Official *Consoles Are For Losers* thread

[MCD]

Hey, I like modern setting when it look interesting like Modern Warfare. But not Alpha Protocol, way too bland.

[pilonv1]

haven't played AP tho

Get to it, awesome fun.

[cool breeze]

Obsidian is great.  Over rated or whatever by forum people, I guess, maybe, I dunno, but I really liked their games.  Except Dungeon Siege 3, because I haven't played that.

To me the problem is that they can't finish a game.  I don't just mean quality control.

[Great Rumbler]

Except Dungeon Siege 3, because I haven't played that.

Dungeon Siege 3 is a pretty good game, relatively shallow but the combat is fun and the locations are varied enough to be interesting. It's also the least buggy Obsidian game to date.

I prefer Bethesda out of Bioware and Obsidian.

I like all three companies, though Bioware has been testing my patience recently. I'd probably pick Bethesda as my favorite of the three, though.

[maxy]

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-03-22-gamestop-next-xbox-with-anti-used-game-tech-unlikely

US shop GameStop has poured cold water on the rumour that the next Xbox will include anti-used game technology.

In January Kotaku reported that its sources said Microsoft's next home console would use Blu-ray discs and that Microsoft was planning on including technology that would somehow combat used games, though didn't provide specifics on exactly how that would work.

Today, in an investor call, GameStop executives said such a move is "unlikely".

"We think it's unlikely that there would be that next-gen console because the model simply hasn't been proven to work," Paul Raines, GameStop CEO, said. "Remember, used video games have a residual value. Remember GameStop generates $1.2 billion of trade credits around the world with our used game model. So, consider taking used games out of that, you'd have to find new ways to sell the games.

"And, our partners are good partners. The console companies have great relationships with us."

GameStop pointed out that the majority of the $1.2 billion of credit it generated went back into purchasing a video game. For many gamers, the shop said, this made buying games more affordable.

It also said its highest market position is with Microsoft and Xbox 360 software. The shop talks to the first party almost "every day".

"This is the kind of news that gets out in the industry and gets people worked up and hyper-ventilating and excited," Raines added.

"The pre-owned business is not a cannibalistic business. If you follow the popular conventional wisdom, you would think pre-owned is replacing new. The truth is, pre-owned is an opening price-point category. The average price is $18. A lot of it is old generation. What is is is a category for the customer who's maybe not ready to invest in a new game, but wants to get into the console business and console entertainment.

"What we've done is create a way for that new leading edge consumer to dispose of their old games, and that's what creates this great circle of life we talk about that so many try to imitate. That's how we see it."

gamestop :'(

[Stoney Mason]

I hope he's right. Unlike a minority of gamers,  I'd like to postpone throwing away more of my rights for as long as possible.

[chronovore]

Rage poster next to Blade Runner one.

smh

Average sci fi goes together

You keep poking at a movie that is widely agreed to be one of the landmark pieces of sf cinema out there; it only exposes that you have either missed the point of it, or potentially have bad taste where SF is concerned. You don't have to like it, but it would be nice if you could keep yourself from shitting on something others appreciate.

GameStop pointed out that the majority of the $1.2 billion of credit it generated went back into purchasing a video game. For many gamers, the shop said, this made buying games more affordable.

Yeah, but it doesn't specifically go toward purchasing a new game, so it still doesn't necessarily do anything for the publishers and developers.

[Himu]

It's a troll from the early days of bore

[chronovore]

It's a troll from the early days of bore

[maxy]

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/digitalfoundry-unreal-engine-evolution

Samaritan's return was the only taste of the next-gen we'd be getting at this briefing, but Mark Rein made it obvious that this was the visual target for the new wave of consoles and there was a brief implication that the mystery NVIDIA Kepler card's performance would be matched by whatever the console platform holders are working on now. Rein himself would know: sources close to Epic have told us that the company is working on next-gen target hardware from Microsoft right now - one source has even gone so far as to say to us that Samaritan is already running on whatever kit is currently being used to simulate the new Xbox.

and in other news some Darksiders dude said that currently Weeeooo is on par with current gen

...

[Trent Dole]

and in other news some Darksiders dude said that currently Weeeooo is on par with current gen
...

Of course it is, and it'll cost more than the other current gen consoles despite having less storage space!

[Brehvolution]

Wii U using The Cell confirmed. 

[BlueTsunami]

Man, if thats the case you're going to see the Nintendo tech board analysts blow their heads

[maxy]

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-03-27-pre-owned-increases-cost-of-games-cannibalizes-industry-says-dyack

Used games are a constant irritant for many in this industry - they're at best tolerated and at worst despised with a passion. Frontier Development's David Braben recently lashed out against the used games business, saying that it's effectively killed off single-player titles, and now Silicon Knights boss Denis Dyack has weighed in with his thoughts as well.

Speaking to GamesIndustry International, Dyack remarked, "From a consumer side, [in the last few years] we started seeing used games really come into fruition, and I believe that has caused quite a problem. I would argue that used games actually increase the cost of games."

The biggest problem is that used games have essentially cut off the revenue tail for most titles, Dyack explained.

"There used to be something in games for 20 years called a tail, where say you have a game called Warcraft that would sell for 10 years. Because there are no used games, you could actually sell a game for a long time, and get recurring revenue for quite a while. Recurring revenue is very key," he said.

"Now there is no tail. Literally, you will get most of your sales within three months of launch, which has created this really unhealthy extreme where you have to sell it really fast and then you have to do anything else to get money," he continued, alluding to steps developers take like including multiplayer or launching DLC.

Dyack warned that if the pre-owned market continues unchecked it could threaten the industry as we know it.

"I would argue, and I've said this before, that used games are cannibalizing the industry. If developers and publishers don't see revenue from that, it's not a matter of hey 'we're trying to increase the price of games to consumers, and we want more,' we're just trying to survive as an industry. If used games continue the way that they are, it's going to cannibalize, there's not going to be an industry," he said. "People won't make those kinds of games. So I think that's inflated the price of games, and I think that prices would have come down if there was a longer tail, but there isn't."

I think that software licence thing is one of the biggest scams in human history but on the other hand I understand publisher standpoint.
Selling one million copies and seeing like 3 million unique users has to sting.I would be angry also.

One thing is clear,something has to change and not just in used game segment.It will be interesting to see how things pan out.

[magus]

you know everytime i hear someone saying "XXXX is killing the industry" i can't help but think "I FUCKING WISH"

the game industry is not dying,it's turning into the comicbook one,which is a fate much worse than death

[maxy]

you are just old and bitter,jrpgs are thing of the past now

[Eel O'Brian]

PS4

http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-playstation-is-called-orbis-sources-say-here-are-the-details

lots of spec rumors in that article, and this:

Just like the next Xbox/Durango, we've heard from multiple sources that the Orbis will likewise have some kind of anti-used games measures built into the console. Here's how our main source says it's currently shaping up: new games for the system will be available one of two ways, either on a Blu-Ray disc or as a PSN download (yes, even full retail titles). If you buy the disc, it must be locked to a single PSN account, after which you can play the game, save the whole thing to your HDD, or peg it as "downloaded" in your account history and be free to download it at a later date.
 
Don't think you can simply buy the disc and stay offline, though; like many PC games these days, you'll need to have a PSN account and be online to even get the thing started.

yeah, console used game lockdown is definitely coming, too many rumors pointing in the same direction

as i keep saying, they are about to learn a brutal, hilarious lesson on the realities of the average person's video game habits/spending

[Great Rumbler]

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-03-27-pre-owned-increases-cost-of-games-cannibalizes-industry-says-dyack

Used games are a constant irritant for many in this industry - they're at best tolerated and at worst despised with a passion. Frontier Development's David Braben recently lashed out against the used games business, saying that it's effectively killed off single-player titles, and now Silicon Knights boss Denis Dyack has weighed in with his thoughts as well.

Speaking to GamesIndustry International, Dyack remarked, "From a consumer side, [in the last few years] we started seeing used games really come into fruition, and I believe that has caused quite a problem. I would argue that used games actually increase the cost of games."

The biggest problem is that used games have essentially cut off the revenue tail for most titles, Dyack explained.

"There used to be something in games for 20 years called a tail, where say you have a game called Warcraft that would sell for 10 years. Because there are no used games, you could actually sell a game for a long time, and get recurring revenue for quite a while. Recurring revenue is very key," he said.

"Now there is no tail. Literally, you will get most of your sales within three months of launch, which has created this really unhealthy extreme where you have to sell it really fast and then you have to do anything else to get money," he continued, alluding to steps developers take like including multiplayer or launching DLC.

Dyack warned that if the pre-owned market continues unchecked it could threaten the industry as we know it.

"I would argue, and I've said this before, that used games are cannibalizing the industry. If developers and publishers don't see revenue from that, it's not a matter of hey 'we're trying to increase the price of games to consumers, and we want more,' we're just trying to survive as an industry. If used games continue the way that they are, it's going to cannibalize, there's not going to be an industry," he said. "People won't make those kinds of games. So I think that's inflated the price of games, and I think that prices would have come down if there was a longer tail, but there isn't."

Wait a second here, so used games are some new phenomenon now? What?

[Eel O'Brian]

they're basically going to make console gaming as complicated as pc gaming is to the average person

look at how well that turned out

[Phoenix Dark]

Yea, I don't see this ending well. Anyone who has been to a Gamestop or other gaming store has seen a middle aged grandma either buying a bunch of $10 used games or trying to sell a bunch of used games

[Mupepe]

The average person is going to start caring a lot more about modding their console again.

[MyNameIsMethodis]

glorious sony and microsoft protecting us developers

if Microsoft had shut down like they were supposed to with this generation then this wouldn't be happening. Another case of Microsoft fukkin over thei ndustry cuz theyre greedy bastards

[Eel O'Brian]

that's pretty weak, methodis

i think you might still be exhausted from working overtime in that gaf thread

rest up, get your game back, and try again

[MyNameIsMethodis]

working out everyday is turnign me into a less viscious internet troll  :'(

[MyNameIsMethodis]

Why blame Sony? Microsoft started this with not being able to share bought content digitall, online passes and they will absolutely have this also.

[Eel O'Brian]

Not to mention I guarantee when you can lock out rentals and used games, Sony and other publishers will never drop prices because they wont have to.

oh, they'll have to, just not out of any sort of kindness or consideration for consumers

it'll be more of a desperate backpedal

[Trent Dole]

Shit games are killing the games industry, Denis. Games like every single one you've made this gen.

[cool breeze]

why does every rumor about next gen sound awful

[Brehvolution]

Once they figured out gamers would pay big money to take it in the ass they wanted to go deeper.

[Momo]

well at least from that rumour the orbis name is a legit thing

[MyNameIsMethodis]

microsoft also started putting everything behind a pay gate. because of this they are incredibly greedy. wanna watch Netflix? fuck you pay me $50. Wanna watch Sky? Fuck you pay me 50ls. Wanna watch HBO GO? Fuck you pay me $50.

Microsoft killed the industry and ih ave been saying this since day 1 of xbox 1. no one listened to me of course.

[cool breeze]

reggie gon' bust out the champagne, looks like wiiU is saved

it's kinda funny how Nintendo refusing to adapt finally has a positive aspect.  For better or worse, 3DS might be the last gaming hardware where you can just buy a game and play it right away.  Even the Vita has stupid online passes and stuff.

[Momo]

reggie gon' bust out the champagne, looks like wiiU is saved

it's kinda funny how Nintendo refusing to adapt finally has a positive aspect.  For better or worse, 3DS might be the last gaming hardware where you can just buy a game and play it right away.  Even the Vita has stupid online passes and stuff.

The Panasonic Jungle will rise from it's grave to save us all, dont you worry.

[maxy]

from kotaku article

So, apparently, a lot of game developers have recently received the new PS4 and XBox 3 specifications so they can be ready when the prototype devkits drop. And I got ahold of them.
 
I tried to leak them to Engadget, but they weren't going to print it without independent confirmation, and no one is going to confirm this shit because they like their jobs. But being a jobless student, I figured someone should get some laughter out of this. So, here's the rundown.
 
No firm date has been set for either, but currently they are stating that they are both setting to launch for the Holiday season in 2013. Codename of XB3 is "Durango". PS4 Codename is "Orbis".
 
Both consoles are going to have Blu-Ray, with support for Single-Layer and Dual-layer, and higher-fidelity versions of their current motion control systems.
 
The X-Box 3 is going to have an 8-core 64-bit processor (assumedly an i7 or similar design) rated at 1.2 Teraflops. The PS4 will feature a 4-core 32-bit processor. XB3 will be using a GPU running support for DirectX 11, while the PS4 will be using an OpenGL 4 GPU. XB3 is specified to use 4 GB RAM, and the PS4 will be shipped with 2GB.
 
Specifications state that the PS4 will have *NO* hard drive by default, while the XB3 will come with a 500GB Hard Drive with 8GB of Flash memory. The XB3 will also have a 24/7 connectivity system which has not been entirely elaborated on, with coming support for cloud-based connectivity in 2015/2016.
 
Why do I have this? Well, let's just say that some major developers like EA games are currently very pissed because the PS4 specs are shitty compared to the next XBox and besides limiting their abilities in making more impressive games for the new Playstation, it's also going to shit up cross-platform titles in the same way that the lack of Blu-ray and Standard Hard Drive did with the XBox this generation, and Sony's not listening to their pleas for less shitty hardware. Right now, programmers are pretty much looking at it and comparing the two consoles like one is a high-end gaming PC and the other's a piece of shit eMachines unit from Walmart's $200 special (including monitor).
 
EDIT: The prototype PS4's will start hitting developers around Q3 2012.

 

[BlueTsunami]

Sony eMachine

[cool breeze]

so, wii u and orbient are more comparable than the orbient and durango?

or is this going to be like wii u = dreamcast, orbient = ps2, durango = xbox?

sony doesn't own sucker punch, right? ideally they'd go to SE-Eidos or something and I can successfully avoid the orbient

[MyNameIsMethodis]

why should sony have to conform to Microsoft? why can't microshit conform to sony?

[MyNameIsMethodis]

ps that article has wayy too much pro xbox shit in it. its false.

[Phoenix Dark]

WiiU stronger than PS4? Please make it so 

[Stoney Mason]

Not saying its even true about the specs but it would amuse me to hear all the sony fanboys spin no backwards compatibility and not having the leading tech because that's all they talked about this gen.

For what its worth I think the tech is less of an issue. I think both systems will be fine on that front. But I would/will be highly annoyed if all my digital purchases don't transfer over to the new xbox.   

[Eel O'Brian]

people aren't paying $60 right now for anything other than the biggest of games like a cod or a skyrim, i dunno what makes console manufacturers think they'll just start paying that $60 because "they won't have a choice"

thing is, they will have a choice - most normal people will simply move on to other/cheaper things...like .99 game apps for their phones or tablets

sounds like next gen is gonna be stillborn, i know i'm not buying into any of that bullshit

[MyNameIsMethodis]

hey guyz im a college student 2 i kno some devs tey told me xbox 7280 duringus wont play dvds hurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[Himu]

[BlueTsunami]

WiiU stronger than PS4? Please make it so 

As long as Microsoft goes balls deep with their console, I'd be ok with this. The fallout would be beautiful.

And all of this definitely isn't implausible. We're seeing the results of being burned by 599 US DOLLARS. No more exotics, maybe not even bleeding edge.

[cool breeze]

Not saying its even true about the specs but it would amuse me to hear all the sony fanboys spin no backwards compatibility and not having the leading tech because that's all they talked about this gen.

For what its worth I think the tech is less of an issue. I think both systems will be fine on that front. But I would/will be highly annoyed if all my digital purchases don't transfer over to the new xbox.

problem is that no one has a good track record with backwards compatibility these days .  if I had to guess, I'd say Microsoft would make it more important since all those old games have achievements and stuff. 

wii u will have wii bc, but considering nintendo expects users to rebuy NES games on the 3DS, who knows if it'll pull the same move with the wii u virtual console.  wouldn't be surprised if they play it like sony and have downloadable gamecube games, but slot loading those games won't work.

[Eel O'Brian]

It won't be much. Locking out rentals and used sales all but guarantees fewer new game sales.

sorry for altering your post, but i can't for the life of me figure out why they aren't seeing this inevitable end to their various machinations

is it because the majority of these corporate people are so far removed from living on monthly/weekly budgets that they have no sense of what that means anymore?

[Phoenix Dark]

WiiU stronger than PS4? Please make it so 

As long as Microsoft goes balls deep with their console, I'd be ok with this. The fallout would be beautiful.

And all of this definitely isn't implausible. We're seeing the repercussions of being burned by 599 US DOLLARS. No more exotics, maybe not even bleeding edge.

jokes for days

Sony fans going full circle. First it was the "more battery life is a good thing" realization with the Vita, next it's the "graphics don't make  art better" spin

I can see it now. "Casablanca is the greatest film of all time, and it's black and white. Would you Xfans argue Transformers is better because it's shot in HD? Of course not. Gears of War 4's polygon count doesn't make it better than a true masterpiece like Uncharted 4, no more than Transformers' 1080p makes it better than Casablanca's writing."

[Stoney Mason]

Not saying its even true about the specs but it would amuse me to hear all the sony fanboys spin no backwards compatibility and not having the leading tech because that's all they talked about this gen.

For what its worth I think the tech is less of an issue. I think both systems will be fine on that front. But I would/will be highly annoyed if all my digital purchases don't transfer over to the new xbox.

problem is that no one has a good track record with backwards compatibility these days .  if I had to guess, I'd say Microsoft would make it more important since all those old games have achievements and stuff. 

wii u will have wii bc, but considering nintendo expects users to rebuy NES games on the 3DS, who knows if it'll pull the same move with the wii u virtual console.  wouldn't be surprised if they play it like sony and have downloadable gamecube games, but slot loading those games won't work.

I think backwards compatibility for digital content is so much more important than regular old backwards compatibility even. This is really the first gen where you were asked to purchase stuff online. Not carrying that forward would be a huge slap in the face and stab at the very credibility that system has brought on.

I would hope Sony and MS understand this. Nintendo still doesn't even get the concept of online properly so if anybody was going to botch it, I would expect it to be them.

[Eel O'Brian]

they don't even understand the concept of multitouch

[Stoney Mason]

As far as the digital drm codes and such its not going to stop me from buying a next gen console. What it will simply do is stop me from buying more games or digital content for the used games I would have bought. I recently bought Enslaved for instance and then bought the DLC for it because I liked it. Instead under the new proposed system I wouldn't have bought either so they would get no money from me. I don't believe that they will drop their prices if a restrictive online code system is used but that's what a smart business would do hence why they won't.

There are a small percentage of the market of games worth $60 at launch. I mean easily less than 15 or 20 in a year for me and I'm being generous at that number. It's really probably about 5. So what this means is I'll end up buying those small handful and spending more money on xbox live arcade stuff which at least is priced appropriately based on the amount of content.

[Tasty]

reggie gon' bust out the champagne, looks like wiiU is saved

WiiU stronger than PS4? Please make it so 

[maxy]

ps that article has wayy too much pro xbox shit in it. its false.

must be some well informed xbot

BY: A GUEST ON DEC 15TH, 2011


No firm date has been set for either, but currently they are stating that they are both setting to launch for the Holiday season in 2013. Codename of XB3 is "Durango". PS4 Codename is "Orbis".

there are whispers that someone got fired for just mentioning the codename Durango

[MyNameIsMethodis]

not going to happen nbot

[cool breeze]

just to be clear, the main reason I want these consoles to be powerful is to have better looking PC games.  It's at the point where every game runs smoothly.  Disgusting.  The people buying the gtx 680 and higher end cards are doing it for obscene resolutions (or multi-monitor support).

[MyNameIsMethodis]

ps that article has wayy too much pro xbox shit in it. its false.

must be some well informed xbot

or a stupid college kid making shit up? he wouldn't know PS4 specs and they weon't be that low. if anything the xbox will be lower agian

[Tasty]

wouldn't be surprised if they play it like sony and have downloadable gamecube games, but slot loading those games won't work.

Um of course they won't work, the new Wiis can't play them and there's no GC ports on the Wii U.

[maxy]

dunno,Holmes

Durango is pretty much set in stone as next xbox codename and if Orbis codename is true...

you cannot get that kind of shit by guessing or browsing internet

[cool breeze]

wouldn't be surprised if they play it like sony and have downloadable gamecube games, but slot loading those games won't work.

Um of course they won't work, the new Wiis can't play them and there's no GC ports on the Wii U.

I think you misunderstood what I meant or are completely unaware of the how sony handles it.

A few PS2 games are downloadable for the PS3, but the DVD versions of those games can't be played.  Presumably there's an emulator for each specific game (I think that's how the virtual console handles it).  So if you own God Hand and want to play it on the PS3, you have to rebuy a version that's ostensibly an iso and emulator.
 

[pilonv1]

Not to mention I guarantee when you can lock out rentals and used games, Sony and other publishers will never drop prices because they wont have to.

I don't think they will be locked out in the basic sense. Just an extension of the Online Pass.

"Not the original owner of this game? Pay $15/20/30 to register it to your console. Have a nice day"

[Stoney Mason]

PlayStation 4 (now reportedly called Orbis) is in the news once again, and the latest report reinforces a recent rumor about the possibility of new consoles blocking consumers from playing used titles (or imposing a fee to unlock them). This would be the equivalent of dropping a nuclear bomb on GameStop, and the retailer wouldn't sit idly by, Wedbush Securities analyst Michael Pachter commented to GamesIndustry International.


"It isn't really in Sony's or Microsoft's best interests to block used games. It would benefit Activision and EA slightly, and would hurt GameStop a great deal. If Sony unilaterally did this, I could see GameStop refusing to carry their console, and sales of the PS4 would therefore suffer," he said.

Pachter stressed that "if one does it and the others don't, the one who does it will see a loss of market share." He added that none of the big three console manufacturers "are stupid enough to do this unilaterally" and none of them "are evil enough to do it together."

David Cole of DFC Intelligence agrees that Sony or Microsoft would be foolish to block pre-owned, as a console with anti-used technology would turn off a large chunk of the hardcore gaming market.

"A system that tried to stop used game sales would probably turn off the core consumers that rush to trade in their old product to buy new product. In other words, I don't think it would do so well in the core market," he said.

Lewis Ward, IDC's research manager, acknowledges that publishers and many in the industry would love to "wave a magic wand and cut the used disc market off at the knees," but he also doesn't see it as a likely scenario.

"Customers would rebel. Until there's the equivalent of a great 'used' digital console game trade-in program up and running, gamers will continue to like the ability to trade in discs and basically get discounts on other games," he commented. "I can certainly see Sony stepping up the idea of $10 online passes for connected multiplayer and so on, but especially for families of limited means or that have a narrowband connection at home, the ability to buy/trade use discs is an important reason why they buy game consoles in the first place."

Ward also noted that certain hacks would likely overcome the anti-used technology even if Sony did decide to go forward. "I suspect that even if disc DRM/security is stepped up a lot that countermeasures will soon surface that will allow physical and digital games to be played on the platform, limiting the effectiveness of the effort," he said.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-03-28-gamestop-could-refuse-to-stock-playstation-orbis-says-pachter