International Politics Thread - Disease and Disaster

[shosta]

I feel bad for the UK, to be honest. Went from being run by filthy plutocratic crooks to being possessed by economically suicidal fantasies of divorce from the greatest regional alliance in human history all because Cockney blowhards don't like Pollocks. What an embarrassment.

[Nintex]

https://twitter.com/SkyNewsPolitics/status/1005129596814016514

Theresa May can't compete with the power and might of Boris the Lion. 

[VomKriege]

The state of France right now :

National Railways on intermittent strikes for a few months, a new law on asylum seekers (there's one every year or so these days) with one of Macron MP voting against (the others taking selfies in the chamber to celebrate #unity in their voting), an amendment being passed to reduce the obligation of making housing accessible to disabled people from 100% to 10%, public radio and network TV probably facing 300m€ in cuts... Oh and Macron commissioned a report on poor suburban districts but sent it to the bin right away and joked in fromlnt of local officials that a "a report written by old white dudes read by old white dudes" wasn't gonna help anyway and that they were at fault and shouldn't expect much more credits from the state.

Still no real opposition figure emerging however. Mélenchon is mired in a recent scandal about his campaign funding (a hatchet job and everyone is doing the same is his defense). The conservatives are basically going full right just short of far (if even that) and straining their own base while doing so.

Municipal and European elections coming up, both being a test of sorts though on two different dimensions (can Macronism become a real political party beyond his Providential Man at the local level, does his message on Europe get through and can he have some sort of credibility steering the EU ?). Apparently he is targeting the powerful Paris city hall which has been in the hands of socialists since 2001 (otherwise a strong presence of ex-Gaullist networks depending on the socioeconomic make up of a particular district). A LOT of money is flowing through Paris and the region, both as the undisputed country center and for massive infrastructure projects.

Growth is up, deficit within European criteria for two years in a row and the Social Security is on the way of much smaller losses than expected though it's unclear how much economic recovery he can take credit for.

[Nintex]

France is so weird politically.

They vote for Macron to reform things because they wanted to modernize and not become trapped in a nostalgia binge like Brexit UK.
Macron starts reforming and they block his efforts.

Macron seems like a typical liberal sleazebag but is definitely a step-up from whatever Hollande was supposed to be.

[VomKriege]

There's not much actual "blocking" going on, you know. Railways are disturbed less than half the week (though it is noteworthy that so far all the major unions are on board). Some universities are occupied. There's absolutely not the same vibrancy of outright protest than in 1995, 2006 or even for the latest labor reform under Hollande when the Place de la République was occupied every night for two months by a spontaneous popular assembly. Even if out of resignation, people are accepting.

Macron basically has a free hand for at least a year to get whatever he wants through (with only some resistance in Senate). Still everyone agrees he's giving in to the Bonapartist tendencies of the Vth Republic instead of really effecting lasting changes in the political landscape.

[VomKriege]

To summarize : polls indicate that a lot of people think of him as the "President for the wealthy" yet are so far not ouright hostile despite this usually cardinal sin.

[shosta]

Is he really? I feel like all he's done in that regard is relax some labor laws.

[VomKriege]

Is he really? I feel like all he's done in that regard is relax some labor laws.

They're reducing the tax on wealth, the tax on companies, have a partial amnesty on tax evasion (temporarily) and will suppress a tax aimed at it, passed a flat tax on capital, easing housing norms as I mentioned (and random luck has it, exactly as advocated by real estate promoters !), reducing subsidies for renters but only asking effort to compensate from public landlords... Plus the general language (especially from the Budget Minister who supposedly is shopping in the "Horror Show" of Bercy, the collection of radical cost cutting measures deemed too outrageous). Most of those measures are already voted and on their way to implementation while the "balancing" ones for the middle class and the common man have been defered to a later date and planned over a longer period of time (like the suppression of the tenant tax, though that one, to be fair, have started) while the tax rise on pensions has been acted in the first couple of months.

Not to be a raging leftist but even agreeing with the necessity of reforms, it's fairly clear who the current winners are.

To elaborate on that poll (from early May 2018) :
72% of the sample thinks he is "The President of the wealthy"
50% that his policies are balanced (or both right and left, to quote Macron), 43% that it leans right, 7% that it leans left.
48% have a good opinion of him (Favorability).
59% does not wish him to run for a second mandate (not out of the norm, they thought it even more for the President before him. I guess it comes down to weariness towards politicians.)
78% thinks he is dynamic / energetic and 66% that he has a clear idea of where he is going.
75% that he lacks humility and 68% that he is not in touch with common people.

[Madrun Badrun]

[Nintex]

https://twitter.com/L0gg0l/status/1005885588086644736

It begins (ends?)

[VomKriege]

Not to support the move but Italy's grievances with regards to how little EU partners actually did share the burden (despite intentions) are not unfounded, even excluding the outrageous bad faith effort of Central Europe members.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/08/eu-met-only-5-of-target-for-relocating-refugees-from-greece-and-italy

"We don't understand why citizens won't trust the EU !?"

[VomKriege]

Also this depressing op-ed probably tells it better :

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jun/10/sunday-essay-how-we-colluded-in-fortress-europe-immigration

(You can find fault with it but I think there's definitely truth to it.)

[EVOL]

I doubt anybody here is going to give a fuck, but the provincial elections in South Korea are being held. The liberal party is slaughtering the conservative party, 13-3.

On a side note, the election coverage has been amazing

[kingv]

Seems like they should really be using Starcraft imagery instead of Dark Souls.

[EVOL]

Seems like they should really be using Starcraft imagery instead of Dark Souls.

 

StarCraft has been dead here for years gramps, get with the times

The imagery itself is supposed to be a Harry Potter spoof.

[Kara]

I give a fuck inasmuch that it's a referendum on Moon Jae-in's peace process.

[Nintex]

Seems like they should really be using Starcraft imagery instead of Dark Souls.

 

StarCraft has been dead here for years gramps, get with the times

The imagery itself is supposed to be a Harry Potter spoof.

That settles it, reunite on the North's terms. We won't sanction this buffoonery. 

[Nintex]

There is new hope for Europe. Merkel's position is shaky with politicians at home (CSU) and abroad(Salvini) lined up against her.
https://twitter.com/BBCWorld/status/1007319539439284233

Austria has called for a 'axis of the willing' to deal with the migration problems. The EU is holding a summit in the next two weeks but Merkel's allies are not confident the EU will reach any agreement and are calling her to take matters into her own hands and start closing the border and deporting the illegals.
Meanwhile Merkel responded to the murder of 14 year old girl at the hands of an Iraqi refugee by saying that's why integration was necessary.

This week the head of NATO is talking to the SPD(German social democrats and Putin's biggest gas buddies in Europe) to persuade them to greenlit more military spending.

The austerity/open-borders beast is almost slain 

[shosta]

Sometimes I hate you a lot

[Kara]

#RememberWhen a Nazi cell murdered people of Turkish descent for years in Germany and the police didn't really investigate it because, well, who knows?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-17514394

[Nintex]

#RememberWhen a Nazi cell murdered people of Turkish descent for years in Germany and the police didn't really investigate it because, well, who knows?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-17514394

Because in most European states the police are limp dicks or rendered powerless and useless by the political class.
Germany can't handle the far right any better than it can handle the Erdoganista's, Antifa, Eastern European mobsters or fucked up axe wielders.
Most murders go unsolved.

The moment even the most mundane villages had their roads blocked with Merkel lego and security forces started to visibly patrol airfields, train stations and concerts with machine guns it was obvious that any sort of preemptive measures had failed.

In fact, in this Dutch coastal town a state of emergency was declared in a neighborhood after the buses that carry the disabled to school were set alight by 16 year old fuckheads and the locals wanted to take matters into their own hands.
The only police station in this town is actually located in the same neighborhood.

Sometimes it feels like people running social housing here are just doing some fucked up experiment. Housing all the migrants, disabled, LGTBQs, elderly, unemployed in the same neighborhood known to attract drug dealers just to see what happens. 

[Kara]

In summer 2013, Andreas Temme, the Hessian LfV agent who was inside Halit Yozgat’s internet cafe in Kassel when Yozgat was murdered, testified that he did not hear the silenced shots, nor did he notice the sprinkles of blood on the counter where he placed his payment in coins when he left. Spectators of the Munich trial agree that one of the most searing moments of the trial came when Yozgat’s father described how he found his dying son. It was impossible, he said, that Temme could have left the cafe without seeing the dead body behind the counter.

Temme, who denies any involvement, said that it was simply a coincidence he was in the cafe at the time of the murder and that he had been surfing dating websites. (“I was in the wrong place at the wrong time,” he said in an interview on German public television in July 2012.) When the police rounded up all those who were present at the scene of the murder, Temme did not come forward. After he was tracked down, Temme claimed that he did not volunteer any information because he was worried that his wife would discover his online proclivities.

One of the prosecution’s witnesses, a policeman from the village where Temme grew up, testified that in his youth, Temme was known as “Little Adolf”. When the local police tried to dig deeper into allegations that Temme had a personal library of Nazi literature and weapons manuals, the interior minister of the state of Hesse, Volker Bouffier, shielded him from further investigations and from the press.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/15/neo-nazi-murders-revealing-germanys-darkest-secrets

[HardcoreRetro]

Sometimes it feels like people running social housing here are just doing some fucked up experiment. Housing all the migrants, disabled, LGTBQs, elderly, unemployed in the same neighborhood known to attract drug dealers just to see what happens. 

Ain't that just to increase values of other properties? Get all the undesirable people in one place so prices can go up in another one.

[Mandark]

Kind of impressed at "they corralled all the marginalized groups together under lousy conditions" being used as evidence against any lingering fascist tendencies.

[Rufus]

Just a reflex.

[Nintex]

Kind of impressed at "they corralled all the marginalized groups together under lousy conditions" being used as evidence against any lingering fascist tendencies.

It is ultimately what causes both problems.

Asylum seekers housed in overcrowded centers, which end up being recruitment centers for Al Qaeda and ISIS and the same civil Sunni,Shia,Qurds civil war just rages on inside the asylum centers.
Government houses those that are granted asylum in the shittiest crime ridden neighborhoods and cut budgets for aid, education and economic incentives.

Radical Imams start preaching that the state isn't taking care of them and they should take matters into their own hands, don't integrate, stick together as Muslims and/or wage Jihad against their oppressors.
Populist right wingers start campaigning in the already shitty neighborhoods which now blame all their existing problems on the other people.

Note that those from Europe who went to fight for ISIS were not first/second generation migrants. In fact most of them hold European passports and were born here.
But they fell prey to radicalization and economic problems which hit the lowest classes the hardest. Immigration and especially integration has been a big problem in Europe prior to the waves of refugees and it was never properly handled.
Instead of fixing the broken system the EU governments opted to increase the scale of the same failed policies and systems.

The waiting list for mental help for war victims in the Netherlands is now 12 months.

Sometimes it feels like people running social housing here are just doing some fucked up experiment. Housing all the migrants, disabled, LGTBQs, elderly, unemployed in the same neighborhood known to attract drug dealers just to see what happens. 

Ain't that just to increase values of other properties? Get all the undesirable people in one place so prices can go up in another one.

That would be true if you build a fence around the neighborhood. But most of the time an entire village or city is at some point less secure because police has a hard time dealing with a neighborhood.
In some places it actually went quite well. When the less fortunate and minorities are housed alongside people who are well off. One of the best things our government did was to stop huddling all the mentally disabled together in institutions and housed them next to 'normal people' so they'd be better accepted by society. It worked out pretty well.

Part of why integration of the Poles after a few early problems has also been a success. They're not put together in one Polish neighborhood but are actually spread out across communities.   

[HardcoreRetro]

You don't need fences to keep people within their own neighbourhoods, you just need other people.

[Nintex]

Next week might see the end of Merkel's reign
https://www.politico.eu/article/angela-merkels-battle-with-bavaria-refugees-migration-masterplan/

All EU crises are coming to their conclusion.

1. Migration
The big issue. Seehofer (interior minster) wants to curb migration and fix it on Germany's terms as the EU has so far failed to reach (and or act) on an agreement. In 3 years time about 1.6 million migrants have entered Germany in less legal ways.
Seehofers' plan includes securing Germany's borders within the EU. Effectively putting Shengen on ice. Polls show most of the German public agrees with him. Merkel refused to let him show his plans but he's not backing down.
Branded a 'rebel' within the government. However, Seehofer is not from Merkel's party but the CSU. A more conservative party than hers which rules Bavaria an important border region. They're facing a big electoral challenge from Afd (Alternative for Germany) which is Germany's version of the 'far right'. Merkels' party wants Merkel to fire Seehofer, which would mean the end of the government and the coalition between the two parties CSU/CDU.

2. Greece and Italy
Italy and Greece are the key for Merkel's plan. She wants them to commit to the original EU migration policy. Which states that asylum seekers should request asylum in the country they first arrive in when they enter Europe.
Which are always the border states (Spain/Greece/Italy etc.) . She intends to offer them the same deal that Erdogan got. Take in the refugees and control the flows in exchange for cash. Now this might've worked 10 years ago but the situation is different.
Greece is fucked financially anyway. Any money they get would be used to pay off loans. They also have no love for Merkel. Italy is an interesting case as well. With populists in power, they're already denying NGO ships entry to ports.
Their interior minister has told illegal migrants to 'start packing their bags'. Chances that Merkel will find allies there for a 'deal' to save her ass domestically are slim. But without Greece and Italy a deal on migration is worthless.

3. Austria/Poland etc.
In the EU a 'coalition of the willing' it forming to reinstate border controls and limit migration. They recently gained a strong ally with Austria and if Seehofer gets his way Germany could join in as well.
Knowing this, these countries aren't expected to make a deal on Merkels terms anytime soon.

4. Merkels allies
An important ally for Germany in Europe is the Netherlands. But our government will be ridden in scandals after the weekend as well. They gave Shell a 7 billion euro tax cut on 45 billion in profit for no good reason outside the books.
Not only does this reek of corruption but it is forbidden within EU regulations as well. Macron of France is an ally of Merkel but he also sees that if Merkel falls on her own sword he would be the leading figure of the EU.
Otherwise Merkel is becoming increasingly isolated politically within the EU. Although she can count on the head figures of the EU itself.

Today Trump made a call to Orban of Hungary. They both discussed the importance of secure borders and Orban wants to create stronger ties between Hungary and the US. Going against Merkel and others who wish to counter Trump on the trade war.
And finally there is NATO who wants Germany to spend more (much more) on restoring and renewing it's military capability. Merkel so far has been cautious on this issue so no love lost there should Merkel lose her power.

[Nintex]

Seehofer turns out to be another pussy pushed around by MUTTI MERKEL.
Has agreed to wait until the end of June with any next steps.

In accordance with the true and tested EU policy of kicking the can down the road until there is no more road.

[Kara]

[Rufus]

The fourth Reich
Die-hard nazis dominated the interior ministry during its founding. A study demonstrates the danger which emanated from the public officials.
[...]
The findings are depressing: in the ministry led by the Union [CDU+CSU], historians discovered an "anti-pluralistic understanding of politics", an affinity for "authoritarian solutions", as well as "anti-semitism, racism and xenophobia."

Above-average numbers of former national socialists found refuge in the FMI. In 1961, two-thirds of its leading management had been members of the Nazi Party. About half of which had also joined the Nazi Party's paramilitary wing, the SA.

[Nola]

Thanks for the translation

[Brehvolution]

Kind of ruined the mystery for me, tbh. 

[Nabbis]

Seehofer turns out to be another pussy pushed around by MUTTI MERKEL.
Has agreed to wait until the end of June with any next steps.

In accordance with the true and tested EU policy of kicking the can down the road until there is no more road.

Well, what options are there? Any solution is bound to cause a shitstorm. EU won't make authoritative measures unless fringe parties get into power in their respective countries.

[Nintex]

https://twitter.com/POLITICOEurope/status/1009103687732596736

 

[Madrun Badrun]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44543286

[Nintex]

Salvini the new interior minister of Italy also has a plan. He wants to ask NATO (specifically the US) to help defend Europe from the South by using the 6st fleet stationed in the Mediterranean.

To Der Spiegel he said about the EU:

"Whether the whole thing has no sense any more" will be seen in particular in talks on budget and within context of 2019 European Parliament elections.

On migrants, Salvini confirmed:

"We can’t take even one more, actually we want to hand over a couple," adding that he is aware his stand on migrants could lead to fall of Chancellor Angela Merkel but this isn’t Italy’s intention "even though we’re very distant, not just on the migration issue."

In this documentary he says:

“We need a mass cleansing. Street by street, quarter by quarter” in the EU.

And Merkel's plan? To ask Italy and Greece to keep the migrants from going to germany by offering them cash and debt relief in return.

Indeed 'Wir schaffen das' Merkel.


And this is why I was against the 'open borders' policy. Because I know those migrants would end up in terrible conditions because the EU in its entire existence has never properly managed to fix any crisis and could/would(?) hardly support their own poorer member states. 

[Nintex]

Erdogan has just been re-elected.

Say what you will about the US, they only voted for Bush twice.
The Turks have voted for Erdogan over a dozen times now?

The guy that completely tanked your international relations, economy and got you into a covert war with Syria certainly seems like the person who can fix your country. 
Turks are celebrating that the west is crying (of course). 70% of Turkish migrants in the Netherlands voted for Erdogan (of course). And now he has new presidential powers and the absolute majority in parliament to rubber stamp anything.

[Flannel Boy]

Erdogan has just been re-elected.

Say what you will about the US, they only voted for Bush twice.
The Turks have voted for Erdogan over a dozen times now?

The guy that completely tanked your international relations, economy and got you into a covert war with Syria certainly seems like the person who can fix your country. 
Turks are celebrating that the west is crying (of course). 70% of Turkish migrants in the Netherlands voted for Erdogan (of course). And now he has new presidential powers and the absolute majority in parliament to rubber stamp anything.

In Austria, support for Erdoğan was as high as 72.4 percent with 38.7 ballot boxes opened, while 73.6 percent of Turks living in Belgium voted for the incumbent president.

In Germany, where more than 1.4 million eligible Turkish voters live, Erdoğan had garnered 65.4 percent of the vote.

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/majority-of-turkish-expats-endorse-erdogans-presidency-in-election-133737

That's funny considering he got 52.5% overall. 

[team filler]

[VomKriege]

Not at all overblown and sensationalistic, I'm sure.

Just as a side note I was nearby the Moulin Rouge too a couple of days ago and I saw a handful of girls literally just wearing bras up top (at the pretty mild temperature of 24°c).

[team filler]

[paprikastaude]

The guy that completely tanked your international relations, economy and got you into a covert war with Syria certainly seems like the person who can fix your country. 

He's also running a propaganda machine and persecuting critics.

[Broseidon]

https://twitter.com/danielsilas/status/1011163851440697345

[team filler]

[Madrun Badrun]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-06-20/saudi-moves-forward-with-plan-to-turn-qatar-into-island

[Nintex]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-06-20/saudi-moves-forward-with-plan-to-turn-qatar-into-island

This plan is james bond villain level.

They plan to cut off Qatar's only land border. Furthermore they plan to turn the border into a nuclear waste dump.


The world has gone completely bonkers. 

[curly]

https://twitter.com/SaadAbedine/status/1011151885913370631?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FSaadAbedine%2Fstatus%2F1011151885913370631

Absolutely brutal story

[Crash Dummy]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-06-20/saudi-moves-forward-with-plan-to-turn-qatar-into-island

This plan is james bond villain level.

They plan to cut off Qatar's only land border. Furthermore they plan to turn the border into a nuclear waste dump.
(Image removed from quote.)

The world has gone completely bonkers. 

just need to rename GCC/KSA to the middle east equivalent of ONAN now

[benjipwns]

https://twitter.com/SaadAbedine/status/1011151885913370631?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FSaadAbedine%2Fstatus%2F1011151885913370631

Absolutely brutal story

similarly, just to the west and south, this has been a consistent issue with the Western Sahara situation for the last few years too, people are giving up on the "refugee camps" and "autonomous zones" (that are totally collapsing in any semblance of even fake governance) and heading into the desert to disappear

[Nintex]

https://twitter.com/SaadAbedine/status/1011151885913370631?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2FSaadAbedine%2Fstatus%2F1011151885913370631

Absolutely brutal story

Now THIS is some Nazi shit.
If you deport people at least have the courtesy of driving them all the way home.

 

[curly]

Europe knows about this too and is fine with it because it means less immigrants. From the Times article:

Algeria's mass expulsions have picked up since October 2017, as the European Union renewed pressure on North African countries to head off migrants going north to Europe via the Mediterranean Sea or the barrier fences with Spain.

A European Union spokesperson said the EU was aware of what Algeria was doing, but that "sovereign countries" can expel migrants as long as they comply with international law. Unlike Niger, Algeria takes none of the EU money intended to help with the migration crisis, although it did receive $111.3 million in aid from Europe between 2014 and 2017.

[Rufus]

Naturally. We were quite happy with Gadaffi, too.

[curly]

It reminds me of when the Bush administration would send prisoners to places like Egypt to do the torturing that was even too much for us. Outsource the brutality.

[Cerveza mas fina]

How will pulling out Nato help American security?

Do Americans think US will spend less on Military if they pull out?

No one is forcing you to spend 3,5% of your gdp...

[Brehvolution]

trump is just doing what putin wants.
 

[Cerveza mas fina]

Pulling out always saves you money

Spoken like a true westerner that doesnt rely on his seed to be their 401

[shosta]

"In the nine months leading up to this weekend's presidential election [in Mexico], 132 politicians have been killed."

[benjipwns]

is Hillary Clinton running for President of Mexico?

[Nintex]

Europe is going to build 'closed' migrant centers in South and Eastern Europe and is going to make more deals with Africa to let refugees die in the desert.

Hitler would be proud of little Angela.