Random Gaming Talk Thread

[Bebpo]

I'd take that rumor with a colossal grain of salt.

That said, Horizon ZD is a way better game and story than Horizon 2, so I wouldn't have a problem with a ZD that looks as good as H2 for legacy value.

I wouldn't buy it or play it, but I'd be fine with it existing.

[Rahxephon91]

Lol. Why does this console generation exist?

For people like you to complain.

[Bebpo]

Speaking of Horizon, I just want Lance Riddick to in the live-action TV show.

Also why did Sony hire the guy who makes mostly mecha movies Neil Blomkamp and have him do a Gran Turismo racing movie and not have him do Horizon as a movie, instead relegating Horizon to a TV show which makes zero sense given the CG needs. 

[Potato]

Lol. Why does this console generation exist?

For people like you to complain.

Still waiting for a reason other than slightly upgraded graphics...

[Rahxephon91]

Upgraded graphics....

Is usually the point of new consoles.

[Potato]

If you have low standards, sure. I prefer new experiences.

[Svejk]

If you have low standards, sure. I prefer new experiences.

And you get this from the Switch?  Please expound. 

[Himu]

Are you saying that BOTW isnt the most original sandbox game in the past decade? That ARMS isn't unique take on fighting games? That Mario Odyssey isn't one of the greatest 3d platformers of all time with lots of unique gameplay ideas? That the concept of a handheld that is also a console isn't novel and genius?

Okay.

[Rahxephon91]

If you have low standards, sure. I prefer new experiences.

What the fuck are you talking about?

New consoles usually come out as tech has evolved, companies invest in that tech, and it outpaces what previous consoles could do. Now there's been quite a hick-up to this process, one you stupidly don't seem to think is true, but that's why new consoles come out so yes....graphics are why.

As for new "experiences" which is a vague statement that means nothing. I've been playing plenty of new games on my PS5 to the best of it's ability while all you do is cry.

[Rahxephon91]

Are you saying that BOTW isnt the most original sandbox game in the past decade? That ARMS isn't unique take on fighting games? That Mario Odyssey isn't one of the greatest 3d platformers of all time with lots of unique gameplay ideas? That the concept of a handheld that is also a console isn't novel and genius?

Okay.

I played Zelda BOTW on the WiiU.

 

[Svejk]

Are you saying that BOTW isnt the most original sandbox game in the past decade? That ARMS isn't unique take on fighting games? That Mario Odyssey isn't one of the greatest 3d platformers of all time with lots of unique gameplay ideas? That the concept of a handheld that is also a console isn't novel and genius?

Okay.

Nope.  Not even close.  From what I was getting from it, playing something like REVII and/or Astrobot Rescue Mission on PSVR are truly playing a new experience.  No question.  Mario Odyssey brought absolutely nothing new to the table.  Completely fueled on Switch launch hype.  It was good, but it didn't bring that Mario 64 magic, not even remotely.  The bosses were horribly dull to fight when compared to other 3D platformers. 
BOTW was a unique open world game, but like mentioned prior, it was a WiiUUUUUU game, where I played it as well.  I really believe if the Switch wasn't portable, the thing wouldn't have took off the way it did, besides being a last gen port dumping ground.

[Tasty]

Nintendo handhelds will always do well, especially when Sony isn't out there soaking up a portion of sales (RIP PSP/Vita I guess).

It was smart business sense to once again zig when others zag, and unify their handheld and console dev teams for the first time ever. That kind of first-party development pipeline may not have saved the Wii U had the unification existed back then, but it certainly guaranteed the Switch's success in my mind.

We're getting both AAA 3D Zeldas as well as the top-down handheld style. We're getting (real) Pokemon games on a home console, nearly every year. If you were ever bummed <Nintendo Franchise X> was strictly for home consoles, or strictly for handhelds, that wall was burned down forever by the Switch. It was definitely exciting, and nice as a Nintendo fan to only have to buy one system going forward.

[Tasty]

Odyssey wasn't as good as Galaxy. It was nice the mainstream was hyping it but at the end of the day, Svej is right, it's a pretty by-the-numbers Mario game. The personality Koizumi started secretly injecting into the franchise without Miyamoto's notice was drained noticeably in 3D Land/World+NSMB, and Odyssey is but a small step up from those games in terms of whimsy and soul.

The New Donk musical sequence stands out because it's the only real highlight of the game, when Galaxy was busting moments like that every world. Other cool things were seemingly included just to make the player say "whoah this is in a MARIO game??" T-Rex, realistic humans, most of the costumes, most of the hat possessions, etc. Yawn-worthy set-dressing. Meanwhile, Galaxy maintains an effortless aesthetic and thematic consistency that rides the line perfectly between Mario and non-Mario.

(I haven't played Bowser's Fury but I hear that's trying some new things, thankfully.)

IMO.

[Himu]

Mario Odyssey is so much better than Galaxy and the Galaxy HD thing proved it. Galaxy has nothing on hat jumping.

Odyssey the GOAT.

Wrath was right about Mario Galaxy the whole time. It's a very rigid paint by the numbers linear platformer that takes away options.



The ability to turn into Mario Odyssey's adds a whole new dimension.

Balloon World and online added tons of replay value to an already vast game.



Mario Galaxy put me to sleep in that collection. The worst part of that collection was the realization none of those games were particularly good anymore and had tons of flaws.

The idea that Odyssey isn't refreshing or does no new things with Mario is frankly bizarre. Also 3d Fury is extremely flawed although it has some good ideas.

[Potato]

If you have low standards, sure. I prefer new experiences.

And you get this from the Switch?  Please expound. 

Who mentioned Switch?

Atari 2600 > NES = scrolling worlds/stages, much more complex sprites and stages could be achieved significantly altering gameplay
NES > Mega Drive/SNES = Much more complex stages/environments and hardware improvements had a huge impact on gameplay
SNES gen > PS1/N64/Saturn = 3D gaming
PS1/N64/Saturn > PS2/GC/XB/DC = Huge leap in the size of the worlds, open world games, huge change in physics capabilities
PS2/GC/XB > PS3/Wii/360 = Another massive leap in the size of worlds available to the player, all consoles introduced new ways to play games (motion, Guitar Hero, cameras etc), online gaming hit the mainstream
PS3/Wii/360 > PS4/XBO/WiiU/Switch = New better engines made significant impacts on gameplay, better digital distribution of games, hybrid Switch changed the game, massive jump in size of open worlds and complexity of worlds. There was also the weird WiiU experiment which led to Switch becoming viable.

I was there for every single one of those generation changes. Each one facilitated a massive leap in gameplay.

Right out of the gate, there were games made for the new generation of hardware that were simply not possible on previous generation hardware.

What has the PS5/XBS generation offered that's new?

Absolutely nothing unless you're simpleminded enough to be happy to shell out hundreds of dollars for some shiny graphics and some vague promises about new experiences.

Two years in and nothing new gameplay wise has been offered. Almost every single game has been cross-gen and the developers have been so creatively bankrupt that they are literally remaking games that aren't even one generation removed.

So I stand by my statement that this is the most pointless generational change ever.

[HardcoreRetro]

Each of those steps was facilitated by the increase in horse power.

I feel like your complaints should be directed at modern developers and less at the consoles themselves. I feel like the plateau you're complaining about was already reached in the PS3 to PS4 era.

[Coax]

PS3-has-no-games-meme.jpg

[Potato]

Each of those steps was facilitated by the increase in horse power.

I feel like your complaints should be directed at modern developers and less at the consoles themselves. I feel like the plateau you're complaining about was already reached in the PS3 to PS4 era.

Of course the increase in horsepower facilitated those leaps, that's not in dispute. In fact, the generational change was integral to those new experiences.

However, the generational change this time has facilitated absolutely nothing new in two years (and nothing on the horizon either) and the experience of playing games on the current generation is fundamentally unchanged outside of some slightly better graphics.

My statement that this was the most unnecessary generational change in the history of video games remains. Nothing that is being experienced on the PS5/XBS cannot be experienced on the PS4/XBO. The Xbox Series S is proof of that.

[paprikastaude]

Mario Odyssey has good worlds, but the controls are such a stepdown. It's a setup slighty better than 3D World, but way behind Mario64/Sunshine. I replayed Mario 64 not long before Odyssey and it felt like going from playing an acrobat to a sack of rice. Where's all the intuitive movesets? Even Galaxy might have had more. And to the complainers of the Mario 64 camera, all I can say is, I don't what you're talking about Had no problems with it, even in complex levels like the pyramid, which I haven't played in ages.

Nope.  Not even close.  From what I was getting from it, playing something like REVII and/or Astrobot Rescue Mission on PSVR are truly playing a new experience.  No question.  Mario Odyssey brought absolutely nothing new to the table.  Completely fueled on Switch launch hype.  It was good, but it didn't bring that Mario 64 magic, not even remotely.  The bosses were horribly dull to fight when compared to other 3D platformers. 
BOTW was a unique open world game, but like mentioned prior, it was a WiiUUUUUU game, where I played it as well.  I really believe if the Switch wasn't portable, the thing wouldn't have took off the way it did, besides being a last gen port dumping ground.

To this day, all people gush over is Odyssey, BotW and maybe a few year 1 games. Take away the launch year, and Switch has almost nothing unique or special to offer. tbh, its biggest innovation was the marketing. Blinding fanboys and turning near worthless crap into moneymakers. Show me a single Direct conference in which the majority of announcements wasn't old ports and remasters. You can't (maaaybe last E3). They tuned their fanbase not only into defending this dumping ground of ports and ripoffs, but literally longing for it  Not even asking for new games anymore, Nintenyearolds just demand more ports in internet wishlists, fansite articles, or even in fake rumours like "Wind Waker - again".

At this point they know they can get away with anything, too. People pay more for simple ports of Donkey Kong or Skyward Sword than for the originals 10 years earlier Absolute bitch fanbase. Actual sequels like Mario Party/Mario Sports, Animal Crossing or Switch Sports launch with half the content (or less) of their 10-20 y/o predecessors, Splatoon 3 is identical to Splatoon 2 outside of a few QOL tweaks. Pokemon looks like it was made in a game jam. And then they talk highly about innovation - get the hell out of here, lmao.

[HardcoreRetro]

Edit: This was directed at Potato.

That's not true. There aren't a lot of games that tap into the potential of this gen, but there are some.

Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart, Astro's Playroom, The Medium and anything that adds raytracing. I'd add Cyberpunk 2077 as well since it's almost unplayable on the old gen.

I'd agree that raytracing doesn't seem to add much to most games, but then there's outliers like Metro: Exodus where it truly changes the feel of the game. So once again it seems it has more to do with how developers use the technology and less with it not being a leap. 

and the experience of playing games on the current generation is fundamentally unchanged outside of some slightly better graphics.

That basically describes the jump from PS3 to PS4 as well.

[Potato]

Edit: This was directed at Potato.

That's not true. There aren't a lot of games that tap into the potential of this gen, but there are some.

Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart, Astro's Playroom, The Medium and anything that adds raytracing. I'd add Cyberpunk 2077 as well since it's almost unplayable on the old gen.

I'd agree that raytracing doesn't seem to add much to most games, but then there's outliers like Metro: Exodus where it truly changes the feel of the game. So once again it seems it has more to do with how developers use the technology and less with it not being a leap. 

and the experience of playing games on the current generation is fundamentally unchanged outside of some slightly better graphics.

That basically describes the jump from PS3 to PS4 as well.

Somewhat agree, but the jump from PS3 to PS4 felt much more significant in gameplay terms than anything that's going on now.

[Himu]

Where's all the intuitive movesets? Even Galaxy might have had more.

This is an incorrect claim. Mario Odyssey has an incredible moveset compounded by the fact you have more moves.

Butt stomp -> jump lends to verticality

Mario has a roll which leads to longer and further jumps

Cappy allows multi tiered jumping and jump extension

You are just exposing you suck at Mario Odyssey. To question "where's the movesets?" in this game?



Yeah. That's on you.

Switch is the best Nintendo era in years. I frankly find the anti-Switch people are on serious meds but that's a personal opinion you're fine to disagree with. BOTW and Odyssey are modern classics as far as I'm concerned. Then stuff like Arms, the fact they remade Famicom Detective and translated it, Pokemon Arceus is the most forward thinking Pokemon in generations;etc. It's easily the best Nintendo system in ages if you had a brain and didn't buy a Wii U like most people.

I played Mario 64 just a few years ago on actual Nintendo 64 hardware and much of it has aged like milk. This (1:26 and that awful camera) is what you're defending.




So bad.

I happen to notice that every single anti Switch poster has severe bias. Either they're deranged Nintendo fanbous crying for the good ol days of Nintendo or they're anti Nintendo game players that still have a chip on their shoulder from the Genesis days.

I especially think the most ridiculous claim against the Switch is "it's all Wii U ports" as if most players even had a Wii U. If you bought a Wii U, that fuck up is on you and not the rest of society.

[Nintex]

What has the PS5/XBS generation offered that's new?

The issue is mostly that devs made everything scale better or simply released new things on old platforms. The battle royale games for example are "new" this generation but they run on everything.
At the same time new rendering techniques like DLSS and FSR have completely changed the game in terms of performance. The next generation of games didn't really start with the release of PS5/Xbox Series S|X.

They sort of dropped in the middle of the transition because the launch PS4/Xbox One games were vastly different from what is releasing now.
Some innovations also have a specific set of hardware requirements like VR.

So if you look at this 'new' generations most iconic games they are either multiplatform (Elden Ring), highly scalable (Fortnite) or stuck to a specific hardware configuration (Half Life: Alyx).

To this day, all people gush over is Odyssey, BotW and maybe a few year 1 games. Take away the launch year, and Switch has almost nothing unique or special to offer.

Nintendo's console generations are usually front-loaded but on Switch they've kept up the pace of releases fairly well.
They have dropped the ball on some things like the Mario Sports titles but critics usually filter out a lot of games they personally don't like just to make their point.

What Switch showed is that from a healthy platform perspective it's better to have a steady flow of games including a bunch of DLC's, remakes, remasters, asset flips and third party games, than just having 'unique' or 'special' games.
The biggest change is that Nintendo now fills the void between big (10/10) releases with (7/10 or 8/10) Warriors' games, ports and remakes. So even if their big games like Zelda TOTK are delayed they still have something to release.

Overall though if you look at OpenCritic these are Nintendo's most highly rated games this year.
It is likely that Mario + Rabbids and the new Pokemon make this list also.

Xenoblade Chronicles 3 (88)
Kirby and the Forgotten Land
Fire Emblem Warriors: Three Hopes
Pokémon Legends: Arceus
Splatoon 3
Live A Live (81)

OpenCritic has about 60 Switch games listed for 2022 that scored 80 or higher.
Xbox Series X and PS5 have about 40 listed for this year.

The Wii U by comparison has a total of 60 games that scored 80+ just like the 3DS.
The PlayStation 4 has a total of ~650(!) 80+ rated games. The Switch has ~430 games rated 80+ over its lifetime, the PS5 and Xbox Series both top out at ~100.

Purely based on the question: "is there something good to play?" the Switch is the best Nintendo console since the SNES and you can even play a bunch of iconic SNES games on Switch.
I loved my GBA too but Golden Sun is no match for Xenoblade 3 and a shoddy Rayman 2 DS port can't beat the likes of Mario + Rabbids.

[MMaRsu]

I especially think the most ridiculous claim against the Switch is "it's all Wii U ports" as if most players even had a Wii U. If you bought a Wii U, that fuck up is on you and not the rest of society.

Lmao what kind of bullshit is this? Why would you not buy a Wii U lmao

[MMaRsu]

Xenoblade Chronicles 3 (88)
Fire Emblem Warriors: Three Hopes
Pokémon Legends: Arceus
Live A Live (81)

Ugh, gross.

Boring ass games, miss me with that shit
Where is the next Nintendo banger?

New Smash Brothers? New Mariokart? New Metroid Prime? New Yoshi's story or something, Paper Mario RPG? New Donkey Kong?

Where are all the good new Nintendo games? I dont care about boring rpg's of yesteryear or pedo games like Xenoblade.

I had Arceus by the way, game looked and played like a turd.

[Svejk]

Edit: This was directed at Potato.

That's not true. There aren't a lot of games that tap into the potential of this gen, but there are some.

Ratchet and Clank: Rift Apart, Astro's Playroom, The Medium and anything that adds raytracing. I'd add Cyberpunk 2077 as well since it's almost unplayable on the old gen.

I'd agree that raytracing doesn't seem to add much to most games, but then there's outliers like Metro: Exodus where it truly changes the feel of the game. So once again it seems it has more to do with how developers use the technology and less with it not being a leap. 

and the experience of playing games on the current generation is fundamentally unchanged outside of some slightly better graphics.

That basically describes the jump from PS3 to PS4 as well.

Somewhat agree, but the jump from PS3 to PS4 felt much more significant in gameplay terms than anything that's going on now.

I think this varies on one and other depending on what games you like/play.  I agree on this point for something like Shadow of Mordor; it was incredible in PS4, but was completely a shitty game on PS3 because it was incapable of the Nemesis system.
But there were fantastic playing games like MGSV which were virtually identical on PS3 & 4, but the boost in performance was evident on PS4.. And a preferred version to play for that reason alone.

Also, I bring up VR often.. PSVR specifically, since it's console based.  I know it's not for everyone (unfortunately), but it really is proven to bring gaming experiences like no other games have.  As plateaued PS4 hardware was, it was still bringing what it could (like switch maybe?), but the PS5 along with what they've shown for PSVR2, Sony is bringing improved experiences like no other.  Have you tried Returnal or Astros Playroom? You can't have the gameplay experience anywhere else.  Granted it's been far and few between such games, but again, things have been delayed because of reasons. 

[demi]

I moved recently, and my new room is much bigger than the previous, so I could actually buy a shelving unit and look at all the videogames the fatties I bring in to pound will see and admire

I threw away all the Xbox so I kept all the REAL GAMER SHIT

https://i.imgur.com/BPUQxlV.jpg

[Nintex]

They're now bringing back cancelled licensed GBA games

[Nintex]

Xenoblade Chronicles 3 (88)
Fire Emblem Warriors: Three Hopes
Pokémon Legends: Arceus
Live A Live (81)

Ugh, gross.

Boring ass games, miss me with that shit
Where is the next Nintendo banger?

New Smash Brothers? New Mariokart? New Metroid Prime? New Yoshi's story or something, Paper Mario RPG? New Donkey Kong?

Where are all the good new Nintendo games? I dont care about boring rpg's of yesteryear or pedo games like Xenoblade.

I had Arceus by the way, game looked and played like a turd.

critics usually filter out a lot of games they personally don't like just to make their point.

with that said Arceus is very overrated.

The new Mario RPG is about to ship this month (Mario + Rabbids: Sparks of Hope), in 2020 they released Paper Mario: The Origami King. Smash Bros. already released in 2018 including a fuck ton of DLC, they're busy adding even more tracks to Mario Kart 8 as well. Currently 24 tracks have been added with 24 additional tracks on the way. New Metroid Prime is in development but that's taking forever, Metroid Dread finally released last year though. New Donkey Kong is rumored but I have my doubts. New Yoshi Story? Already released called: Yoshi's Crafted World. I haven't had time to play it myself but I've heard great things about Kirby and the Forgotten Land if you're looking for a new quality Nintendo platformer.

Another possible banger coming up is Bayonetta 3.

[Svejk]

https://twitter.com/Nibellion/status/1576674498929098753

Apparently this is a part of a big SIE leak.. More stuff should be dropping on the horizon. 

[Pissy F Benny]

Last of Us 2 remake

[paprikastaude]

>

The idiots who always cry that games "age poorly" because they refuse to learn alternate game systems for 5 minutes are the reason we get nonsense projects like TLoU and Horizon remastered now.
I'd argue not even RE4 needed a remake, but I can see it from a complete casual perspective (still, something like the limited RE4 movement isn't an age thing, but was a deliberate and smart design choice). When you get to the era of games like Dead Space though... nah. There's more things modern games should learn from Dead Space than vice versa. tbf if you think a PS360 era game aged poorly, it was most likely always weak to begin with. Not to mention freaking PS4 games. More likely you were dumb, too easily impressed, etc. The originals of these examples don't even have bad graphics, even Dead Space looks more than adequate - art direction goes a long way.

[Nintex]

I remember when games would just vanish into thin air when a new generation started and were already hard to find at retail to begin with.
No way to buy, no way to play.

So I like this idea that we can keep playing our favorite games and they improve on new hardware.
Pricing is the big issue for me. I'd rather see these at $30. With that said they usually drop in price pretty quickly after launch, physical at least.

[Rahxephon91]

Nah it's a waste of time and resources.

[Nintex]

Nah it's a waste of time and resources.

Lots of Junior developers who need to get more experienced in making games.
This is one very effective way for them to learn.

They're mostly doing this because they don't have enough game designers to come up with new games and game ideas.

Epic Games now offers a 300k/year salary and a 100k sign-up bonus for game designer positions.

[Joe Molotov]

Put some of those junior developers on damn Bloodborne, Sony you fucks!

[Himu]

I especially think the most ridiculous claim against the Switch is "it's all Wii U ports" as if most players even had a Wii U. If you bought a Wii U, that fuck up is on you and not the rest of society.

Lmao what kind of bullshit is this? Why would you not buy a Wii U lmao

I think a problem with gamers is they just buy to buy. There was no real draw to buying Wii U unless you were a complete and utter diehard. The result is a system so niche that it sold Dreamcast levels. Why wouldn't Nintendo make Wii U ports? The rest of us were smart enough not to buy one and missed out on the good games. More for us.

[Rahxephon91]

I like video games. There's been plenty good games this year. Sorry some of you I guess don't have much to play.

[paprikastaude]

I remember when games would just vanish into thin air when a new generation started and were already hard to find at retail to begin with.
No way to buy, no way to play.

So I like this idea that we can keep playing our favorite games and they improve on new hardware.
Pricing is the big issue for me. I'd rather see these at $30. With that said they usually drop in price pretty quickly after launch, physical at least.

We need proper BC, or something like GOG except for all platforms instead of just PC games. Not constant cash-ins and ripoffs (of varying redundance) for only a few prominent IPs.

[tiesto]

Xenoblade Chronicles 3 (88)
Fire Emblem Warriors: Three Hopes
Pokémon Legends: Arceus
Live A Live (81)

Ugh, gross.

Boring ass games, miss me with that shit
Where is the next Nintendo banger?

New Smash Brothers? New Mariokart? New Metroid Prime? New Yoshi's story or something, Paper Mario RPG? New Donkey Kong?

Where are all the good new Nintendo games? I dont care about boring rpg's of yesteryear or pedo games like Xenoblade.

I had Arceus by the way, game looked and played like a turd.

Ehh, I'd much rather have remakes of SNES RPGs on the level of Live A Live than any of the above (excepting maybe Smash).
And XB3 has an extremely low quantity of lewdness (disappointingly, I like my cheesecake), kind of an overreaction to XB2 critics.

[bork]

https://twitter.com/ColinWilliamson/status/1576760990607155200

[Tasty]

[bork]

https://twitter.com/ColinWilliamson/status/1577475978221465602

https://twitter.com/ColinWilliamson/status/1577475990867300352

https://twitter.com/ColinWilliamson/status/1577475995955003395

https://twitter.com/ColinWilliamson/status/1577476007602577408

These are the best ones yet

[Himu]

https://twitter.com/ColinWilliamson/status/1576760990607155200

Sarah is the only good looking one.

[benjipwns]

Some of the faces are creepier than the old ones.

[Raist]

I'm surprised the AI could determine the characters' ethnicity considering the OG models probably have 10 polygons at best used for the whole face.

[Coax]

I'm surprised the AI could determine the characters' ethnicity considering the OG models probably have 10 polygons at best used for the whole face.

Tbf with Stable Diffusion you enter a text prompt to describe the desired output, even when using the image-to-image transformation, so wouldn't surprise me if that was part of it for some results.

[james]

Wtf is overwatch

[Nintex]

 

[Pissy F Benny]

they should have gone all the way and done a cell shaded one set in japon

and get rid of the shitty cops

[MMaRsu]

nope

[Nintex]

[Himu]

(Image removed from quote.)

 

Looks fucking dope.

[Rahxephon91]

Should have done modern Auto Modelista.

[paprikastaude]

Criterion game with a story? Just let me drive and takedown.

[MMaRsu]

(Image removed from quote.)

 

Looks fucking dope.

Lol some cgi images?

The entire style screams

[MMaRsu]

Full trailer, with a lot of cool colors! Wow! Look at the flashy lights and quick cuts!

[Svejk]

People have zero taste in aesthetics for cars these days.  Vomit inducing stickers, patterns, colors, rims, accessories...   This is indeed a clown world we live in now.

I'm sure you can customize however you want, but this presentation seems awfully geared to focus on the more edgey/ non serious racer crowd.  Granted, I haven't played a NFS since the original Hot Pursuit... other racers just do it so much better now.  Gonna be a fat pass for me.

[paprikastaude]

Need for Budget: unbound?

People have zero taste in aesthetics for cars these days.  Vomit inducing stickers, patterns, colors, rims, accessories...   This is indeed a clown world we live in now.

NSF Underground came out in 2003.

[Svejk]

Need for Budget: unbound?

People have zero taste in aesthetics for cars these days.  Vomit inducing stickers, patterns, colors, rims, accessories...   This is indeed a clown world we live in now.

NSF Underground came out in 2003.

These days, as in the turn of the century.   Underground looks to have been undoubtedly fueled by the gawdawful Fast series leading to a Kenny Powers Collection caliber of trashy colors and pointless spoilers and trim…  This shit looks like straight up Joker’s Minions type, hooligan cars.  The decline continues.  If they're atempting to show the broad range of customization, it's a bit of a turn off.  Borderline Saints Row cheese.... At least it was expected and tolerable in SR.