (holy hell the missile spam part near the end jfc and that's with the toned down scholar edition), the DLC2 wolves fight is the worst goddamn thing in all of souls (trek out 5 mins in the snow for one attempt where you can die in 10 seconds and then have to do the trek each time) and the graphics are pretty shitty, also some physics/collision issues that show it was definitely rushed/unfinished.

Still a solid B+ even as the worst Souls game.

Probably would never bother replaying it though. But the experience the first time was pretty neat. Some real cool bits in there.

[Himu]

The game definitely is on the brink of kusoge.

Shit has no concept of things like rules. Dark Souls and by extension rpgs are all about rulesets.

Dark Souls 2 continuously breaks rules without one hint of explanation. At Heide you encounter white knights just sitting there that don't attack unless provoked. Fine. Beat the boss and they now go aggro. Why? Is there a lore reason? Is there a gameplay reason? No. It's just stupidity. Dark Souls 2 is full of shit like this. Where it breaks its rules with seemingly no explanation. Another example is enemies not respawning after a certain point. Why? Is there a lore reason?

Dark Souls 2 shoves as much random shit in as possible making a world that is not consistent or reliant on a ruleset

And Beige itself? Just a literal scenic place that's a goddamn tunnel. In fact pretty much all the locales wonder besides Forest of the Giants are linear hallways with no sense of progression. Gone is the multi-pathed approach that allows mastery of a locale. How many ways are there to Undead Parish? Or Blighttown?

Dark Souls 2 is kusoge. Who really cares about "build variety" if that's the case?

Bad Souls game? No. Bad RPG. Rpgs subsist on rules. What are they otherwise?

The FFXIII of Souls

[Bebpo]

 

[Himu]

This game stretches what is considered a "good game". This game is utter balls. No Man's Wharf is terrible. Pincer attack after pincer attack. Trap after trap. Ambush after ambush. Just throw enemy numbers at the situation. Soulsborne is great because generally it's a game of knowledge and observation. Count the enemy numbers and plan a plan of action. Here, I will trigger enemy ambushes where they normally weren't even there because the game operated under its own flawed ruleset. The game is the definition of unfun. I just cleared an entire keep in No Man's Wharf with no reward in it.

Kusoge.

[Himu]

I unlocked the shortcut at no man's wharf and it was the least fun thing I've ever done in a Soulsbourne game.

Fans of this game are smoking crack.

It's such an unfun cheap fest. You know how in turn based rpgs you'll some times get a surprise encounter? Like a back attack? Those are cool. But what if you made an entire dungeon based off that formula?



Surprise attack surprise attack surprise attack surprise sttack

Shit game.

That's not to say surprise attacks are bad. They're fantastic and one of my favorite parts of rpgs. Bloodborne had this.



Why does this work? Bloodborne occasionally does jump scares and it's always satisfying. Why does it work? Because souls games almost always play their cards close to their chests. They're made so that you know the precise numbers, with adaquete scouting and getting information of the encounter before it even happens. So that the surprises are actually just that - unexpected. In DS2 they throw numbers and constant pincer attacks even with accurate information and scouting.

Therefore, your information is pointless. But finding information and executing a plan is why the games are fun. If the game constantly throws up and shits its pants to throw you off then it's not fun.

The above video embodies that. Just lazy design because lol PrePeRrr 2 DiEee

DIE, BART. DIE!!

[Himu]

I'm skipping this and playing III instead. Life is too short to play dog shit.

[El Babua]

No man's wharf isn't even close to as bad as it gets either lmao

spoiler (click to show/hide)

I remember it as another unremarkable area where the whole buildup of firing up the big light ended up being useless because of the borked lighting system

[close]

[Himu]

Decided that hey, maybe I'm wrong and decided to pop it in tonight.



Nope. Look how much stamina each attack and roll does. I feel so limited in this game. Even with a stamina ring it's soooo slow. I'm limited to one, maybe two slashes because I might need to roll. And against an HP sink of an enemy this makes combat tediously dull even when it's mind numbingly easy.

Compare to my fight with Havel.



Look how smooth it is. Look how fast my stamina bar increases. Look how many actions I can do.

Dark Souls 2 is not fun, feels like shit, and so far isn't even dark. Booty cheeks.

Dark Souls 3 time.

[Himu]

Dark Souls 3 is pretty good stuff. It's exactly what I want out of Soulsborne. It doesn't feel like Souls though. The aesthetic is more like Bloodborne. Still great however.

But at this point, Dark Souls 1 might be a top 5 game for me.

The game resonated with me at a point where I needed something like it in my life and it reminded me that life is worth living. One of the most powerful messages I've ever received from a game. 2, 3, Bloodborne, and Sekiro don't have that messaging for me. I think Dark Souls 1 stands alone in the series and transcends beyond it. I love Soulslikes but Dark Souls 1 is in a class of its own and neither 2 or 3 or even BB are as good.

And that's fine.

[Himu]

Yes, they're strong af.