Author Topic: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads  (Read 1026278 times)

0 Members and 16 Guests are viewing this topic.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4980 on: March 16, 2018, 01:18:33 AM »
in non-DC, i read The October Faction which seemed to have a decent premise but refused to get started with it until the series literally ended and also a lot of the art was colored stupidly. Like seriously, this is a 18 issue series before its "renaming" (and hiatus/ending) and it seems like at the end of the first arc they're setting up the premise of a monster hunting family, but they literally don't get around to establishing this until like issue 14. :lol

also, The Great Divide which was a quite fun take on a post-apocalyptic setting, and i don't know if it's ended ended or creator ended or just eternally delayed but i'm okay if it's ended as is (even if hinting at the arc villain recurring on the last panel which is kinda argh...), it unfurled the central arc mystery to the events the characters were in without explaining the entire thing regarding why it happened and was happening to the world, etc. ala The Walking Dead which is under Kirkman's mandate to never reveal the cause of the zombies...unlike TWD though it has a protagonist i wouldn't wish had died already (seriously does anyone care about Rick at this point lol, i'm convinced Kirkman hasn't killed him just because he knows nobody would care and more people would be happy) and as the main character is smartly used by being the only one to be given "riders" in a way that lets us experience the change that occurs (other than the dyslexia, which could have been amusing for the book to attempt)

Tasty

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4981 on: March 18, 2018, 10:40:18 PM »
Detective Comics #976

AKA :batman

They're writing Tim like a whiny teenager, which fair enough - that was him a lot on his solo Robin series and even in the beginning of Red Robin. Problem is, this Tim is supposed to be older than his early teenage Robin years. I get that seeing a version of your future self try to kill people would kinda mess with you (not to mentioned being imprisoned for a couple months by Mr. Oz... side note, what was the point of that, anyways?) but not only is Tim now acting more impulsively than fucking Jason, he's getting literally zero respect or understanding from Batman (kinda like Jason, actually. :doge)

I get they have to inject drama but the issue ends with Tim being offered Bat-Tim's Bat-computer dump from the future by a known sociopath, and of course he's gonna take it and it's gonna lead to even more drama.

Where's my smart, charming, happy Timmy of yore? :goty2







:'(

Rahxephon91

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4982 on: March 18, 2018, 11:13:46 PM »
They are rebooting Mother Panic? Milk Wars is important to the story of it? I skipped milk Wars because Mother Panic was the only Young Animal book I was reading.

Edit-Yeah I don't like the sound of it. I've liked the low key on the edge tone of the series so far. Not sure how I'd like it being some strange Batman Beyond like world.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4983 on: March 19, 2018, 03:03:51 AM »
Naw, Milk Wars is kinda fun because she interacts with Batman in their team-up issue. And the "Milk Wars" setups are supposed to be HELLS for the Young Animal characters not the DC ones, so they're peaceful, cloyingly happy worlds. :lol

Milk Wars actually doesn't entirely have to do with anything outside of Doom Patrol (who caused it and featured the main villains prior), but they're using it as the point where the reinventions of the series start afterwards. (Shade from Girl -> Woman, etc.)

I think they might be shifting Mother Panic because as fun as her interactions have been with the Bat Family, it makes more sense for her story to be occurring in a post-Bat Gotham, since otherwise Batman would be handling this stuff himself rather than letting her run wild. I don't think they're actually going to be changing the series significantly, just time-shifting it a few years and taking out Batman. So not like all the way to Batman Beyond future. Just a decade. But some of the details on that have been conflicting. Like there was one comment that you should just pretend the existing issues already took place in this new time frame, but Wray has made it sound like more futuristic. Of course he doesn't write the thing, thankfully.

I hoping the former is true and they just continue with the side characters where the last issue left off with them, and it's like the ten years timeskip was always there from the start.

Tasty

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4984 on: March 21, 2018, 03:02:30 PM »
Superman #43



Bizarro Robin ("Robzorro) is revealed to be... an eloquent, polite, French-mustache-sporting ladies man. :lol :lol :rofl



And he may or may not be boyfriends with Bizarro Superboy ("Boyzarro.") :thinking :uguu

This whole arc is so fucking insane and cute and I love it.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
:drudge



NONCENSENSUAL KISSING!!! :trigger
[close]

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4985 on: March 22, 2018, 07:52:05 AM »

bork

  • おっぱいは命、尻は故郷
  • Global Moderator
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4986 on: March 22, 2018, 08:22:52 AM »
ど助平

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4987 on: March 22, 2018, 09:00:33 AM »
Shitstorm incoming?
Incoming? Bleeding Cool already has a stupid article up, saw it this morning - https://www.bleedingcool.com/2018/03/21/action-comics-writer-dan-jurgens-fat-people/ hopefully no one reads this shit blog anymore (saw it on reddit)

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4988 on: March 22, 2018, 09:07:16 AM »
Quote
As the writer of Action Comics at DC, Dan Jurgens gives a voice to a superhero who represents the best of humanity, despite being an alien from outer space. But when Jurgens himself went up, up, and away for an airline flight, his tweets about a fellow passenger seemed to lack a certain compassion the big blue boy scout is known for.

Of course, a First Class plane ticket can cost 10 times as much as a regular ticket, and even buying two regular seats can be expensive depending on the flight. And the problem with airline seating seems to be one of the airlines’ making, as airline seats have continuously gotten smaller and smaller, even as the average size of Americans has gotten larger, part of a general trend to cut costs and pack more travellers onto a single plane. Even for an average-sized person, a trip on most modern airlines is far from comfortable. For a person of above average size, it can be a nightmare.

Given all of that, reactions to Jurgens’s tweet were negative, accusing the writer of fat-shaming, lacking empathy, and contradicting the principles he writes about, amongst other things. But Jurgens followed up by doubling down.

It looks like Jurgens hasn’t yet reconsidered, even though several followers have responded by telling him he’s lost them as a fan. Maybe he’ll have a change of heart by the time he lands? Perhaps he even talked with the “immense fat guy” who was unfortunately seated next to him and gained a new perspective on the issue? If this were a comic book, that would be the ending we’d expect to see.

We’ll let you know if anything changes when the plane touches down.
fatty triggered amirite lol

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4989 on: March 22, 2018, 09:09:19 AM »
Quote
Bernardo Marra  Flinkman • 16 hours ago
Also, the DC PR team must be breathing a sigh of relief that he just left AC before this whole FatGate thing probably explodes across the media.
:trigger -gate suffixes :trigger

Yeti

  • Hail Hydra
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4990 on: March 22, 2018, 09:29:24 PM »
Maybe he was just sitting next to a Clark Kent who had been afflicted with fat Kryptonite?



also the fact that this wiki exists is lol
http://cartoonfatness.wikia.com/wiki/Superman
WDW

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4991 on: March 22, 2018, 10:12:57 PM »
Who does Dan think reads comic books?

Also, I’ve been reading bendis’s recent Defenders run and... I am actually.... enjoying it?

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4992 on: March 28, 2018, 05:23:10 PM »
Mother Panic looks like it'll be just fine at least.

Doomsday Clock was kinda interesting.

METAL was kind of a let down, especially since, like the whole rest of it...

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4993 on: March 29, 2018, 01:17:24 AM »
Metal was waaaay too kumbaya

samfish

  • Cereal mispeller
  • Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4994 on: March 29, 2018, 12:26:17 PM »
I liked Metal a lot, but man was that last issue rushed. It at least needed some extra pages, if not a whole extra issue. The problem seemed to be more the writing. They wasted #5 and The Wild Hunt on making everything seem hopeless, when they probably could have spread some of the turn around into issue #5 or TWH. But Snyder has always ended his stories pretty poorly, if you ask me, so Metal kind of landing with a 'thud' is no surprise.

With DC, I've always operated under the assumption that anything Justice League-related isn't actually happening because it almost always seems to take place within it's own little world. JL books or events never really bleed over or tie into the other books or series in a meaningful way. Metal and the whole No Justice thing seem to be continuing that tradition. I'm still eager to see where Justice League goes from here though. I just treat it like an Elseworlds thing.

Doomsday Clock felt like another honest- to-god proper followup issue to Watchmen. I'm really enjoying it so far, although it's a really slow burn. At some point it feels like its going to have to change gears and shift into a more typical DC, higher octane event. That's what I'm expecting at any rate, but I'm not seeing how they could make that tonal shift at this stage.

bork

  • おっぱいは命、尻は故郷
  • Global Moderator
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4995 on: March 29, 2018, 01:19:54 PM »
Since I'm hopelessly behind on all things DC, I'm just going to read the entire Metal mini-series and its tie-ins rather than read up until the event starts.  Doesn't really look like there's too many tie-in books anyway.
ど助平

bork

  • おっぱいは命、尻は故郷
  • Global Moderator
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4996 on: March 29, 2018, 01:27:32 PM »
Invincible Iron Man #577+578: This is really starting to feel very Bendis-- lots of dialogue and people meeting each other, but nothing really happening to actually progress the storyline.  Riri gets confronted by some people working for Stark Enterprises who claim all her tech, saying it's their patents and whatnot.  She is then visited by Blade is told to accept a "position at M.I.T." that is actually some kind of secret SHIELD operation (I thought SHIELD was disbanded?  Uh...) staffed with some other armor users like Toni Ho and Arno Stark.  She then gets the go-ahead to get her armor back, presses a button on her watch, and the armor activates and comes right back to her right out of the crate the Stark people were about load onto a plane.  Then everyone jumps on a lead to go search for Tony Stark and it's a dead end of sorts, but Stark hijacks Stark A.I. hologram Friday's signal and talks through her, telling people not to come look for him.  OK...?  We also finally get somewhere with the completely separate Infamous Iron Man story that pops up every now and then in these books since his series got canceled.  Doom heads to his old castle in Latveria, gets taken down by The Hood and a bunch of villains, escapes right out of his armor and teleports to a woman's apartment that he apparently knocked up ( :lol) and asked for help.  Still nothing to do with Tony Stark and crew, yes, but the Hood thinks that they need to find Stark to find out whatever Doom is hiding (they just want his riches, wherever they are- maybe try in a bank account?  :doge)  Also notably-absent the last few issues is A.I. hologram Tony, but I assume he was just off-panel the whole time.
ど助平

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4997 on: March 29, 2018, 01:42:12 PM »
By the end of Metal I didn’t really understand what was happening or why. The earth fell below the darkness or something because Batman got bukkakeed by 9 metals.

The only part I really found interesting were the tie-ins. The actual series sort of sucked. It was just too confusing, and not well explained.

samfish

  • Cereal mispeller
  • Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4998 on: March 29, 2018, 03:06:43 PM »
Bendis only has like 2 issues left on Iron Man before he leaves I think, so he better hurry the fuck up. The Infamous Iron Man stuff is still pretty damn good, but the whole search for Tony Stark and is just fucking dumb and dragging on. I thought for sure this would be the issue where Doom goes back to being a mangled monster who hides under a mask, but he got out of that pickle. It's a shame Doom is inevitably going to go back to his classic self, because I actually really like him  now. The old Doom is such a one-note character. Healed Dr. Doom trying to repent is the only reason to bother reading Iron Man for me.

Freyj

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #4999 on: March 30, 2018, 01:46:30 PM »
By the end of Metal I didn’t really understand what was happening or why. The earth fell below the darkness or something because Batman got bukkakeed by 9 metals.

The only part I really found interesting were the tie-ins. The actual series sort of sucked. It was just too confusing, and not well explained.

Yeah same. Interesting premise for a Crisis event, but lost me along the way and the ending was a bunch of nothing.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5000 on: March 30, 2018, 03:41:00 PM »
WARNING: benji post; with some extended wrap-up thoughts re: METAL

Since I'm hopelessly behind on all things DC, I'm just going to read the entire Metal mini-series and its tie-ins rather than read up until the event starts.  Doesn't really look like there's too many tie-in books anyway.
The series/tie-ins reference events up to the start, especially Snyder's Batman run (which ended with New 52) and the Court of Owls. But it's not essential to the METAL story itself other than this, the Court's actions in an earlier plotline were not just part of torturing Bruce, but to set him up. Also, there's some tie-ins to DARKSEID WAR, when Bruce had Metron's chair he learned a bunch of stuff about the universe, that's why he has The Joker in a cell under the Batcave. (Also, this story is why Darkseid is a baby.) The tie-in issues also have references to prior events, almost all of these get enough of an explanation that you don't need to know the original, there's lots of "random thing before now means something" type stuff.

All the rest are gravy references to place METAL within the DC Epic.

The main one that METAL doesn't explain, isn't Snyder related and not in anything from New 52 is why Nightwing's head is slashed open and he's having visions. It's Dr. Hurt/Thomas Wayne (from RIP) who showed up for two issues to slice Nightwing in the head with a specific metal and sound like he was going even more mad, when he was actually foreshadowing Barbatos' plan which started like the next week in METAL. Snyder obviously wasn't aware of this or didn't give a shit because even in METAL the plotline doesn't go beyond the tie-ins written by the Nightwing writer and Nightwing basically doesn't do anything or help. :lol

I liked Metal a lot, but man was that last issue rushed. It at least needed some extra pages, if not a whole extra issue.
It was already an extended issue, 48 pages, and it's received at least three months of delays. METAL was supposed to be basically over by the time 2018 started, and Doomsday Clock would pick up the banner as the EVENT, except the delays to that are why we're getting NO JUSTICE.

Problem was, fell back to Snyder writing a big superhero fight for 20 pages, and then a tighter and better done Batman/Joker showdown of sorts. Followed with an epilogue to actually explain what happened. :lol

Also DC writ large decided to use METAL to do some tinkering with existing series, as well as shuffle in and out creative teams. Which is a bit of a response to:
With DC, I've always operated under the assumption that anything Justice League-related isn't actually happening because it almost always seems to take place within it's own little world. JL books or events never really bleed over or tie into the other books or series in a meaningful way. Metal and the whole No Justice thing seem to be continuing that tradition. I'm still eager to see where Justice League goes from here though. I just treat it like an Elseworlds thing.
DC books have been for a couple months now been taking place "post-METAL" as there's been plenty of references to it in the past-tense. The delays were apparently not due to Snyder, so the storyline was known to the other writers but they didn't want to tip anything about it. Like Batman's proposal to Catwoman is the result of his coming back from METAL I believe. But King until recently couldn't outright say that was the reason.

As noted, DC is coming out of METAL with far more changes than were originally planned (just these new series like The Terrifics, etc.) because the delays created a post-METAL gap that was never expected to be there. METAL would have ended and things gone back to normal as Doomsday Clock continued to unfold. But METAL got delayed, Doomsday Clock got delayed even more. And Bendis/creative teams.

This has come together to where they were going to relaunch the JL sets originally this summer,  including bringing back Dark and having a Suicide Squad/JL-mashup team, but what DC seems to have done is asked the METAL team to create a new event to explain the new Justice League teams, which is NO JUSTICE. The four teams in the teaser and in the series are not entirely the JL teams that will come out of it, but are close. Like Wonder Woman will be leading JLDark, Harley and crew will be in the one JL team with a tech focus (iirc), Martian Manhunter is into the main JL book which will take on a space/global focus, Batman's JLA team will be the "ground" based team. With all of them taking on JLA's "redemption" concept which is why they have villains/anti-heroes in them.

Basically METAL got upgraded to a larger scale EVENT that DC has lined up a bunch of changes to "come in the wake of" that go beyond the six series they originally intended to launch. (Two of which are already two issues in lol, while another, I think DiDio's book is like a year behind now.)

By the end of Metal I didn’t really understand what was happening or why. The earth fell below the darkness or something because Batman got bukkakeed by 9 metals.

The only part I really found interesting were the tie-ins. The actual series sort of sucked. It was just too confusing, and not well explained.
Snyder wrote a Morrison Epic but he's not the level of writer to provide the density where re-reading makes it clearer, METAL basically doesn't get clearer on re-reads once we get to the events of METAL proper. It's by and large a loud mess and reveled in that batshit loudness until this last issue.

I'll make things worse by trying to explain some of it for you while also working through my thoughts on it and where it went.

The Dark Multiverse, exists literally underneath our standard universe and is where corrupted stories go to die. Stories with endings that wipe out everything, bad dreams that aren't fully formed and so collapse, twisted versions of our heroes, etc.

Batman discovered that the supernatural metals of the DC Universe were pointing to a greater purpose, which was that they can open the gateway to the Dark Multiverse, especially because the original "thing" at the helm of The Forge has disappeared. (Which allowed Barbatos to trap Carter Hall as his Forge.) The entire first half plot was based around how only Batman could put this together and get it to the right point (partly because of when he traveled through time post Final Crisis), where the agents of Barbatos could trick him and open the gateway.

After that Earth (which is the center of the Multiverse) began to literally sink into the Dark Multiverse. (Which again, is below the Multiverse. Literally below it.) If it did Barbatos would end "good" stories. End heroes. End hope. The Trinity overcame this by finding the Tenth Metal (which arguably should be the eleventh since BATMANIUM! HOW DID THEY FORGET BATMANIUM!) within The Forge which was the one thing that could stop the Dark Multiverse as it's literally "God's metal" of creation.

spoiler (click to show/hide)
The Batman Who Laughs part in the finale was the backup plan for Barbatos, which if he couldn't have the universe, no one could. They were going to merge The Monitor and the Anti-Monitor (well, his brain) to destroy all reality.
[close]

The "antenna" stuff was a call back to the first two Crisis in which the big bad's built antennas that the heroes then used to turn the tables. The Thule was a throwback to Final Crisis (and The Multiversity), Barbatos to The Return of Bruce Wayne.

The Epilogue infodump is actually the end game of METAL because the two pages where the heroes were all holding hands and shit and they cracked the Source Wall and God's hand appeared, Barbatos (or something) used the connection powered by literal metal of creation to make some of his terrors (and maybe even worse in the case of Atlantis, some people's hopes) real before he was bound.

And for the upcoming NO JUSTICE, the breaching of the Source Wall called the attention of billion year old celestials. (I use celestials here because not only do they fucking look like Marvel's but "METAL", they sound like the same exact concept, each one an embodiment of a concept.)



This ultimately was the part I liked and disliked most about the finale. (Other than Snyder closing his take on The Joker by making him essential to save the universe.) I disliked that Snyder shoved that all into an Epilogue. And infodumped it over two pages. I liked that Snyder realized he couldn't come up with a more powerful metal AND pull off a stunt to revert the universe without it having consequences of all types.

From a canon wank perspective, I disliked that he's tied it to breaching the Source Wall without doing any of the canon research he did for everything else. The Wall has been breached multiple times before, including by Batman of all people, and it's been canon even before Wildstorm was integrated that The Bleed is on the other side of it. Morrison changed this in The Multiversity for a specific reason. (He also renumbered the Earth's, so there's no Earth 52. The Earth 53 Snyder had come to the rescue skips an Earth!) The Multiversity explains what's on the outside of the new Source Wall. Other multiverses. As The Empty Hand has come from recently destroying Multiverse-2. Snyder appears to be using it to instead bring back things from the DC Canon.

And it's through exploring this that I come to METAL's central problem. Barbatos. Once the Dark Batmen are shoved aside, outside of the Batman Who Laughs, so that the heroes can confront a literal Barbatos is when the epic falls apart. When they're battling Barbatos as a concept, the story takes on its epic apocalyptic tones and the heroes are seemingly doing more than punching even as everything fails until they realize what they're battling. And this is why I called it an attempt an a Morrison Epic. Morrison constantly makes his ultimate villains a concept entity. Darkseid goes beyond a super tyrant, an alien power, even an Evil God, instead he's the personification of No Free Will. His physical "defeat" by Batman in Final Crisis, is what brings about the All Over, as he's dragging down reality with himself. The Empty Hand, exists, along with his Gentry minions, as concepts taken to an unending horror. Barbatos should have been and stayed this, the embodiment of nightmares, a creature literally created by our nightmares and fears, who has become so empowered because of Batman's rejection of this. The Dark Batmen exist because Batman didn't succumb even in those nightmares including the Snyderverse one and including the ones where he had to trap his friends in hell to survive.

By the end we're seeing Dark Wonder Women, etc. and some are drawn interesting on their own, but unlike the Dark Batmen, we didn't get their backstory which was way more effective than I thought. The story never grapples with The Dark Batmen, outside of one, not being servants of Barbatos, but instead trying to save their universes. Arguably for five pages of wanking about heroes and metal and hope as white swirls around, it would have been more effective for the heroes to re-emerge in the Dark Batmen, to reject Barbatos seeing what his endgame actually is, shattering Barbatos' hold on the nightmares and requiring him to fall back on the one who wasn't "broken" but chose willingly to "break" in The Batman Who Laughs.

This is also a way you can get to the deus ex machina of the "Tenth" Metal and do it all on panel. The first half of the series and the one-shots touch on it, but the story mostly loses it, WHY THE FORGE EXISTS and why it's in the Dark Multiverse, etc. And you can use it for the same reason. The ended stories are being destroyed in The Forge to provide the fuel to create new stories. A sacrifice of the other Dark Batmen to provide the fuel for Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman to come back from within The Forge with the "Tenth" Metal that essentially ends Barbatos' plans and ties up the "metal" and Dark Batmen's plotlines. Something METAL doesn't actually do. Batman and The Joker still need to do the one thing that only they know, which is track down their counterpart, to end the backup plan, AND get The Monitor, who happens to know how to pull the Earth out of the Dark. But most importantly it shifts the deus ex machina to being one that actually deals with the concepts of The Dark Batmen and Barbatos, by defying him, they provide the fuel to return our heroes, it's an inverse of the start when our heroes are used to open the door to Barbatos and elevate the Dark. It also firmly plants METAL as a story about heroes/hope/dreams/aspiring vs. terrors/fear/nightmares/despair.

Overall, I have loved METAL though, even when it sprawled all over, it was in a fun way. But it never really escaped Snyder's heavy hand, which is why some of the tie-ins like Batman: Lost and Wild Hunt were more engaging than stuff in the main book. (I have to assume Snyder's buddy Tynion saved a lot of these, as did their buddy Williamson, as they're credited on the stronger stuff...thankfully they're both full credits on all of No Justice!)

One thing kinda weird to me is that Snyder didn't used to write so clunky. American Vampire (until Second Cycle) is tightly plotted and handles its scope better, The Black Mirror start of his Batman career is brilliant and even into Court of Owls does a lot more with its plotting, Death of the Family doesn't get out of control and sticks to its central hook even, up until Zero Year which is where it falls apart. And Eternal is a mess. Both of them could have been half as long. Endgame is a mess that only seems tightly plotted because it's six issues, and even there its brilliant moment of OH SHIT WE SERIOUS is earlier and ultimately irrelevant. Even The Wake seems okay, and Swamp Thing was fine, Rotworld is...actually...Rotworld is sorta like a METAL test-run, now that I think about it...hmm...huh. Interesting.

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5001 on: March 30, 2018, 03:53:53 PM »
I read that and remain confused 🤷‍♀️

One thing I sort of like about 1980s comics is that they have so much exposition and are so verbose that the plots rarely are truly confusing in the way this is.

I thought the beginning of Metal was great, with the investigation into the connection between these supernatural weapons and what not, but the connection with Barbados and how he tied it all together with the court of Owls needed more explanation, IMO. Same with the 10th metal (and Batmanium) and how all of that tied to Barbatos.

samfish

  • Cereal mispeller
  • Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5002 on: March 30, 2018, 04:13:27 PM »
By the end we're seeing Dark Wonder Women, etc. and some are drawn interesting on their own, but unlike the Dark Batmen, we didn't get their backstory which was way more effective than I thought. The story never grapples with The Dark Batmen, outside of one, not being servants of Barbatos, but instead trying to save their universes. Arguably for five pages of wanking about heroes and metal and hope as white swirls around, it would have been more effective for the heroes to re-emerge in the Dark Batmen, to reject Barbatos seeing what his endgame actually is, shattering Barbatos' hold on the nightmares and requiring him to fall back on the one who wasn't "broken" but chose willingly to "break" in The Batman Who Laughs.

This is also a way you can get to the deus ex machina of the "Tenth" Metal and do it all on panel. The first half of the series and the one-shots touch on it, but the story mostly loses it, WHY THE FORGE EXISTS and why it's in the Dark Multiverse, etc. And you can use it for the same reason. The ended stories are being destroyed in The Forge to provide the fuel to create new stories. A sacrifice of the other Dark Batmen to provide the fuel for Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman to come back from within The Forge with the "Tenth" Metal that essentially ends Barbatos' plans and ties up the "metal" and Dark Batmen's plotlines. Something METAL doesn't actually do. Batman and The Joker still need to do the one thing that only they know, which is track down their counterpart, to end the backup plan, AND get The Monitor, who happens to know how to pull the Earth out of the Dark. But most importantly it shifts the deus ex machina to being one that actually deals with the concepts of The Dark Batmen and Barbatos, by defying him, they provide the fuel to return our heroes, it's an inverse of the start when our heroes are used to open the door to Barbatos and elevate the Dark. It also firmly plants METAL as a story about heroes/hope/dreams/aspiring vs. terrors/fear/nightmares/despair.

I like your ending better.

A lot of Metal seems to be about saying "fuck it" and throwing any sort of storytelling caution to the wind, and just making a crazy story where things only make sense if you keep rolling with it and don't think too much about it. That makes the ride a lot of fun the first time you're on it, but it doesn't lend itself well to being revisited.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5003 on: March 30, 2018, 04:13:54 PM »
The Owls exposed Batman to a bunch of the metals, and openly said they were there just to see Bruce lose and bring about the end, after that they weren't really relevant and bailed out.

Barbatos is in/from the Dark Universe, the metals just opened things so The Dark Batmen could come through and set things into motion. Barbatos never actually leaves the Dark Universe, Earth is pulled into it.

The "Tenth" Metal was what Barbatos was preventing from being created when he swapped in the corrupted Carter Hall at The Forge. It's the metal of creation itself, Barbatos was blocking it from being created which "evened" the playing field essentially and allowed the Dark Universe to move up to our level, otherwise the normal process of creation would keep the Dark Universe at the bottom.

The Bats and Birds stuff was supposed to be that Morrison style mythology, but it wound up just being an extension of his Court of Owls plotline and also the fact that Hawkman/woman had to be allies with Batman and end the war, because the start of their war (which Batman started after Final Crisis when he went back in time) was when Barbatos first set the plot in motion by seeing and marking him beginning his attempts to get through. (First through Thomas Wayne/Dr. Hurt.)

Snyder never explained the other half of the mythology though, so the importance of the birds kinda never gets explained.

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5004 on: March 30, 2018, 04:14:30 PM »
Also, was there any explanation of where Joker came from in the final part of Metal? That was crazy confusing to me.

Like, it was cool and sort of make sense that the only thing that can beat a jokerified Batman is Batman + the Joker, but didn’t he disappear in the the casting or the forge? Disappeared to where? And why would he even work with Batman? And what did Batman do with him after? And why did the Joker seem to kind of know what was going on?

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5005 on: March 30, 2018, 04:23:43 PM »
The Joker was there because he knew what would happen, he was in the secret Batcave when Batman was uncovering everything about the metal, he was trying to stop Batman and Duke and them. He was explaining it at the time, even the bats and the birds, and that Batman was going to bring forth something dark, it just didn't make any sense. I'm assuming he knew to be there because he knew what was happening and knew to be there for the same reason Batman was, he just went about it a bit more carefully.

As Batman bails out with The Monitor in the background of the panel, you can see the Joker fighting with The Batman Who Laughs as the cave is collapsing around them, Bats had bigger priorities than those two once he had The Monitor.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5006 on: March 30, 2018, 04:25:09 PM »

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5007 on: March 30, 2018, 04:37:49 PM »
Of course, that whole ambiguity allows The Batman Who Laughs to come back...

The other Dark Batmen are shown (or implied by being in the battle) being outright killed by the Tenth Metal empowered Justice League. He notably isn't. (As well as already being hiding in a place where the Tenth Metal couldn't go.) Not to mention his sharing traits with the always escaping death Joker.

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5008 on: March 30, 2018, 10:18:58 PM »
I might have to reread it form the beginning and see if it makes more sense without the long gaps between issues.

I always have trouble with cosmic stories. There’s just a layer of abstraction where I feel like I don’t really understand enough to enjoy it...

I largely felt the same way about Infinity.

I never get lost in Bendis events though... :doge

I also would have guessed that the Joker would like the idea of destroying everything, maybe even really like the irony of a Batman destroying everything.

Edit: injustice Batman has multiple kids, so he will always be known as the Batman who cream pies
« Last Edit: March 30, 2018, 10:23:03 PM by kingv »

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5009 on: March 31, 2018, 02:41:09 AM »
Batman is his, Joker doesn't want Batman running off getting the Multiverse killed. That'd be mean he couldn't play with his friend anymore.

From The Casting:



benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5010 on: March 31, 2018, 03:39:27 AM »
Underneath our universe is the Dark Universe, it's where all our nightmares, our fears, our corrupted stories, go to be destroyed to create new stories. Barbatos helped pluck The Dark Batmen from this oblivion while our Batman chased the mystery of the METALS that led him to open up the gateway to the Dark Multiverse so they could come through. Barbatos attempts to sink the Earth into the dark, replacing the Multiverse with only darkness. No hope of escape, only endless nightmares.

For like 90% of the story, it's the heroes losing again and again, because the foes are Batmen, they're always one step ahead and our heroes are doing the work for them, except these Batmen have nothing holding them back like ours. It's great because it's so absurd and over the top and crazy, dumb fun that lets itself be dumb fun while canon wanking to build up the despair and parade of horribles.

Then it gets SNYDER ENDING. Which is what the above is mostly talking about.

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5011 on: March 31, 2018, 05:42:36 AM »
Metal started to piss me off with the Hawkguy shit then it made me go nuclear with the last chapter, whatever, looks like they will use this setup to turn some heroes bad and vice versa with villains so maybe there's some interesting shit to come.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5012 on: April 01, 2018, 02:15:13 AM »
METAL self-contained but as a launching pad for the five new series originally announced plus bringing back Hawkman was totally fine to me, but it does now seem like during the delays that editorial was like "we're making this more of an event" and thus that epilogue infodump and NO JUSTICE

NO JUSTICE actually has already expanded, it was a four issue intro to Snyder taking over the Justice League book with some ties to METAL (namely Hawkman back and with Jonn joining the team), now it's a larger series launching/reworking FOUR Justice League books

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5013 on: April 01, 2018, 02:16:32 AM »
oh shit, Justice League Dark is going to have some DARK MULTIVERSE tie-in bullshit now isn't it rather than just being a crappy name for an inferior Shadowpact with Constantine all over it

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5014 on: April 01, 2018, 05:31:53 PM »
Are any of the new metal books any good?

Damage looks like the Badrock solo book we always wanted

Purple Filth

  • This cosmic dance of bursting decadence and withheld permissions twists all our arms collectively, but if sweetness can win—and it can—then I'll still be here tomorrow to high-five you yesterday, my friend. Peace
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5015 on: April 01, 2018, 06:26:22 PM »
The Batman who Laughs is the best part of Metal

And its fitting the only person that can go against him in some form is the one that ultimately created him.

Purple Filth

  • This cosmic dance of bursting decadence and withheld permissions twists all our arms collectively, but if sweetness can win—and it can—then I'll still be here tomorrow to high-five you yesterday, my friend. Peace
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5016 on: April 01, 2018, 06:41:09 PM »
Looking back at previous posts and now i see where that Batman avatar came from  :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol


Superman #42

This book continues to be great. Thought this page was cute as hell:

(Image removed from quote.)

Best marriage in comics? Best marriage in comics.

The Bizarro stuff was a little hard to read at first but then I got into it. Looking forward to this arc.

Not much time left before "BENDIS IS COMING!!!!" :-\

Yea that was fucking excellent.

Sucks when your parents are Superman and the best Reporter in DC comics  :lol

Bebpo

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5017 on: April 02, 2018, 04:34:00 PM »
I read Nailbiter (vol.1-6) while traveling and it was pretty enjoyable. I liked the characters, the slasher kills, the mysteries. In the end I think it's hard to make any sort of reveal to a mystery that's been stretched an entire series satisfying, so was kinda disappointed in the reveal, but was a decent finale. I think for a comic version of a slasher film they did a good job with it. Had solid art too.

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5018 on: April 03, 2018, 12:57:01 AM »
Batman #43

Rahxephon91

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5019 on: April 03, 2018, 12:58:46 AM »
The Tom King run has been good.  Really dry humor.

benjipwns

  • your bright ideas always burn me
  • Senior Member

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5021 on: April 03, 2018, 08:47:13 AM »
It was posted too close to a bleeding cool article and i was blinded, sorry :goldberg

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5022 on: April 07, 2018, 06:42:30 AM »
Batman White Knight Issue 7 was good, i liked it after a bunch of meh stuff before, looking forward to the end conclusion next issue. The weirdest part about Batman Issue 44 to me is how Batman can sleep through the chapter, thought he would be a lighter sleeper.

samfish

  • Cereal mispeller
  • Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5023 on: April 09, 2018, 01:05:02 AM »
I still can't understand how after all these years there hasn't been a DC/DBZ or Superman/Goku crossover


Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5024 on: April 11, 2018, 02:23:36 PM »


:lawd

bork

  • おっぱいは命、尻は故郷
  • Global Moderator
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5025 on: April 11, 2018, 02:38:32 PM »
I still can't understand how after all these years there hasn't been a DC/DBZ or Superman/Goku crossover

(Image removed from quote.)

I still can't understand how after all these years people would want a DC/DBZ or Superman/Goku crossover
ど助平

samfish

  • Cereal mispeller
  • Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5026 on: April 11, 2018, 03:13:38 PM »
I still can't understand how after all these years there hasn't been a DC/DBZ or Superman/Goku crossover

(Image removed from quote.)

I still can't understand how after all these years people would want a DC/DBZ or Superman/Goku crossover

So you can have an official Superman vs Goku battle to nerd-reference in that perennial debate. Otherwise, it would probably suck because I honestly don't know how you'd possibly mash those 2 universes together since they clash so much. I guess you could do it like Batman/Spawn and Spawn/Batman back in the 90's, where there's an Image version and a DC version... but then you wind up with the question of which is the official version or which counts more. Meh.
Although if you did it Metal style where you just sort of say 'fuck it all' and try to tell a silly, fun story, it could work.

samfish

  • Cereal mispeller
  • Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5027 on: April 11, 2018, 03:17:38 PM »
And I have to sing the praises of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles book from IDW. This is easily one of the best, most consistently solid books I've been keeping up with for several years now. Not always great, but also never bad or tiring.

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5028 on: April 11, 2018, 03:32:50 PM »
IDW transformers is pretty good too. But the books are numbered in such a way to punish new readers. Whoever chose how to number that shit was a serious asshole.

bork

  • おっぱいは命、尻は故郷
  • Global Moderator
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5029 on: April 12, 2018, 01:14:21 PM »
I still can't understand how after all these years there hasn't been a DC/DBZ or Superman/Goku crossover

(Image removed from quote.)

I still can't understand how after all these years people would want a DC/DBZ or Superman/Goku crossover

So you can have an official Superman vs Goku battle to nerd-reference in that perennial debate. Otherwise, it would probably suck because I honestly don't know how you'd possibly mash those 2 universes together since they clash so much. I guess you could do it like Batman/Spawn and Spawn/Batman back in the 90's, where there's an Image version and a DC version... but then you wind up with the question of which is the official version or which counts more. Meh.
Although if you did it Metal style where you just sort of say 'fuck it all' and try to tell a silly, fun story, it could work.

Two completely different styles of comics and storytelling.  Would not work very well.  Actually I could see it working within Dragonball because it would probably be done in a humorous way.  'Murica?
:nope
ど助平

Junpei the Tracer!

  • I started with Nightbright and ended with Comics
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5030 on: April 12, 2018, 04:23:02 PM »
Captain America #700 had a good ending.The entire run so far has been really simple stories, like some other comics try really hard to tell deep, thematic stories but this is just 'cap encounters problem, cap saves day'. Shame Samnee is gone but Romero is just as good.
Boo

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5031 on: April 15, 2018, 01:57:00 AM »


I like these guys, discovered this channel recently :o

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5032 on: April 18, 2018, 01:17:47 AM »
BATMAN: WHITE KNIGHT #8 9/5
BATMAN #45 18/4
MISTER MIRACLE #8 18/4
DOOMSDAY CLOCK #5 Who cares, whatever

Two of my books out today :rejoice

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5033 on: April 18, 2018, 06:43:05 AM »
BATMAN #45
 :crazy
SPOILER REVIEW
spoiler (click to show/hide)
:crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :confused :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy
[close]

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5034 on: April 18, 2018, 06:53:37 AM »
MISTER MIRACLE #8
spoiler (click to show/hide)
Kinda dreading where this ends up for Scott tbh, I feel this is going to end in the most fucked up way possible
[close]

samfish

  • Cereal mispeller
  • Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5035 on: April 20, 2018, 10:30:37 PM »
Man every time Tom King does a great story he follows it up with a shit arc. How can he be allowed to completely write Booster out of character like that?

Momo

  • Nebuchadnezzar
  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5036 on: April 24, 2018, 02:24:47 AM »
For Tasty's eyes only
spoiler (click to show/hide)
[close]

bork

  • おっぱいは命、尻は故郷
  • Global Moderator
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5037 on: April 24, 2018, 07:15:55 AM »
BATMAN #45
 :crazy
SPOILER REVIEW
spoiler (click to show/hide)
:crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :confused :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy :crazy
[close]


Was wondering about this- so Booster Gold pulled a Flashpoint and now it's...Batpoint?  More alternate world nonsense again. :hyper

For Tasty's eyes only
spoiler (click to show/hide)
[close]

I thought Krypto got killed off?   ???
ど助平

bork

  • おっぱいは命、尻は故郷
  • Global Moderator
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5038 on: April 24, 2018, 07:27:44 AM »
Been catching up on Spider-Man books.

Amazing #799: Just not feeling this final Dan Slott story.  Crazy fucked-up Green Goblin possessed by Carnage should be something insane, but it's...just not.  Maybe #800 will up the ante.  I'm definitely ready for the new creative team now.

Ben Reilly, The Scarlet Spider: Didn't read this one for a while.  They finally acknowledged Secret Empire and Las Vegas is shown...kind of in ruins?  Huh?  In Secret Empire it looked like a crater.  Here there's just some places that are fucked up here and there.
:confused
It continues to be difficult to root for Ben after he was turned into a villain before and they really shouldn't call this "Ben Reilly, Scarlet Spider" since bro-clone Kaine is also there and gets the spotlight in some issues.

Renew Your Vows: This is the alternate reality Spider-Man book that came out Secret Wars, where Peter is still married to Mary Jane and they have a daughter with spidey-powers.  It's fun to read because it's entirely self-contained and is kind of like the old Spider-Girl series in that you get a different take on various Marvel characters- like you get the X-Men shown as being more like their 1991 versions, albeit with Wolverine married to Jean Grey (and they have a kid).  Spider-Man himself is the same, but he's joined by Mary Jane and their daughter fighting crime.  MJ first gets a power-suit that she can use to take power from Peter and turn into strength for herself.  That causes problems so they end up giving her the Venom symbiote.  She goes crazy for an issue or two but then makes the symbiote 'submit' in her mind and has full control over it.  Fine with me since as Venom, she basically looks like Spider-Woman II...the other costume they gave her was this awful white suit.  The big bad here is Harry Osborn's kid, who has been taking grandpappy's goblin serum and is now a super-intelligent 10 year old running a corporation and doing evil things.  His mother (Liz Allen) seems to be aware of this and doesn't care...which is... ???  About to finish up what I assume is the end of his arc since the book pulls a time skip and their daughter is shown as a teenager in recent issues.
EDIT: Read two more issues- The symbiote gets destroyed so bye-bye good Mary Jane costume design.  White mess is back  :yuck
« Last Edit: April 24, 2018, 07:43:52 AM by bork »
ど助平

kingv

  • Senior Member
Re: Bore Comics Thread: Crisis On Infinite Megathreads
« Reply #5039 on: April 24, 2018, 11:10:18 PM »
I like the Scarlet spider and Renew your vows books, but I’ve always had a soft spot for spider books.